Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Vince]

QUESTION : now I have shiny new drawers, I need to label them of course... am thinking of investing in one of these thingies depicted below (just some random pic), a compact portable/battery powered label printer, a "Dymo" or other brands... looks like there some affordable ones now, lots models and brands around... but I don't know what to be wary of, traps for young players, I don't know... so if you have any advice  I am all ears.

Budget is 50 to 75 euros tops, for a new one. I don't mind used if it gets me cool benefits of a more fancy unit.

I measured the front of the drawers. The available height / to put a label, is 11mm. So a 10mm wide ribbon would be perfect.. if that's a standard size, I don't know.

I see there are colour printers... I don't have that as a requirement, black on white is fine with me.
What I want is the ability to use a 10mm ribbon for my drawers, or possibly even wider ribbons as well, for other uses, if a printer can make use of several different width of ribbons ? Or are they stuck to using only a given size and that's it ?

As far as sophistication, would be a dream if I could download component symbols into the printer, like small bitmap files / icons drawn on my computer.. that I could the print.
I could have a label with the component symbol on the far left, then on it's right the component value and what not.
Useless in case of a drawer that's 100% filled with resistor, but I am think of drawer units that would hold a mix of components, resistors, caps, misc H/W parts, X-tals, what not... a bit of a pot-pourri. In this case having symbols next to the text, could help find what you need more quickly perhaps ? Just an idea...

If too fancy a feature, well plain text will be just fine of course ! 
As long as I can print very large characters so as to make fullest use of the height of the ribbon, so that the text is as easy to read as possible when you stare at all those drawers...

[tggzzz]

I have a labeller which looks like that, and it is fine.

[BU508A]

And why don't you buy such DIN-A4 sheets with sticking labels? Can be used with a laser printer.

https://www.pokornys.de/DIN-A4-Universaletiketten

I'd do first print them on an ordinary DIN-A4 sheet and check, if the printings hits correctly all the labels.
But then it is a cheap and nice thing to label the drawers with them.

[Neomys Sapiens]

QUESTION : now I have shiny new drawers, I need to label them of course... am thinking of investing in one of these thingies depicted below (just some random pic), a compact portable/battery powered label printer, a "Dymo" or other brands... looks like there some affordable ones now, lots models and brands around... but I don't know what to be wary of, traps for young players, I don't know... so if you have any advice  I am all ears.

Budget is 50 to 75 euros tops, for a new one. I don't mind used if it gets me cool benefits of a more fancy unit.
.
.

Dymo, Brady and Brother labeling apparatus work all fine, as long as you do not fall for cheap no-name tapes for them. In that case the results are somewhat unpredictable.

[mnementh]

Yup. I have the cheapest Brother; it cost like $12 new on sale at Wally Wurld, & have had it for over 10 years. Still works a dream. The only thing I'd pay more money for is USB input for to make custom icons.

mnem
 

[Vince]

And why don't you buy such DIN-A4 sheets with sticking labels? Can be used with a laser printer.

https://www.pokornys.de/DIN-A4-Universaletiketten

I'd do first print them on an ordinary DIN-A4 sheet and check, if the printings hits correctly all the labels.
But then it is a cheap and nice thing to label the drawers with them.

I will use that technique to print the labels for all the resistor bags/envelopes, but for labeling the drawers I prefer a label printer... because it's gonna b ea lot of "on offs". I find it more practical and quicker to be at the bench with the printer and make labels as I go, on the fly : fill a drawer with rubber feet, say, print immediately a label for that. A minute later fill a drawer with X-tals.. print another label for that, next, next... 
Printing a full A4 on the laser printer for just a one-off is not practical and too time consuming, plus the sheet can not be passed through the printer too many times....
so I find an A4 laser printed suited when I want to do a full page of labels, like when labeling the resistor bags. Use the entire page, print once, use it all.

But for the small drawers it's gonna be a random mix of misc stuff... i want to be able to print each label as one-off, on the fly, at the same time as I am filling the drawers with random stuff... more practical and quicker this way I find ?! 

