Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

Freqq, remember that in the U.S. back in the day, there were three names in oscilloscopes - Tektronix, Tektronix and Tektronix.  For everything else, there was HP.

-Pat

Yup, other than Fluke for multimeters. I never used old Keithley gear (only modern stuff), but haven't heard anything bad about it. If I were to collect old gear, I'd probably limit it to those four brands, and for scopes, only Tek. Back when I was young, there was a guy who thought HP was the answer to everyone's need for equipment. Funny thing was though he always mispronounced it "Hewmlett Packard" for some reason.

Get your hands on a 54645A like mine; you'll see the light. Arguably one of the most intuitive to use instruments ever made. Of any species.

mnem

[med6753]

Freqq, remember that in the U.S. back in the day, there were three names in oscilloscopes - Tektronix, Tektronix and Tektronix.  For everything else, there was HP.

-Pat

Yup, other than Fluke for multimeters. I never used old Keithley gear (only modern stuff), but haven't heard anything bad about it. If I were to collect old gear, I'd probably limit it to those four brands, and for scopes, only Tek. Back when I was young, there was a guy who thought HP was the answer to everyone's need for equipment. Funny thing was though he always mispronounced it "Hewmlett Packard" for some reason.

For quite a long time my bench was hp-less but one day I picked up a 6215A power supply at a ham fest. And then a visit to nixiefreqq's house of all that is hp resulted in being gifted an 5326B counter and a 5248L counter with a fan loud enough to wake the dead. I have since on my own purchased a 3456A DMM which is now my bench standard for all my DMM's and even rules over several Flukes. But I draw a line in the sand with regards to an hp scope. 

[mnementh]

Dude... Come on. This is me you're talking to; the 2465 poster child.

Even I have respect for this instrument. Tek for analog, hells yeah. But hp tore them a new asshole with their digital scopes for the digital age.

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

[0culus]

Oh yeah. And it's telling that the Megazoom ASIC that HP pioneered is still the cornerstone of Keysight's general purpose DSOs and MSOs. Running a megazoom scope is as nice as running a CRO, because the front panel is latency-free as it should be.

[0culus]

Freqq, remember that in the U.S. back in the day, there were three names in oscilloscopes - Tektronix, Tektronix and Tektronix.  For everything else, there was HP.

-Pat

Yup, other than Fluke for multimeters. I never used old Keithley gear (only modern stuff), but haven't heard anything bad about it. If I were to collect old gear, I'd probably limit it to those four brands, and for scopes, only Tek. Back when I was young, there was a guy who thought HP was the answer to everyone's need for equipment. Funny thing was though he always mispronounced it "Hewmlett Packard" for some reason.

For quite a long time my bench was hp-less but one day I picked up a 6215A power supply at a ham fest. And then a visit to nixiefreqq's house of all that is hp resulted in being gifted an 5326B counter and a 5248L counter with a fan loud enough to wake the dead. I have since on my own purchased a 3456A DMM which is now my bench standard for all my DMM's and even rules over several Flukes. But I draw a line in the sand with regards to an hp scope. 

I have a relatively rare -hp- 1727A "portable" storage scope. It's not a bad scope at all. The controls are rather unintuitive which is the main gripe with it. Also, it's huge. It's the same depth as a 7104 and heavy.

[med6753]

Dude... Come on. This is me you're talking to; the 2465 poster child.

Even I have respect for this instrument. Tek for analog, hells yeah. But hp tore them a new asshole with their digital scopes for the digital age.

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

Everyone tore Tek a new butt hole after the 24XX analog/early digital series and their foray into the DSO world resulted in giant turds which is the reason I don't have any, and won't have any. 

[Cubdriver]

Good eye, Vince.  Yes, it's 575, and is in the repair/restore queue.   

Great    So that's 3 of these beats on TEA... you, me and Oculus.

Anybody else has one ? I wonder how many there are here...

I actually have two - the second, more functional one, is a Mod 122C with the additional 400V collector voltage option.  It at least works, but still needs some going-through.

I know for sure that the base step selector switch is mechanically stuck in the 'repetitive' position, and have not yet powered it up to learn what other evils may lurk therein. 

Hmmm.... funny you mention that, because I think that very switch on my unit is kaput too !  Not in the same way as yours, but still.

Just read the user manual to make sure I understand how it's supposed to behave, mechanically. I understand the "Repetitive" and "OFF" positions, are stable positions, and the third position, " Single Family" is spring loaded / momentary.

