Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[VK5RC]

TEA has been a bit quiet lately as I have been going through a mountain bike phase - in late December 2020 my new toy arrived from 'merica, 7 months after ordering (bike sales have gone crazy), I have upgraded it a little with carbon rims, and SRAM eagle X01 AXS electronic dropper seat post and gears. For the bike spotters it is a 2020 Santa cruz hightower CC X01. It climbs pretty well but can handle bloody rough trails at speed going downhill and not get too unsettled. Both the forks and the shock have individually controllable high and low speed compression and rebound - setting it up is not a simple task - I have no doubt that the bike is better than me😂
A had a kangaroo - abrasion induced rest off the bike for a while in February but back on again and attempting to get back some of the fitness lost.
The electronics are quite different from manual gears - quite sensitive controls - not easy if you are being shaken around by the trail, but really helpfully can give you a readout on your bike computer/garmin as to what gear you are in, saves that perilous between the leg gawk. The other weird thing is that electronic gears are really consistent as cable wear/stretch is never an issue so they 'integer' really well and generally stay that way better than cable gears do.
The hand controllers use a CR2032 battery - said to last about a year, the seat post dropper and derailleur use a proprietary SRAM small waterproof LiPo that lasts about 400km of cycling.

[xrunner]

You actually let some of those Hobos in your house? Did you have to fumigate afterwards? 

You want a tales from the crypt radio repair story? I'll write it up today but be careful what you ask for. 

[SilverSolder]

The single reason which answers all that, and the fact that it continues to persist even today, and still indirectly poisons all digital formats that have followed, is simple human greed. 

mnem
 

I'm talking about audio quality and manageability, and you are -- conveniently to your argument -- including metadata and politics.

Yes, with the hindsight of 2021, adding 1-10KiB or so of metadata is a no-brainer.

Given the technical solutions of 1982, that would mean ASCII or worse, just look at the GSM SMS charset, it is such a worse-ness; it's almost but not quite LATRINE-1, and what would Sony say? Dutch like English has hardly any characters outside 7-bit so neither one of the inventors nor most of the readers of this thread would even start thinking of this as a problem unless beaten with an internationalisation stick. Us Nordic people look at the 7-bit world and their Heavy Metal usage of umlauts and simply break down in a meleé of cringe and pity: "Mötley Crüe" "Tröjan")

(Creating that paragraph involved editing Wikipedia to insert "Tröjan", with references, just because.)

The thing with CD that has made it good beyond its useful life is that it is simple, well understood, open and not encumbered by stupid things like software "patents".  Given that CD is alive still -- according to you -- because of greed, that might seem like a controversial statement, but look at what came after it; MP3, AAC, Apple Lossless, WMA, Real, APT-X, et c. ad inf. All festering piles of greed. Compared to those, CDDA is immaculate conception pure. Not until the arrival of Ogg Vorbis, FLAC and Opus has the music compression landscape become something else than an industrial wasteland.

So, there!

Not to mention YOU OWN the CD unlike a iTunes download.

Yes and no...   technically, you have still licensed the music on the disc (you are not allowed to broadcast it, public performances, etc.)

But I'm nitpicking.   I've actually just bought a stack of CDs and use them to burn compilations that I then share and discuss with my friends -  it is so much more "tangible", and - funnily enough - most people still have a CD player somewhere, even if it is in their car or whatever, and they seem to enjoy dusting it off and "going back to their roots".

I like the Verbatim "Digital Vinyl" CDRs for this, they look awesome and work great, giving a completely inauthentic experience! 

[bd139]

Yeah had one too that didn't work properly. Took some fixing that one!

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hp-1740a-power-supply-burn-up/

This was my favourite diagnostic picture - spot the missing bond wire on the LM723:

Collector bond wire of the internal power transistor. Probably the main cause of death for this type of chip.

Greetings,

Rainer

That's the one! 

