Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 16502536 times)

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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123475 on: June 20, 2022, 03:25:02 pm »
Am I correct in assuming that all mechanical telephone exchanges have been taken off line?

I'll have money on there still being some hidden away in Rural England or Wales. They claim to have decommissioned the last Strowger exchange on the British public network on the Isle of Jura in Sept. 1995. There are rumours that Railtrack still have some on their (extensive) private network and I find that all too believable.
are you sure?  might have to dig a little deeper.   would have bet that in the public network there would be a union rule mandating the retention of manual plug switchboards.
:-DD

I think you underestimate quite how effectively the unions were gutted in this country starting in the Thatcher years. Remembering the years when the Communication Worker's Union could command that sort of power would no doubt result in retired members crying into their beer. The days when trades union members could expect to be invited to No. 10 Downing Street for a convivial chat over "beer and sandwiches" disappeared with Harold Wilson's Gannex mac.

I was jess a senseless teenager then, tho I do still remember comedic assertions that Reagan and Thatcher were the respective male/females clones of Mussolini more than once for their union-busting jihads. Which do you suppose infected the other...? How bad was it over there back then...?

I'm just curious how it felt from a "sitting around the pub for a brew" perspective... not the political crap. Was it really as obvious over there what was being stolen away as it was over here?

mnem
*historical theater*
In my opinion, yes it was, whole communities were just about wiped out at the time and became almost ghost towns as most of the younger ones jumped on their political bicycles and disappeared to other areas where jobs were to be found, leaving the handicapped, elderly and sick behind, I remember it as being a very bleak time indeed.
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123476 on: June 20, 2022, 03:37:28 pm »
Uggh... that's grim. It was similar over here.  :-[

Whole towns around Pittsburgh literally dried up & blew away; the only thing left in McKeesport when we moved to Mt Lebanon was the local gin mill with a few old połocks grumbling aboot how "things will be better once we get the damned mills open again..." No concept of how that was to happen, of course...

Cerebus...? Do you recall what it felt like when the unions died?

mnem
*pulls up a rug & just listens*
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 03:46:38 pm by mnementh »
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123477 on: June 20, 2022, 03:44:37 pm »
5440 update: <snip> Bedtime or thereabouts now, will ponder on through the week.

Now have nice A3 printouts of the Artek-supplied schematics. This will improve work.
That's indispensable even !  ;D   I have plan to try and get an old cheap A3 B&W printer solely for that very purpose ! In the mean time I make do with A4 size, or if I am well motivated, two A4 sheets taped together...

Pffft! A3 size is for those who don't know how to leverage the corporate machine. Artek scans are usually of sufficient resolution to blow up to 18" x 24" or even 24" x 36" poster size at your local KINKO's or equivalent. I got the 18" x 24" done on large-format laser printer from my local FEDEX depot when I was working on my Tek 2230 more than a decade ago... cost me $2/sheet on plain paper, and schematics were crisp & clean as a new dollar bill.  :-+

More than worth the assache.

mnem
 :-BROKE
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 03:51:57 pm by mnementh »
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123478 on: June 20, 2022, 03:48:39 pm »


This came up in my feed today... Sam is again being entirely too excited about some old analog technology.  :-DD

Part II for those who actually give a damn: https://youtu.be/X4WiXp1wAyw

mnem
 :popcorn:
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 03:50:38 pm by mnementh »
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Offline Cubdriver

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123479 on: June 20, 2022, 03:59:32 pm »
I've done a bit of poking and prodding at that NLS DVM I mentioned a few days ago.  After replacing a thyratron tube that was cracked and had vented to atmosphere, I've gotten the stepper relays to run fairly reliably and it seems to measure more or less properly.


-Pat

Damn, Pat... Does Ma Bell know you have half the Hartford exchange's relays there in that little box...?  :-DD

I know I'm gonna get some *cringe* over suggesting it... but on the reluctant ones, maybe some crocus cloth or 1500 grit wet-dry sanding film, followed by some card stock wetted with alcohol...?

I know I had similar *cringe* when Papa Smurf did it to the switch fingers/contact PCBs in one of his scopes... but here we are years later and they seem to have weathered the assault okay...  :-//

mnem


If another dose or three of contact cleaner doesn't fix it, I may wind up going that route, but am saving it to use as a last resort.  The good thing is that they look like they're probably phosphor bronze contacts, and don't appear to be plated with anything, so a very gentle scrub shouldn't cause them harm.

