Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[vk6zgo]

Then you need a PH-163 as Cubdriver wrote; the Heizgerätestecker won't do.

It's Heißgerätestecker (or Heissgerätestecker for our Helvetian friends). The Heizgerätestecker would be the opposite of a Kühlgerätestecker which doesn't exist because it's a Kaltgerätestecker. :-)

You lost me at "enormous Schwanzstücker":

This somehow reminds me of the annual "Swan-Upping" ceremony on the River Thames in England.

[Neomys Sapiens]

I am being NICE to Siglent, Tautech, can't you see ?! 

Yes I can see Vince, as for French designs the first that comes to mind is the Citroën 2CV, something only a mother could love  however the Asians have made some awful stuff too. 

Breguet Br.1050 Alizé ! Citroën HY! Not even a mother, I suppose!

[Robert763]

Oh boy ! Quick, some TEA content we need to share then, QUICK, QUICK QUICK  !!  TEA content please !!! 

Oh here is some, we are saved !!! 

This evening I started recapping my Tek 180A Time Mark Generator, to clean up all my cap bodges that I did while I was troubleshooting it the other day.

I have received the fancy expensive mica caps from Germany to replace the 3 leaky old Domino mica caps.
That's done.

Now I need to replace all the old leaky electrolytics with nice axial film caps, the yellow stuff. They fit nicely and look cool, love them.
I had a few left from when I restored my first glowing Tek 5 years ago. So I was able to replace the 10nF and 100nF.

Now I still have to replace the  2.2nF, 3.3nF, 18nF, 220nF and 1uF ones.

Problem : these yellow axial caps appear to not be very easy to find HERE (please don't throw again Mouser links at me).

I fail to find a vendor that has all the values I need, in a given supplier and series, at the proper voltage rating.
Just like my recap of the 2467B PSU, recapping this Time Mark Generator proves once again to be a major PITA.

So I was wondering... are these yellow axial caps any different than the radial ones ? Radial ones are plentiful of course so that would fix my supply chain problem for sure...
I favour axial for looks and originality, but in case I don't have a choice, I prefer to know my options...

Also, these axial ones usually come in 3 flavours : PS, PE or PP.

I gather PS is the super high-end mega expensive stuff, don't need nor can afford that.

I am more interested in the difference between PE and PP, the two most common and more affordable types.

As well as between MKT and MKP which are the two types I see all the time... but have no idea how to make an informed decision.


See, some TEA content, no need to open worm cans !!! 

If you are replacing electrolytics or paper capacitors any modern plastic film will be an improvement. Electrically no difference between axial and radial
The differencs between PS PP and PE mainly relate to detail compromises like accuracy vis temperature range cost vis volume etc. For 99% of cases it does not matter. 
"The Art of Electronics" by Horrowitz and Hill gives a readable explantion of the differences. You should have a copy of this great reference.

[BU508A]

w2aew: Using a Transistor Curve Tracer as an Octopus I/V Tracer or Huntron Tracker

[Vince]

I am being NICE to Siglent, Tautech, can't you see ?! 

Yes I can see Vince, as for French designs the first that comes to mind is the Citroën 2CV, something only a mother could love  however the Asians have made some awful stuff too. 

Breguet Br.1050 Alizé ! Citroën HY! Not even a mother, I suppose!

Actually the HY is extremely popular here as a "retro" basis for restoring it and use a "food truck" or other commercial / marketing purpose.

I am not into personally it but at the least I do find it has much more charm than the dull VW Combi that's all the rage these days. 

Combi looks way too modern and uninspiring. A fully restored HY with a cool paint job turned a food truck or whatever, appeals much more than the same duty performed by a Combi. 

[Vince]

Oh boy ! Quick, some TEA content we need to share then, QUICK, QUICK QUICK  !!  TEA content please !!! 

Oh here is some, we are saved !!! 

This evening I started recapping my Tek 180A Time Mark Generator, to clean up all my cap bodges that I did while I was troubleshooting it the other day.

