Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[med6753]

I wouldn’t worry about precision there. They are usually specified to -20% +100%. A 5600uF is fine for the 5000uF

Of course and I realize that. But anal me insists we be as close as possible. 

Been there. I’ve untrained myself from that way as it was getting expensive 

Meh. I'd have slapped a couple 2700uF on there so I could keep the leads through-the-PCB short, which is kindof the point of that adapter and all the different hole patterns it supports. Leaving those leads long like that fucks the ESR of the cap right to hell.

mnem
*unplucked*

I disagree. Given that the modern replacements have lower ESR than the originals I see zero net impact.

[AVGresponding]

Here is one for our Spara from The Signal Noise Path:

That was interesting.  I think I saw the same dead U1253B on eBay when I was looking at prices to see if the used one on Facebook Marketplace (still there...) was reasonable.  Also interesting is that the replacement display is a third party kit.  I could've sworn I saw somewhere that Keysight sold OEM displays as a replaceable part, particularly since that is a current product; I'll have to check their website later.  Another interesting thing is that it's the U1253A/B that get all the attention.  I haven't seen much said about the U1273A/AX or the insulation testers that also had OLED displays.  It's the insulation tester that worries me long term.  Those were recently discontinued and the seven year support period after the discontinuation date is starting to tick down.

One can get those modules here for example (NAWTS):

https://www.lcdandmore.de/c/display-module

https://lcdstore.de/epages/17406888.sf/de_DE/?ObjectPath=/Shops/17406888/Categories/Grafikmodul/GrafikOLEDModule

And I can confirm that they work very well indeed. I really need to motivate myself to find the front end issue on my 1273, it's a nice meter.

[AVGresponding]

Depends which V4. The Taunus V4 went from 1.2 to 1.7 litres. The Essex V4 was either 1.7 or 2.0 litres. I've no idea without researching, what might have been fitted to US market Capris.

Considering the shoehorning that Triumph had to do to fit the 2.0 litre straight six into the Spitfire chassis to make the GT6, it's no surprise that only someone of supreme pig-headed stubbornness would attempt to do it with a V6 lump.   

These were the engines where one tops up the fuel and refills the oil tank.

Ending up behind it on the Autobahn is an exercise in blue smoke.

The V6 IIRC was the worst.

Yep, Pops first Mk4 Zepher kept fouling one plug and mechanic suspected it had a broken ring from new.
Pop flicked it after a year IIRC and brought another one that went just fine unit a swift trip 6 5hr trip home with the bro-inlaw/my uncle up it blew a head gasket and that was the last Ford Pop ever owned.

Only a year or 2 later I started with Fords, Cortina Mk1 wagon, Mk3 sedan 1.6 crossflow, Mk3 sedan 2L OHC and last an Escort Mk2 1.6L Sport before I too learnt my lesson and never brought another. 

Then almost all vehicle production ceased in NZ so rather than EU stuff NZ mainly sourced from Oz and the land of the rising sun. I went to GM/Aussie Holden after the tragic run with Fords and still have a 2002 Commodore we brought new.
GM lost a lot of followers when they closed their 50+ year old Aussie plants only a year or so back when they were already sending an Aussie developed grunter to the US and UK and since then the Mustang has gained a large foothold and munched on GM's lunch. 

GM are turds----the megalomaniacs in Detroit just had to micromanage GMH to death!
The only way you will buy a GM car in OZ these days is via an unofficial importer.

Yep, we were just as shocked as you Aussies when the Holden closedown was announced.
Like Oz, NZ was full of Holdens everywhere you looked and now we're seeing them gradually disappear from the roads to be replaced mainly with rice burners of one sort or another.

Next I see gubbermints targeting diesels as they have in Europe but with the population densities of most of Oz and NZ there's little reason for it other than to appease the greenies that are so driven by the principles of the Paris accord they can't even read or understand the fine print ! 

Yes, they threw Vauxhall under the bus too; now it's owned by that pan-euro-atlantic-pacific shite-box maker Stellantis, and will no doubt be murdered and all remaining manufacturing facilities in the UK will be offshored.

