Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Specmaster]

Here comes a sad story: It seems I need to have an appointment at the police station.
The deal with the Keithley 2400 took a dark turn, with the seller not willing to provide me with the tracking data. Also some other details rang a bell.

Oh dear! 
Keep my fingers crossed, that it'll turn out in a good sense.

How did you've bought it? Ebay Kleinanzeigen?

Yes. Link provided by ch_scr. And the deal was too good to be true.
And then
- no complete Name and adress given
- Bank data of a german IBAN, but eastern european name
- reluctant communication, seems to be playing on time
Here goes the TEA budget for several months.

I feel like an idiot now. And worse - I had to let a Analogic DP100 multimeter go because of that.

Sorry to hear that :/
So far my adventures have turned out good, but I have pulled the plug on bad feeling alone before sending money.
Any chance to call the bank and have the money transfer reversed?

Yep, sorry to hear that the deal has turned sour, it sucks don't it. If a deal sounds too good to be true, then it is usually just that, and I never ever do bank transfers unless I know who I'm dealing with. The only time I have done a bank transfer was when I was buying my old company car from a well known leasing company.

[Andrew_Debbie]

I never realised just how crap the range is for the BMW i3, it is pitiful in reality I suppose, the car is only designed as a city car and thats it. I can  do that journey comfortably on a single tank of diesel with a light right foot, with a car that has plenty of space to stretch out in and large 625 litre boot to carry TE acquisitions home in.

Mine is a 2018 with the 94aH (~33kWh) pack.  It is a terrible value for £/mile range. The current 120Ah car is still a poor value in terms of price v. range.   BMW can hardly give them away in the US.  Turns out carbon fibre cars are expensive to build

 It is a fantastic city car and good for journeys under 200 miles.   Boot capacity is not to be underestimated either. 




There are much better choices if range is important.

[tautech]

I never realised just how crap the range is for the BMW i3, it is pitiful in reality I suppose, the car is only designed as a city car and thats it. I can  do that journey comfortably on a single tank of diesel with a light right foot, with a car that has plenty of space to stretch out in and large 625 litre boot to carry TE acquisitions home in.

Mine is a 2018 with the 94aH (~33kWh) pack.  It is a terrible value for £/mile range. The current 120Ah car is still a poor value in terms of price v. range.   BMW can hardly give them away in the US.  Turns out carbon fibre cars are expensive to build

 It is a fantastic city car and good for journeys under 200 miles.   Boot capacity is not to be underestimated either. 


There are much better choices if range is important.

I was quite taken with the i3 a customer turned up here with but he too said its range was quite ordinary but perfectly fine for his everyday commute. One could certainly do most or our local runarounds but not our occasional long distance runs to see family and friends. 
When they can do 650km on a tank like my turbo diesel SUV I might be tempted.

[VK5RC]

The practicality of my Golf turbo diesel is fantastic, great torque, 5l/100km in stop start traffic, hatchback flexibility, 900km range on a 50l tank and enough creature comforts. So of course they stopped making them.

[bd139]

Diesel is nasty shit. Needs to go.

Still rocking my 7 year old 0.99L shitroen tuk tuk. 31k miles on the clock now. Runs on mosquito farts at 59-65 avg mpg if I don't rag it. Cheap road tax, insurance, fuel. Fits in any parking space in London. ULEZ exempt. Looks like new apart from a smell dent in the side from a cyclist being a twat.

Edit: importantly plenty of room for scopes

[Andrew_Debbie]

When they can do 650km on a tank like my turbo diesel SUV I might be tempted.

Tesla Model S is close.  ~600km, I think.   200-250 miles of true usable range and good infrastructure is enough.     We all should take a break from driving every few hours.


There are many cars on sale now with that kind of range.     An MG5 is about £20,000 after discounts and will go  200 miles on a charge.  The only problem is the software is as good as Hantek. 

[med6753]

Cost of fuel is rarely a consideration here because as you know gasoline compared to the EU is cheap. Typically under $3.00 USD per US gallon although lately has been creeping up over $3.00 USD. If I stick to 70 MPH or less on the open highway I can achieve 30+ MPG with the CR-V SUV. Over 75 MPH and it starts to drop off rapidly. Unfortunately I have a heavy right foot. 

