Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[factory]

Some cheap boat anchor TEA for those in the US, including the hp 2590A from a few weeks back, several microwave amplifiers, a RF signal gen and a few TV waveform monitors. All reduced to $10 start price.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/Test-Measurement-Inspection/181939/m.html?_ssn=elizha35&_from=R40&_nkw=

If that 2590A was over here I would have bid.


David

[Cymaphore]

Testing after charging is not that much of a problem for typical lead batteries, wet, vrla and gel.

It's designed for that and a normal use case. You drive for a while, battery is charged. You stop the engine, start it, and you will have a similar situation.

Typical starters will momentarily draw a couple of hundred amps.

Testing it to get a comparable value is another story. For that I would recommend a charging mode with a long settling phase. Something like 24h UI as with the standardized cold start test.

Depends on what you are doing and what you want to know.

With my 250 kW tester I usually run some well defined rectangles for Ri charge/discharge to evaluate the overall fitness of the testee in a well defined situation at regular intervals and have a calibrated window to decide if the test cycle can go on or needs to be aborted for safety reasons.

[Saskia]

update from the ebay side.
Received partial refund for damaged item (55 $ from seller, plus shipping charges for about 80 lbs going over the pond for a total of about 330 $). Item itself is ok, packaging is done for.

Received 2 pinballs today from the guy still owing me hunks of moolah as a down payment.

Anybody over here in need of a couple of pinball machines ? I gotta move some stuff, I'll be moving 
FFS these beasts are at 330 lbs apiece.
Currently got 5 sitting here plus 5 or 6 in storage plus another one coming in as final payment ...
oh gawd Odin ...

[mnementh]

   Mail actually delivered today... random baggities from parts unknown.  I wonder what secrets they might hold...?

mnem
No, seriously... it's been so long, I'm not sure...

      

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B08CRHGLCN/?th=1

mmmmokay... so these are some switches I bought off Amazon when I first started rebuilding my lightsaber, which are still showing as AWOL.  They weren't the kind I wanted, but they were so crazy cheap; like 2/$6 delivered and they helped me make a order minimum, so I got a couple to throw in the drawer.

These particular ones are SPDT Momentary rated 24V (for the LED), but turn-on voltage is still right around 3V, and this is the illumination level at 5V/~1.5mA drive. More than acceptable for a workbench panel, and as the LED is completely isolated, it can be driven directly off a processor pin. The action is very firm with a strong detent and click at aboot 2mm travel.

Given the complete absence of electrical ratings in the listing, I decided to pop one open in the name of science... it appears to have decent-sized contacts, but given the total lack of Common-pin shunt strap in the design and open contact structure with short travel and no arc-control, I'd say def only good for low-voltage control switching at an amp or two max. Less on the NC contact, as it doesn't meet very squarely. Still worth having at the price; sadly, they must've been clearing out a disco product as that particular one is NLA.


      

This is the drive adapter I ordered so long ago for my cordless ratchet. Time will tell if it's a "daily driver" tool or little more than a curiosity; while the thing does seem to feel pretty solid when snapped in place, it also does pop out pretty easily with my thumb. Which it needs to, as that is how you reverse the thing. 

I still have to rebuild the battery pack; I'll prolly use some of my leftover 18650 cells from the extra hoverboard pack in a 2S2P config. That will likely be a "after the move" project, however.


   

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B07HBTPC2F

And finally this little box of Damifino... another "bought to fill out a minimum" purchase, they cost me 5 bux & change; like those 0603 resistors, they're now sold out from the original supplier and only available much more expensively from other vendors.

Closeup look shows they're all cheapest possible generic epoxy TO92 package with text-only laser marking; but hey, for 2.5c ea, I guess they're gonna be good enough to set fire to on my bench when I'm in the mood to channel bd for a while. 

A quick test of a few 2N2222s and MCP 2N2907s with my cheap Chinese component tester revealed correctly identified as NPN/PNP, EBC pinout (as most Chinese versions of these use), expected h_FE of ~350/250, and they didn't just explode when I used them to switch a 1157 bulb at 12V/current limited to 300mA for a couple minutes.