Now, OK.. I could fill all the drawers, then take note of all the labels that I need to do, go to the computer, create all the labels and print the A4 page yeah.... I guess.
But then I would have to cut the labels by hand with a sharp blade, to make them perfect rectangles of the appropriate height, 10mm... not 9 or 11.  I doubt there are A4 label sheets with spot on the correct dimensions ? So I would need to print on a huge A4 sticker (the sticker being the entire size of the page...this one https://www.pokornys.de/Universal-Etiketten-2100-x-2970-mm )  then cut it up, so more work 

Plus, these labels are paper based... if if I later want to remove that label to use the drawer for something else, it will be a pain to remove... whereas the portable label printer uses a plastic ribbon, so if I want/need to remove it later, I can just peel it off easily, no residue, and put a new one in its place ?

But... I also want this portable printers to label cables, and so a paper label will not do in this case, not resistant enough.

So to sum it up : I would like one of these label printers around for all kinds or purpose, not just for labeling my small drawers... the drawers just so happen to be the first opportunity that pops up, to use such a printer, that's all.

So I will tell you what... I will get a printer anyway then, and try BOTH methods to labels the drawers, and see which method I prefer !   

[BU508A]

Good man! Decision-making based on empirically collected data. Keep going!

    

[med6753]

Was it someone here that snagged the RM567 on the Bay of Evil just now?  I took a crack at it, but somebody wanted it more.   

-Pat

Wasn't me.

[med6753]

@med6753

Here in Germany is somebody selling HV parts for a 547 but one has to request a quote for them:



Edit:
This guy is also offering a repair service. He is doing this as a part of his hobby, not as a business:
Quote:
"Defekte HV-Unit, ein Reparatur-Beispiel

Bei Rückgang der Bildschirmhelligkeit mit gleichzeitiger Bildvergrößerung bis zum Ausfall des Bildes ist meistens der HV-Trafo defekt. Sie schicken mir zum Beispiel beim TEK 547 die aus dem Plastikgehäuse ausgebaute HV-Unit und ich repariere den HV-Trafo in einem speziellen Verfahren. Lässt dieser sich nicht mehr reparieren, schicke ich eine Austausch-Unit, soweit der Vorrat reicht. Das ist ein Beispiel für eine Reparatur durch Sie mit meiner Hilfe!"

Translation (via DeepL):
Defective HV unit, a repair example

If the brightness of the screen decreases and the image is enlarged at the same time, the HV transformer is usually defective. For example, with the TEK 547, you send me the HV unit removed from the plastic housing and I repair the HV transformer using a special procedure. If it can no longer be repaired, I send a replacement unit, as far as stocks last. This is an example of a repair by you with my help!

Let me know if you are interested and if I can assist you.

Thanks for the info.  Could you make some inquiries for me?

Cost of just a replacement transformer if he still has one in stock. Don't need the entire HV assembly.

Cost to repair one of my transformers if I send it to him. 

 

[BU508A]

@med6753

Sure, will send him tomorrow an email and ask.
Will let you know, then.

On other notes:
Why tickling a dragon's tail isn't a good idea.
Scientists in Los Alamos had discovered this astonishing fact!

[Cerebus]

And why don't you buy such DIN-A4 sheets with sticking labels? Can be used with a laser printer.

https://www.pokornys.de/DIN-A4-Universaletiketten

I'd do first print them on an ordinary DIN-A4 sheet and check, if the printings hits correctly all the labels.
But then it is a cheap and nice thing to label the drawers with them.

The downside with those is that using them is essentially a batch operation. It's difficult to print off a single label as you need them. On the other hand, the tape type printers are good for single labels, perhaps a few at a time, but are poor for larger batches.

I'm seriously considering acquiring an industrial/point-of-sale type label printer - almost certainly used - which uses reels of sticky paper labels. I'll probably use the type that takes a thermal transfer ribbon (as opposed to direct thermal printing) as the direct thermal labels have a relatively short life. Anyone who buys from Digikey will be familiar with the results, as that's what they use for their cut tape packaging like this:



I'd probably aim for slightly smaller labels.

And yes, I do have a sealed pack with some STM32s in, and anyone trying to filtch them had better turn up with an army.