[Specmaster]

I still like CDs and I still keep buying them.
Why ?
Because I hate streaming services and the bloody DRM stuff. I want to be able to listen to and watch my stuff when I like, where I like and as often as I like.
Without anybody charging me for it continuously.

I also like CDs, then I can use them how I like, rip them into what ever format(s) I want and still have the CD as back up, play them in my desktop PC, laptop, car or home Hi-Fi or even on the TV via DVD/Bluray player, load the rips onto my iTunes, iPod, phone, tablet or whatever. 

[tonyalbus]

and not paying over and over for copyright you have allready paid.
i already have de bloody vhs/cd/dvd, i did pay already 3 times..

[BU508A]

Tek 335, starting bid ca. 70 Euro, no bids so far.



Any good?

[mansaxel]

Not to mention YOU OWN the CD unlike a iTunes download.

You might own the physical copy, but not the data. The one being tied to the other has served as a damper on the batshit crazy lawyers and media moguls, because it gave us as consumer some leverage, we could sell the carrier and therefore transfer the custody of the data, and further, it was impractical to grant a temporary license to consume the data. Even though the fine print says the license can be revoked.

Now, with file-based media flows (including streaming; it's all files, including the live lookalikes, make no mistake, it's just that someone else has the rights to your temp directory, unless you take measures to reassert it.) the insanity and greed has reached boiling levels.

The fact that copying is fundamental to computers and seen as bad in media business, to the extent that they will attempt to buy any law that can help them stop it, including very unnatural limitations on computing, is at the crux of much of the stupidity around media today.

If they could, the media industry would gladly pursue a ban on consumers owning Turing machines, to be replaced with the equivalents of Hollerith plugboard punchcard devices. Parts of the software industry would applaud this.

[med6753]

Tek 335, starting bid ca. 70 Euro, no bids so far.



Any good?

$84 USD starting bid? Way too much. And volts/div knob is broken.

[beanflying]

TEA has been a bit quiet lately as I have been going through a mountain bike phase - in late December 2020 my new toy arrived from 'merica, 7 months after ordering (bike sales have gone crazy), I have upgraded it a little with carbon rims, and SRAM eagle X01 AXS electronic dropper seat post and gears. For the bike spotters it is a 2020 Santa cruz hightower CC X01. It climbs pretty well but can handle bloody rough trails at speed going downhill and not get too unsettled. Both the forks and the shock have individually controllable high and low speed compression and rebound - setting it up is not a simple task - I have no doubt that the bike is better than me😂
A had a kangaroo - abrasion induced rest off the bike for a while in February but back on again and attempting to get back some of the fitness lost.
The electronics are quite different from manual gears - quite sensitive controls - not easy if you are being shaken around by the trail, but really helpfully can give you a readout on your bike computer/garmin as to what gear you are in, saves that perilous between the leg gawk. The other weird thing is that electronic gears are really consistent as cable wear/stretch is never an issue so they 'integer' really well and generally stay that way better than cable gears do.
The hand controllers use a CR2032 battery - said to last about a year, the seat post dropper and derailleur use a proprietary SRAM small waterproof LiPo that lasts about 400km of cycling.

Way to flash  I brought my first bike with Hydraulic brakes two years ago and they tried to sell me on the idea of electric shifters at the time. Must get my fat ass arse back on the saddle through Autumn now we can free range again.

[nixiefreqq]

what?  did tektronix's make oscilloscopes?

seems unlikely because i looked around the fortress of solitude and found none.

unless there are some behind this big pile of ones built by bill and dave.


in other news.  just got a summons for federal jury duty.   have to call harrisburg every friday in june to see if they want me to report monday morning.  feck!  maybe med could loan me a boatanchor........ which would result in his doctor writing me an excuse.

ps  hey med.  you probably should stay away from that 1740.  am very happy with all of my hp scopes.......but they do have personality quirks, and it would take a while for you to adjust to them after being indoctrinated to just bahama blue.

[bd139]

Not to mention YOU OWN the CD unlike a iTunes download.