NOTE: EDITED TO ADD MISPLACED PIC OF SWITCH GUTS

mnem
We now return you to your regularly scheduled insanity; already in progress...!

[factory]

and a little mysterious TE thingie:   

It's a under-load cell tester for old-school Lead-Acid batteries with exposed bus bars between the cells. Grand-dad had one; also had such a battery in Miss Allis (old diesel tractor ~110HP or so).

mnem
 

AKA the crackle tester, so named for the noise it makes when you stab the probes onto the battery terminals. Make sure it's a 12V and not a 6V one before you test it on your car battery, as these things get HOT under nominal voltage; put a 6V one on a 12V battery and the resistive element may well melt before you can disengage it, as the probes have a tendency to weld themselves to the battery terminals.

Nooo it is not a complete battery tester but an old-fashioned cell tester, back in the day when batteries also had the cell connections visible rather than just the final + and - terminals on todays batteries. Also, I think you may want to revise your statement,  as a 6V battery only provide 50% of the heat generated as a 12V one would do to the load resistor.

I can't be certain but I think I've seen individual cells in a forklift battery pack a few years ago. And there is something that looks to be a filtered water supply for topping up the cells, in the department I work in.

We also had a safety  briefing about an explosion involving a vehicle battery pack at another site, can't remember much of it, apart from it happening during or after charging.

David

[bd139]

A quick test of a few 2N2222s and MCP 2N2907s with my cheap Chinese component tester revealed correctly identified as NPN/PNP, EBC pinout (as most Chinese versions of these use), expected hFe of ~350/250, and they didn't just explode when I used them to switch a 1157 bulb at 12V/current limited to 300mA.

The chinese transistor packs are usually pretty good. Never found any bad ones. Worth looking up the datasheets for the other parts. The S8050's are fairly decently specced. I built a small RF PA out of them a few years back when I was pissing around with parallel transistor arrangements and managed to get 4W out of 6 of them at 7MHz which is damn near impossible out of anything else that cheap. Even a couple of BD139's you get from ST won't kick that out any more.

[factory]

Well Yodel managed to deliver all the computer upgrade parts OK, pretty good considering the parcel only dispatched at 6pm last night and I paid for the cheapskate shipping option (up-to 5 days). 



David

[tautech]

A quick test of a few 2N2222s and MCP 2N2907s with my cheap Chinese component tester revealed correctly identified as NPN/PNP, EBC pinout (as most Chinese versions of these use), expected hFe of ~350/250, and they didn't just explode when I used them to switch a 1157 bulb at 12V/current limited to 300mA.

The chinese transistor packs are usually pretty good. Never found any bad ones. Worth looking up the datasheets for the other parts. The S8050's are fairly decently specced. I built a small RF PA out of them a few years back when I was pissing around with parallel transistor arrangements and managed to get 4W out of 6 of them at 7MHz which is damn near impossible out of anything else that cheap. Even a couple of BD139's you get from ST won't kick that out any more.

I'm quite sure our bd139 can emit over 4W with sufficient stimulus ! 

[Saskia]

enjoy the build and remember that the Ryzens depend hugely on memory speed when it comes to performance.

[Saskia]

A quick test of a few 2N2222s and MCP 2N2907s with my cheap Chinese component tester revealed correctly identified as NPN/PNP, EBC pinout (as most Chinese versions of these use), expected hFe of ~350/250, and they didn't just explode when I used them to switch a 1157 bulb at 12V/current limited to 300mA.

The chinese transistor packs are usually pretty good. Never found any bad ones. Worth looking up the datasheets for the other parts. The S8050's are fairly decently specced. I built a small RF PA out of them a few years back when I was pissing around with parallel transistor arrangements and managed to get 4W out of 6 of them at 7MHz which is damn near impossible out of anything else that cheap. Even a couple of BD139's you get from ST won't kick that out any more.

