Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Peter_O]

snip

What about this one:
https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/hp-34401a-multimeter/1738253689-226-9218

Is it worth 300, I was thinking to offer 250, but 200 should be OK  ?

 Cheers,
 DC1MC

Seems quite comparable to mine. No bumber, no handle. Fine optics, full function ensured (don't forget to screeshot the advertisement before seller deletes it)
I paid 350 for a 2001 Malaysian Agilent, this one is 1996 US. Prices o f34401 seem to rise. I'm looking at commercial seller in US.  Acceptable prices in Germany are in the range of US prices plus shipment.

Your seller wants 398 Euro. A 300 Euro offer might work, 250 I'd expect to be denied.
I'd offer 50 more than I think is a good deal, because being turned down is not a good feeling either.       as a TEA addict at least. 

[beanflying]

And because I'm completely  sick, I'm now starting with R2R

Ever since I was a wee lad I always wanted a reel to reel deck - solenoid action for the dream fulfilled.  Some years ago I came upon an AKAI GX620 for a sum I was happy to spend which seemed operational except for once channel dead on playback.  I suspected the fix would be electronic and later I discovered there were "overhaul kits" containing semis and caps as items of the era were prone to needing such action.

So ... one day ... I will get around to giving it the attention it deserves and I will have it proudly displayed with a couple of 10" reels - and then show it can play music (to the probable disbelief of the younger generation).


It is, however, missing one of the thumbscrews that retains the head cover panel.  Other than that, it is rather good cosmetically.

Just in case you would like an Aussie made option for the queue eBay auction: #203404028852 How long before I get told to go stand in the far queue .....

[AVGresponding]

OK; got a headscratcher here...

Got another 199C on the bench, this one came with all the bits and bops still in sealed plastic bags so I used some probes I had laying around. Seems to work just fine, and it shouldn't. The BNC shrouds are isolated, doesn't make contact with the probe ground clips. So they might as well not be there. In fact, when disconnecting the clips, the image is still the same. For a "regular" scope, I get it. Ground connection through the mains distribution sockets and all, all tied together. Got it.

But the 199C is 100% floating. How can there be a measurement at all? 

These isolated BNC should make GND contact with your probes, look inside the plastic connector, there's the metal ring that contacts the slotted cylindric part of the BNC plug. Works for _most_ BNC plugs, but as usual there are ones that do not make proper contact this way.

Are the fluke inputs isolated to each other, or is just the fluke floating? What happens if you disconnect only one or both GND clips? What happens if you add some DC offset to your signal?

As far as I know the inputs share a common ground, which is also the common (black) input. It is on my 99 series 2 anyway.

[med6753]

Type 547 update: The -150VDC reference is reading -115VDC and won't adjust.  Which means all the PSU voltages are reading way low. So now I know what to go after.

More later.

[BU508A]

Type 547 update: The -150VDC reference is reading -115VDC and won't adjust.  Which means all the PSU voltages are reading way low. So now I know what to go after.

More later.

Drinking a coffee? 

[Brumby]

How long before I get told to go stand in the far queue .....

Right ... about ... ... ... now!

[Specmaster]

Yes, fleabay is being objectionable, but I'm more relaxed about this than the "f**k off after May unless you give us your bank account".

As regards to their payment system, I have to say that so far I'm finding it very good. As soon as I enter details of the shipping and tracking info, they release your money directly into your bank and they deduct their fee at the same time, which at the moment as I'm using the £1 offer, means the full amount less the £1. There are no other fees coming off as there used to be with PayPal then taking their cut.

I know fleabay can, via one means or another, "deduct" money from my credit card. I can tolerate that. What I haven't assessed is whether they could do something similar with a bank account.

As several people have noted, the workaround is to have a new semi-dormant account solely for that. I haven't opened a bank account in decades, so that's currently an unknown for me. Given other things on my plate ATM, that ain't gonna happen soon

I really doubt that there is anyway that they can withdraw funds from your bank account. All I had to do was give them my account number, sort code and the name of the account which is the same info that you give anybody to make a payment to your account, i.e., your employer so that they can pay your salary directly to your account. I'm all for being cautious, but I don't see any need to open up another bank account just for eBay. If there is a dispute, then I suspect that they will hold back funds from future / other sales (assuming that you are a usual seller) otherwise they will expect you to honour the agreement otherwise they will more than likely shut your account down.

