Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 18857152 times)

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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106075 on: November 01, 2021, 05:37:54 pm »
Well Scheiße  |O, lost the two (defective) Agilent scopes to someone that bit a day ago 20 something EUR, because Gixen failed me :(  :palm:
merde'!

Please elucidate... how exactly did Gixen fail...? Genuine curiosity, as I've never had a Gix fail other than due to user error...  :o

mnem
*too much blood in my caffeine circulatory system*

Well, I was looking as seconds pass, and didn't see my bid coming and the the auction ended, in the Gixen bids list I've got "Unknown Error 3" and the "No error log can be found". It's a first for me as well, but mensch, there were TWO Agilent DSO hackable scopes  |O |O
Dang. Sounds like an actual last-moment connection fault on their end. This is what they warn against when they're trying to sell you their mirror service.

First one I've seen a first-hand accounting of.  :-+

mnem
 :o
« Last Edit: November 01, 2021, 05:41:14 pm by mnementh »
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Online Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106076 on: November 01, 2021, 05:50:27 pm »
you could also try FreeBSD which is the better OS ...

Oh boy don't open a whole can of worms you naughty Saskia !  :-DD

Let's just say I am not looking for a new OS... I am done playing/fucking with computers. The less I touch them, the less they go wrong, the happier I am...

I just want to upgrade the H/W not fuck with the S/W...






 

Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106077 on: November 01, 2021, 06:03:51 pm »
yes. While I am at it: Z390 / i7 9700 / 32 GB RAM all new. Interested ?
 

Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106078 on: November 01, 2021, 06:11:16 pm »
Well Scheiße  |O, lost the two (defective) Agilent scopes to someone that bit a day ago 20 something EUR, because Gixen failed me :(  :palm:
merde'!

Please elucidate... how exactly did Gixen fail...? Genuine curiosity, as I've never had a Gix fail other than due to user error...  :o

mnem
*too much blood in my caffeine circulatory system*

Well, I was looking as seconds pass, and didn't see my bid commning and the the auction ended, in the Gixen bids list I've got "Unknown Error 3" and the "No error log can be found". It's a first for me as well, but mensch, there were TWO Agilent DSO hackable scopes  |O |O

Hmm, I see, well was your intended maximum bid on Gixen higher than they were sold for or not?
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Offline med6753

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106079 on: November 01, 2021, 06:12:04 pm »
Delivery from Kiwi land. Tautech sent me a probe that goes to the Tek 212 mini. Mine is missing the correct probes. Thanks Rob!  :-+



He also sent me this. Not quite sure what it is but obviously 3D printed. A bottle opener possibly?  :-//


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Offline mansaxel

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106080 on: November 01, 2021, 06:15:15 pm »
"He who does not like cats, will not get a beautiful women" - chinese proverb
...make of that what you will...

It's not working.  :(

I think you are messing the formal logic up.

  • It is a prerequisite to like cats to befriend beautiful persons of the appropriate gender.
  • Liking cats will not in and of itself lead to said befriendment.


Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106081 on: November 01, 2021, 06:17:58 pm »
ok, quick update:
called the manufacturer of the conservatory wrt static/stability issues. They said: ok in principle, but they will do some calculations and tell me how many panels are possible.
Sent off an email to our county administration and asked if I needed a building permit to actually install a PV there.

Looking at those various pieces of PV irradiation simulators it looks feasible so far.
My plan is to go for LG panels and Enphase microinverters. I don't buy into those "optimizers" thingie that the installers cannot explain ...

Had a quick chat with one on Friday ...
oh, if you are looking at internet quotes, don't bother coming to us, we are much more expensive (yeah, like 10000 more for a 4 kWp PV ..., don't worry, yer not gonna get the job...)
Oh, shading, yes, we install some optimizers if you go for the top of the line solution (add $$)
Hmm, what kind of, what do they do ?
well, they help against shading ...
oh ok ...

Here's what I want: LG panels, enphase microinverters ..
(oh, we don't sell those, you have to go with our standard stuff)
umm.
no.
 
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Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106082 on: November 01, 2021, 06:19:53 pm »
Well Scheiße  |O, lost the two (defective) Agilent scopes to someone that bit a day ago 20 something EUR, because Gixen failed me :(  :palm:
merde'!