You might own the physical copy, but not the data. The one being tied to the other has served as a damper on the batshit crazy lawyers and media moguls, because it gave us as consumer some leverage, we could sell the carrier and therefore transfer the custody of the data, and further, it was impractical to grant a temporary license to consume the data. Even though the fine print says the license can be revoked.

Now, with file-based media flows (including streaming; it's all files, including the live lookalikes, make no mistake, it's just that someone else has the rights to your temp directory, unless you take measures to reassert it.) the insanity and greed has reached boiling levels.

The fact that copying is fundamental to computers and seen as bad in media business, to the extent that they will attempt to buy any law that can help them stop it, including very unnatural limitations on computing, is at the crux of much of the stupidity around media today.

If they could, the media industry would gladly pursue a ban on consumers owning Turing machines, to be replaced with the equivalents of Hollerith plugboard punchcard devices. Parts of the software industry would applaud this.

Best way to fix this is learn to play an instrument 

Fun today. Toilet flush packed in. Siphon dead. I’m not doing any plumbing as I only do electrons and higher levels of information abstraction.  Well fuck I didn’t get away with the hack job I did last time and now need a new toilet 

[Ice-Tea]

I still like CDs and I still keep buying them.
Why ?
Because I hate streaming services and the bloody DRM stuff. I want to be able to listen to and watch my stuff when I like, where I like and as often as I like.
Without anybody charging me for it continuously.

I also like CDs, then I can use them how I like, rip them into what ever format(s) I want and still have the CD as back up, play them in my desktop PC, laptop, car or home Hi-Fi or even on the TV via DVD/Bluray player, load the rips onto my iTunes, iPod, phone, tablet or whatever. 

I have well over 400CDs. It was a passion of mine for a long time (aka addiction).

Then I got Spotify (and bad CD players in cars) and I put them in a box in the attic. Never looked back.

[Specmaster]

<snip>

Fun today. Toilet flush packed in. Siphon dead. I’m not doing any plumbing as I only do electrons and higher levels of information abstraction.  Well fuck I didn’t get away with the hack job I did last time and now need a new toilet 

You can go to the hardware store B&Q etc, and buy just the siphon and replace the old one, no need for an expensive new toilet.

[mnementh]

...At this point, I believe I need to sleep on it. Maybe some clarity will come with the morning light.

mnem
 

This is what the morning light brought...

fukkin' seriously? 3 days ago I was sweating like a longshoreman, doing yardwork in t-shirt & shorts...

mnem
*clarity*

[mnementh]

   https://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/26-x1-75-Wheel-size-36V-500W-Electric-Bike-Conversion-Kit-for-Rear-Wheel-Motor-Hub-Control/PRD4FR0J46H75OW

the kit looks like a 750w unit    have fun 

Yeah, some of these hub kits are deliberately underrated to get past import restrictions; they derate them to a lower wattage at lower max voltage, but the real eBike maniacs know just by looking that they can swap in a higher-voltage controller (or mod the one in the kit) and get twice the rated wattage out of the same motor.

I never could understand the whole subculture behind this; after building several back in the day, I found it is almost impossible to make a high-wattage eBike that isn't a deathtrap. A bicycle makes a horrible motorcycle, and the bigger kits can get you up into highway speeds on a top-heavy 2-wheeled vehicle with no suspension, or worse, bicycle suspension which is not designed for anything more than 1 people-power. Talk aboot death wobbles...

mnem
 

[bd139]

<snip>

Fun today. Toilet flush packed in. Siphon dead. I’m not doing any plumbing as I only do electrons and higher levels of information abstraction.  Well fuck I didn’t get away with the hack job I did last time and now need a new toilet 

You can go to the hardware store B&Q etc, and buy just the siphon and replace the old one, no need for an expensive new toilet.

Yeah not that easy. It was immovably stuck which is why I rapidly subcontracted it out to someone else. During removal the pipe needed to be replaced and the donut flange thing. Which is now pissing out because the original person who installed it (not me) managed to take a chunk out of the cistern and bodged it with sealant.