[Ice-Tea]

OK; got a headscratcher here...

Got another 199C on the bench, this one came with all the bits and bops still in sealed plastic bags so I used some probes I had laying around. Seems to work just fine, and it shouldn't. The BNC shrouds are isolated, doesn't make contact with the probe ground clips. So they might as well not be there. In fact, when disconnecting the clips, the image is still the same. For a "regular" scope, I get it. Ground connection through the mains distribution sockets and all, all tied together. Got it.

But the 199C is 100% floating. How can there be a measurement at all? 

These isolated BNC should make GND contact with your probes, look inside the plastic connector, there's the metal ring that contacts the slotted cylindric part of the BNC plug. Works for _most_ BNC plugs, but as usual there are ones that do not make proper contact this way.

Are the fluke inputs isolated to each other, or is just the fluke floating? What happens if you disconnect only one or both GND clips? What happens if you add some DC offset to your signal?

As far as I know the inputs share a common ground, which is also the common (black) input. It is on my 99 series 2 anyway.

Nah, took this picture some time ago. If they shared a common ground (reference would be a better word I suppose), that would not have ended well One of the strenghts of the thing, IMO.

[tggzzz]

Yes, fleabay is being objectionable, but I'm more relaxed about this than the "f**k off after May unless you give us your bank account".

As regards to their payment system, I have to say that so far I'm finding it very good. As soon as I enter details of the shipping and tracking info, they release your money directly into your bank and they deduct their fee at the same time, which at the moment as I'm using the £1 offer, means the full amount less the £1. There are no other fees coming off as there used to be with PayPal then taking their cut.

I know fleabay can, via one means or another, "deduct" money from my credit card. I can tolerate that. What I haven't assessed is whether they could do something similar with a bank account.

As several people have noted, the workaround is to have a new semi-dormant account solely for that. I haven't opened a bank account in decades, so that's currently an unknown for me. Given other things on my plate ATM, that ain't gonna happen soon

I really doubt that there is anyway that they can withdraw funds from your bank account. All I had to do was give them my account number, sort code and the name of the account which is the same info that you give anybody to make a payment to your account, i.e., your employer so that they can pay your salary directly to your account. I'm all for being cautious, but I don't see any need to open up another bank account just for eBay. If there is a dispute, then I suspect that they will hold back funds from future / other sales (assuming that you are a usual seller) otherwise they will expect you to honour the agreement otherwise they will more than likely shut your account down.

I would hope an expect that, but a recent conversation with a bank didn't enthuse me with confidence.

I and my brother are in the process of using a Limited Power of Attorney to operate my mother's account. The LPA states that we can operate it individually for amounts less than £X, but more than that and we have to jointly sign. Nothing special there. But they won't issue an ATM card or chequebook to us on the grounds that it would allow one of us to exceed £X. But surely their automated systems would simply prevent that? Not so, and they state all other banks are the same. I can see how that might be the case (presume all OK let transactions proceed, and clear up mess afterwards), but I don't like it.

My brother, X.Y.Z.Brother, is also having aggro proving who he is, since one of the credit reference agencies knows him as X.Y.Brother. Grrrr.

So I prefer to avoid trouble rather than clean up messes with a chatbot.

[Saskia]

Seems I am liable for the funeral costs. 
And a shredder or a piranha ridden river apparently are not an acceptable option.

I'm setting up a Google calendar reminder (monthly) to remind me to stay off your enemies list. 

don't worry, I have no reason to see you as a an enemy.

[bd139]

Yes, fleabay is being objectionable, but I'm more relaxed about this than the "f**k off after May unless you give us your bank account".