-Pat
If it jams, force it.  If it breaks, you needed a new one anyway...
 
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Offline Cubdriver

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123480 on: June 20, 2022, 04:05:26 pm »
I want to hear the steppers clicking as the voltage varies.  :-+

I made a quick recording of the unit in operation as it currently stands just a few minutes ago.  The relay contacts are going to need more cleaning - last night the LSD was working most of the time; today it's back to being out more than on.  The third digit was much better last night, too.  More Deoxit is in the cards, but in the meantime, behold stepper relays clattering away for your enjoyment...



-Pat
If it jams, force it.  If it breaks, you needed a new one anyway...
 

Offline Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123481 on: June 20, 2022, 04:16:21 pm »
5440 update: <snip> Bedtime or thereabouts now, will ponder on through the week.

Now have nice A3 printouts of the Artek-supplied schematics. This will improve work.
That's indispensable even !  ;D   I have plan to try and get an old cheap A3 B&W printer solely for that very purpose ! In the mean time I make do with A4 size, or if I am well motivated, two A4 sheets taped together...

Pffft! A3 size is for those who don't know how to leverage the corporate machine. Artek scans are usually of sufficient resolution to blow up to 18" x 24" or even 24" x 36" poster size at your local KINKO's or equivalent. I got the 18" x 24" done on large-format laser printer from my local FEDEX depot when I was working on my Tek 2230 more than a decade ago... cost me $2/sheet on plain paper, and schematics were crisp & clean as a new dollar bill.  :-+

More than worth the assache.

mnem
 :-BROKE

Well given that the schematic is meant to lie on the bench so you can take notes of all,your measurements and what not, next to your boat anchor and TE around it.... you would have to have one huge workbench my dear !!!  :scared:

A3 size to me is the perfect size, and if sometimes might be too large/getting in the way too much, you can just fold it and just display the part of it that you are currently interested in.
It's A3 for me. Of course for simple schematics, A4 when it suffices. As long as it's easily readable, then the smaller the better, to keep the bench as unencumbered as possible.

 

Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123482 on: June 20, 2022, 04:17:51 pm »
Uggh... that's grim. It was similar over here.  :-[

Whole towns around Pittsburgh literally dried up & blew away; the only thing left in McKeesport when we moved to Mt Lebanon was the local gin mill with a few old połocks grumbling aboot how "things will be better once we get the damned mills open again..." No concept of how that was to happen, of course...

Cerebus...? Do you recall what it felt like when the unions died?

mnem
*pulls up a rug & just listens*

Unions are basically suicide cults.

10 Watch the train strike over the next few days.
20 Then watch the commuters decline and work from home.
30 Then watch the rail companies cut service and staff.
40 GOTO 10

If unions got their way we’d all be in a polluted coal fired dystopia with twenty foreman required to have a shit.

Don’t strike. Get educated. Unions should be helping with that.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 04:21:24 pm by bd139 »
 

Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123483 on: June 20, 2022, 04:18:13 pm »
If a UPS is boiling a car battery, it would cook an SLA in half the time; the float voltage should be lower, and if it isn't, it's either (1) badly adjusted and/or (2) a POS.

If you deep discharge any lead acid you reduce its life, including so called deep cycle ones, and you do not deep cycle UPS batteries, unless you (a) have a lot of power cuts and also (b) don't do a controlled power down when the mains fails, and just run the UPS until low battery cutoff.

Maybe you have routinely seen One Hung Low brands in tiny UPSs like that, but I can assure you that the kind of places that use proper machines (50kVA and up) would shit a brick if you put crap like that in their battery string.

Yuasa and the like have much better quality lead. I don't care if it does come from the same place, they use the premium line, and the locals use the value brand.

And we are NOT talking about those machines; I know the difference, man... gimme a fucking break. You're making a straw-man argument here. Completely different class from the ones I serviced regularly, and I specifically stated that. As soon as I said 1.5-5KVA, I KNOW you knew the difference.

Those systems I worked/work on are mostly used used in retail, so aren't going to be the top tier, "failure is not an option" class machines... but even they are not the same class as this decades-old consumer grade unit from CompUSA.