[AVGresponding]

But, nothing beats the sound of a supercharger.

The current tractor has a 5cyl TDi engine, and the turbo whine when it starts to make more power at a steady rpm (cruise control, meet uphill) is very, very addictive.

The Bimmer has a turbo but you wouldn't know it from the noise - there isn't any. In fact there's precious little engine noise at all, anything short of full throttle and all you hear is a gentle rumble from the tyres and suspension. All very civilised. Oddly I appreciate the quiet, despite spending the last 22 years driving a mid-engined car with the intakes and valve gear separated from my head by 10 inches and one thin steel engine access cover that with some carpet on it is basically the parcel shelf inside the cabin.

I am not a fan of turbo fitted engines in general, I've driven quite a few over the years and the laggy throttle response at low RPMs makes me very uncomfortable - if I'm going to have intake boosting give me a supercharger any day. Thankfully there's some clever cooperation goes on between the electric and petrol engines in the Bimmer with the electric motor filling in any gaps left by the turbo, and the only time you notice any turbo lag is on standing starts with hard acceleration. If I'd know it had a turbo before I'd driven it I'd have probably given it a miss based on past experience.

Hmm, that's odd, because my car also has a turbo and I can honestly say that I have not noticed any lag in it cutting in at all.

A "modern" (post mid 90s) roadgoing turbo car will have most of the lag tuned out, at the expense of peak power. The only real performance detriment you notice nowadays is the lack of torque at very low revs in a modern diesel turbo (don't bother telling me about how yours can set off at idle; I know, so can mine. But where's your idle at? Close to 1krpm I'll bet, not the 300-500rpm of an old-school diesel).

No no, real men don't need to have a thumbing great V8 and all that racket that goes with them, you just need a decent Euro small engine designed with plenty of HP, decent sound muffling and reduce all that stupid gas guzzling to something more sensible for the sake of the planet and others. Chances are that a run, a smaller more sensible sized engined car will be just as quick or maybe quicker overall as your gas guzzler will need frequent fuel stops and the sensible car will be whizzing past the fuel pumps while the other will be sat there pouring gallon after of gallon of fuel down its neck and into the tank, increasing its weight again 

I do like the sound of an old-school NA V8, but those US ones are hilariously primitive, even the modern "advanced" ones aren't really; they're just a primitive V8 with fancy ancillaries to get the power up and emissions down(ish). My 20 year old, 4-cyl TT has 25% more valves than a typical modern US V8!

Yep. Rocking the 0.99L 3 cyl here 

Sounds like a V8 if you stick kangaroo juice in it.

Mines just a sensible 2 litre 4 cylinder, 125kW, producing 350Nm torque @1750 RPM with a 0-62mph of 8.6 seconds and frequently returns around 56 to 58 mpg on a run, that all the engine and power you need, especially on our roads.

Depends how much fun you want to have. 168kW (225bhp) is enough for quite a bit of fun in a small chassis, especially when you add in 4WD traction, but I have recently found myself wondering how much more I'd be prepared to risk with a remap and stock internals...

I gave up caring about mpg some time ago. It's fine if you live somewhere flat and only do motorway runs, but neither applies to me so I have to just shrug, accept the cost, and get on with it.

[xrunner]

Working on a restoration marking label for the hp 3476A. Coming along still want to do more work on the red and black marks. I have restored most of the missing red lines and worked on missing black areas. Frankly when it's printed the correct size as I have it any flaws won't be noticed as it is now. The plan is to make the tan background a transparent area. I also have to obliterate all the markings I tried to restore with a sharpie. Maybe some will overlap OK.

The reason they all got rubbed off is the way hp made this side panel. It can be closed if you didn't realize it. When it slides "closed" two fuses pop out and hold it, and they are a pain in the arse to get pushed down again so the panel can be closed (or opened pick your word). You find yourself fumbling and pushing with all fingers and looking for tools to push the fuses down at the same time.