As regards to their payment system, I have to say that so far I'm finding it very good. As soon as I enter details of the shipping and tracking info, they release your money directly into your bank and they deduct their fee at the same time, which at the moment as I'm using the £1 offer, means the full amount less the £1. There are no other fees coming off as there used to be with PayPal then taking their cut.

I know fleabay can, via one means or another, "deduct" money from my credit card. I can tolerate that. What I haven't assessed is whether they could do something similar with a bank account.

As several people have noted, the workaround is to have a new semi-dormant account solely for that. I haven't opened a bank account in decades, so that's currently an unknown for me. Given other things on my plate ATM, that ain't gonna happen soon

I really doubt that there is anyway that they can withdraw funds from your bank account. All I had to do was give them my account number, sort code and the name of the account which is the same info that you give anybody to make a payment to your account, i.e., your employer so that they can pay your salary directly to your account. I'm all for being cautious, but I don't see any need to open up another bank account just for eBay. If there is a dispute, then I suspect that they will hold back funds from future / other sales (assuming that you are a usual seller) otherwise they will expect you to honour the agreement otherwise they will more than likely shut your account down.

I would hope an expect that, but a recent conversation with a bank didn't enthuse me with confidence.

I and my brother are in the process of using a Limited Power of Attorney to operate my mother's account. The LPA states that we can operate it individually for amounts less than £X, but more than that and we have to jointly sign. Nothing special there. But they won't issue an ATM card or chequebook to us on the grounds that it would allow one of us to exceed £X. But surely their automated systems would simply prevent that? Not so, and they state all other banks are the same. I can see how that might be the case (presume all OK let transactions proceed, and clear up mess afterwards), but I don't like it.

My brother, X.Y.Z.Brother, is also having aggro proving who he is, since one of the credit reference agencies knows him as X.Y.Brother. Grrrr.

So I prefer to avoid trouble rather than clean up messes with a chatbot.

It creates a DD when you sign up. See attached screenshot.

You can of course cancel that. But they can request it again.

On a positive note, DD is being shot in a couple of years entirely. It’s going the way of cheques.

[med6753]

Well that didn't take long. See schematic. V609 OG3 VR tube is dead. Should have -84 volts on the cathode. 0 volts.  R608, 33K, current limiting resistor is OK. The -150VDC measures -115VDC with the tube installed or pulled out. Pretty good indicator that it's dead.

Unfortunately I don't have one. Off to Ebay.




BIG EDIT. This isn't the issue. Found the real problem. Stand by for an update

[BU508A]

Well that didn't take long. See schematic. V609 OG3 VR tube is dead. Should have -84 volts on the cathode. 0 volts.  R608, 33K, current limiting resistor is OK. The -150VDC measures -115VDC with the tube installed or pulled out. Pretty good indicator that it's dead.

Unfortunately I don't have one. Off to Ebay.

This is a voltage regulator for 84V, right?
If so, you could test it with a ZD51 and a ZD33 in series.

[med6753]

Discovered that an 0G3 is same as industrial 5651 VR tube. I have one. Installed and no joy. But I found the real issue and it's in the +100VDC supply. See schematic.



R675, R676. 47 ohm, 1 watt. Burnt to a crisp.



R670A 10 ohm, 2 watt. Partially burnt.



Chances are C709C has leakage/high ESR which would cause the carnage. That settles it. Preparing a BOM to re-cap the PSU in this scope before applying power again. That BOM will also include new resistors.

[McBryce]

R670A 10 ohm, 2 watt. Partially burnt.



Chances are C709C has leakage/high ESR which would cause the carnage. That settles it. Preparing a BOM to re-cap the PSU in this scope before applying power again. That BOM will also include new resistors.

That first diode to the left of the resistors doesn't look all that healthy either, or is that just dirt?

McBryce.

[mnementh]

On The Bench This Morning:

   AiO CPU Cooler Periodic Maintenance

Y'all may have noticed the dwagon hasn't been around stirring sh...tuff up this morning... I've been a little busy.

Since I have the CPU out of my PC anyways, I figured now was a good time to do periodic maintenance on the cooler in my Gaming/VR machine

This kind of nonsense is why I built my own.