[bd139]

...At this point, I believe I need to sleep on it. Maybe some clarity will come with the morning light.

mnem
 

This is what the morning light brought...

fukkin' seriously? 3 days ago I was sweating like a longshoreman, doing yardwork in t-shirt & shorts...

mnem
*clarity*

All i see is that your deck is bigger than my house 

[Saskia]

Not to mention YOU OWN the CD unlike a iTunes download.

You might own the physical copy, but not the data. The one being tied to the other has served as a damper on the batshit crazy lawyers and media moguls, because it gave us as consumer some leverage, we could sell the carrier and therefore transfer the custody of the data, and further, it was impractical to grant a temporary license to consume the data. Even though the fine print says the license can be revoked.

Now, with file-based media flows (including streaming; it's all files, including the live lookalikes, make no mistake, it's just that someone else has the rights to your temp directory, unless you take measures to reassert it.) the insanity and greed has reached boiling levels.

The fact that copying is fundamental to computers and seen as bad in media business, to the extent that they will attempt to buy any law that can help them stop it, including very unnatural limitations on computing, is at the crux of much of the stupidity around media today.

If they could, the media industry would gladly pursue a ban on consumers owning Turing machines, to be replaced with the equivalents of Hollerith plugboard punchcard devices. Parts of the software industry would applaud this.

Best way to fix this is learn to play an instrument 

Fun today. Toilet flush packed in. Siphon dead. I’m not doing any plumbing as I only do electrons and higher levels of information abstraction.  Well fuck I didn’t get away with the hack job I did last time and now need a new toilet 

There is a very easy way to unclog ...

it involves due diligence and the application of 50 grams of ...

[Saskia]

I still like CDs and I still keep buying them.
Why ?
Because I hate streaming services and the bloody DRM stuff. I want to be able to listen to and watch my stuff when I like, where I like and as often as I like.
Without anybody charging me for it continuously.

I also like CDs, then I can use them how I like, rip them into what ever format(s) I want and still have the CD as back up, play them in my desktop PC, laptop, car or home Hi-Fi or even on the TV via DVD/Bluray player, load the rips onto my iTunes, iPod, phone, tablet or whatever. 

I have well over 400CDs. It was a passion of mine for a long time (aka addiction).

Then I got Spotify (and bad CD players in cars) and I put them in a box in the attic. Never looked back.

I have my high end audio streamer (custom built) which hosts FLAC images of my CD library. Works like a charm.
Also comes with network streaming.

[YurkshireLad]

...At this point, I believe I need to sleep on it. Maybe some clarity will come with the morning light.

mnem
 

This is what the morning light brought...

fukkin' seriously? 3 days ago I was sweating like a longshoreman, doing yardwork in t-shirt & shorts...

mnem
*clarity*

Same here! Though it's not settling on the ground as much where I am.

[psykok]

I still like CDs and I still keep buying them.
Why ?
Because I hate streaming services and the bloody DRM stuff. I want to be able to listen to and watch my stuff when I like, where I like and as often as I like.
Without anybody charging me for it continuously.

I also like CDs, then I can use them how I like, rip them into what ever format(s) I want and still have the CD as back up, play them in my desktop PC, laptop, car or home Hi-Fi or even on the TV via DVD/Bluray player, load the rips onto my iTunes, iPod, phone, tablet or whatever. 

I have well over 400CDs. It was a passion of mine for a long time (aka addiction).

Then I got Spotify (and bad CD players in cars) and I put them in a box in the attic. Never looked back.

I put my CD's in the attic since many years, to have more space to grow my LP collection

And because I'm completely  sick, I'm now starting with R2R

[Saskia]

Very nice. Recommend Revox B77 with external Nakamichi Dolby C

[Cubdriver]

I still like CDs and I still keep buying them.
Why ?
Because I hate streaming services and the bloody DRM stuff. I want to be able to listen to and watch my stuff when I like, where I like and as often as I like.
Without anybody charging me for it continuously.