[25 CPS]

There's member in the US who claims to be working on a rewind device but haven't heard anything from him lately. There is a company in Michigan called "Heyboer Transformers" who can build and rewind transformers. You can request a quote. I can just imagine how expensive that might be.      

I haven't used Heyboer Transformers yet but I have kept them back of mind since a couple of people 15 years ago or so had them rewind blown transformers in H. H. Scott audio equipment and they were reviewed positively.  My ex blew a Scott amplifier of mine while I was coming home from work and if I need to get one of the transformers rewound, it'll probably go to Heyboer, but honestly, I haven't had the heart to get the amplifier off the shelf and check it out.

[mnementh]

We've got a massive nor'easter coming; calling for 12-18 inches by Sunday afternoon.

Boi and I just went out to the grocery to get some staples for the snowed-in weekend, and while I was at it paid too much for a 2nd snow shovel and got some COVID test kits for all of us to make us officially ready to return to normal life. The store was a zoo tonight; I'm hoping we I didn't just get re-infected. 

We're back inside now; but the snow was already flying thick & heavy just as we were unloading the car.

mnem
so much for that gas grill I was looking at on CL...

[med6753]

I haven't tested my 547 (got it in late spring after an unknown amount of time - doubtless a LONG time - in a damp storage unit), but am pretty sure its transformer will be even wetter than those in the scopes you have, Mike.  I've been contemplating getting a vacuum chamber and leaving the transformer in there under partial vacuum for who knows how long in a warm spot to try to dry it out.  Seems like something that might be worth a shot.  Knowing how you instrumented yours, perhaps Ill get ambitious while snowed in this weekend and run a similar test on mine and see how it behaves (assuming I can even bring it to life).  If, as I suspect, it fails, I'll try the vacuum chamber thing.

<heads off to look for something to use as a vacuum chamber...>

-Pat

The Type 547 that I got last March and worked on for months to restore was also stored an unheated, but dry, shed. And the HV is fine. Never an issue. Will it fail someday? Who knows.   

[cyclin_al]

There's member in the US who claims to be working on a rewind device but haven't heard anything from him lately. There is a company in Michigan called "Heyboer Transformers" who can build and rewind transformers. You can request a quote. I can just imagine how expensive that might be.      

I haven't used Heyboer Transformers yet but I have kept them back of mind since a couple of people 15 years ago or so had them rewind blown transformers in H. H. Scott audio equipment and they were reviewed positively.  My ex blew a Scott amplifier of mine while I was coming home from work and if I need to get one of the transformers rewound, it'll probably go to Heyboer, but honestly, I haven't had the heart to get the amplifier off the shelf and check it out.

I wonder how much of the cost of those services is designing the rewind and tooling & setup for the particular job?
It leaves me thinking what the possibility would be if a number of people all sent their transformers to the same place, and that a mini assembly line could be used to greatly reduce the unit cost compared to a one-off job.  There would be no harm in asking the questions.  Could the batch cost meet the price point needed to make a go of it?

[cyclin_al]

We've got a massive nor'easter coming; calling for 12-18 inches by Sunday afternoon.

Boi and I just went out to the grocery to get some staples for the snowed-in weekend, and while I was at it paid too much for a 2nd snow shovel and got some COVID test kits for all of us to make us officially ready to return to normal life. The store was a zoo tonight; I'm hoping we I didn't just get re-infected. 

We're back inside now; but the snow was already flying thick & heavy just as we were unloading the car.

mnem
so much for that gas grill I was looking at on CL...

Patience my dwagon; it looks like that grill is going nowhere anytime soon ... 

[mnementh]

Yes, including on my back porch where I can cook on it.

And if you don't think I'd grill in the middle of a raging blizzard... you don't know me well at all.

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

[TERRA Operative]

Just turn the burners up to keep warm. Is what I do.

[mansaxel]

Yes, including on my back porch where I can cook on it.

And if you don't think I'd grill in the middle of a raging blizzard... you don't know me well at all.

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

I've done whole tenderloin on my puny Weber "ball" style grill, in heavy snowfall.  New year's eve, needs tenderloin, right. Wasn't that windy though.