What those classes of deployment use is irrelevant here. That is not appropriate technology for this application. That UPS probably came with a PowerSonic or equivalent Chinesium battery, and spending 40-50 bux on a genuine Yuasa "upgrade" is money wasted in this application.

As for the float charge... I think you need to review that. I know from personal experience that a new known good motorcycle or garden tractor battery used in this application will start to boil in a few days or a week; I've tried it on two different occasions. Shallow-cycle starting batteries do not tolerate constant float-charge the same way that deep-cycle batteries do.

I think you'll find the difference is in fact the IR of the battery... but I don't want to start another shit-flinging match here.  :palm:

mnem
 :-/O

Standard SLAs are not deep cycle. That would be the kind that they use in mobility scooters etc, "traction batteries" I believe they are known as.

I maintain (crap pun, unintended, keeping it anyway) that if your charger is boiling liquid lead acid batteries, it's just set too high. You shouldn't see that kind of reaction unless you're doing an equalisation charge.

My principal point is this: you can spend idk £5-10 on a cheap shit 12V 12Ah battery, that will probably last 6 months, and will probably be actually around half the claimed capacity, or you can spend £30 or so on a decent branded one that has all the chooch it says it does, and it'll last 5+ years. If you tweak the float voltage down to 13.2-13.5 or so, a lot +.
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Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123484 on: June 20, 2022, 04:21:46 pm »
Uggh... that's grim. It was similar over here.  :-[

Whole towns around Pittsburgh literally dried up & blew away; the only thing left in McKeesport when we moved to Mt Lebanon was the local gin mill with a few old połocks grumbling aboot how "things will be better once we get the damned mills open again..." No concept of how that was to happen, of course...

Cerebus...? Do you recall what it felt like when the unions died?

mnem
*pulls up a rug & just listens*

Unions are basically suicide cults.

10 Watch the train strike over the next few days.
20 Then watch the commuters decline and work from home.
30 Then watch the rail companies cut service and staff.
40 GOTO 10

There should be a better way.

There is. Pay the staff a decent wage, don't fuck them over with hire-and-fire contracts to cut back their pay/benefits/conditions, don't force compulsory redundancies on them while paying top managers large bonuses, and don't claim to be negotiating while basically refusing to change your position at all.
nuqDaq yuch Dapol?
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123485 on: June 20, 2022, 04:22:59 pm »
Uggh... that's grim. It was similar over here.  :-[

Whole towns around Pittsburgh literally dried up & blew away; the only thing left in McKeesport when we moved to Mt Lebanon was the local gin mill with a few old połocks grumbling aboot how "things will be better once we get the damned mills open again..." No concept of how that was to happen, of course...

Cerebus...? Do you recall what it felt like when the unions died?

mnem
*pulls up a rug & just listens*

Unions are basically suicide cults.

10 Watch the train strike over the next few days.
20 Then watch the commuters decline and work from home.
30 Then watch the rail companies cut service and staff.
40 GOTO 10

There should be a better way.

There is. Pay the staff a decent wage, don't fuck them over with hire-and-fire contracts to cut back their pay/benefits/conditions, don't force compulsory redundancies on them while paying top managers large bonuses, and don't claim to be negotiating while basically refusing to change your position at all.

Perhaps people should stop voting for this then  :-//

This country is full of retards.

Also see my edit. Unions are as regressive as the current situation. Legal situation and legislation is the problem. And you aren’t going to fix that without education, legal professionals and political interest.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 04:24:45 pm by bd139 »
 
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Offline Cubdriver

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123486 on: June 20, 2022, 04:24:29 pm »
I've done a bit of poking and prodding at that NLS DVM I mentioned a few days ago.  After replacing a thyratron tube that was cracked and had vented to atmosphere, I've gotten the stepper relays to run fairly reliably and it seems to measure more or less properly.


One big issue is that the relay contacts are cruddy as it sat unused for an unknown length of time in a basement, so unlike the full display in the picture above, in many instances one or more of the digits doesn't light up.


