Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[med6753]

really don't see a problem here.   the problem starts when the building inspector says your structure will no longer support your collection.

and then you call in a structural engineer to size additional supports.

County Engineer for Ulster County, New York tipped you off did he?   

Nah. Turns out he's a fellow Republican and we downed a Guinness or two or three and called it good.

BTW....Happy St Paddy's Day and no, I don't drink green beer.   

[Cerebus]

really don't see a problem here.   the problem starts when the building inspector says your structure will no longer support your collection.

and then you call in a structural engineer to size additional supports.

County Engineer for Ulster County, New York tipped you off did he?   

Nah. Turns out he's a fellow Republican and we downed a Guinness or two or three and called it good.

BTW....Happy St Paddy's Day and no, I don't drink green beer.

Lightweight!

We're still waiting to hear whether you need to get the floor reinforced or not...

[med6753]

We're still waiting to hear whether you need to get the floor reinforced or not...

If all works out as planned by tomorrow afternoon it will be painfully evident.

[mindcrime]

For example:
- some references: voltage reference, resistor reference, 10MHz lab refrence ...

A rubidium frequency reference! Dang, I knew that was something I was forgetting.   

And one-of-these-days I'll get a standalone frequency counter.

That's it. Two more items for my bench and I'm DONE. Really. I mean it. This time, for reals...

[mnementh]

I had it under control.    I really did. No, I mean it..    I really, really had my test equipment addiction handled.     Until I didn't. 

Throughout all of 2020, I managed to limit myself to ONE new piece of test equipment. I bought a new Rigol DL3021A Programmable Load. And that was it. I am not an addict. I have this under control. No, I mean it. I do...

And then this week hit. And the bug bit. Something snapped inside of me. I couldn't control my compulsions anymore. The floodgates opened.

Now I either have, or have on the way:

1. An official EEVBlog BM786 multimeter. I mean.. that's not so bad. Who wouldn't want an official EEVBlog meter, right? And you can never have too many multi-meters. Right? RIGHT?!?

2. A Keysight 16862A Logic Analyzer - Errm... it was like 85% of the original price, and it's from the "official Keysight Ebay Store" and has a warranty and everything. And who doesn't need a second logic analyzer? Especially one that's nicer than the existing HP boat anchor? That's not so bad. I'm not really an addict. This is all totally reasonable. Right? RIGHT???

3. An Extech 380193 LCR Meter - It's not like these are real expensive. Or take up a lot of room. And you can *always* use an LCR meter, no? I'm right and you know I'm right. High Five!!

4. A Rigol RSA3015N 1.5 GHz Spectrum Analyzer - Umm... I didn't have a proper spectrum analyzer, OK? Who are you to judge me anyway. I am not an addict. You lot shut up. People who live in glass houses and all that. I can stop anytime I want anyway.

5. A Rigol MSO7024 200 mhz,4 channel MSO - I ah... that is. Well.. you see... that is. Urk. I mean, my old scope was only 100mhz, OK? And I uh... really needed the logic analyzer part because I didn't already.. have... two. logic. analyzers. It's OK. Really. I needed it. For um... stuff. Yeah. You know. Aaaah. Urrrm...   I might have a problem.

Hummmmph. Okay... It's a start. But nowhere even close to a collection...

Pat, could you please show this pretender what he's up against...?

freqq... I know you can marshall a force to be reckoned with... Tony has only been with us a couple years, and he can scare you too.

I'll refer you to the glossary on page 1... Look for enheavyment.

Oh... And welcome home, brother. We knew you'd be back. 

mnem
*veteran of a thousand psychic wars TEAcquisition Campaigns*

[med6753]

For example:
- some references: voltage reference, resistor reference, 10MHz lab refrence ...

A rubidium frequency reference! Dang, I knew that was something I was forgetting.   

And one-of-these-days I'll get a standalone frequency counter.

That's it. Two more items for my bench and I'm DONE. Really. I mean it. This time, for reals...

You are never done. Welcome to our Rabbit Hole. 

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/test-equipment-anonymous-(tea)-group-therapy-thread/msg3505384/#msg3505384

[mnementh]

We're still waiting to hear whether you need to get the floor reinforced or not...