Meh - not the greatest example of hp engineering out there. 

[bd139]

I wouldn’t worry about precision there. They are usually specified to -20% +100%. A 5600uF is fine for the 5000uF

Of course and I realize that. But anal me insists we be as close as possible. 

Been there. I’ve untrained myself from that way as it was getting expensive 

Meh. I'd have slapped a couple 2700uF on there so I could keep the leads through-the-PCB short, which is kindof the point of that adapter and all the different hole patterns it supports. Leaving those leads long like that fucks the ESR of the cap right to hell.

mnem
*unplucked*

I disagree. Given that the modern replacements have lower ESR than the originals I see zero net impact.

Yep. ESR on them isn’t that important. They’re just there to stop the regulators dropping out at 100/120Hz. Anything which requires lumps of current is well decoupled with tants. Now if you replace the tants that’s a different thing. 2x the value low ESR electrolytics are fine there. But main supply caps, any old shit will do.

[mnementh]

Yep. Rocking the 0.99L 3 cyl here 

Sounds like a V8 if you stick kangaroo juice in it.

I think you've been drinking too much of the kangaroo juice. Nothing sound like a V-8 except a V-8.

I have no problem with folks keeping the heavy metal of yesteryear alive... I'll always be a motorhead, and there still is no replacement for displacement. But this is a different world; these toys of yesteryear have to be treated as toys, not as a way of life if we are to survive as a species. We cannot afford for those lovely beasts to be anybody's "daily driver" any longer.

mnem

[mnementh]

But, nothing beats the sound of a supercharger.

The current tractor has a 5cyl TDi engine, and the turbo whine when it starts to make more power at a steady rpm (cruise control, meet uphill) is very, very addictive.

The Bimmer has a turbo but you wouldn't know it from the noise - there isn't any. In fact there's precious little engine noise at all, anything short of full throttle and all you hear is a gentle rumble from the tyres and suspension. All very civilised. Oddly I appreciate the quiet, despite spending the last 22 years driving a mid-engined car with the intakes and valve gear separated from my head by 10 inches and one thin steel engine access cover that with some carpet on it is basically the parcel shelf inside the cabin.

I am not a fan of turbo fitted engines in general, I've driven quite a few over the years and the laggy throttle response at low RPMs makes me very uncomfortable - if I'm going to have intake boosting give me a supercharger any day. Thankfully there's some clever cooperation goes on between the electric and petrol engines in the Bimmer with the electric motor filling in any gaps left by the turbo, and the only time you notice any turbo lag is on standing starts with hard acceleration. If I'd know it had a turbo before I'd driven it I'd have probably given it a miss based on past experience.

Hmm, that's odd, because my car also has a turbo and I can honestly say that I have not noticed any lag in it cutting in at all.

Yes, well... we all know that most of your driving experience is in land yachts stuffed to the gunwales with commuters and grammas lugging groceries. We wouldn't expect you to notice the difference.

mnem

[AVGresponding]

Yep. Rocking the 0.99L 3 cyl here 

Sounds like a V8 if you stick kangaroo juice in it.

I think you've been drinking too much of the kangaroo juice. Nothing sound like a V-8 except a V-8.

I have no problem with folks keeping the heavy metal of yesteryear alive... I'll always be a motorhead, and there still is no replacement for displacement. But this is a different world; these toys of yesteryear have to be treated as toys, not as a way of life if we are to survive as a species. We cannot afford for those lovely beasts to be anybody's "daily driver" any longer.

mnem

Aaaaand this has always been utter nonsense. This is why Colin Chapman's designs blew all the primitive displacement based ones into the weeds.

The only thing adding displacement is good for is going fast in a straight line. For anything else, weight reduction is the real answer. Hence how Mini Coopers could beat 7-litre+ yank tanks in the early days of touring cars.

[AVGresponding]

I keep getting distracted... I only really logged on to post that the seller of the bench grinder (assetclear) issued a pretty much instant full refund and apology without ebay getting involved.