I'm working on making up a longer video showing the troubleshooting (actually sprung for editing software to try to string clips together for a change), but in the meantime, here is a quickie video showing how to clean the stepper relay contacts using Deoxit and a piece of paper.  They're still not perfect (some skips still), but are a whole lot better than they were a few nights ago.
youtube.com/watch?v=eeJXLf0qoNM

Now to do the rest of them...

-Pat

Ooohhhhhh, now that is some real quality porn right there.....

Do want! Tinkering with that at night with some random electronics youtube vids humming in the background is the dream.


Let that deoxit soak for a bit, the contacts will come good eventually with some excersise.

I want to hear the steppers clicking as the voltage varies.  :-+

That's why we Germans would call this a "Klapperatismus"

It reminds me of an old telephone exchange, wonder if it sounds similar....

Similar, but those exchange relays step in two dimensions, so the klunks they make sound different from one another - first set of steps indexes the armature axially to one of the ten banks of contacts, and the second steps it radially to the correct contact.  Then when the call disconnects, it is first released in the radial direction to disengage the contacts, then drops back axially to the home position.

Impressively reliable tech, given the constant use and mechanical complexity.

-Pat
If it jams, force it.  If it breaks, you needed a new one anyway...
 

Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123487 on: June 20, 2022, 04:25:09 pm »
Has anyone ever seen a calculator like this at all? I can't recall seeing anything like myself.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313959676347

looks like the one the predator wore on his wrist.
      https://www.amazon.com/Boogie-Board-8-5-Inch-Writing-PT01085CYAA0002/dp/B00AFPR68E/


It's just a cheap calcrapulator combined with one of these to jot notes on. The panel is not an input device; it's literally just electrically erasable notepaper.

mnem
 :-/O

I am inclined to agree. What I found particularly puzzling was this warning:

"2. Don't rinse with water or directly touch the fire source."

Something you want to tell the group here Mnem..?
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123488 on: June 20, 2022, 04:26:07 pm »
If it’s aliexpress then a fire source it could possibly be too. Like those T12’s  :-DD
 

Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123489 on: June 20, 2022, 04:28:25 pm »
Uggh... that's grim. It was similar over here.  :-[

Whole towns around Pittsburgh literally dried up & blew away; the only thing left in McKeesport when we moved to Mt Lebanon was the local gin mill with a few old połocks grumbling aboot how "things will be better once we get the damned mills open again..." No concept of how that was to happen, of course...

Cerebus...? Do you recall what it felt like when the unions died?

mnem
*pulls up a rug & just listens*

Unions are basically suicide cults.

10 Watch the train strike over the next few days.
20 Then watch the commuters decline and work from home.
30 Then watch the rail companies cut service and staff.
40 GOTO 10

There should be a better way.

There is. Pay the staff a decent wage, don't fuck them over with hire-and-fire contracts to cut back their pay/benefits/conditions, don't force compulsory redundancies on them while paying top managers large bonuses, and don't claim to be negotiating while basically refusing to change your position at all.

Perhaps people should stop voting for this then  :-//

This country is full of retards.

Also see my edit. Unions are as regressive as the current situation. Legal situation and legislation is the problem. And you aren’t going to fix that without education, legal professionals and political interest.

This much is beyond question. Sadly so are the unions, and like most other organisations, the scum rises to the top. I am a socialist and a unionist, and I despair of the incompetence displayed.

Probably best to end this subject before Dave turns up with his Politics Banhammer...
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123490 on: June 20, 2022, 04:29:50 pm »
Incidentally I agree on all counts  :-DD

And off to TE. Nothing on eBay today. Disappointing. Will be attending Newbury radio rally next weekend though
 

Offline Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123491 on: June 20, 2022, 04:37:01 pm »
Chinese Tester Time.

When the components leads are too big or too far apart to fit into the ZIF socket... what do you do...

So far I made do with grabbing 3 Dupont wires, shoving them in the socket, then grab 3 crocodile test leads and connected them to the Dupont wire.

This was not very convenient... takes time to set up, wires are way too long, it's a mess on the bench that takes way too much space, looks crap and wires just catch on stuff whe I drop stuff around the bench.
And it takes time to dismantle and put stuff back into the drawer.

So... after 6 month of hard R&D work and many prototypes, testing, qualifying, quality control etc.. I have finally just come up with that state of the art revolutionary solution.
Soon for sale for only 150 Euros + 50 Euros shipping.