Please elucidate... how exactly did Gixen fail...? Genuine curiosity, as I've never had a Gix fail other than due to user error...  :o

mnem
*too much blood in my caffeine circulatory system*

Well, I was looking as seconds pass, and didn't see my bid commning and the the auction ended, in the Gixen bids list I've got "Unknown Error 3" and the "No error log can be found". It's a first for me as well, but mensch, there were TWO Agilent DSO hackable scopes  |O |O
you have my sympathies. I am also looking for a busted Keysight DSO 20xx as I would very much like to pilver the stuff to set up the 2 additional channels on the one I got ...
 

Online Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106083 on: November 01, 2021, 06:25:25 pm »
Sounds great being able to use H/W for longer but what I have never fully understood is about the actual software that runs on Linux, is it dedicated software or Windows based software? And if it is dedicated software, where is it available from etc? Sounds like it might be expensive and difficult at the same time to replace all the useful Windows SW with Linux versions, and what about games etc. I really don't know enough about this, so it keeps putting me off from making the switch, but now finances are becoming far tighter and for at least, to continue with Windows based gear, I'll need to upgrade to version 11 and that needs a total replacement of my current H/W  :scared:



Hmmm..... looks like you are not a good candidate for Linux then.

Games forget about it. Unless we are talking Sudoku and Solitaire of course.

S/W ? Well you get it from a "store" like you install apps on your Google/Android smarthpone (Android is just one of a million different flavours of Linux).
Or you can go straight to the vendors website and download their S/W.  Like Kicad fo example. If you go to their download page they offer packages for various Linux flavours, as well as Windows and even Apple computers.
But most major S/W vendors do not support Linux. You will not find MS Office for Linux.... so you will have to be happy (or not) with the Linux counterpart(s).

Problem when trying to "convert" to Linux is, does it support your existing H/W ? Most H/W vendors do not support Linux, or poorly, and waiting for the Linux community to write their own driver is hit and miss. So if you want to switch to Linux to save money, might not be the best.

If you expect to just go buy the latest and greatest printer and just expect it just work, you will be disappointed. You have to select your H/W based on what drivers are available at a given time. Of course writing drivers takes time and if nobody is interested in writing one for your particular device, bad luck.
However, if there is a driver for your device, then as I said, you can be pretty sure it will still be there and working in 10 or 20 years time, out of the box, turn key. That's the beauty.

You need to assess what it is that you want to do with your computer, today and tomorrow. Are you prepared to make some compromises and spend some time to get up the learning curve, posting on forums... if not, give up.

If you want a gaming machine then forget about it, stick to Windows or well, get a game console that's what it's for after all...

If your needs like me are basic, web access, playing music watching pics and movies, it's wonderful.

If you need a specific piece of S/W then you can try to run it inside a Windows Virtual Machine. I do that, I have Windows XP in a VM, But of course a VM is not magical and has limitations too.


In other words, the devil is in the detail... you will not know if Linux (or FreeBSD as Saskia mentioned, or any other OS that's not Windows) suits you until you actually try it, and give it a chance.


You can download the install CD for Ubuntu for example (the most popular Linux distro since many years now), and just boot your computer from it. Linux will then run entirely from RAM (it won't touch your data/ hard drive don't worry). This way you can see if it supports your H/W, and you can play around with it. You can access the data from your drives if you choose to, for a more realistic test drive, pun intended forgive me....

This would be the first step, it's quick and easy.

Then next step you could install Linux in a virtual machine on your Windows computer. This way you can spend more time playing with Linux without disrupting your every day work flow, no need to reboot the machine, you can stay in your Windows environment while testing Linux harmlessly at the same time.  The virtual machine can share data between Windows and Linux so you can see how the Linux S/W handles your files, detect problems, potential show stoppers or what not...

Generally speaking, do it progressively, one step at a time... do not just wipe your Windows machine all of a sudden then install Linux hoping everything will be alright, that's a recipe for disasters...

Linux is not for every one, just like Windows or Apple or anything that's different from what one has presently, is not either.  You have to try it for some time to see if it works for you.