It's been running for quite a while now, and since I use auto coolant, corrosion isn't an issue. Evaporation is glacially slow, I looked at the header tank the other day and it looks like I may need to top it up in a few more years.

It was also much cheaper.

Every word of this is just... wrong.

Auto coolant is not proof against corrosion; where in the world did you get that idea...? This cooler uses common household ethylene glycol automotive coolant, with very little dilution.

The jelly boogers are a byproduct of this kind of coolant, and they happen in any motor vehicle, any liquid-cooled device that uses it. Your cooler will need exactly this kind of periodic service as well, or the cooling block and several other places in the system will clog up. If you use the pink/orange OAT coolant, it is even worse for making those jelly boogers.

I've been doing liquid-cooling of PCs for decades... going back to the original Pentiums and Athlons, so I know exactly how much it costs to DIY this stuff, even if you start with a junkyard heater core for a rad. I highly doubt you built your own for "much less" than $60. 

Cheers,

mnem
*beginning to think that "sharing" wasn't such a good idea...*   

[mnementh]

The cheap US LeCroy discussed a bit earlier actually powers up, I've messaged the seller and he made some pictures with it on:

https://www.ebay.de/itm/384116654445?ul_noapp=true

How if shipping and VAT won't double the price.... 

It's right at US$400 to me, now that eBay is calculating shipping and VAT for me. That, sadly, is quite resistible, as I know appropriate probes will double that cost, even if it works 100%. As I said earlier... I might use it in anger once before I kick the bucket. 

mnem
*sigh*

[mnementh]

...
 I noticed that the OG3 VR tube for the -150V reference was not ionizing. That's not good. I don't have a replacement. Tried re-seating the VR tube and now good. Time delay kicked in but still have major issues.

med,

I remember a case where a VR tube did not work in a ham radio transceiver (Collins). The result was that the gas in the VR tube was doped with a radioactive material to set the reference voltage. After 50 years, most of that stuff had decayed enough so that the VR tube did not show a constant voltage anymore. Sounds like your problem. Maybe time to build a zener replacement?

Greetings,

Rainer

The radoactive component is to provided relaible starting with minimal overshoot rather than set the voltage. This is a particular problem if the tube is in the dark. Two options to fix:
1/Stick a radium luminised watch hand to the outside of the tube (some tubes used external sources a standard)
2/illuminate the tube with a blue or UV LED.

That is just... the neatest hollow-state workaround I've heard since the old TV nerd trick of winding a few turns around the HV coil to get isolated heater voltage for a CRT with a short to the heater. I learned something today.

mnem
 

[mnementh]

(snip)   While doubtless an effective solution, somehow it just seems sacrilegious to put (of all colors) a blue LED inside a 500 series Tek scope.   

-Pat

Maybe but guess what solution Med is likely to choose. 

Oh, now you're just agitatin'. 

mnem
carry on.

[mnementh]

Heads up for UK ebay members, you might want to watermark your pictures with user name or similar. They have changed the T&C so they have rights to your "content"

"When providing us with content (including causing content to be posted using our Services), you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, perpetual (or for the duration of any copyright or other rights in such content), irrevocable, royalty-free, sublicensable (through multiple tiers) right to use the content (including, without limitation, creating and using derivative works). We may in particular use your content, including any photographs you upload, for marketing and promotional purposes."

And
"Further, to the fullest extent permitted under applicable law, you waive your moral rights in the content and promise not to assert such rights or any other intellectual property rights you have in the content against us, our sublicensees or our assignees."

So they can use and sell your photos.

Great... so now fleaBay is turning into FurkBook.

mnem
*antisocial media at its finest...*

[mnementh]

...Yes, fleabay is being objectionable, but I'm more relaxed about this than the "f**k off after May unless you give us your bank account".

It's like they're trying to drive people to Amazon...

mnem
*staying away in droves*

[Cubdriver]

Mine needs a control knob.  (....and some clean up - got it relatively cheap from the 'bay and it's a bit rough looking.)  Think I'll ultimately be making the knob on the lathe at some point, as it's bigger than most and I haven't seen any on the auction site that don't include a whole 'nother instrument for a lot of $$, and aftermarket ones look klugy.



