Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Zucca]

Yeah I know, I have the same problem with my Sat Nav and also mobile phone screen, they look totally blank unless I look above or below the glasses and then of course I'm almost blind as I need glasses distance glasses for driving and reading glasses for close up work 

Don't tell it to BMW customers who pays $$$ for the head up display and then find out they need to use not polarized sunglasses....
I tried to report it to BMW development but you know.... they told me is a known tolerated issue. 

[Specmaster]

Ok need some help with an ethical conundrum here.

The tinySA guy said on the ebay message that I could keep the fake one. In the jiffy bag for the replacement he has a hand written note asking for me to return the fake one.

I am loathed to return it because (a) it's at my cost and (b) it'll probably get sold on as a good one to someone else less diligent and (c) he's said I can keep it already.

Thoughts?

Edit: incidentally it is broken when testing it with the not broken one. The ref output is approx -5dBm below expected level.

I'd probably write the seller through ebay, that you are confused, because of (c) and the note you've found.
I'd also ask him for paying the return costs, if he wants it back. It wasn't your fault, that you got a non-working fake unit.

Use ebay messaging just in case you need proof about the communication.

Agree 100%, you also have of course his message to you in the messages' section saying to keep the fake unit, so if push becomes shove, eBay should agree and side with you.

[0culus]

Got the urge to build another pulser. This time I laid it out so that I would be able to connect a charge line easily. This effort incorporates all the tricks I have learned in my journey of building Jim Williams' circuit.

[..]

Measurement set up today is my Type 547 'scope with the Type 1S1 sampling plug-in set to 200 mV/cm and 0.5 ns/cm. The output is going through a GR-874 20 dB (10X) pad.

Wow the pulse looks beautiful on that blue CRT 
However I don't think this is a conclusive experience.. you don't know if your design efforts have been rewarded do you ? The sampling head seems to be too slow, it's probably hiding the true performance of your pulser  ?

I mean I just checked the rise time for the 1S1. Manual says " 350ps OR BETTER ". Eye-balling it on your photograph, it looks like 300ps or a little less, consistent with the rise time of the 1S1 then. So... that means your pulser is much faster than that, but we don't know how much... we need a faster sampling head or multi-Ghz scope ! 

As tggzzz (ok I can't remember how many of each letter) said above, the rubber really meets the road when I get the charge line working. Right now it is more of an impulse generator...since we don't yet have a flat top (which the charge line will provide) we really can't infer anything meaningful about rise time.

[McBryce]

Yeah I know, I have the same problem with my Sat Nav and also mobile phone screen, they look totally blank unless I look above or below the glasses and then of course I'm almost blind as I need glasses distance glasses for driving and reading glasses for close up work 

Don't tell it to BMW customers who pays $$$ for the head up display and then find out they need to use not polarized sunglasses....
I tried to report it to BMW development but you know.... they told me is a known tolerated issue. 

To be fair, BMW didn't develop the HUD, they only wrote the requirements. You'd have been better to report it to VDO, but I'm pretty sure they already know.

McBryce.

[Saskia]

@Mounty
once I am done moving I could hook it up to the 500 MHz Keysight I have here

[Zucca]

To be fair, BMW didn't develop the HUD, they only wrote the requirements. You'd have been better to report it to VDO, but I'm pretty sure they already know.
McBryce.

Oh yes.. I know that. You know also very well it is not a single case, it is standard process.

You do not know how sad I was to discover that developer is normally just a guy who needs to talk to the real developer.

[Brumby]

48kg of Frequency Generating Door Stop. Pickup only in Sydney if you are prepared to risk a fine for breaching stay at home orders.... eBay auction: #154569906786

Go on @Brumby you know you NEED it and its only $2/kg 

I wish I was in a position to drop $100 on it - but I don't really have the space unless I dump it in the garage, which I'd rather not.  Besides, I am trying to keep a lid on my acquisitions to those I will actually use.  This not to mention that it might cost me $5,000 if I get busted going for an unsanctioned drive.
(Yes, folks, as of today, that's the fine for disobeying the lock down we have in place. On the news tonight, there was an engagement party, the attendees of which were handed out about $350,000 in fines in total ... and it seems they have identified 3 people from there that tested positive for Covid - so far.  Authorities are concerned this could turn out to be a super-spreader event.  It's this kind of stupidity that makes me want to bury my steel caps right up the arse of each of these idiots - while the rest of us are busting our butts doing our bit to get on top of things.)