I also get to keep the grinder, though it'll for sure not be getting used as such, at least on the right hand stub. Maybe a polishing wheel on that side, and maybe I can find a decent stone for the left hand stub, which does run true but the stones that came with are both warped.

[tautech]

I keep getting distracted... I only really logged on to post that the seller of the bench grinder (assetclear) issued a pretty much instant full refund and apology without ebay getting involved.

I also get to keep the grinder, though it'll for sure not be getting used as such, at least on the right hand stub. Maybe a polishing wheel on that side, and maybe I can find a decent stone for the left hand stub, which does run true but the stones that came with are both warped.

Get a wire wheel for it and you can thank me later as you'll end up using it more than if it had just stones on it.

[AVGresponding]

I keep getting distracted... I only really logged on to post that the seller of the bench grinder (assetclear) issued a pretty much instant full refund and apology without ebay getting involved.

I also get to keep the grinder, though it'll for sure not be getting used as such, at least on the right hand stub. Maybe a polishing wheel on that side, and maybe I can find a decent stone for the left hand stub, which does run true but the stones that came with are both warped.

Get a wire wheel for it and you can thank me later as you'll end up using it more than if it had just stones on it.

Yeah, that's another thing I'd considered. No big deal to do both, it doesn't take long to swap a wheel after all.

[mnementh]

Yep. Rocking the 0.99L 3 cyl here 

Sounds like a V8 if you stick kangaroo juice in it.

I think you've been drinking too much of the kangaroo juice. Nothing sound like a V-8 except a V-8.

I have no problem with folks keeping the heavy metal of yesteryear alive... I'll always be a motorhead, and there still is no replacement for displacement. But this is a different world; these toys of yesteryear have to be treated as toys, not as a way of life if we are to survive as a species. We cannot afford for those lovely beasts to be anybody's "daily driver" any longer.

mnem

Aaaaand this has always been utter nonsense. This is why Colin Chapman's designs blew all the primitive displacement based ones into the weeds.

The only thing adding displacement is good for is going fast in a straight line. For anything else, weight reduction is the real answer. Hence how Mini Coopers could beat 7-litre+ yank tanks in the early days of touring cars.

And it's equally arguable that your line of reasoning is just wankers spankin' it because they can't get their hands on a real car.

Anything you can do to a tiny engine you can do to a big engine and get even more power. Simple physics.

You don't have a right to judge how people like to play, or their choice of toys... don't be a dick, man.

mnem
 

[mnementh]

I keep getting distracted... I only really logged on to post that the seller of the bench grinder (assetclear) issued a pretty much instant full refund and apology without ebay getting involved.

I also get to keep the grinder, though it'll for sure not be getting used as such, at least on the right hand stub. Maybe a polishing wheel on that side, and maybe I can find a decent stone for the left hand stub, which does run true but the stones that came with are both warped.

Get a wire wheel for it and you can thank me later as you'll end up using it more than if it had just stones on it.

1000x this. My shop isn't complete without a grinder that has coarse rope wire wheel on one side for heavy debriding and a medium terrier-hair-bristle wheel on the other for cleaning threads and bolt heads. Then another grinder or two for actual grinding wheels. 

mnem
*sigh* Delta 10" drill press on CL for $75... and I'm tapped out*

[AVGresponding]

Yep. Rocking the 0.99L 3 cyl here 

Sounds like a V8 if you stick kangaroo juice in it.

I think you've been drinking too much of the kangaroo juice. Nothing sound like a V-8 except a V-8.

I have no problem with folks keeping the heavy metal of yesteryear alive... I'll always be a motorhead, and there still is no replacement for displacement. But this is a different world; these toys of yesteryear have to be treated as toys, not as a way of life if we are to survive as a species. We cannot afford for those lovely beasts to be anybody's "daily driver" any longer.

mnem

Aaaaand this has always been utter nonsense. This is why Colin Chapman's designs blew all the primitive displacement based ones into the weeds.

The only thing adding displacement is good for is going fast in a straight line. For anything else, weight reduction is the real answer. Hence how Mini Coopers could beat 7-litre+ yank tanks in the early days of touring cars.