As for me, I switched to Linux 20 years ago originally because I friend introduced me to it and at the same time I happened to be upgrading my machine. New motherboard was not supported by Windows 95 anymore, so was forced to install Win XP instead. This in turn meant my scanner would not work anymore, as it was an old SCSI AGFA scanner that was not supported anymore, so no XP driver. Old driver was Win 3.1, would still work on Win95 but not in XP.

Well I noticed that this scanner somehow worked out of the box on Linux ! So that was a major driver for me.
Then over time I noticed I would spend more and more of my time on Linux and less and less on Windows, so I just gave up on Windows altogether and just sticked with Linux. Then over the years I got to appreciate more and more things about Linux, while at the same time watched Windows evolve/degrade after each and every release... to the point that today there is absolutely no way I would give up Linux to go back to Windows, even if I got paid for it.

YMMV as always...
« Last Edit: November 01, 2021, 08:36:42 pm by Vince »
 
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Online DC1MC

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106084 on: November 01, 2021, 06:28:23 pm »
Well Scheiße  |O, lost the two (defective) Agilent scopes to someone that bit a day ago 20 something EUR, because Gixen failed me :(  :palm:
merde'!

Please elucidate... how exactly did Gixen fail...? Genuine curiosity, as I've never had a Gix fail other than due to user error...  :o

mnem
*too much blood in my caffeine circulatory system*

Well, I was looking as seconds pass, and didn't see my bid commning and the the auction ended, in the Gixen bids list I've got "Unknown Error 3" and the "No error log can be found". It's a first for me as well, but mensch, there were TWO Agilent DSO hackable scopes  |O |O

Hmm, I see, well was your intended maximum bid on Gixen higher than they were sold for or not?

Way higher compared with what they sold for.
 
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Online Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106085 on: November 01, 2021, 06:40:47 pm »
yes. While I am at it: Z390 / i7 9700 / 32 GB RAM all new. Interested ?

Nope it looks like a full size ATX board, way too big. I need a uATX or else it won't fit inside the old IBM Aptiva case I want to use. Even then not all uATX can fit.

I remember years ago I did measure the available space in the case and checked two dozen uATX boards. Only a few of them would actually fit....

I don't need lots of PCI slots and can do with on-board graphics, so I can make do with a uATX form factor. All I need is Ethernet / RJ45 and audio output, and any uATX has that I think.... Only thing I am not willing to compromise, is RAM capability. Needs to be able to handle at least 32GB or else in just 10 years it will run out of steam again and I will be back to square one...  ::)


« Last Edit: November 01, 2021, 06:47:30 pm by Vince »
 

Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106086 on: November 01, 2021, 06:45:12 pm »
GA-B450M-S2H / Ryzen 5 3600 / 16 GB (upgradable) ?
Did you consider the PSU requirements ?
 

Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106087 on: November 01, 2021, 06:53:25 pm »
"He who does not like cats, will not get a beautiful women" - chinese proverb
...make of that what you will...

It's not working.  :(

I think you are messing the formal logic up.

  • It is a prerequisite to like cats to befriend beautiful persons of the appropriate gender.
  • Liking cats will not in and of itself lead to said befriendment.

I was reading it as "If you can put up with the shenanigans of the average cat you are now qualified to put up with the shenanigans of an Irish Redhead a beautiful woman.".  :)
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 
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Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106088 on: November 01, 2021, 06:55:01 pm »
why do I have to think of my 3 favorite Role Playing Games

Macho Women with Guns
Renegade Nuns on Wheels
Batwinged Bimbos from Hell ...

 
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Online tautech

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106089 on: November 01, 2021, 08:10:05 pm »
Delivery from Kiwi land. Tautech sent me a probe that goes to the Tek 212 mini. Mine is missing the correct probes. Thanks Rob!  :-+



He also sent me this. Not quite sure what it is but obviously 3D printed. A bottle opener possibly?  :-//



Really pleased you can use it Med and wasn't aware you didn't have either of the correct probes.  :o
Musta missed that post.  :-[

Yeah the creator of the 3dp bottle opener will be along in a little while when he drags his sorry arse from the sack....yep it's originally all the way from the Shipwreck Coast in Oz sporting his bean grinding company logo.
Avid Rabid Hobbyist.
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Offline factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106090 on: November 01, 2021, 08:17:43 pm »
Well Scheiße  |O, lost the two (defective) Agilent scopes to someone that bit a day ago 20 something EUR, because Gixen failed me :(  :palm:
merde'!