I have received the fancy expensive mica caps from Germany to replace the 3 leaky old Domino mica caps.
That's done.

Now I need to replace all the old leaky electrolytics with nice axial film caps, the yellow stuff. They fit nicely and look cool, love them.
I had a few left from when I restored my first glowing Tek 5 years ago. So I was able to replace the 10nF and 100nF.

Now I still have to replace the  2.2nF, 3.3nF, 18nF, 220nF and 1uF ones.

Problem : these yellow axial caps appear to not be very easy to find HERE (please don't throw again Mouser links at me).

I fail to find a vendor that has all the values I need, in a given supplier and series, at the proper voltage rating.
Just like my recap of the 2467B PSU, recapping this Time Mark Generator proves once again to be a major PITA.

So I was wondering... are these yellow axial caps any different than the radial ones ? Radial ones are plentiful of course so that would fix my supply chain problem for sure...
I favour axial for looks and originality, but in case I don't have a choice, I prefer to know my options...

Also, these axial ones usually come in 3 flavours : PS, PE or PP.

I gather PS is the super high-end mega expensive stuff, don't need nor can afford that.

I am more interested in the difference between PE and PP, the two most common and more affordable types.

As well as between MKT and MKP which are the two types I see all the time... but have no idea how to make an informed decision.

See, some TEA content, no need to open worm cans !!! 

If you are replacing electrolytics or paper capacitors any modern plastic film will be an improvement.

Yes that's what I though too, can't be much worse than 60 year old electrolytic...
but I thought just in case, at least I would ask between PE/PP in case one of them  as somehow a major drawback in one of the parameters... I would rather want to know about it.

The differencs between PS PP and PE mainly relate to detail compromises like accuracy vis temperature range cost vis volume etc. For 99% of cases it does not matter. 

OK that's cool, I can buy either type and mix the two types if no choice then...an extra degree of freedom to help me find a solution.

"The Art of Electronics" by Horrowitz and Hill gives a readable explantion of the differences. You should have a copy of this great reference.

I do have it !
I bought the second edition in 1997 when I was studying electronics. No internet for me back then, didn't know about the popularity of the book, but I was reading the Elektor magazine back then and they would be selling it in French.  Cost an arm and a leg to buy, especially as it came in to volumes instead of just one, then again two more volumes for the lab experiments.. so before I spent a fortune on paper, I went to a book store and they had it on their shelves, so I had a quick look and it was love at first sight... it stood out so much compared to any other electronic book I had ever seen, I was more than happy to spend the money ! Still by far my favorite book to this day     I guess 25 years later I could benefit from reading it a second time to refresh the knwoledge and help it soak it more...

When I am rich, I am tempted to buy the new third revision, as I understand it's not just updated, but a complete rewrite.

[Black Phoenix]

I do have it !
I bought the second edition in 1997 when I was studying electronics. No internet for me back then, didn't know about the popularity of the book, but I was reading the Elektor magazine back then and they would be selling it in French.  Cost an arm and a leg to buy, especially as it came in to volumes instead of just one, then again two more volumes for the lab experiments.. so before I spent a fortune on paper, I went to a book store and they had it on their shelves, so I had a quick look and it was love at first sight... it stood out so much compared to any other electronic book I had ever seen, I was more than happy to spend the money ! Still by far my favorite book to this day     I guess 25 years later I could benefit from reading it a second time to refresh the knwoledge and help it soak it more...

When I am rich, I am tempted to buy the new third revision, as I understand it's not just updated, but a complete rewrite.

I would love to buy both 3: the AoE 3rd Ed,  the Learning AoE and the X Files but... 192$ currently is a little too steep for me.

I'm not saying that it doesn't value that, on the contrary, for the info that packs is a excellent price mind it.

To be sincere if all were available in eBook it would be even better, then I could convert it to PDF and print it, having a copy I can carry and use without bothering if I'm going to damage it while having the originals in digital.