So....combined with being retired if I want something I go get it. Longest trip so far is 4.5 hours one way to visit nixie_freqq in Gettysburg, PA. But, my last road trip to Utica, NY was a total fiasco which is why I'm sitting here with an incision and stitches. So I may have to cut back on the long road trips for good.   

[bd139]

To be fair you’re paying more than $3 a gallon for that fuel. Got to pay for all those US foreign occupations too 

[med6753]

Sometimes it is worth masking up and going shopping. Beer, Bread and a mid winters Sunset.

That's not Winter.  This is Winter.   

[med6753]

To be fair you’re paying more than $3 a gallon for that fuel. Got to pay for all those US foreign occupations too 

Perhaps. But still cheaper than UK petrol. 

[bd139]

Hah so true 

[beanflying]

Sometimes it is worth masking up and going shopping. Beer, Bread and a mid winters Sunset.

That's not Winter.  This is Winter.   

I prefer todays version of Winter thanks Should have had my COVID boosted self on the bike today but maybe tomorrow.....

Either that or a trip in my 2000+kg gas guzzler AWD to the local secondhand shops to buy stuff I don't need 

[Robert763]

I went for the middle ground, Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV 2016MY with the 2.0 engine. Bought it used, private owner and as it was registered before April 2017 it is zero road tax and no congestion charge. No practical way to charge at home but I can charge for free at work and that covers my 22 odd mile commute on electric only. It's at it's worst on a motorway fast run, about 40 MPG but does well on A roads and in town.
Loads of space for TE even with the seats up.

[Brumby]

Diesel is nasty shit. Needs to go.

Did a stint with a mechanic some years ago and he was working on a "dual phase" fuel system for diesel vehicles.  Typical focus was on larger vehicles, but the idea was to introduce a healthy sniff of LPG into the air/fuel mix which increased combustion, reduced emissions and provided better fuel economy.

I moved on before I heard anything about its progress, but I believe this approach did have its merits.


Still, we are talking 100% fossil fuel.

[med6753]

I'm not ready to make the switch to EV or total electric although it does sound appealing. Weaning us Yanks off of cheap gas is a long and slow process and the infrastructure just isn't there (yet, it's improving) to be assured that you can find a charging station within your typical 200 mile range. The CR-V has a typical 400 mile range on a tank of fuel and I know once I get to a quarter tank just up the road will be a gas station and I don't even have to think about it. Not so with all electric.

[RolandK]

Here comes a sad story: It seems I need to have an appointment at the police station.
The deal with the Keithley 2400 took a dark turn, with the seller not willing to provide me with the tracking data. Also some other details rang a bell.

Oh dear! 
Keep my fingers crossed, that it'll turn out in a good sense.

How did you've bought it? Ebay Kleinanzeigen?

Yes. Link provided by ch_scr. And the deal was too good to be true.
And then
- no complete Name and adress given
- Bank data of a german IBAN, but eastern european name
- reluctant communication, seems to be playing on time
Here goes the TEA budget for several months.

I feel like an idiot now. And worse - I had to let a Analogic DP100 multimeter go because of that.

Sorry to hear that :/
So far my adventures have turned out good, but I have pulled the plug on bad feeling alone before sending money.
Any chance to call the bank and have the money transfer reversed?

Yep, sorry to hear that the deal has turned sour, it sucks don't it. If a deal sounds too good to be true, then it is usually just that, and I never ever do bank transfers unless I know who I'm dealing with. The only time I have done a bank transfer was when I was buying my old company car from a well known leasing company.

Sorry to hear that. As a hint:

on ebay-kleinanzeigen i see regulary a hp 3458a for too little money - just insist on paypal-none-friends, use their new payment-function with waranty or tell him you will pick it up aigainst cash - even if you are 5000 miles away. Never you will hear an acceptance. And please press the "melden" Button.