If all works out as planned by tomorrow afternoon it will be painfully evident.

 

I just felt a great disturbance in The Force... As if millions of transistors cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced...

mnem
 

[med6753]

We're still waiting to hear whether you need to get the floor reinforced or not...

If all works out as planned by tomorrow afternoon it will be painfully evident.

 

I just felt a terrible disturbance in The Force... As if millions of transistors cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced...

mnem
 

Better include the hollow state crowd too. 

[mnementh]

I do suspect that an emergent critical mass of hollow state was the ultimate cause of that great disturbance... 

mnem
 

[nixiefreqq]

For example:
- some references: voltage reference, resistor reference, 10MHz lab refrence ...

A rubidium frequency reference! Dang, I knew that was something I was forgetting.   

And one-of-these-days I'll get a standalone frequency counter.

That's it. Two more items for my bench and I'm DONE. Really. I mean it. This time, for reals...

counters never stand alone around here.

they travel in herds.

ps you also need a gpsdo to check your rubidium against.

[Cubdriver]

I had it under control.    I really did. No, I mean it..    I really, really had my test equipment addiction handled.     Until I didn't. 

Throughout all of 2020, I managed to limit myself to ONE new piece of test equipment. I bought a new Rigol DL3021A Programmable Load. And that was it. I am not an addict. I have this under control. No, I mean it. I do...

And then this week hit. And the bug bit. Something snapped inside of me. I couldn't control my compulsions anymore. The floodgates opened.

Now I either have, or have on the way:

1. An official EEVBlog BM786 multimeter. I mean.. that's not so bad. Who wouldn't want an official EEVBlog meter, right? And you can never have too many multi-meters. Right? RIGHT?!?

2. A Keysight 16862A Logic Analyzer - Errm... it was like 85% of the original price, and it's from the "official Keysight Ebay Store" and has a warranty and everything. And who doesn't need a second logic analyzer? Especially one that's nicer than the existing HP boat anchor? That's not so bad. I'm not really an addict. This is all totally reasonable. Right? RIGHT???

3. An Extech 380193 LCR Meter - It's not like these are real expensive. Or take up a lot of room. And you can *always* use an LCR meter, no? I'm right and you know I'm right. High Five!!

4. A Rigol RSA3015N 1.5 GHz Spectrum Analyzer - Umm... I didn't have a proper spectrum analyzer, OK? Who are you to judge me anyway. I am not an addict. You lot shut up. People who live in glass houses and all that. I can stop anytime I want anyway.

5. A Rigol MSO7024 200 mhz,4 channel MSO - I ah... that is. Well.. you see... that is. Urk. I mean, my old scope was only 100mhz, OK? And I uh... really needed the logic analyzer part because I didn't already.. have... two. logic. analyzers. It's OK. Really. I needed it. For um... stuff. Yeah. You know. Aaaah. Urrrm...   I might have a problem.

You're off to a good start.   

Stick around here and we'll help you along in your journey into the bunny hole that is this place...
I started my descent into TE madness after getting back into playing with vacuum tubes again about nine years ago.  The DIY audio forums led me to buy a 3562A Dynamic Signal Analyzer.


That led me to the HP/A/K mailing list where people happened to be griping about clock makers buying and scrapping out old counters for their nixie tubes.  That prompted me to buy an old 5245L to 'save' at least one from that fate.


That led to an interest in the old counters and there began the quest to 'collect the whole set' that continues to this day.


I have, of course, also branched off into voltmeters, power supplies and everything else in the catalogs (which are also very dangerous to one's credit card), and have a rather large collection of playthings in the basement.


(...and in my office, and the spare bedroom, and the living room, and the dining room, and the...)

Welcome to the nut house.  The water's fine and we have cookies!

-Pat

[nixiefreqq]

damn cub!



am now feeling like a light weight candy ass.

i salute you sir.


ps  it appears that you are waaaaay ahead of med in total tonnage.  after all....he has mostly tek. 

and that almost makes him a feather merchant.  (until tomorrow anyway)

[Specmaster]

I found the problem with the Type 321A. Was doing some reading on the tin whisker problem with those Philips 2N2207's and decided to do some simple continuity checks. The transistors are in metal cases which are in holders securing them to the chassis. They are prone to have tin migration from the chip to the case. And since the cases are secured to the chassis the result is a short.