And it's equally arguable that your line of reasoning is just wankers spankin' it because they can't get their hands on a real car.

Anything you can do to a tiny engine you can do to a big engine and get even more power. Simple physics.

You don't have a right to judge how people like to play, or their choice of toys... don't be a dick, man.

mnem
 

You're completely missing the point, not sure if deliberately or not, but w/e.

The Point: Weight reduction improves EVERY aspect of a car's performance. Putting a bigger engine in it, or for that matter keeping the same engine and increasing the power by boring/stroking it, ONLY improves (assuming you have the traction and gearing headroom) straight line acceleration and top speed. That is simple physics.

I have not at any point criticised or judged other people's method or means of playing, that's entirely in your head. I put it to you that it is not I that is "being a dick".

[bd139]

On cars. MOT pass. No issues. Dealer did it. Did some additional checks on it, topped up the oil and washer fluid and cleaned it inside and out. Latter was all free  .  They send you the report via email with full video of them doing it linked.

Full £54.85 but worth it IMHO over cheaping it out for a tenner saving.

Still done bugger all miles. Just hit 35k on a 2014 car.

[dl6lr]

"Ford is a company that builds cars in order for Opel to not be the worst brand around."

Never buy a car starting with 'F':
Ford
Fiat
French

[bd139]

The car I just mentioned is French  (Citroen)

Agree with Fiat (last one was one of those turds)

[mnementh]

Yep. Rocking the 0.99L 3 cyl here 

Sounds like a V8 if you stick kangaroo juice in it.

I think you've been drinking too much of the kangaroo juice. Nothing sound like a V-8 except a V-8.

I have no problem with folks keeping the heavy metal of yesteryear alive... I'll always be a motorhead, and there still is no replacement for displacement. But this is a different world; these toys of yesteryear have to be treated as toys, not as a way of life if we are to survive as a species. We cannot afford for those lovely beasts to be anybody's "daily driver" any longer.

mnem

Aaaaand this has always been utter nonsense. This is why Colin Chapman's designs blew all the primitive displacement based ones into the weeds.

The only thing adding displacement is good for is going fast in a straight line. For anything else, weight reduction is the real answer. Hence how Mini Coopers could beat 7-litre+ yank tanks in the early days of touring cars.

And it's equally arguable that your line of reasoning is just wankers spankin' it because they can't get their hands on a real car.

Anything you can do to a tiny engine you can do to a big engine and get even more power. Simple physics.

You don't have a right to judge how people like to play, or their choice of toys... don't be a dick, man.

mnem
 

You're completely missing the point, not sure if deliberately or not, but w/e.

The Point: Weight reduction improves EVERY aspect of a car's performance. Putting a bigger engine in it, or for that matter keeping the same engine and increasing the power by boring/stroking it, ONLY improves (assuming you have the traction and gearing headroom) straight line acceleration and top speed. That is simple physics.

I have not at any point criticised or judged other people's method or means of playing, that's entirely in your head. I put it to you that it is not I that is "being a dick".

That is exactly what you were doing. There is nothing wrong with wanting NOTHING MORE than to go fast in a straight line. There is nothing wrong with wanting to strap your ass to the biggest chunk of horsepower you can muster, and just PUNCH IT.

You were passing judgement on that, and denigrating that form of play. You were being a dick.

EDIT: And speaking of MISSING THE POINT ENTIRELY: My point was explicitly that musclecars are a toy and need to be treated as such. You're the one had to jump on them being huge and wasteful, as if that matters more than a fat heap of dingoes' kidneys when we're talking about toys.

mnem
Try putting a 460 into a VW Beetle some time. The thrill is visceral, and partly because it is dumb and dangerous and puts you out of control.

[Cerebus]

Hmm, that's odd, because my car also has a turbo and I can honestly say that I have not noticed any lag in it cutting in at all.