Don't by any other expensive TEA on such sides, eg. marktplaats.nl or willhaben.at and even on ebay under other conditions, not even a percent prepayment.

Sometimes i use paypal commercial and add the fees. Only one woman complained because auf not-insured shipment, but it was only for 50 bucks and everything went well.

[bd139]

I'm not ready to make the switch to EV or total electric although it does sound appealing. Weaning us Yanks off of cheap gas is a long and slow process and the infrastructure just isn't there (yet, it's improving) to be assured that you can find a charging station within your typical 200 mile range. The CR-V has a typical 400 mile range on a tank of fuel and I know once I get to a quarter tank just up the road will be a gas station and I don't even have to think about it. Not so with all electric.

I’m not jumping yet either. I know the state of our electricity grid here and the inability for it to scale to the requirements of sudden increase in electric vehicles with the impending end of life of a big chunk of our generation capacity. Plus there’s still retards vandalising the chargers near me 

This is still very early days especially for large political statements like ending all production of certain vehicles within ten years.

Really the only thing we can scale is less transportation and vehicle use looking forwards.

[ch_scr]

Here comes a sad story: It seems I need to have an appointment at the police station.
The deal with the Keithley 2400 took a dark turn, with the seller not willing to provide me with the tracking data. Also some other details rang a bell.

Oh dear! 
Keep my fingers crossed, that it'll turn out in a good sense.

How did you've bought it? Ebay Kleinanzeigen?

Yes. Link provided by ch_scr. And the deal was too good to be true.
And then
- no complete Name and adress given
- Bank data of a german IBAN, but eastern european name
- reluctant communication, seems to be playing on time
Here goes the TEA budget for several months.

I feel like an idiot now. And worse - I had to let a Analogic DP100 multimeter go because of that.

Sorry to hear that :/
So far my adventures have turned out good, but I have pulled the plug on bad feeling alone before sending money.
Any chance to call the bank and have the money transfer reversed?

Yep, sorry to hear that the deal has turned sour, it sucks don't it. If a deal sounds too good to be true, then it is usually just that, and I never ever do bank transfers unless I know who I'm dealing with. The only time I have done a bank transfer was when I was buying my old company car from a well known leasing company.

Sorry to hear that. As a hint:

on ebay-kleinanzeigen i see regulary a hp 3458a for too little money - just insist on paypal-none-friends, use their new payment-function with waranty or tell him you will pick it up aigainst cash - even if you are 5000 miles away. Never you will hear an acceptance. And please press the "melden" Button.

Don't by any other expensive TEA on such sides, eg. marktplaats.nl or willhaben.at and even on ebay under other conditions, not even a percent prepayment.

Sometimes i use paypal commercial and add the fees. Only one woman complained because auf not-insured shipment, but it was only for 50 bucks and everything went well.

These are good tips to make sure! The new ebay-kleinanzeigen trustee money transfer sure is a nice addtion.
But like I said I have prepaid 2k€ on ebay kleinanzeigen via bank transfer (the new trustee thing was not around yet) - but only with a seller I had a good feeling (we haggled for days)
Also, you can call your bank to take back money you have send via bank transfer, which now that I look at it I had a false sense of security about:
It's not guaranteed to work (seems like the other bank has to cooperate) and your bank will take a fee of 10 to 25€ 
So in the future I think I will make more use of the trustee services...

[Andrew_Debbie]

I’m not jumping yet either. I know the state of our electricity grid here and the inability for it to scale to the requirements of sudden increase in electric vehicles with the impending end of life of a big chunk of our generation capacity. Plus there’s still retards vandalising the chargers near me 

This is still very early days especially for large political statements like ending all production of certain vehicles within ten years.

National Grid just ran a new 33kV line down the centre of our very rural road, so there is some hope.   Vandalism of rapid chargers is a problem.  That  and idiots reversing over them.  At £20,000 each it is as expensive as a totalling a car.

At least the i3 locks the lead into the car which makes cable theft a little harder.

Most of us charge overnight at home nearly all the time so the extra load on the grid is minimal.