Q183 has a 16 ohm tin whisker short emitter to case. I checked all the other 2N2207's and they are OK. I found two 2N2207's on Ebay for $10 USD including shipping. Ordered....and I realize the risk of using them because it's a known issue with these Philips transistors but I want to stay original if I can.

(Am I seeing a pattern here? Blue Phillips capacitors suck. Phillips GE transistors have tin whisker issues. Maybe Philips should have stuck with what they did best....rape audiophools with their over priced tubes.  )

You can cure them if you're careful by charging a capacitor and then applying the charged cap across the shorted terminals to evaporate the offending whisker.

[Cubdriver]

damn cub!



am now feeling like a light weight candy ass.

i salute you sir.


ps  it appears that you are waaaaay ahead of med in total tonnage.  after all....he has mostly tek. 

and that almost makes him a feather merchant.  (until tomorrow anyway)

   I have no SWMBO here to act as a limiter on my inclinations to collect cool stuff, so the result is what you see in the pics.  And yeah, gross tonnage wise I'm definitely up there!  But if nothing else, it keeps me off the streets and more or less out of trouble.  I have been doing my best recently to take a hiatus from the fjord of turpitude in order to FIX some of the things in the repair queue rather than just lengthening it.  The FedEx and UPS guys are probably going to be wondering if I'm ok.

-Pat

[Specmaster]

I found the problem with the Type 321A. Was doing some reading on the tin whisker problem with those Philips 2N2207's and decided to do some simple continuity checks. The transistors are in metal cases which are in holders securing them to the chassis. They are prone to have tin migration from the chip to the case. And since the cases are secured to the chassis the result is a short.

Q183 has a 16 ohm tin whisker short emitter to case. I checked all the other 2N2207's and they are OK. I found two 2N2207's on Ebay for $10 USD including shipping. Ordered....and I realize the risk of using them because it's a known issue with these Philips transistors but I want to stay original if I can.

(Am I seeing a pattern here? Blue Phillips capacitors suck. Phillips GE transistors have tin whisker issues. Maybe Philips should have stuck with what they did best....rape audiophools with their over priced tubes.  )

You might be able to fix the transistor. Find the two pins with a short, charge up a 2200uF cap to about 5V or so and stick it across the junction in reverse (so it's not conducting through the transistor). Usually smokes the tin whisker.

Lift one of the legs of course!

Edit: purely by chance a Tek 422 has popped up about 4 miles from me. Buyer collects only. 

Ha, me trying to catch up here, came across med's post and replied and told him about using a charged cap, but you beat me to it already 

[Specmaster]

... works for the whisker that is causing the short right now.
But its not safe, because a whisker never comes alone. The growth of the other ones could repeat the problem any time in future.
Much better to replace the part.

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/anecdote/af114-transistor/index.html

Are they still making GE transistors then or are those that are available NOS, in which case they might already have their own whisker issues?

[Specmaster]

really don't see a problem here.   the problem starts when the building inspector says your structure will no longer support your collection.

and then you call in a structural engineer to size additional supports.

County Engineer for Ulster County, New York tipped you off did he?   

Nah. Turns out he's a fellow Republican and we downed a Guinness or two or three and called it good.

BTW....Happy St Paddy's Day and no, I don't drink green beer.   

That ain't beer, that's antifreeze 

[mnementh]

Cloud is faster and more reliable than half the shitty flash drives out there now. I got so fed up I've got a Samsung 970 Evo on a SATA/USB bridge 

Yebbutt... not shitty name-brand ones are sooo cheap now... I have literally a fistful of 'em. Windoze boot/install off a random 32GB Kingston 3.1 USB drive I bought a couple years ago for $15 off Amazon took like 7 minutes last night.

Samsung BAR are rated 200-400MB/s and cost $20-40. I have a couple of them too. 