[McBryce]

To be fair, BMW didn't develop the HUD, they only wrote the requirements. You'd have been better to report it to VDO, but I'm pretty sure they already know.
McBryce.

Oh yes.. I know that. You know also very well it is not a single case, it is standard process.

You do not know how sad I was to discover that developer is normally just a guy who needs to talk to the real developer.

Yes, many people believe that car companies actually design and develop their cars, when in fact >90% of the car is designed by other companies, the OEM just documents the requirements and put the car together (and in some cases even that is outsourced!).

McBryce.

[mansaxel]

The whole premse with "safety" shroulded 4mm plugs is not just what they are intended to be used for but how they may be misused.

In our plans, we rarely make mistakes. Reality, though, is littered with them. Well put, Robert.

Another take is safety belts or helmets; which, assuming you never crash or are crashed into, are useless inconveniences. Right?

[Robert763]

So with the Rapco 1804 working, I realise I have four GPSDO's running in the workshop. And a 4 channel 'scope so why not? 
 The GPSDO's are an HP 58503B, Trimble Thunderbolt, Odetics GPStar and Rapco 1804P6
Two screen shots below, 3 minutes apart. Very little phase shift so pretty stable. The blue trace has moved a little. That's the GPStar. However I don't think it's out. The cable I used is at least 10m long and I think the phase shift is due to the cable changing temperature.

I think I know what the time is

[Cubdriver]

Another of the transparent cobalt blue Tek mugs has appeared on the bay, though be forewarned the seller wants crazy $$ for it.  Figure I'll put it out here just the same.  NAWTS.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/294337808614?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20180105095853%26meid%3Dc5b98641e34c4a08ab40f500d8d4cdd9%26pid%3D100903%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D20%26sd%3D294337808614%26itm%3D294337808614%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2510209%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2510209.c100903.m5276

-Pat

[med6753]

This is $43 USD worth of cheap ass #2 Southern Yellow Pine. Want cabinet grade #1? Prepare to sell your first born. Anyway, this is just a portion of the total material I'll need to build the 2nd scope cart. Objective for today is get the top and bottom cut to size and then the glue joinery. Tomorrow after the glue dries build up the basic frame. I'll post pix of that when done.

[mnementh]

   

Got the urge to build another pulser. This time I laid it out so that I would be able to connect a charge line easily. This effort incorporates all the tricks I have learned in my journey of building Jim Williams' circuit.
-
(3) Use island cutter to make spots for soldering
-
(6) And last, but most certainly not least, this design conspicuously eliminates the 1 pF cap the original circuit uses. Instead, I put my microwave engineer hat on and am relying on the parasitic capacitance of the board. It works rather well!

Measurement set up today is my Type 547 'scope with the Type 1S1 sampling plug-in set to 200 mV/cm and 0.5 ns/cm. The output is going through a GR-874 20 dB (10X) pad.

Well played.  I expected, when I first saw it, that the island-cutter technique would be especially suited to exactly this kind of HF/black magic tinkery due to its essentially 2D planar nature which minimizes unexpected covalent area. That's why I posted aboot it.

Bonus, you got something that can actually put the spurs to your type 547, and show off that gorgeous cobalt blue trace! 

mnem
 

[mnementh]

On Aliexpress variate your search words and sort by price, eg. look for "lcr leads".

If you put them in the basket, ali shows what others bought, sometimes there is the same article much cheaper.

If something is linked here the price tends to go up.

Aw, man. Now TEA affects vendor prices, too?

Yeah, well... the prices on AliEx are very fluid; I expect they adjust their prices based directly on browsing and buying habits on a hourly (or less) basis. Interest in an item is doubtless the cause; not TEA itself.

mnem
 

[Neomys Sapiens]

Anybody here from Germany with a much faster scope than my 100MHz RTB2004 which likes to test my crude Jim Williams pulse gen.?   