Please elucidate... how exactly did Gixen fail...? Genuine curiosity, as I've never had a Gix fail other than due to user error...  :o

mnem
*too much blood in my caffeine circulatory system*

Well, I was looking as seconds pass, and didn't see my bid commning and the the auction ended, in the Gixen bids list I've got "Unknown Error 3" and the "No error log can be found". It's a first for me as well, but mensch, there were TWO Agilent DSO hackable scopes  |O |O

Hmm, I see, well was your intended maximum bid on Gixen higher than they were sold for or not?

Way higher compared with what they sold for.

It could also have been a failure at ePays end, I've definitely noticed a lack of server capacity when they have listing fee promotions.

David
 

Online Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106091 on: November 01, 2021, 08:20:06 pm »
GA-B450M-S2H / Ryzen 5 3600 / 16 GB (upgradable) ?

Yes that's more like it, a small board... do you run a computer shop ?! I thought you were in IT not in retail !  ;D

Anyway again, not spending any money at the moment. When I get round to upgrading my computer it will take a few weeks of studying to figure out what to buy exactly. I am not going to buy any part in a hurry.


Quote from: Saskia
Did you consider the PSU requirements ?

That's part of course of the studying I will have to do.

Idea is to make a low power "office" computer.
Low power because I don't want a big noisy fan and H/S, and because I don't like wasting energy and because electricity is very expensive here and price increase a lot each and every year, and I am not rich, and the computer runs 24/7. Also why I am using a cheap/low poer grphics card (Nvidia GeForce 6200)

So, power consumption is a major criteria indeed.

Now "how much" exactly well... my reference is my current computer of course. So I need to buy a power meter to measure how much power it takes.
goal of course is to not exceed that, and hopefully make it less.

CPU is a core core2duo 8200  2,66GHz with 6MB of cache, 45nm process, TDP of 65Watts.
15years later it still performs adequately, so I am looking at something of similar performance maybe a bit more, but with a much lower power consumption thanks to finer etching processes these days. This CPU would probably draw only half a watt with todays fab processes ?!.......

Storage : two spinning 500GB 3,5" drives, these must draw some power I am sure.... so idea is to replace them with a single 500GB SSD, which I guess will draw a lot less power.

RAM : have not researched numbers, but I understand RAM sticks do draw a fair amount of power... based on the fact that some of them have freaking heat sinks on them ?!   :o So since I want lots of RAM, I will have to see what the power penalty is in that regard.
If some RAM sticks require less power than others, or if a new generation of RAM is round the corner, that might draw less power, in this case I would probably want to wait for said RAM to be available. Same with CPU of course, if a better one is round the corner, will wait for it. I am in no hurry, computer will have to last for 10++ years like the current one.

GPU : not into gaming at all, nor video editing or 3D movie rendering... so any built-in GPU will be just fine. This will help reduce the power requirements.

Another reason for wanting to go low /moderate power is of course that the old IBM Aptiva I want to use does not have stellar venting/cooling capabilities, for it was designed for a Pentium 120MHz or 166MHz, which had only a minuscule tiny heat sink and no fan at all. So I have to keep that in mind.
Ideally new CPU would be similar, low enough power (given my modest performance requirements) to not need a fan nor a big H/S either.

Basically I guess I want something like Tablet or entry-level laptop motherboard, but in a uATX form factor so I can have all the I/O connectors I need, slots for RAM stick and ZIF CPU socket and at least one PCI expansion slot just in case I might want to install something.

Monitor : I will probably consult a psychiatrist so he can help me let go my space and power hungry 17" CRT monitor, in favour of less power hungry and more compact LCD monitor. This will help reduce the electricity bill as well.. IF the LCD monitor has a real H/W power switch (at least at the back somewhere) not a crappy soft switch and then still draw 10 or 15 watts when supposedly " OFF "  ::)

I think that's pretty much it ?!.....
 