"OFF" and " Single Family "  behave properly, from a mechanical perspective. However when I flick the switch to the " Repetitive " position... it's just flapping in the breeze. It won't lock/click into place, and offers zero resistance. It just falls back to the OFF position like a rock, as soon as I remove my finger from it. Broken switch then...

However from an ELECTRICAL perspective, seems like it behaves like yours : in any 3 position, it will display curves constantly.

So maybe that particular switch is a weak point in the 575...

Following are some macro photos of the rear of the Base Step Mode switch from my 'working' 575-122C
'Off' position - moveable contacts both separate from outer contacts, and connected to inner contacts.  R184 grounded through lower set of 'inner' contacts, 'single family' contacts (uppermost pair) open:


'Repetitive' position - bat handle up; contact actuator down, latched - R184 ungrounded (lower 'inner' contacts open), 'single family' contacts (uppermost pair) open:

Switch latches in this position when actuator overrides bent moveable contact and groove on face engages ridge on bent contact leaf

'Single Family' position - bat handle down, contact actuator up, momentary - R184 grounded (lower 'inner' contacts closed), Single Family line grounded through now closed upper contact pair:

Switch cannot latch in this position due to shape of moveable contact - 'straight' leaf stays above actuator, cannot be overridden by actuator nose

Base step mode switch (SW 145) in schematic:

I just powered up the beast to make sure I was not dreaming, before I posted this. Nope, no mistake. Except it seems the poor 575 is now going downhill for some reason ! The " 120 / 240 / 120 "  STEPS / SEC switch is acting up. I just can't get it to display curves reliably, it just does weird and wonderful things at semi random when I touche either of these two switches. Sometimes it even displays what looks like a really neat animated 3D rendering of some hollow shape... poor 575 is completely losing it now ! 

So, it " might " HAS some electrical gremlins after all, it's not just a cosmetic restoration anymore !    Well it's more fun this way.

I looked at all the tubes glowing in the thing... noticed one of them that really looks like it's not lighting up at all, not even really faintly. V132 (an 6AL5).
Looked it up in the schematics.... oh surprise, it's part of the base step generator !    A dual rectifier, both plates connected together and going straight to... "surprise " again, the STEPS / SEC switch ! 

Just checked my spreadsheet listing all the tube models contained in my Tek scopes. The 6AL5 is not very common... I mean all bar one (Type 547) has this tube but one and only one. Still, I have some then, so could swap that tube to see if that improves thins... most likely will...

Here are similar pics of the rear of the Steps/Second switch, in 240, upper 120 and lower 120 positions, respectively.  Perhaps cleaning the contacts by dragging some printer paper wet with contact cleaner between them might help?

240 step/sec position (all contacts open):


120 step/sec (handle up) position (lower contact pair closed):


120 step/sec (handle down) position (upper contact pair closed):


Hope these help somewhat.

-Pat

[bd139]

Not often I give away a bargain as resident Ferengi but there is a nice Fluke 27 here https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FLUKE-27-MULTIMETER-Unit-Only-/165021824575?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0

£35. Mark on screen otherwise looks pretty tidy.

Now mine! The 25 needs company.

Looks like one segment may be a bit dodgy, but that could either be a wipe clean of the zebra strip or just camera shutter versus multiplexed display (which was the case as I predicted correctly ,he said smuggly, for the HP 53132A).

Congratulations to you and apologies to your wallet 

[bd139]

Dude... Come on. This is me you're talking to; the 2465 poster child.

Even I have respect for this instrument. Tek for analog, hells yeah. But hp tore them a new asshole with their digital scopes for the digital age.

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

Everyone tore Tek a new butt hole after the 24XX analog/early digital series and their foray into the DSO world resulted in giant turds which is the reason I don't have any, and won't have any.

To be fair the early “light weight” digital units (TDS200) were fairly groundbreaking when they came out. They had no fan, decent display, weighed bugger all, we’re pretty cheap and had enough functionality to tick most basic boxes. When your other option was to drag a 546xx around it was a good proposition.

The key take home though is it ain’t a megazoom.

Anyway I’ve got this TBS1000 turning up this week sometime. Should be interesting to play with. We have another thread going reverse engineering the firmware at the moment. It runs Linux on ARM  . Wait for the cease and desist from Fortive 

Edit: also for those who never experienced this hell, the first 546xx’s were somewhat unreliable and fragile bits of kit. It took HP a good year to get on top of that and they never solved the fragility issues.