Long term the en-route rapid chargers are going to need battery storage.  Tesla and newcomer Gridserve are already doing this.   Part of Gridserve's business model is playing the spot market for power selling off excess stored power during demand peaks.

There are challenges but this is entirely doable.

Really the only thing we can scale is less transportation and vehicle use looking forwards.

I agree.   It will be much harder to get people out of their cars then it will be to switch to battery EVs.   There is also too much focus on cars, but that is a different can of worms.   (transportation losses in the UK gas grid has roughly the same GHG contribution as the entire aviation sector, but  such things do not make interesting political talking points)

[tggzzz]

It would need to be around its current price to make the journey to collect worthwhile and viable, its approx 360 miles round trip, about 7 to 8 hours driving assuming normal traffic conditions and around £60 for fuel. The probes don't worry me anyway, I have some insulated probes already. I expect the 2 bidders on it already are going closer than I am so would be likely to push that price upwards a bit more yet. I have it on watch and see what happens with it.

If I want to dissuade myself, my rule of thumb is 25p/mile for fuel and depreciation.

I work around 17p a mile, can't really factor in depreciation as that happens really just sitting outside the front door all year.

It has to be factored in somehow, so what do you suggest?

I've only bought 2 year old cars, so the initial heavy depreciation has occurred - and the remaining depreciation is largely mileage related. For want of a better figure, I'll assume a car will last 120kmiles and start with ^{(120000 - initialMileage)}/_{(secondHandPrice)}.

Insurance is the one that really isn't mileage related.

[tggzzz]

Speed eats range because of i**r losses in the battery.

Speed eats range because the air resistance is proportional to the square of the airspeed. That's true for any vehicle.

FFI see a resource highly praised by both Big Energy and EcoWarriors: https://withouthotair.com/cA/page_254.shtml and following.

[Specmaster]

Diesel is nasty shit. Needs to go.

Still rocking my 7 year old 0.99L shitroen tuk tuk. 31k miles on the clock now. Runs on mosquito farts at 59-65 avg mpg if I don't rag it. Cheap road tax, insurance, fuel. Fits in any parking space in London. ULEZ exempt. Looks like new apart from a smell dent in the side from a cyclist being a twat.

Edit: importantly plenty of room for scopes

There is no need for diesel to go, it can be made as clean as petrol and also petrol could also be made even cleaner than it currently is, just needs science to be applied to it, but that won’t happen unless all manufacturers agree to introduce cleaner engines at the same time to avoid a price advantage being gained by none agreeing manufacturers. The reality is that it will not happen now with the current move to electric vehicles, which are ultimately probably going to be found to be just as polluting, but that pollution being relocated to other parts of the world.

My car can also return similar MPG's on decent runs with ease if I can resist the urge to mash the throttle to the floor and just let the car gather speed through the torque and gearbox alone, which is pretty good for a car that has a kerb weight of 1.6 tons, but it does require a large parking space and is not ULEZ exempt.

[AVGresponding]

I went for the middle ground, Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV 2016MY with the 2.0 engine. Bought it used, private owner and as it was registered before April 2017 it is zero road tax and no congestion charge. No practical way to charge at home but I can charge for free at work and that covers my 22 odd mile commute on electric only. It's at it's worst on a motorway fast run, about 40 MPG but does well on A roads and in town.
Loads of space for TE even with the seats up.

Oooopsss...

[25 CPS]

I'm not ready to make the switch to EV or total electric although it does sound appealing. Weaning us Yanks off of cheap gas is a long and slow process and the infrastructure just isn't there (yet, it's improving) to be assured that you can find a charging station within your typical 200 mile range. The CR-V has a typical 400 mile range on a tank of fuel and I know once I get to a quarter tank just up the road will be a gas station and I don't even have to think about it. Not so with all electric.

I’m not jumping yet either. I know the state of our electricity grid here and the inability for it to scale to the requirements of sudden increase in electric vehicles with the impending end of life of a big chunk of our generation capacity. Plus there’s still retards vandalising the chargers near me 

This is still very early days especially for large political statements like ending all production of certain vehicles within ten years.