Online DC1MC

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106092 on: November 01, 2021, 08:21:23 pm »
Well Scheiße  |O, lost the two (defective) Agilent scopes to someone that bit a day ago 20 something EUR, because Gixen failed me :(  :palm:
merde'!

Please elucidate... how exactly did Gixen fail...? Genuine curiosity, as I've never had a Gix fail other than due to user error...  :o

mnem
*too much blood in my caffeine circulatory system*

Well, I was looking as seconds pass, and didn't see my bid commning and the the auction ended, in the Gixen bids list I've got "Unknown Error 3" and the "No error log can be found". It's a first for me as well, but mensch, there were TWO Agilent DSO hackable scopes  |O |O

Hmm, I see, well was your intended maximum bid on Gixen higher than they were sold for or not?

Way higher compared with what they sold for.

It could also have been a failure at ePays end, I've definitely noticed a lack of server capacity when they have listing fee promotions.

David

The fact they they went to some simpleton that just put some LOL bid, it really pisses me off. But this is the situation with luck, someone looks down and see that they found 100EUR, another do the same and find that they've stepped in a dog shite  :blah:.
 

Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106093 on: November 01, 2021, 08:59:39 pm »
@Vince
I am selling off some of my test equipment. Furthermore I do have a splendid relationship with a distributor and get some of his returns.
If you want to go energy serving 24/7 etc you may want to look into the Fujitsu industrial boards.
I do have one of those with a 9400F CPU and 32GB in SODIMMs ... you could fit a 8400 or similar and run it with a heatpipe.

There are also some options to run such a board with an external 12V PSU.
 

Offline tggzzz

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106094 on: November 01, 2021, 09:07:34 pm »
why do I have to think of my 3 favorite Role Playing Games

Macho Women with Guns
Renegade Nuns on Wheels
Batwinged Bimbos from Hell ...

You might like the Netflix TV series "Warrior Nun", which is best characterised as " ninja nuns with guns". Preposterous rubbish which somehow manages "a willing suspension of disbelief". 
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106095 on: November 01, 2021, 09:51:15 pm »
"Well, I'm not having anyone staring in disbelief at my willie suspension."
Cptn. E. Blackadder
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106096 on: November 01, 2021, 10:31:43 pm »
yes. While I am at it: Z390 / i7 9700 / 32 GB RAM all new. Interested ?

Nope it looks like a full size ATX board, way too big. I need a uATX or else it won't fit inside the old IBM Aptiva case I want to use. Even then not all uATX can fit.

I remember years ago I did measure the available space in the case and checked two dozen uATX boards. Only a few of them would actually fit....

I don't need lots of PCI slots and can do with on-board graphics, so I can make do with a uATX form factor. All I need is Ethernet / RJ45 and audio output, and any uATX has that I think.... Only thing I am not willing to compromise, is RAM capability. Needs to be able to handle at least 32GB or else in just 10 years it will run out of steam again and I will be back to square one...  ::)



I'm going to suggest something here, and not trying to belittle your desire to "not waste a perfectly good case" but quite frankly... your case is not perfectly good anymore. It was designed around ~100-200W TDP including graphics solution. Modern PCs start at twice that with a entry-level office-workload GPU or APU.

I spent quite some time trying to "keep my sleeper look" vintage Chieftec Dragon box aboot the time I started rebuilding my AMD 1055T; in the end I gave up and spent $55 correction: US$37 on a simple glass-sided box that had room built-in for a modern full-length GPU and had actual front-back airflow.

Modern cases are designed around straight-through airflow, and modern MBs, CPUs and GPUs demand it. The layout and airflow needs of the VRMs and even the chipset cooler demand it; even modern SSDs generate enough heat that they will choke and flip out without it.

On top of that, the newer boxes come with easily removable quick-change drive cages, oodles more front I/O and and most importantly, they isolate the airflow for the PSU from the rest of the case. On top of that, you can't reasonably put current versions of USB in the front of that; the connectivity is completely different and requires a new USB header/connector which is physically larger than old USB 2.0 etc.

I realize you don't need glass sides or the LEDs that I as a gamer like; but the airflow is something that horrible box just cannot give you unless you're prepared to go Totally Jethro on its beige ass with a power drill and just embrace the ghetto-fab. That front panel just makes my inner PC builder scream "Starved for fucking air!"