Had bought some grabbers a fdew years ago, never used them... cheap Ebay stuff.... they look and feel very cheap, but they do the job  :-//
Still, when I am rich I think I will replace them with better quality ones. That must exist somewhere, I guess.

Now the cable is short, much more "manageable" both on the bench and once stored in the drawer.
One piece cable, and devoted to the tester, which means set up time is much reduced. Cable can just stay plugged in the tester at all times. Grab the tester... cable is already htere ready to use. Don't need it ? just open the ZIF socket and pull the cable out.

It makes my life so much better, I love this little cable... and it took only a few minutes to do. Well worth it....

Obviously designing and building such a tremendously advanced piece,  has blown my neuron budget for the next 20 years, so not much will happen in the lab for a while now...



« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 04:39:02 pm by Vince »
 
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Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123492 on: June 20, 2022, 04:50:07 pm »
On topic, some TE stuff. That 3478 went for £86 plus shipping. Much of the other TE they had listed went unsold, so we can look forward to half priced relists in a day or so.



Some ebay spots, maybe something for would be Ferengi here:

Or not, who knows:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/334477999891





Test your IR laser with this:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/354112785935





Another one of these odd things:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144610017121





Cheap (for now) counter:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/295048808057





Another HP counter, maybe? Wonder what happened to the original front panel, surely this is a replacement?  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/125376931629





This is in need of a kick in the lowballs:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144610110499





Coffee table ornament?  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265740767106





Don't know if this is the same one, but one sold for £50 the other day. Could be a fucker flipper:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/204000207050

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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123493 on: June 20, 2022, 04:54:33 pm »
The signature analyser is rather useful for debugging old HP kit. They tend to go for a fair amount of cash.

As for the counter with the replacement panel it gets worse the more you read and look at at the pictures. I expect the original plastic panel was damaged in some way, not an unusual thing on those counters. Shame really.

Also 5328A = cancer. If it works great but noisy. If it doesn’t, nightmare. 5334B is a far nicer and somehow considerably cheaper bit of kit usually.

Anyway trying not to buy more stuff because it’s hard enough moving with what I’ve bought in the last 2 months  :-DD
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 04:56:50 pm by bd139 »
 
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123494 on: June 20, 2022, 05:01:32 pm »
I was jess a senseless teenager then, tho I do still remember comedic assertions that Reagan and Thatcher were the respective male/females clones of Mussolini more than once for their union-busting jihads. Which do you suppose infected the other...? How bad was it over there back then...?

I'm just curious how it felt from a "sitting around the pub for a brew" perspective... not the political crap. Was it really as obvious over there what was being stolen away as it was over here?

mnem
*historical theater*

Some of the unions had gone power mad. They'd diverted from their reasonable and legitimate job of defending their members to becoming hubs of political power in and off themselves. Even in their legitimate place, they had gone from protecting workers from managerial greed or malfeasance to controlling whole industries.

I had personal experience of this. I used to help run a small print shop that was part of the student union. We weren't a 'print union shop'  despite being being unionised in a non-print union in a "post-entry closed shop" (i.e. To work there you had to be a member of the staff union, but you could start working there as long as you joined the union after starting). So, unionised up to the hilt - staff in the closed-shop staff union who were themselves working for a union.

If we wanted to get something printed that was beyond the physical capabilities of our print machines we had to send it out to another printers. If that printers was unionised, with the printers either members of SOGAT or the NGA, they would not accept work from us (unionised to the hilt remember, but not in a print union) unless the the artwork we sent them was from another SOGAT or NGA unionised shop with an official union stamp or sticker on the back of the artwork. We had a mate (Wolfie) who ran his own commercial printshop as a one man business who was an NGA member (business owner, father of chapel [NGA shop steward] and sole branch member all rolled into one person) precisely to get around the union cartel in the printing world. For an occasional drink, he used to stick his NGA stamp on the back of any artwork we wanted to send out to a (different) unionised shop.

So basically that situation was insanity across a whole industry just because the union had let power go to their heads, and the rest of the world had let them get away with it.

On the other hand, the Thatcher government had a doctrinaire loathing of the mere existence of unions. There were excesses, just as I've illustrated, that needed kerbing, but Thatcher el al merely used that as an excuse to do their damnedest to get as close to eradicating unions as they could get away with.