Really the only thing we can scale is less transportation and vehicle use looking forwards.

I've been having the electric vehicle debate as well since my truck is coming due for a lot of costly work or it's going up for replacement.  I don't need a big truck anymore, I can rent something when I absolutely must have the carrying capacity, so I'm going to be replacing it with something much smaller if replacement is what ends up happening.  What I suspect is going to happen is the next vehicle is going to be internal combustion and then the one after that is going to be electric.

The cost of electricity in Ontario has been a political football.  Volumes could be written about what's been done with that and how that's gotten out of hand over the last 20 years.  Then if you go look at this website https://live.gridwatch.ca/home-page.html at pretty much any time, nuclear is carrying the vast majority of the load here.  That nuclear infrastructure is not new and some of it's quite old, and eventually it's going to have to be retired but there's no plan for replacement capacity.

There are two other strikes against electric vehicles.  Contrary to popular belief, there's a lot more to Canada than the Greater Toronto Area (Huh, what? You mean there's stuff north of Bloor St?).  Here, EV infrastructure, travel distance, and winter aren't too bad.  Head north, winter is a lot more severe, the EV infrastructure is a lot more sparse, hell in many places infrastructure period is a lot more sparse, and winter can be vicious.  You can drive for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of KM in places and there'll be signs by the side of the road saying "Last gas for ...km".  Forget charging stations.  Then add reduced cold temperature battery performance in winter.  There's no EV equivalent of keeping a jerry can or two in the trunk in case of running low in the middle of nowhere that I know of.

I totally agree, the political pronouncements are optimistic.  Well intended but optimistic.

[med6753]

I'm not ready to make the switch to EV or total electric although it does sound appealing. Weaning us Yanks off of cheap gas is a long and slow process and the infrastructure just isn't there (yet, it's improving) to be assured that you can find a charging station within your typical 200 mile range. The CR-V has a typical 400 mile range on a tank of fuel and I know once I get to a quarter tank just up the road will be a gas station and I don't even have to think about it. Not so with all electric.

I’m not jumping yet either. I know the state of our electricity grid here and the inability for it to scale to the requirements of sudden increase in electric vehicles with the impending end of life of a big chunk of our generation capacity. Plus there’s still retards vandalising the chargers near me 

This is still very early days especially for large political statements like ending all production of certain vehicles within ten years.

Really the only thing we can scale is less transportation and vehicle use looking forwards.

I've been having the electric vehicle debate as well since my truck is coming due for a lot of costly work or it's going up for replacement.  I don't need a big truck anymore, I can rent something when I absolutely must have the carrying capacity, so I'm going to be replacing it with something much smaller if replacement is what ends up happening.  What I suspect is going to happen is the next vehicle is going to be internal combustion and then the one after that is going to be electric.

The cost of electricity in Ontario has been a political football.  Volumes could be written about what's been done with that and how that's gotten out of hand over the last 20 years.  Then if you go look at this website https://live.gridwatch.ca/home-page.html at pretty much any time, nuclear is carrying the vast majority of the load here.  That nuclear infrastructure is not new and some of it's quite old, and eventually it's going to have to be retired but there's no plan for replacement capacity.

There are two other strikes against electric vehicles.  Contrary to popular belief, there's a lot more to Canada than the Greater Toronto Area (Huh, what? You mean there's stuff north of Bloor St?).  Here, EV infrastructure, travel distance, and winter aren't too bad.  Head north, winter is a lot more severe, the EV infrastructure is a lot more sparse, hell in many places infrastructure period is a lot more sparse, and winter can be vicious.  You can drive for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of KM in places and there'll be signs by the side of the road saying "Last gas for ...km".  Forget charging stations.  Then add reduced cold temperature battery performance in winter.  There's no EV equivalent of keeping a jerry can or two in the trunk in case of running low in the middle of nowhere that I know of.

I totally agree, the political pronouncements are optimistic.  Well intended but optimistic.

Add to that. DRL's are a requirement in Canada which puts an additional load on your precious battery resource. Although LED headlights are a big help.