-Pat

[Specmaster]

On The Bench This Morning:

   AiO CPU Cooler Periodic Maintenance

Y'all may have noticed the dwagon hasn't been around stirring sh...tuff up this morning... I've been a little busy.

Since I have the CPU out of my PC anyways, I figured now was a good time to do periodic maintenance on the cooler in my Gaming/VR machine

This kind of nonsense is why I built my own.

It's been running for quite a while now, and since I use auto coolant, corrosion isn't an issue. Evaporation is glacially slow, I looked at the header tank the other day and it looks like I may need to top it up in a few more years.

It was also much cheaper.

Every word of this is just... wrong.

Auto coolant is not proof against corrosion; where in the world did you get that idea...? This cooler uses common household ethylene glycol automotive coolant, with very little dilution.

The jelly boogers are a byproduct of this kind of coolant, and they happen in any motor vehicle, any liquid-cooled device that uses it. Your cooler will need exactly this kind of periodic service as well, or the cooling block and several other places in the system will clog up. If you use the pink/orange OAT coolant, it is even worse for making those jelly boogers.

I've been doing liquid-cooling of PCs for decades... going back to the original Pentiums and Athlons, so I know exactly how much it costs to DIY this stuff, even if you start with a junkyard heater core for a rad. I highly doubt you built your own for "much less" than $60. 

Cheers,

mnem
*beginning to think that "sharing" wasn't such a good idea...*   

Now that I can again join in, I was thinking to myself that building your own was expensive unless you already have many of the parts in stock. I was looking at building one myself after watching Linus build one but quickly decided to buy a sealed unit as it was considerably less expensive, and it was itself costing over the £100 mark even then.

[mnementh]

bubble-butt.jpg

Yesterday my gpsdo module came. No time to waste, put it into an enclosure. Enclosure is sponsored by "5 pound of sh*t in a 3 pound bag". Totally not too small! Totally intended to print bubble out the back to fit buck regulator module from the beginning! Locks, now to wrestle lady heather...

Hey now! Don't make me have to sue you send you a strongly worded letter over my Uncle Bumblebutt nickname and my certified certifiable blivet-packer secondary profession!!!

mnem
You know you're a slave to Lady Heather's mesmerizing beat...

[mnementh]

Yes, fleabay is being objectionable, but I'm more relaxed about this than the "f**k off after May unless you give us your bank account".

As regards to their payment system, I have to say that so far I'm finding it very good. As soon as I enter details of the shipping and tracking info, they release your money directly into your bank and they deduct their fee at the same time, which at the moment as I'm using the £1 offer, means the full amount less the £1. There are no other fees coming off as there used to be with PayPal then taking their cut.

I know fleabay can, via one means or another, "deduct" money from my credit card. I can tolerate that. What I haven't assessed is whether they could do something similar with a bank account.

As several people have noted, the workaround is to have a new semi-dormant account solely for that. I haven't opened a bank account in decades, so that's currently an unknown for me. Given other things on my plate ATM, that ain't gonna happen soon

I really doubt that there is anyway that they can withdraw funds from your bank account. All I had to do was give them my account number, sort code and the name of the account which is the same info that you give anybody to make a payment to your account, i.e., your employer so that they can pay your salary directly to your account. I'm all for being cautious, but I don't see any need to open up another bank account just for eBay. If there is a dispute, then I suspect that they will hold back funds from future / other sales (assuming that you are a usual seller) otherwise they will expect you to honour the agreement otherwise they will more than likely shut your account down.

Fuck that, with a capital FUCK THAT!

fleaBay is just another gawddamn online vendor. They do not need any more than my credit card. For any fucking thing. There is no reason in the world my PayPal is not good enough for those bastards, and they can kiss my scaly dragon ass if they think they're getting direct access to any bank account I hold. That layer of protection is what I give PayPal their cut for, and I don't mind it a bit.

It is worth every penny to have someone I pay to be on my side in the event of a dispute.

mnem
not only no, but HELL NO!