I want hard copies of my music, too.  That was reinforced some years ago when I went to listen to the music library on my iPhone and discovered that Apple had deleted it during a software update.  Was on a trip out west, and had luckily brought my iPod along for use in the rental car, so I wasn't musicless for two weeks, but I was damned annoyed.  Oh, but you can just stream it!  No, I'm in a fucking airplane, and not paying extra for WiFi just to listen to music that I previously bought, ripped and loaded myself.  Nor am I paying for data to stream stuff I already own.  That stunt really pissed me off.

Having hard copies means I can rip it to iTunes, or to my FLAC players, or even listen to the little spinny disc on an old school player.  (Yike - I'm now thinking of 80s era stuff as 'old school'.  Where does time go, and how is it getting there so fast?)  As far as people ripping then selling their CDs cheaply, well, I think they're foolish for not keeping them, but if they want to sell them cheaply I'm not above buying them.

-Pat

[mnementh]

The single reason which answers all that, and the fact that it continues to persist even today, and still indirectly poisons all digital formats that have followed, is simple human greed. 

mnem
 

I'm talking about audio quality and manageability, and you are -- conveniently to your argument -- including metadata and politics.

Yes, with the hindsight of 2021, adding 1-10KiB or so of metadata is a no-brainer.

Given the technical solutions of 1982, that would mean ASCII or worse, just look at the GSM SMS charset, it is such a worse-ness; it's almost but not quite LATRINE-1, and what would Sony say? Dutch like English has hardly any characters outside 7-bit so neither one of the inventors nor most of the readers of this thread would even start thinking of this as a problem unless beaten with an internationalisation stick. Us Nordic people look at the 7-bit world and their Heavy Metal usage of umlauts and simply break down in a meleé of cringe and pity: "Mötley Crüe" "Tröjan")

(Creating that paragraph involved editing Wikipedia to insert "Tröjan", with references, just because.)

The thing with CD that has made it good beyond its useful life is that it is simple, well understood, open and not encumbered by stupid things like software "patents".  Given that CD is alive still -- according to you -- because of greed, that might seem like a controversial statement, but look at what came after it; MP3, AAC, Apple Lossless, WMA, Real, APT-X, et c. ad inf. All festering piles of greed. Compared to those, CDDA is immaculate conception pure. Not until the arrival of Ogg Vorbis, FLAC and Opus has the music compression landscape become something else than an industrial wasteland.

So, there!

Okay... I've read ahead, and I can see folks are getting tired of this, even though I was deliberately avoiding politics and talking only aboot the core reasons and the history involved, nothing else. 

Here's the thing... the engineering folks at Philips & Sony developed metadata as part of the CDDA specification, and tried to get it into production. The music execs said no because they didn't want to be arsed with the miniscule bit of expense involved in developing the database. 

Their tiny little management brains couldn't wrap themselves around the whole idea that people wanted... needed... a music experience that was actually convenient. All they saw in CD was smaller, shinier, bigger profit margin due to hugely rising costs in shipping large heavy plastic discs, which coincided with a time when almost the entire industry was needing a hardware refresh anyways.

Metadata made it into production on the specifications for both VCD and MD; the folks at Philips and Sony both knew what a game-changer metadata was, and understood exactly how it drove directly into the root of the problem with vinyl...the horrible UI. Well, lets face it... nonexistent UI. These technologies were coeval with CDDA's inception, and they are the proof that metadata was easily possible at the time.

We won't get into Sony BMG's utterly insane business practices which followed in the years after... (remember Sony rootkit-gate?) and Microsoft trying to own the DRM market by owning the formats underlying DVD and HDCD... those abominations actually are more politics than technology, and I have no interest right now... I'm miserable with back pain and stuck in the middle of 3 different projects; all stalled waiting on parts or weather or both.

Cheers,

mnem