Either TDS684 (500MHz 2Gs/s) or Tek DPO7354 (2.5/3.5GHz 40Gs/s)

[mnementh]

   Ok replacement tinySA received already and confirmed genuine by Erik. Seller is good IMHO - they replaced it. I can't complain really. This is probably best product support I've seen for a few years overall 

Now I've got 1.5 tinySA's I need to work out what to do with the 0.5 half. It sort of works with some constraints which I need to evaluate. It probably will make a reasonable signal source still or something 

Oh dear... I guess that means my TinySA bought off Bang-em-good is for sure a clone/fake as I figured it probably had to be given the price. And the source.  also makes me feel a bit of a dick for just buying both off BunkGoods after HCXQS blew everybody off for 6 months re: 4" model release date.

Let us know how your tinkery with the fake unit works out; it would be nice to be able to test correctly and make mine work correctly if you can reduce the project to a repeatable process.

Also, could you show us the cables/accessories that came with your "real" one? Those that came with mine were immediately suspect; made of some funky black cable I'm not even sure what it is. It doesn't look or feel like RG316 or RG174.

Only thing I can say in their defense is that both articles were A) available at a reasonable price B) when I wanted them and C) availability wasn't shrouded in a fog of bullshit and hearsay.

mnem
 

[Neomys Sapiens]

Quick update on the 2 Avo 8 Mk V meters I picked up this morning. The leads are in a pretty bad way, hopefully a good clean will improve them, but the probes have had it. One meter was in a near perfect leather case, the meter had a rattle when I got it home, opened it up and a little screw and washer fell out. Tested the DC volts and the meter reads a little low, further investigation reveals some damage to plastic movement protection shell, and it seems some plastic bits may be caught up in the meter movement as the meter is not linear. Need to investigate that more.

The other meter had a sticker on the side stating it had been serviced by Megger, who own Avo and that one checks out perfectly OK and still had the factory applied seal intact following its service. That does not mean to say it's free from faults, when they reassembled the meter, failed to correctly align the meter assembly with its plinth  and as a result has obscured the top of dial markings as you can see in the photo, 4,5 and 6, so this needs a little fettling. Otherwise, both meters are in good condition cosmetically and all the switches and cut-outs function correctly, and battery compartments are in original condition.

More info and photos as I get to grips with them.

Looking forward to seeing how they look with the lamps fitted!

 

Not ever on my watch will that happen, so don't hold your breath.

Still looking for a late model military one. Should be completely working, have the broad arrow on the faceplate, nice condititon and not cost silly money. I'm not looking for that every day, so if someone sees one that fits, please tell.

[mnementh]

Yeah I know, I have the same problem with my Sat Nav and also mobile phone screen, they look totally blank unless I look above or below the glasses and then of course I'm almost blind as I need glasses distance glasses for driving and reading glasses for close up work 

Don't tell it to BMW customers who pays $$$ for the head up display and then find out they need to use not polarized sunglasses....
I tried to report it to BMW development but you know.... they told me is a known tolerated issue. 

BMW being assholes is a known tolerated issue.

At least for the last 40 years or so. Old man Basche (the guy who got me into electronics in high school) rode a pristine R75 and he told numerous tales of how BMW corporate took care of him as a long-time customer; including but not limited to shipping parts to a trusted garage in New Mexico by air and arranging for the bike to be picked up by AAA and dropped off at said garage when it kakked a rocker arm in the middle of the desert.

mnem
 

[0culus]

   

Got the urge to build another pulser. This time I laid it out so that I would be able to connect a charge line easily. This effort incorporates all the tricks I have learned in my journey of building Jim Williams' circuit.
-
(3) Use island cutter to make spots for soldering
-
(6) And last, but most certainly not least, this design conspicuously eliminates the 1 pF cap the original circuit uses. Instead, I put my microwave engineer hat on and am relying on the parasitic capacitance of the board. It works rather well!

Measurement set up today is my Type 547 'scope with the Type 1S1 sampling plug-in set to 200 mV/cm and 0.5 ns/cm. The output is going through a GR-874 20 dB (10X) pad.