[Specmaster]

@Vince, the Citroen HY is also fairly popular here, I have seen many as you say, converted into food wagons, we have a retail park not far from us that last time I went, had 2 of them being used as just that. Both had been lovingly restored as well, all body panels were like new, which is unusual  because they are generally pretty thin metal and easily dented. 

[mansaxel]

w2aew: Using a Transistor Curve Tracer as an Octopus I/V Tracer or Huntron Tracker

"Using a dump truck as a wheel barrow". There's something TEA in that. Overcapacity in instrumentation where a Fluke 27 would do.

[McBryce]

w2aew: Using a Transistor Curve Tracer as an Octopus I/V Tracer or Huntron Tracker

"Using a dump truck as a wheel barrow". There's something TEA in that. Overcapacity in instrumentation where a Fluke 27 would do.

It's only "real TEA" if you then buy a second and third dump truck to confirm that the first dump truck is working correctly!

McBryce.

[Saskia]

and honestly, are we not all into slight cases of overbombing ?

[BU508A]

Speaking of "overbombing"

A used Keithley 2002 for more than 17kEUR.

        

https://www.ebay.de/itm/185399964875



NAWTS

[david77]

the postman just rang. twice ...

Got a Keithley 2000 in the mail. Sender information plus serial number intakt. boots wo errors. Selftest gets to 400, then asks me to insert 4 wire short which I don't have. Last calibration was in 2010. Cosmetically it looks a shitload better than the 2700. Display ok, no covers missing.

cost was 155 Pesos incl postage

Look, what just showed up in the ebay Kleinanzeigen:
https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/agilent-technologies-34172a-dmm-calibration-short/2088597742-168-23789

A case for your Flutschfinger ice?

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flutschfinger#/media/Datei:Flutschfinger.jpg

I'm sorry... I'll find the door.

[AVGresponding]

Speaking of "overbombing"

A used Keithley 2002 for more than 17kEUR.

        

https://www.ebay.de/itm/185399964875



NAWTS

I know we're in a period of inflation, but this is crazy

[tggzzz]

To be sincere if all were available in eBook it would be even better, then I could convert it to PDF and print it, having a copy I can carry and use without bothering if I'm going to damage it while having the originals in digital.

The pdf of AoE3 is available at archive.org.

I  don't know how it got there, but Win Hill did put a copy on a server in 2017

[THDplusN_bad]

Gone are the days when the only thing that you needed to do something with your oscilloscope were some probes.
I'm looking for a keyboard for the incoming TDS5104 now. It should be as compact as possible and best would be one with an integrated trackball. I found a Siemens Nixdorf one with a touchpad, which has the desired PS2 interfaces (2, as one for the keyboard and one for the pointing function). But knowing that S-N gear was in many cases not really compatible with anything else, I am a bit wary. Looking on. If someone does know a unit fulfilling the requirements outlined above, please let me know..

A tad late, but you can use any USB-keyboard (as in "wired USB") with the Tektronix TDS5000 series oscilloscopes. I have used inexpensive Cherry and Logitech keyboards, wireless as well as USB-connected ones, with my TDS5054 without any problems. Enjoy...

Cheers,

THDplus_bad

[Saskia]

I do have one of those thinkpad external keyboards for USB. Contact me if you have a requirement

[cyclin_al]

I've been putting off buying a bench oscilloscope, but I was trying to debug a circuit and I really needed to simultaneously monitor 2-4 points. I managed with my single channel toy and eventually worked out that the breadboard was bowed in the middle and any connections were untrustworthy at best. I need therapy.

Welcome!  I was recently like you when I arrived here.  I have never left.

When I arrived, I had 1 DMM and a brand new DSO.
Now I have 7 DMMs, Arbitrary Waveform Generator, Spectrum Analyser, Vector Network Analyser and even an old tube analogue oscilloscope... and always looking for more.  See, the therapy really does work!