So fault, and excess, on both sides. Two immovable forces both determined to move each other, what could go wrong? Meantime, the general public suffered while the unions and government fought it out in public with coal, steel, firemen, power, transport and teachers strikes called left right and centre as tactics in a fight to retain power, and the police misused to suppress them at every opportunity (I have credible reports from people I trust, and who were there, of the police using agent provocateurs to start violence at otherwise boisterous but peaceful pickets).

In the late 70s the unions had set themselves up for a fall, Thatcher et al took advantage of that and took the fight beyond a "reasonable victory" to as close to genocide as they could get away with. The loser was the unions, weakened by successive governments. The ultimate losers are ordinary working folks, where the power of the unions has been weakened by law to the point where it is difficult for them to be effective. There was a time where almost every blue collar, and many white collar, workers were members of a union, now union membership is comparatively rare.

Ironically, there is a national rail strike called for tomorrow.
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 
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Offline m k

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123495 on: June 20, 2022, 05:01:54 pm »
5440 update: <snip> Bedtime or thereabouts now, will ponder on through the week.

Now have nice A3 printouts of the Artek-supplied schematics. This will improve work.
That's indispensable even !  ;D   I have plan to try and get an old cheap A3 B&W printer solely for that very purpose ! In the mean time I make do with A4 size, or if I am well motivated, two A4 sheets taped together...

Pffft! A3 size is for those who don't know how to leverage the corporate machine. Artek scans are usually of sufficient resolution to blow up to 18" x 24" or even 24" x 36" poster size at your local KINKO's or equivalent. I got the 18" x 24" done on large-format laser printer from my local FEDEX depot when I was working on my Tek 2230 more than a decade ago... cost me $2/sheet on plain paper, and schematics were crisp & clean as a new dollar bill.  :-+

More than worth the assache.

mnem
 :-BROKE

Well given that the schematic is meant to lie on the bench so you can take notes of all,your measurements and what not, next to your boat anchor and TE around it.... you would have to have one huge workbench my dear !!!  :scared:

A3 size to me is the perfect size, and if sometimes might be too large/getting in the way too much, you can just fold it and just display the part of it that you are currently interested in.
It's A3 for me. Of course for simple schematics, A4 when it suffices. As long as it's easily readable, then the smaller the better, to keep the bench as unencumbered as possible.

Back in the day I had, actually still have, it seems, 85x55cm schematics with two add-on tape hanging holes.
Obviously modules in question were not exactly very rarely on the table.

Enough and practical table space I've had once, it was old nuts and bolts storage rack cutted vertically half.
Standing height, 80cm deep and around 2x5m wide with thick coated birch veneer surface and full sized under shelves.
Occasional use for commercial purposes disturbed a bit.

For different surface materials I think 5 is pretty optimal.
One for elements that should slide and one for those that shouldn't.
Then one for cuts and one for drills and finally one specially antistatic.

For TE melamine is pretty optimum for the base.
Technical rubber is available in many forms and colors.
Pink bags used to be also thick plates.
Around here hardware stores are selling single vacuum packed wooden shelves.
Linoleum and vinyl are also regular stuff.

I seem to have a recollection that this sliding or not is sort of never sort of as it should.
PET plates are also quite poorly hot solder iron resistant.

BTW,
I've not seen a hot glue gun for a while.
So one from the would-you-resell-that category.
Advance-Aneng-Appa-AVO-Beckman-Danbridge-Data Tech-Fluke-General Radio-H. W. Sullivan-Heathkit-HP-Kaise-Kyoritsu-Leeds & Northrup-Mastech-REO-Simpson-Sinclair-Tektronix-Tokyo Rikosha-Topward-Triplett-YFE
(plus lesser brands from the work shop of the world)
 

Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123496 on: June 20, 2022, 05:03:01 pm »
@Vince,

Please can you refrain from calling Med or Papa Smurf, Allinson, he doesn't like it  :-DD :-DD :-DD

Yeah, he prefers Shirley.  >:D
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123497 on: June 20, 2022, 05:07:07 pm »
Comedy auction. Anyone want a marginal RIFA Russian roulette game for £12?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/275355457823
 