I'm quite sure our bd139 can emit over 4W with sufficient stimulus ! 

"The human body generates more bioelectricity than a 120-volt battery and over 25,000 BTUs of body heat," ...

[Neomys Sapiens]

Another of those hp logic dart testers has appeared on ePay (US only), with a working screen this time. 


https://www.ebay.com/itm/224556878202

David

I like that beastie! While it is no logic analyser, it does show you much more than the usual probes. I think 0culus has aquired one too..

[Specmaster]

Or as we Brits and Mericans call it a star delta connection and the circuit shown is only for the power, the control circuitry has been omitted.

If all three coils are energised at the same there will be a big flash as K93M will present a bolted short circuit to the incoming 3 phase supply. In a correctly connected starter system for such a configuration, there should only ever be 2 contactors energised at any time.

To start it should be in star mode with K91M and K93M energised to place the windings in star fashion to reduce start up inrush current and once the motor has run up to speed and the current has dropped to a manageable level, K93M must de-energised and K81M energised to reconnect the motor windings in delta fashion. When in delta mode, both K91M and K81M contactors are closed.

No, the circuit referred to is not Star/Delta. Star Delta is single speed and used to adjust voltage or lower current for starting. The
Dahlander is dual speed. It changes the number of poles in the motor by having two setsof windings and wiring each set either to the same phase (N poles) or next phase (2N poles).
I've not seen it drawn like that before so did not recognise it.

Both star delta and dual speed motors share the same basic concept power wiring of their starters, the only physical differences that can be visual are that 2 speed starters will have 2 overload relays, 1 for each speed whereas star delta only needs 1 relay for the delta position and also a star delta starter will have a timer module to control the length of time it runs in star mode. The other differences are in the control circuitry which is not shown in the drawing.

[Neomys Sapiens]

(partially already answered by Robert763)

Or as we Brits and Mericans call it a star delta connection

nope, star delta does not use the taps. see below.

and the circuit shown is only for the power, the control circuitry has been omitted.

I did not claim otherwise, but the Kloeckner Moeller Schaltungsbuch listed so many variants of the control circuit that I left it out in the hope that Mansaxel would ask if he needed more.

[mnementh]

Have fun you maniacs. I'm gonna piss off and corrupt my son with THE MATRIX...

mnem

[nixiefreqq]

Some cheap boat anchor TEA for those in the US, including the hp 2590A from a few weeks back, several microwave amplifiers, a RF signal gen and a few TV waveform monitors. All reduced to $10 start price.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/Test-Measurement-Inspection/181939/m.html?_ssn=elizha35&_from=R40&_nkw=

If that 2590A was over here I would have bid.


David

had been watching that 2590 transfer oscillator at 50 bucks for a couple of weeks.   then saw it go to an auction starting at 10.  was gonna wait till the last second and steal it just to have something cub does not already have.  (because who in the world would be watching for a POS like that).

but then SOMEONE had to announce it to the only crowd on planet earth who are compulsive enough to actually bid on it.

you have almost pushed me to the point of crowing about tossing tea in the harbor. 

am consoled by the fact that on sunday morning i stole a 5256a hetrodyne converter from a hobo for 20 bucks.

[Cerebus]

A quick test of a few 2N2222s and MCP 2N2907s with my cheap Chinese component tester revealed correctly identified as NPN/PNP, EBC pinout (as most Chinese versions of these use), expected hFe of ~350/250, and they didn't just explode when I used them to switch a 1157 bulb at 12V/current limited to 300mA.

The chinese transistor packs are usually pretty good. Never found any bad ones. Worth looking up the datasheets for the other parts. The S8050's are fairly decently specced. I built a small RF PA out of them a few years back when I was pissing around with parallel transistor arrangements and managed to get 4W out of 6 of them at 7MHz which is damn near impossible out of anything else that cheap. Even a couple of BD139's you get from ST won't kick that out any more.

I'm quite sure our bd139 can emit over 4W with sufficient stimulus ! 