[med6753]

Here's something that will make your wallet run away from home. Just got bill for same day hernia surgery. This is for the hospital services only. Does not include the surgeon's bill, which I haven't seen yet.

Total charges: $32,266.30 USD. 

My co-pay: $325.00 USD.

If I hadn't purchased additional insurance who knows how much of that would be on me. 

Usual comments about USA health care. 

[med6753]

To be fair the early “light weight” digital units (TDS200) were fairly groundbreaking when they came out. They had no fan, decent display, weighed bugger all, we’re pretty cheap and had enough functionality to tick most basic boxes. When your other option was to drag a 546xx around it was a good proposition.

The key take home though is it ain’t a megazoom.

Anyway I’ve got this TBS1000 turning up this week sometime. Should be interesting to play with. We have another thread going reverse engineering the firmware at the moment. It runs Linux on ARM  . Wait for the cease and desist from Fortive 

Edit: also for those who never experienced this hell, the first 546xx’s were somewhat unreliable and fragile bits of kit. It took HP a good year to get on top of that and they never solved the fragility issues.

And then all the surface mount tants let loose and turned them into trash. 

[bd139]

Here's something that will make your wallet run away from home. Just got bill for same day hernia surgery. This is for the hospital services only. Does not include the surgeon's bill, which I haven't seen yet.

Total charges: $32,266.30 USD. 

My co-pay: $325.00 USD.

If I hadn't purchased additional insurance who knows how much of that would be on me. 

Usual comments about USA health care. 

To be fair that’d cost about the same here. Your charges aren’t that bad for that one. I was expecting 6 figures to be honest.  The thing is we don’t have to actually even see the bill or pay it here 

(Although we’d probably be dead before we managed to get to a GP and get a referral at the moment)

[bd139]

To be fair the early “light weight” digital units (TDS200) were fairly groundbreaking when they came out. They had no fan, decent display, weighed bugger all, we’re pretty cheap and had enough functionality to tick most basic boxes. When your other option was to drag a 546xx around it was a good proposition.

The key take home though is it ain’t a megazoom.

Anyway I’ve got this TBS1000 turning up this week sometime. Should be interesting to play with. We have another thread going reverse engineering the firmware at the moment. It runs Linux on ARM  . Wait for the cease and desist from Fortive 

Edit: also for those who never experienced this hell, the first 546xx’s were somewhat unreliable and fragile bits of kit. It took HP a good year to get on top of that and they never solved the fragility issues.

And then all the surface mount tants let loose and turned them into trash. 

TBH not seen any problems with the surface mount tants. The only plague worthy mention was the SMD cans in the TDS5xx and TDS7xx series.

But honestly all of these problems are outside the design life of the units so we’re pretty much necromancers here by trade 

[med6753]

This is an Amazon partner seller. It's the 105V zener diode for the Type 547. They generated the shipping label on August 14th. Today is the 17th and they still haven't given the package to USPS. How many days do you think I should wait before sending them a  ?

Oh and they claim they send out orders within 2 days. Yea, right. 


 

[Vince]

To be fair the early “light weight” digital units (TDS200) were fairly groundbreaking when they came out. They had no fan, decent display, weighed bugger all, we’re pretty cheap and had enough functionality to tick most basic boxes.

You forgot the main point !     You got 1 GS/s for dirt cheap ! 
Portability / LCD / form factor was equally ground breaking.
I remember when they just came out and we had received a batch of them at school. They looked like an alien spaceship, every one wanted to have them to play with, nobody wanted the CRO's anymore...
I remember telling the Tek rep who visited us my two criticisms about them though. Sluggish LCD and no way to uncalibrate the time base to do phase measurements yet no automatic measurement either to compensate for that.

Each to their own but for me I Iove Tek scopes including digital stuff but only the first generation : TDS200 and TDS 300/500/600/700 and their various A/B/C revisions. Still would love a fully optioned TDS 784D or better yet a 794 but rare as hens teeth.

Later digital scopes from Tek don't attract me at all. Even their latest offering.
Recent stuff from HP / Keysight does attract me, but R&S even more.
That said all these modern scopes still look bloated with millions lines of code that always contain some sort of bug or quirk or lack of responsiveness no matter what, and a UI I always find something wrong with. I particularly hate the blue HP uses every where in their menus and buttons, I hate blue (only for classic Tek CRTs !  ). If at least you could customize the colours like you can in a 30 year old Tek TDS...
I like yellow on black background, like R&S does.