[Robert763]

More experimentation and checking voltages on the Type 547 HV issue and unfortunately it has led to one dreadful conclusion. The HV transformer is toast. It's a very solid conclusion based upon my individual results as well as the experiences of others on the Facebook Tek Group.

<snippage>

From what I've read and seen on the Tek Group this is a toasted HV transformer. The grid will soar as high as +150V and then the HV will shutdown. But you risk damaging V800. That's probably what was about to happen when I observed the trace bloom the other day. I'm going to put the other Type 547 on the same experiment and see if the results duplicate. I suspect they will.

So what to do? The transformer needs to be replaced (unobtainium) or rewound. There's a member of the Tek group in OZ who managed to get a hand winding device and he successfully rewound a 547 and a 556 HV transformer and they perform perfectly. But here's the issue. He won't perform that work for anyone else UNLESS they fork over a pristine Type 1A4 plug-in. He says the rewind takes hours and he doesn't want to get swamped with requests. But then he flaunts over and over his repair and is being somewhat of a dickhead about it. I got a damp rope for him. 

There's member in the US who claims to be working on a rewind device but haven't heard anything from him lately. There is a company in Michigan called "Heyboer Transformers" who can build and rewind transformers. You can request a quote. I can just imagine how expensive that might be.      

I haven't tested my 547 (got it in late spring after an unknown amount of time - doubtless a LONG time - in a damp storage unit), but am pretty sure its transformer will be even wetter than those in the scopes you have, Mike.  I've been contemplating getting a vacuum chamber and leaving the transformer in there under partial vacuum for who knows how long in a warm spot to try to dry it out.  Seems like something that might be worth a shot.  Knowing how you instrumented yours, perhaps Ill get ambitious while snowed in this weekend and run a similar test on mine and see how it behaves (assuming I can even bring it to life).  If, as I suspect, it fails, I'll try the vacuum chamber thing.

<heads off to look for something to use as a vacuum chamber...>

-Pat

Many applications for that in drying, curing etc. of parts and modules. How are you going to evacuate it? I think that it can be done intermittently if you can achieve a good seal. That would make it feasible using a venturi ejector coupled to a water tap, which seems to be the cheapest device.

Rotary vane pump.  Bought it a few years ago (used a work project to justify it to myself) and knew it would come in handy for other things eventually.


-Pat

Drying slowly under vacuum and heat followed by vacuum impregnation with varnish is certainly worth a go.

[Cubdriver]

Well, it's made its way inside from the garage.  That's a start...



Will try to find time on Saturday to bring it up while monitoring current consumption.

-Pat

[AVGresponding]

And why don't you buy such DIN-A4 sheets with sticking labels? Can be used with a laser printer.

https://www.pokornys.de/DIN-A4-Universaletiketten

I'd do first print them on an ordinary DIN-A4 sheet and check, if the printings hits correctly all the labels.
But then it is a cheap and nice thing to label the drawers with them.

Because that will fade over time; the label machines use thermal printing on plastic tape, which does not fade.

QUESTION : now I have shiny new drawers, I need to label them of course... am thinking of investing in one of these thingies depicted below (just some random pic), a compact portable/battery powered label printer, a "Dymo" or other brands... looks like there some affordable ones now, lots models and brands around... but I don't know what to be wary of, traps for young players, I don't know... so if you have any advice  I am all ears.

Budget is 50 to 75 euros tops, for a new one. I don't mind used if it gets me cool benefits of a more fancy unit.
.
.

Dymo, Brady and Brother labeling apparatus work all fine, as long as you do not fall for cheap no-name tapes for them. In that case the results are somewhat unpredictable.

I have a Brother machine and the cheap tapes work just fine in it, and are close to an order of magnitude cheaper.

More experimentation and checking voltages on the Type 547 HV issue and unfortunately it has led to one dreadful conclusion. The HV transformer is toast. It's a very solid conclusion based upon my individual results as well as the experiences of others on the Facebook Tek Group.

<snippage>

From what I've read and seen on the Tek Group this is a toasted HV transformer. The grid will soar as high as +150V and then the HV will shutdown. But you risk damaging V800. That's probably what was about to happen when I observed the trace bloom the other day. I'm going to put the other Type 547 on the same experiment and see if the results duplicate. I suspect they will.