"The human body generates more bioelectricity than a 120-volt battery and over 25,000 BTUs of body heat," ...

Grrr. That's one of those sets of factoids that gets passed around that's so far off the mark that it's not funny.

[Bijou rant of facts follows.]

Nerve action potential is a brief pulse at around 125 mV peak to peak at some crazy high impedance as the source of the current is a wave of sodium<->potassium ion exchange across the cell wall of the axon. People probing individual nerves in laboratory settings use electrometers to make their measurements possible, that kind of impedance.

An adult 70kg male at rest puts out about 100W of heat, and a world class athlete at extremis (say Bradley Wiggins doing the UCI hour) can put out physical work at 500W for an hour at around 18-22% efficiency so producing ~2kW waste heat while doing so. 25,000 BTU (a unit any sane person has to look up to convert to something comprehensible) is 7.3 kWh <- notice the 'h'.

[mansaxel]

... but the Kloeckner Moeller Schaltungsbuch listed so many variants of the control circuit that I left it out in the hope that Mansaxel would ask if he needed more.

Oh, I only need the one that works! In this particular case. 

The control in this case is a Dahlander-rigged 1-0-2 Nockenschalter (Cam Switch). I haven't tested it, which I probably should, but it's a Klöckner/Möller or perhaps a Kraus & Naimer or that other German-sounding brand. They rarely fail.

[mansaxel]

An adult 70kg male at rest puts out about 100W of heat, and a world class athlete at extremis (say Bradley Wiggins doing the UCI hour) can put out physical work at 500W for an hour at around 18-22% efficiency so producing ~2kW waste heat while doing so. 25,000 BTU (a unit any sane person has to look up to convert to something comprehensible) is 7.3 kWh <- notice the 'h'.

Obvious illustration:

[Cubdriver]

Some cheap boat anchor TEA for those in the US, including the hp 2590A from a few weeks back, several microwave amplifiers, a RF signal gen and a few TV waveform monitors. All reduced to $10 start price.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/Test-Measurement-Inspection/181939/m.html?_ssn=elizha35&_from=R40&_nkw=

If that 2590A was over here I would have bid.


David

had been watching that 2590 transfer oscillator at 50 bucks for a couple of weeks.   then saw it go to an auction starting at 10.  was gonna wait till the last second and steal it just to have something cub does not already have.  (because who in the world would be watching for a POS like that).

but then SOMEONE had to announce it to the only crowd on planet earth who are compulsive enough to actually bid on it.

you have almost pushed me to the point of crowing about tossing tea in the harbor. 

am consoled by the fact that on sunday morning i stole a 5256a hetrodyne converter from a hobo for 20 bucks.

Go for it!  (I have too much stuff here as it is - don't make me buy the damned thing!)

-Pat

[Specmaster]

and a little mysterious TE thingie:   

It's a under-load cell tester for old-school Lead-Acid batteries with exposed bus bars between the cells. Grand-dad had one; also had such a battery in Miss Allis (old diesel tractor ~110HP or so).

mnem
 

AKA the crackle tester, so named for the noise it makes when you stab the probes onto the battery terminals. Make sure it's a 12V and not a 6V one before you test it on your car battery, as these things get HOT under nominal voltage; put a 6V one on a 12V battery and the resistive element may well melt before you can disengage it, as the probes have a tendency to weld themselves to the battery terminals.

Nooo it is not a complete battery tester but an old-fashioned cell tester, back in the day when batteries also had the cell connections visible rather than just the final + and - terminals on todays batteries. Also, I think you may want to revise your statement,  as a 6V battery only provide 50% of the heat generated as a 12V one would do to the load resistor.

I can't be certain but I think I've seen individual cells in a forklift battery pack a few years ago. And there is something that looks to be a filtered water supply for topping up the cells, in the department I work in.

We also had a safety  briefing about an explosion involving a vehicle battery pack at another site, can't remember much of it, apart from it happening during or after charging.