Turbodiesels are better in this regard than turbo petrol engines, partially because any diesel has a flatter broader torque curve so there's less of a  low spot and it's  less noticeable, and one also just doesn't expect the throttle response from a diesel that one does from a petrol engine. Plus you're used to a car with a 0-60 time of 10 seconds or longer (I'm not sure exactly which model you have), whereas I'm really talking about sport models more in 6 to 7 second bracket where these things are much more noticeable.

[Cerebus]

Yes, they threw Vauxhall under the bus too; now it's owned by that pan-euro-atlantic-pacific shite-box maker Stellantis, and will no doubt be murdered and all remaining manufacturing facilities in the UK will be offshored.

I thought that had already happened or was already at least substantively planned and announced, although I'm quite prepared to admit that I haven't been paying attention.

[dl6lr]

The car I just mentioned is French  (Citroen)

Got a Citroen as a replacement car after an accident in winter 2010. It had a full metal gear shift knob and it felt it was bound to permafrost through a heat pipe...

[bd139]

The car I just mentioned is French  (Citroen)

Got a Citroen as a replacement car after an accident in winter 2010. It had a full metal gear shift knob and it felt it was bound to permafrost through a heat pipe...

That’s a feature. The gear stick goes into an ice cube tray full of large nuts.

Citroen can’t do gear boxes I will admit 

[Cerebus]

Depends how much fun you want to have. 168kW (225bhp) is enough for quite a bit of fun in a small chassis, especially when you add in 4WD traction, but I have recently found myself wondering how much more I'd be prepared to risk with a remap and stock internals...

I gave up caring about mpg some time ago. It's fine if you live somewhere flat and only do motorway runs, but neither applies to me so I have to just shrug, accept the cost, and get on with it.

Depends. My old MGF with a paltry 143 bhp and 1100kg wet + driver will leave many a nominally more powerful car in the dust. Sure it's got a theoretical maximum straight line speed of 130 mph and will take all week to get there. But a 0-60 of 7 secs, wide power band with faultless handling and a "corners on rails" attitude more than makes up for the overall lack of grunt. I've always felt that if you want to really have fun, get a small car.

As far as mpg goes it'll do 25 mpg in city stop start traffic and 50 mpg easily on long runs.

[mnementh]

I wouldn’t worry about precision there. They are usually specified to -20% +100%. A 5600uF is fine for the 5000uF

Of course and I realize that. But anal me insists we be as close as possible. 

Been there. I’ve untrained myself from that way as it was getting expensive 

Meh. I'd have slapped a couple 2700uF on there so I could keep the leads through-the-PCB short, which is kindof the point of that adapter and all the different hole patterns it supports. Leaving those leads long like that fucks the ESR of the cap right to hell.

mnem
*unplucked*

I disagree. Given that the modern replacements have lower ESR than the originals I see zero net impact.

Yep. ESR on them isn’t that important. They’re just there to stop the regulators dropping out at 100/120Hz. Anything which requires lumps of current is well decoupled with tants. Now if you replace the tants that’s a different thing. 2x the value low ESR electrolytics are fine there. But main supply caps, any old shit will do.

It has nothing to do with that. It has to do with tiny lead diameter. You can get away with the tiny leads on modern caps when they're 1.5mm long; the wire resistance means diddly. Make them 10mm long and that's a different story altogether. I've seen it demonstrated time and again in high-current amplifiers and the high-current ESCs we use in our quadcopters.

The instantaneous voltage sag that creates is something you can see in real world performance, in dB Drags and in how the quad handles or flips upside down when it should be able to right itself. And I've seen it measured with a scope by people a lot smarter than me, who know how to measure these things correctly.

Now as to whether it is going to matter in this application... probably not. As old man Kirsch used to say: "Choobs are a voltage amplifier; transistors are a current amplifier." (yes, I know this is a gross oversimplification; he said it to make a point about the difference in the way you have to think when designing these circuits most of the time) Meaning the current loading of this system is much lower, so we probably won't see a damn bit of difference.

But it's good practice to keep those leads as close as possible to "just long enough to go through the PCB", because that is how they're designed to be used.

mnem