So what to do? The transformer needs to be replaced (unobtainium) or rewound. There's a member of the Tek group in OZ who managed to get a hand winding device and he successfully rewound a 547 and a 556 HV transformer and they perform perfectly. But here's the issue. He won't perform that work for anyone else UNLESS they fork over a pristine Type 1A4 plug-in. He says the rewind takes hours and he doesn't want to get swamped with requests. But then he flaunts over and over his repair and is being somewhat of a dickhead about it. I got a damp rope for him. 

There's member in the US who claims to be working on a rewind device but haven't heard anything from him lately. There is a company in Michigan called "Heyboer Transformers" who can build and rewind transformers. You can request a quote. I can just imagine how expensive that might be.      

I haven't tested my 547 (got it in late spring after an unknown amount of time - doubtless a LONG time - in a damp storage unit), but am pretty sure its transformer will be even wetter than those in the scopes you have, Mike.  I've been contemplating getting a vacuum chamber and leaving the transformer in there under partial vacuum for who knows how long in a warm spot to try to dry it out.  Seems like something that might be worth a shot.  Knowing how you instrumented yours, perhaps Ill get ambitious while snowed in this weekend and run a similar test on mine and see how it behaves (assuming I can even bring it to life).  If, as I suspect, it fails, I'll try the vacuum chamber thing.

<heads off to look for something to use as a vacuum chamber...>

-Pat

Many applications for that in drying, curing etc. of parts and modules. How are you going to evacuate it? I think that it can be done intermittently if you can achieve a good seal. That would make it feasible using a venturi ejector coupled to a water tap, which seems to be the cheapest device.

Rotary vane pump.  Bought it a few years ago (used a work project to justify it to myself) and knew it would come in handy for other things eventually.


-Pat

Drying slowly under vacuum and heat followed by vacuum impregnation with varnish is certainly worth a go.

Using corona dope or some other varnish seems a far better bet than beeswax, which will have a melting point low enough to liquify under normal use.

[Robert763]

And why don't you buy such DIN-A4 sheets with sticking labels? Can be used with a laser printer.

https://www.pokornys.de/DIN-A4-Universaletiketten

I'd do first print them on an ordinary DIN-A4 sheet and check, if the printings hits correctly all the labels.
But then it is a cheap and nice thing to label the drawers with them.

The downside with those is that using them is essentially a batch operation. It's difficult to print off a single label as you need them. On the other hand, the tape type printers are good for single labels, perhaps a few at a time, but are poor for larger batches.

I'm seriously considering acquiring an industrial/point-of-sale type label printer - almost certainly used - which uses reels of sticky paper labels. I'll probably use the type that takes a thermal transfer ribbon (as opposed to direct thermal printing) as the direct thermal labels have a relatively short life. Anyone who buys from Digikey will be familiar with the results, as that's what they use for their cut tape packaging like this:



I'd probably aim for slightly smaller labels.

And yes, I do have a sealed pack with some STM32s in, and anyone trying to filtch them had better turn up with an army.

I have a Dymo LabelWriter and it works great. It's an older model "330 USB" still going strong at about 16 years old.
I only use genuine labels. They do a translucent plastic film type which is very robust. It's good enough for equipment labels.

[Robert763]

And why don't you buy such DIN-A4 sheets with sticking labels? Can be used with a laser printer.

https://www.pokornys.de/DIN-A4-Universaletiketten

I'd do first print them on an ordinary DIN-A4 sheet and check, if the printings hits correctly all the labels.
But then it is a cheap and nice thing to label the drawers with them.

Because that will fade over time; the label machines use thermal printing on plastic tape, which does not fade.


<SNIP>

I've never know black laser print to fade. It's basically carbon black.

[vk6zgo]

Just in case anyone finds it useful in the future, the raw data for that Metcal PCT-100 temperature profile exported from the Agilent 34461A and slapped into an OpenOffice spreadsheet. Also the obligatory graph of it.



Please note you scunners, and there's people who could learn from this, I label my graph and my axes.

   https://xkcd.com/833/

mnem

The old time wood cutters in the SouthWest of West Oz always labelled their axes!