Well played.  I expected, when I first saw it, that the island-cutter technique would be especially suited to exactly this kind of HF/black magic tinkery due to its essentially 2D planar nature which minimizes unexpected covalent area. That's why I posted aboot it.

Bonus, you got something that can actually put the spurs to your type 547, and show off that gorgeous cobalt blue trace! 

mnem
 

Yeah, it works extremely well. Easy to do, and gives solid results. Perfect for experimenting. One of these days I'll do a proper PCB. To be fair the the 547, the 1S1 plug in is an entire sampling oscilloscope sans indicator. It uses the host mainframe for power and as an X-Y indicator. 

[mnementh]

Ok need some help with an ethical conundrum here.

The tinySA guy said on the ebay message that I could keep the fake one. In the jiffy bag for the replacement he has a hand written note asking for me to return the fake one.

I am loathed to return it because (a) it's at my cost and (b) it'll probably get sold on as a good one to someone else less diligent and (c) he's said I can keep it already.

Thoughts?

Edit: incidentally it is broken when testing it with the not broken one. The ref output is approx -5dBm below expected level.

I'd probably write the seller through ebay, that you are confused, because of (c) and the note you've found.
I'd also ask him for paying the return costs, if he wants it back. It wasn't your fault, that you got a non-working fake unit.

Use ebay messaging just in case you need proof about the communication.

Agree 100%, you also have of course his message to you in the messages' section saying to keep the fake unit, so if push becomes shove, eBay should agree and side with you.

The private request for you to return the "fake" makes my hackles rise instinctively, and my internal BS detector is just pegging the meter. 

They are trying to get you to return the evidence so it's not out there in the wild; this has absolutely zip to do with the specific item or its value. I see absolutely zero ethical conundrum here; they directed you to keep it publicly, and the private request to return it is not reasonable.

Keep it, and for the sake of all of us, dissect that little fucker. That way everybody in eevBlog can have a side by side comparison, and can have some concrete reference when trying to decide between waiting for "the legit item" or buying off bang-em-good, etc just because they're in stock.

Another possibility is that they may not want that "fake" in your hands because it can easily be fixed with a few bodges and/or reflashing with legit FW, which you are obviously capable of determining, and because you are a respected voice on eevBlog, which is a major driving force behind this little China-direct industry they have going here.

mnem
Trust no one.

[nixiefreqq]

Another of the transparent cobalt blue Tek mugs has appeared on the bay, though be forewarned the seller wants crazy $$ for it.  Figure I'll put it out here just the same.  NAWTS.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/294337808614?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20180105095853%26meid%3Dc5b98641e34c4a08ab40f500d8d4cdd9%26pid%3D100903%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D20%26sd%3D294337808614%26itm%3D294337808614%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2510209%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2510209.c100903.m5276

-Pat

just bought my very first piece of tek TE.   and it only cost me 51 cents more than the guy is asking for that mug. 

maybe it would have been best to skip the possibly distressed scope and buy the mug instead?

[bd139]

   Ok replacement tinySA received already and confirmed genuine by Erik. Seller is good IMHO - they replaced it. I can't complain really. This is probably best product support I've seen for a few years overall 

Now I've got 1.5 tinySA's I need to work out what to do with the 0.5 half. It sort of works with some constraints which I need to evaluate. It probably will make a reasonable signal source still or something 

Oh dear... I guess that means my TinySA bought off Bang-em-good is for sure a clone/fake as I figured it probably had to be given the price. And the source.  also makes me feel a bit of a dick for just buying both off BunkGoods after HCXQS blew everybody off for 6 months re: 4" model release date.

Let us know how your tinkery with the fake unit works out; it would be nice to be able to test correctly and make mine work correctly if you can reduce the project to a repeatable process.

Also, could you show us the cables/accessories that came with your "real" one? Those that came with mine were immediately suspect; made of some funky black cable I'm not even sure what it is. It doesn't look or feel like RG316 or RG174.

Only thing I can say in their defense is that both articles were A) available at a reasonable price B) when I wanted them and C) availability wasn't shrouded in a fog of bullshit and hearsay.

mnem
 

In the case of the fake one here it doesn't pass self tests at all so worth running through them. If it does pass the self tests then flash it with the latest firmware as per instructions from [1] and try again and see if it passes or not.