Now you may look at my liquid-cooled stuff and think I'm being overly dramatic; but the fact is that air-cooled CPU and GPU need more airflow than liquid-cooled, they need more volume and more velocity. Neither of which that box can give you unless you're literally ready to rip its face off and drill a million huge holes in it.

Do yourself a favor and let the poor thing die. It has given yoeman service for decades; it has earned its ticket to the Elysian fields. ;)

mnem


https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/random-mode-old-school-iron-1055trx580-rebuild-in-modern-gamer-case/msg2227704/#msg2227704
« Last Edit: November 01, 2021, 11:19:20 pm by mnementh »
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106097 on: November 01, 2021, 10:44:55 pm »
GA-B450M-S2H / Ryzen 5 3600 / 16 GB (upgradable) ?

Yes that's more like it, a small board... do you run a computer shop ?! I thought you were in IT not in retail !  ;D

Anyway again, not spending any money at the moment. When I get round to upgrading my computer it will take a few weeks of studying to figure out what to buy exactly. I am not going to buy any part in a hurry.


Quote from: Saskia
Did you consider the PSU requirements ?

That's part of course of the studying I will have to do.

Idea is to make a low power "office" computer.
Low power because I don't want a big noisy fan and H/S, and because I don't like wasting energy and because electricity is very expensive here and price increase a lot each and every year, and I am not rich, and the computer runs 24/7. Also why I am using a cheap/low poer grphics card (Nvidia GeForce 6200)

So, power consumption is a major criteria indeed.

Now "how much" exactly well... my reference is my current computer of course. So I need to buy a power meter to measure how much power it takes.
goal of course is to not exceed that, and hopefully make it less.

CPU is a core core2duo 8200  2,66GHz with 6MB of cache, 45nm process, TDP of 65Watts.
15years later it still performs adequately, so I am looking at something of similar performance maybe a bit more, but with a much lower power consumption thanks to finer etching processes these days. This CPU would probably draw only half a watt with todays fab processes ?!.......

Storage : two spinning 500GB 3,5" drives, these must draw some power I am sure.... so idea is to replace them with a single 500GB SSD, which I guess will draw a lot less power.

RAM : have not researched numbers, but I understand RAM sticks do draw a fair amount of power... based on the fact that some of them have freaking heat sinks on them ?!   :o So since I want lots of RAM, I will have to see what the power penalty is in that regard.
If some RAM sticks require less power than others, or if a new generation of RAM is round the corner, that might draw less power, in this case I would probably want to wait for said RAM to be available. Same with CPU of course, if a better one is round the corner, will wait for it. I am in no hurry, computer will have to last for 10++ years like the current one.

GPU : not into gaming at all, nor video editing or 3D movie rendering... so any built-in GPU will be just fine. This will help reduce the power requirements.

Another reason for wanting to go low /moderate power is of course that the old IBM Aptiva I want to use does not have stellar venting/cooling capabilities, for it was designed for a Pentium 120MHz or 166MHz, which had only a minuscule tiny heat sink and no fan at all. So I have to keep that in mind.
Ideally new CPU would be similar, low enough power (given my modest performance requirements) to not need a fan nor a big H/S either.

Basically I guess I want something like Tablet or entry-level laptop motherboard, but in a uATX form factor so I can have all the I/O connectors I need, slots for RAM stick and ZIF CPU socket and at least one PCI expansion slot just in case I might want to install something.

Monitor : I will probably consult a psychiatrist so he can help me let go my space and power hungry 17" CRT monitor, in favour of less power hungry and more compact LCD monitor. This will help reduce the electricity bill as well.. IF the LCD monitor has a real H/W power switch (at least at the back somewhere) not a crappy soft switch and then still draw 10 or 15 watts when supposedly " OFF "  ::)

I think that's pretty much it ?!.....

You can get all this, plus a modern LCD with approx the same real estate as your old CRT monitor out of a $300 off-lease Lenovo laptop in the 15.8" range.

Why kill yourself to build it into that old ill-fitting box?

mnem
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106098 on: November 01, 2021, 10:56:21 pm »
yes. While I am at it: Z390 / i7 9700 / 32 GB RAM all new. Interested ?