TBH not seen any problems with the surface mount tants. The only plague worthy mention was the SMD cans in the TDS5xx and TDS7xx series.

And then if I am not mistaken, only on the first two generations of the 500 (vanilla 500 and 500A) and the very first gen of 700. The 700A was already fixed in this regard IIRC. Also the 600 was never affected even in first gen if I am not mistaken.
I have a TDS 544A, so it was affected. All the caps were sorted 5 years ago by the seller (got it from Shakal Nokturn, hi Shakal !    ) when I got it and now runs perfectly, still to this day.

[Robert763]

Another little project (no pun intended). A display for my GPSDO. It will receive serial NMEA data from the RS-232 port on the front of the GPS box, get parsed out, and displayed in some fashion TBD. I need a MAX232 but I already had the display on-hand. I might get a bigger display depending on what I want to show.

Oh what the hell - and a pic of an hp calculator ...

You don't really need a full 232 interface for just receive. If the UART will accept inverted data just a series resistor and couple of clamp diodes. Otherwise just a bipolar transistor as a level shifter and inverter. PICs don't even need the diodes, just a resistor.

[Wolfgang]

Dude... Come on. This is me you're talking to; the 2465 poster child.

Even I have respect for this instrument. Tek for analog, hells yeah. But hp tore them a new asshole with their digital scopes for the digital age.

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

Very true. The top scopes are now Infiniium, and the low end is ruled by Rigol DS1054Z. I still have 3 Teks, but they have been outclassed in the meantime.

[Robert763]

HP got hammered for thr UI on the 1980A and subsequent "single knob" design 'scopes and really did their research and put effort into the 546xx series. Apart from the undersampling non-MegaZoom models they are a great scope to use if you were "brought up" on CRO's. A seamless transition from analog CRO like "handling" to full function DSO. No latency on controls because it uses separate processors for control and aquisition. Not tiny like the LCD models but not too big. Which is nice because it dosn't move around when you push buttons or connect a probe.

[beanflying]

At severe risk of buying Random unneeded TEA items unless I can get out of here and relieve the boredom a bit. I have no space so it had better be small 

Collet and bits box and a chance to try out a nesting Tray idea I sketched in my Secret Squirrel book a while ago incorporated during an otherwise very boring day.

[bd139]

Oh man shit packaging here we come:



Appears to have survived intact probably only due to the fact it weighs bugger all. I haven't powered it up yet though.

This is rather cool:



Gotta go do some work now 

[Specmaster]

Not enough packing beads around it to support the item and also from the look of it not enough space between the corrugated cardboard and the outer carton which should IMV have even more packing beads surrounding the item on all sides and top and bottom. It is not that hard to pack an item surely?

[bd139]

The bottom has ~10mm of foam in it. There was two bits of folded cardboard over the top. Yes indeed people do not know how to pack.

Another video for the series

[tggzzz]

Here's something that will make your wallet run away from home. Just got bill for same day hernia surgery. This is for the hospital services only. Does not include the surgeon's bill, which I haven't seen yet.

Total charges: $32,266.30 USD. 

My co-pay: $325.00 USD.

If I hadn't purchased additional insurance who knows how much of that would be on me. 

Usual comments about USA health care. 

To be fair that’d cost about the same here. Your charges aren’t that bad for that one. I was expecting 6 figures to be honest.  The thing is we don’t have to actually even see the bill or pay it here 

I did, once. My daughter had life changing 6 hour surgery with two consultant surgeons[1]. I insisted they used my company's insurance scheme to pay for it. Bill: £25k.

[1] one of whom had recently been on the excellent TV programme "Your Life in Their Hands", and was just about to fly through a major hurricane to lecture about that operation in Miami

[AVGresponding]

The bottom has ~10mm of foam in it. There was two bits of folded cardboard over the top. Yes indeed people do not know how to pack.

Another video for the series

At least you've some more material for your new yt channel!   

[bd139]

Ok lunch time so screwdriver time  . I have powered it up and it works fine. It was powered down pretty sharply for obvious reasons later...

Looking pretty tidy:



Insides also tidy:



Hole ready for that 10544A to be stuffed in it. This requires a couple of small board mods on this rev which are nice and easy to do.



The reason it's not staying powered up for long  . At least no one has been at it.



The "half installed" channel C 1.3GHz option which will be populated later. All you need is some schottky diodes, a prescaler IC, MMIC, some RG174 and a BNC connector and blow a hole in the front panel and you're done 

Happy with this one.