[cyclin_al]

I'm the epitome of an absolute beginner so I don't need more than a Siglent SDS104X-U, GW Instek 1054B or Rigol DS1054Z. I'm close to pulling the trigger but it's hard to justify for various reasons of inflation and other expenses. I also don't have any room for it, otherwise I'd be cracking open my wallet faster than you can say fast fourier transform.

OK so that answers most of my previous questions !

So it's digital only, modern, Chinese, LCD, colour, and less than 500 Euros with tax.

From your list, the Siglent is by far my favorite. 100MHz instead of 50 for the Rigol. Siglent also looks like a proper tool/scope, the Rigol looks like a Playschool toy for a 5 year old that watches too many Japanese manga on TV.

Out of your list, to me the Siglent is a no brainer.

Actually that Siglent kinda meets my requirements too....might be tempted, in a few years once they sell the 200MHz version of this, for the same price.
I see they have improved the industrial design, out with the ugly chromed knobs. It now looks like... pretty much a Tek.
Still need some minor work on that column of oval push buttons on the right side of the screen, looks off.. too Agilent/Keysight like, in a bad way I mean...

With the correct "riglol" code entered into the Rigol, that 50 goes to 100, although some have tested the actual bandwidth closer to 130 MHz...

[Vince]

Equally, maybe the Siglent can get to 200MHz with the correct code ! 

[AVGresponding]

I've been putting off buying a bench oscilloscope, but I was trying to debug a circuit and I really needed to simultaneously monitor 2-4 points. I managed with my single channel toy and eventually worked out that the breadboard was bowed in the middle and any connections were untrustworthy at best. I need therapy.

You need better quality breadboards...   

[Specmaster]

I've been putting off buying a bench oscilloscope, but I was trying to debug a circuit and I really needed to simultaneously monitor 2-4 points. I managed with my single channel toy and eventually worked out that the breadboard was bowed in the middle and any connections were untrustworthy at best. I need therapy.

Welcome!  I was recently like you when I arrived here.  I have never left.

When I arrived, I had 1 DMM and a brand new DSO.
Now I have 7 DMMs, Arbitrary Waveform Generator, Spectrum Analyser, Vector Network Analyser and even an old tube analogue oscilloscope... and always looking for more.  See, the therapy really does work!

Only 7 DMMs, slacker, pull your finger out will ya 

[Robert763]

Hmm, looks like I won a R&S CMS33 at the Skegness auction.... Not had confirmation yet.
It appears to be without the accessories that most had but hammer dropped at a fair bit less than most went for.
I may have to sell my HP 8920B. I don't need 3 comms test sets. With the two R&S units (CRTU and CMS33) I'm covered to 2.7Ghz+ on the bench and up to 1Ghz portable including avionics nav aids like VOR.

[AVGresponding]

The cheapy-cheap panaplex boat anchor score arrived earlier. In fairness, you'd struggle to anchor more than a rowing boat with it, as despite its size (2U, full rack width), it's not actually that heavy.

Here's under the skirts:



Not a huge amount to note. It's very neatly wired, and I do like the use of marker ferrules. There's a Burr Brown 3501A low bias, low noise op-amp, doing the hard work. The two sockets on the back seem to be for remote control and remote indication, and a proprietary standard at that, no rs232/485/GPIB here.





Seems strange to have 74 series logic chips in sockets, weirder when you see they are individual sockets for each pin. Those are dual resettable multivibrators, I'm guessing for the integration time settings. And there seems to be a fault in this general area, possibly, the display is constantly resetting before it can get a reading.



The channel indicator LEDs aren't coming on either, though the output is doing things related to the input, and the zero and 360° trimmers are working.



The panaplex 4-digit display is self contained, if I can't fix the thing (not sure I'd have a use for it even if I did) I may use it to make a clock.   

[mnementh]

and honestly, are we not all into slight cases of overbombing ?

mnem
"Would you like fries widdat...?"