Nope it looks like a full size ATX board, way too big. I need a uATX or else it won't fit inside the old IBM Aptiva case I want to use. Even then not all uATX can fit.

I remember years ago I did measure the available space in the case and checked two dozen uATX boards. Only a few of them would actually fit....

I don't need lots of PCI slots and can do with on-board graphics, so I can make do with a uATX form factor. All I need is Ethernet / RJ45 and audio output, and any uATX has that I think.... Only thing I am not willing to compromise, is RAM capability. Needs to be able to handle at least 32GB or else in just 10 years it will run out of steam again and I will be back to square one...  ::)



I'm going to suggest something here, and not trying to belittle your desire to "not waste a perfectly good case" but quite frankly... your case is not perfectly good anymore. It was designed around ~100-200W TDP including graphics solution. Modern PCs start at twice that with a entry-level office-workload GPU or APU.

I spent quite some time trying to "keep my sleeper look" vintage Chieftec Dragon box aboot the time I started rebuilding my AMD 1055T; in the end I gave up and spent $55 on a simple glass-sided box that had room built-in for a modern full-length GPU and had actual front-back airflow.

Modern cases are designed around straight-through airflow, and modern MBs, CPUs and GPUs demand it. The layout and airflow needs of the VRMs and even the chipset cooler demand it; even modern SSDs generate enough heat that they will choke and flip out without it.

On top of that, the newer boxes come with easily removable quick-change drive cages, oodles more front I/O and and most importantly, they isolate the airflow for the PSU from the rest of the case. On top of that, you can't reasonably put current versions of USB in the front of that; the connectivity is completely different and requires a new USB header/connector which is physically larger than old USB 2.0 etc.

I realize you don't need glass sides or the LEDs that I as a gamer like; but the airflow is something that horrible box just cannot give you unless you're prepared to go Totally Jethro on its beige ass with a power drill and just embrace the ghetto-fab. That front panel just makes my inner PC builder scream "Starved for fucking air!"

Now you may look at my liquid-cooled stuff and think I'm being overly dramatic; but the fact is that air-cooled CPU and GPU need more airflow than liquid-cooled, they need more volume and more velocity. Neither of which that box can give you unless you're literally ready to rip its face off and drill a million huge holes in it.

Do yourself a favor and let the poor thing die. It has given yoeman service for decades; it has earned its ticket to the Elysian fields. ;)

mnem


https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/random-mode-old-school-iron-1055trx580-rebuild-in-modern-gamer-case/msg2227704/#msg2227704
He's not looking for anything as powerful as I understand it, he seems to be perfectly happy with it running at 2.6 Ghz, @ 65W TDP. I think he would accept a performance boost but still at 65W TDP or preferably less. One reason I think for the lower power is that it runs 24/7, possibly Bitcoin mining?

Personally, I'd rather run at far higher speeds and get more done, mine runs at 4 Ghz 125W TDP and will accept an overclock to 4.2 Ghz, but I'm happy to prolong its life, so I leave it at its native speed. Mine only runs 24/7 if a do a complete scan of the hard drives as it has 4 TB of storage attached, and it can take a while to chunk through that so it gets left on overnight sometimes, otherwise its normally on about 18 hours a day.
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #106099 on: November 01, 2021, 11:12:50 pm »
Still the same answer, only a off-lease Lenovo desktop or NUC.  :-//

Best bang for buck, especially as he doesn't care aboot Win11 cert or even Win10.

EDIT: If you have a need to build it, then the concerns re: the VRMs/Chipset/SSDs being starved for air still obtain. Modern MBs are designed with flow-through airflow in mind. Even the uATX ones expect the airflow from the CPU to cool the VRMs, which that box will stifle.

It is just looking for misery to try and fit a modern machine into that box, when a decent modern box can be bought for as little as $40 delivered which has modern front panel I/O and will fit the MB's I/O shield.

I get that he's in France so prices may be a bit higher; but I believe PC Part Picker still works there too. Which would also give Vince a much better understanding of what a good deal Saskia is offering him.   ;)

mnem
 :-/O
« Last Edit: November 02, 2021, 01:11:56 am by mnementh »
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