The failure mode appears to be that the signal generated by the LO port which is used to self-cal it is down by 5dBm, probably due to filter alignment or design mistake somewhere. Some hooky versions that pass the self test just fake the test passes apparently 

The cables that come with the real one are no different to the fake one as well so I wouldn't worry about that. They're good enough for the job.

[1] https://tinysa.org/wiki/pmwiki.php?n=Main.UpdatingTheFirmware

[med6753]

   

Got the urge to build another pulser. This time I laid it out so that I would be able to connect a charge line easily. This effort incorporates all the tricks I have learned in my journey of building Jim Williams' circuit.
-
(3) Use island cutter to make spots for soldering
-
(6) And last, but most certainly not least, this design conspicuously eliminates the 1 pF cap the original circuit uses. Instead, I put my microwave engineer hat on and am relying on the parasitic capacitance of the board. It works rather well!

Measurement set up today is my Type 547 'scope with the Type 1S1 sampling plug-in set to 200 mV/cm and 0.5 ns/cm. The output is going through a GR-874 20 dB (10X) pad.

Well played.  I expected, when I first saw it, that the island-cutter technique would be especially suited to exactly this kind of HF/black magic tinkery due to its essentially 2D planar nature which minimizes unexpected covalent area. That's why I posted aboot it.

Bonus, you got something that can actually put the spurs to your type 547, and show off that gorgeous cobalt blue trace! 

mnem
 

Yeah, it works extremely well. Easy to do, and gives solid results. Perfect for experimenting. One of these days I'll do a proper PCB. To be fair the the 547, the 1S1 plug in is an entire sampling oscilloscope sans indicator. It uses the host mainframe for power and as an X-Y indicator. 

One day, maybe....into the far off future.....my Type 547 will do the same, in green trace. 

[Cubdriver]

Another of the transparent cobalt blue Tek mugs has appeared on the bay, though be forewarned the seller wants crazy $$ for it.  Figure I'll put it out here just the same.  NAWTS.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/294337808614?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20180105095853%26meid%3Dc5b98641e34c4a08ab40f500d8d4cdd9%26pid%3D100903%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D20%26sd%3D294337808614%26itm%3D294337808614%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2510209%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2510209.c100903.m5276

-Pat

just bought my very first piece of tek TE.   and it only cost me 51 cents more than the guy is asking for that mug. 

maybe it would have been best to skip the possibly distressed scope and buy the mug instead?

LOL - you could always put in an offer on the mug.  Can't recall what I paid for mine, but it was a lot less than that - maybe $25-ish shipped?  That said, they do seem to be pretty rare, as in this is only the third one I've seen come up in the search since starting it in May.

-Pat

Edit to add - freqq, don't keep us in suspense - what is your first hit of teal?

[0culus]

   

Got the urge to build another pulser. This time I laid it out so that I would be able to connect a charge line easily. This effort incorporates all the tricks I have learned in my journey of building Jim Williams' circuit.
-
(3) Use island cutter to make spots for soldering
-
(6) And last, but most certainly not least, this design conspicuously eliminates the 1 pF cap the original circuit uses. Instead, I put my microwave engineer hat on and am relying on the parasitic capacitance of the board. It works rather well!

Measurement set up today is my Type 547 'scope with the Type 1S1 sampling plug-in set to 200 mV/cm and 0.5 ns/cm. The output is going through a GR-874 20 dB (10X) pad.

Well played.  I expected, when I first saw it, that the island-cutter technique would be especially suited to exactly this kind of HF/black magic tinkery due to its essentially 2D planar nature which minimizes unexpected covalent area. That's why I posted aboot it.

Bonus, you got something that can actually put the spurs to your type 547, and show off that gorgeous cobalt blue trace! 

mnem
 

Yeah, it works extremely well. Easy to do, and gives solid results. Perfect for experimenting. One of these days I'll do a proper PCB. To be fair the the 547, the 1S1 plug in is an entire sampling oscilloscope sans indicator. It uses the host mainframe for power and as an X-Y indicator. 

One day, maybe....into the far off future.....my Type 547 will do the same, in green trace. 

You'll get it figgered out I'm sure.