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Offline TERRA Operative

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123498 on: June 20, 2022, 05:09:00 pm »
I want to hear the steppers clicking as the voltage varies.  :-+

I made a quick recording of the unit in operation as it currently stands just a few minutes ago.  The relay contacts are going to need more cleaning - last night the LSD was working most of the time; today it's back to being out more than on.  The third digit was much better last night, too.  More Deoxit is in the cards, but in the meantime, behold stepper relays clattering away for your enjoyment...

youtube.com/watch?v=98PwBWROs3E

-Pat

Glorious  ^-^
Where does all this test equipment keep coming from?!?

https://www.youtube.com/NearFarMedia/
 
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Offline m k

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #123499 on: June 20, 2022, 05:09:23 pm »
If a UPS is boiling a car battery, it would cook an SLA in half the time; the float voltage should be lower, and if it isn't, it's either (1) badly adjusted and/or (2) a POS.

If you deep discharge any lead acid you reduce its life, including so called deep cycle ones, and you do not deep cycle UPS batteries, unless you (a) have a lot of power cuts and also (b) don't do a controlled power down when the mains fails, and just run the UPS until low battery cutoff.

Maybe you have routinely seen One Hung Low brands in tiny UPSs like that, but I can assure you that the kind of places that use proper machines (50kVA and up) would shit a brick if you put crap like that in their battery string.

Yuasa and the like have much better quality lead. I don't care if it does come from the same place, they use the premium line, and the locals use the value brand.

And we are NOT talking about those machines; I know the difference, man... gimme a fucking break. You're making a straw-man argument here. Completely different class from the ones I serviced regularly, and I specifically stated that. As soon as I said 1.5-5KVA, I KNOW you knew the difference.

Those systems I worked/work on are mostly used used in retail, so aren't going to be the top tier, "failure is not an option" class machines... but even they are not the same class as this decades-old consumer grade unit from CompUSA.

What those classes of deployment use is irrelevant here. That is not appropriate technology for this application. That UPS probably came with a PowerSonic or equivalent Chinesium battery, and spending 40-50 bux on a genuine Yuasa "upgrade" is money wasted in this application.

As for the float charge... I think you need to review that. I know from personal experience that a new known good motorcycle or garden tractor battery used in this application will start to boil in a few days or a week; I've tried it on two different occasions. Shallow-cycle starting batteries do not tolerate constant float-charge the same way that deep-cycle batteries do.

I think you'll find the difference is in fact the IR of the battery... but I don't want to start another shit-flinging match here.  :palm:

mnem
 :-/O

Standard SLAs are not deep cycle. That would be the kind that they use in mobility scooters etc, "traction batteries" I believe they are known as.

I maintain (crap pun, unintended, keeping it anyway) that if your charger is boiling liquid lead acid batteries, it's just set too high. You shouldn't see that kind of reaction unless you're doing an equalisation charge.

My principal point is this: you can spend idk £5-10 on a cheap shit 12V 12Ah battery, that will probably last 6 months, and will probably be actually around half the claimed capacity, or you can spend £30 or so on a decent branded one that has all the chooch it says it does, and it'll last 5+ years. If you tweak the float voltage down to 13.2-13.5 or so, a lot +.


My UPS in use is APC something, with load and battery display, load is 11% with a puter and screen.
I've changed its batteries once, with effort.
Inside is a support frame and batteries are hot swap, until they aren't.
Seems that old batteries have a tendency to swollen around that support frame.

I also have another UPS, 800VA and a real deal, with degaussing coil capability.
Unfortunately it wants 6 batteries and is pretty old so cooking those batteries is not very tempting.
But if necessary it can also be just a cleaner.

I also seem to have a feeling that these UPS batteries have better life when their tops are tops.
Including those that are almost solid inside.

BTW,
in case somebody is still unaware.
577 of CA surplus.
https://www.allsurplus.com/asset/5/22524
Advance-Aneng-Appa-AVO-Beckman-Danbridge-Data Tech-Fluke-General Radio-H. W. Sullivan-Heathkit-HP-Kaise-Kyoritsu-Leeds & Northrup-Mastech-REO-Simpson-Sinclair-Tektronix-Tokyo Rikosha-Topward-Triplett-YFE
(plus lesser brands from the work shop of the world)
 


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