David

Yes, I think forklifts do use exposed links, but I'm pretty sure that they are factory insulated these days. There also some that are made up from separate cells connected together so that just the faulty cell could be replaced, but even then I doubt that such a tester would be allowed these days, there far more safe and sophisticated ways of testing batteries now.

[Specmaster]

(partially already answered by Robert763)

Or as we Brits and Mericans call it a star delta connection

nope, star delta does not use the taps. see below.

and the circuit shown is only for the power, the control circuitry has been omitted.

I did not claim otherwise, but the Kloeckner Moeller Schaltungsbuch listed so many variants of the control circuit that I left it out in the hope that Mansaxel would ask if he needed more.

No a star delta does not use those physical tabs in the motor terminal box, it makes those connections within the starter unit itself by switching the contactors as I described. A 2 speed AC motor does essentially use a modified version of a star delta starter. This can be either contactors or a special manual multipole switch with 1-0-2 configuration so that you have to go through OFF to change speeds otherwise a short circuit would result directly across the 3 phase supply to the motor when switching speeds. The switch or contactors does the reconfiguration of the motor windings, same as the star delta does. The only difference between a 2 speed motor and a normal single speed motor is that in a 2 speed winding, that winding is split into 2 windings per phase and the normal motor has 1 winding per phase.

All standard 3 phase motors can be wired using the links in the motor terminal box, connect them one way, and you have a delta connected motor with a high inrush starting current, connect the links the other way, you get a star connection with a far lower inrush and far lower torque available.

[mnementh]

An adult 70kg male at rest puts out about 100W of heat, and a world class athlete at extremis (say Bradley Wiggins doing the UCI hour) can put out physical work at 500W for an hour at around 18-22% efficiency so producing ~2kW waste heat while doing so. 25,000 BTU (a unit any sane person has to look up to convert to something comprehensible) is 7.3 kWh <- notice the 'h'.

Obvious illustration:

Jeebus. That guy's thighs are as big as mine, only it's all muscle. Even when I was young and working out and had stovepipe legs that could press a ton, they weren't like that. 

mnem
Also, motherfuckers ripped that Robert off; wasted half his hard work.  They could've made two toast for the same juice. 

[Neomys Sapiens]

... but the Kloeckner Moeller Schaltungsbuch listed so many variants of the control circuit that I left it out in the hope that Mansaxel would ask if he needed more.

Oh, I only need the one that works! In this particular case. 

The control in this case is a Dahlander-rigged 1-0-2 Nockenschalter (Cam Switch). I haven't tested it, which I probably should, but it's a Klöckner/Möller or perhaps a Kraus & Naimer or that other German-sounding brand. They rarely fail.

If you need anything else on that circuit, send me a PM.

[cyclin_al]

Have you been to the power station and its associated slate museum which is located next to the bottom lake and the power station is actually buried in the mountain that the slate was quarried from?

Interesting.  Here in the GWN, we have two lifts which work on the same principle.  Only difference is that the cargo is water, and maybe a few boats.

[cyclin_al]

Beat me to it!

Sometimes you can get a bucket of slicia-gel packets from a footwear shop for free.  A packet in each shoe box adds up quickly...

Tip:  you can bake these packets in the oven to recharge (dry) them, to be used again or after a humid period.  Just not too hot to burn the paper packet.

I'll do you one better. Silica gel is sold as "crystal kitty litter". You can buy kilos of the stuff for around USD15 at your local supermarket. Making up little packets is easy enough with any kind of textile and a stapler. I have attached an example that I just found on a popular online shopping site.

EDIT:

It's even unscented.

I was going for free in my solution!  (yes, I do have Scottish blood in my ancestry)

Even though we have too many cats at home, I never realized that stuff was made from silica gel.  Then again, it is more expensive than clay kitty litter.

Hmmmm, could this crystal kitty litter work in an air dryer?  I am referring to drying the air in a compressed air system (nothing to do with laundry).  The air dryer pellets are about three times more expensive than the kitty litter...