I realize that's nowhere near the 530-580MB/s the EVO 970 is rated for (good drive... wifey came home and kissed on the lips after its first day at work... ); but how close to that are you really getting after all your bits pass through the bridge and one or two USB controllers...?

mnem
 

Hmmm. Typical turd drive...      55 gig into a 256gb stick has taken 2 hours so far to get to 38%.

Evo ... whole lot = 10 minutes.

I think I've spotted the problem. But you knew that. 

Yeah... that's still a lot better than even my 64GB Samsung Bar; which in its defense, is 1st gen and ~2 years old now. It'll read at a consistent 150-200MB/s, so you can copy ~50GB off it in 10 minutes... but write speed is only aboot 20-30MB/s consistent, so 40-50 min to write that. (Right now... 20 min for 20GB on a 52GB write on my laptop: i7-6500U, 250GB EVO 850) But for the convenience of something the size of a pencap, I still think it's a good compromise vs the assache of my 6TB spinning rust backup drive that'll read and write at ~250MB/s.

I guess it probably is time for another generational increase... start looking for a USB 3.2 NVMe enclosure & drive.

mnem
 

[mnementh]

damn cub!   am now feeling like a light weight candy ass.   i salute you sir.

ps  it appears that you are waaaaay ahead of med in total tonnage.  after all....he has mostly tek. and that almost makes him a feather merchant.  (until tomorrow anyway)

   I have no SWMBO here to act as a limiter on my inclinations to collect cool stuff, so the result is what you see in the pics.  And yeah, gross tonnage wise I'm definitely up there!  But if nothing else, it keeps me off the streets and more or less out of trouble.  I have been doing my best recently to take a hiatus from the fjord of turpitude in order to FIX some of the things in the repair queue rather than just lengthening it.  The FedEx and UPS guys are probably going to be wondering if I'm ok.

-Pat

Thank you Pat... I knew ye would'nae disappoint. 

Enheavyment: TEA-speak and ironic term for enlightenment as quantified by curb weight of latest acquisition(s). Also, qualified as inverse function thereof.

Oh, and good luck clearing out some of that repair queue... I'm sure your last-mile carriers will welcome the shift from "For Parts or Repair" TE to "Parts for Repair of TE". 

mnem

[Wolfgang]

... works for the whisker that is causing the short right now.
But its not safe, because a whisker never comes alone. The growth of the other ones could repeat the problem any time in future.
Much better to replace the part.

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/anecdote/af114-transistor/index.html

Are they still making GE transistors then or are those that are available NOS, in which case they might already have their own whisker issues?

I think they mostly sell off old stock. There are two ways to avoid whiskers:
- use tin with enough lead. Then its gone. Sn60Pb never creates whiskers
- no tin at all.
Later Germanium types (TO-18, TO-5, ...) should be free of whiskers. Small AC/AF types should be able to replace a 2N2207.
Data is 50mA, 140MHz, Gain 36. Thats no rocket science.

[med6753]

... works for the whisker that is causing the short right now.
But its not safe, because a whisker never comes alone. The growth of the other ones could repeat the problem any time in future.
Much better to replace the part.

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/anecdote/af114-transistor/index.html

Are they still making GE transistors then or are those that are available NOS, in which case they might already have their own whisker issues?

I think they mostly sell off old stock. There are two ways to avoid whiskers:
- use tin with enough lead. Then its gone. Sn60Pb never creates whiskers
- no tin at all.
Later Germanium types (TO-18, TO-5, ...) should be free of whiskers. Small AC/AF types should be able to replace a 2N2207.
Data is 50mA, 140MHz, Gain 36. Thats no rocket science.

Yep, NTE126 in TO-18 package is a replacement. Just one problem. They go for $11/ea USD on Amazon. Bend over. 

[Wolfgang]

... works for the whisker that is causing the short right now.
But its not safe, because a whisker never comes alone. The growth of the other ones could repeat the problem any time in future.
Much better to replace the part.

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/anecdote/af114-transistor/index.html

Are they still making GE transistors then or are those that are available NOS, in which case they might already have their own whisker issues?

I think they mostly sell off old stock. There are two ways to avoid whiskers:
- use tin with enough lead. Then its gone. Sn60Pb never creates whiskers
- no tin at all.
Later Germanium types (TO-18, TO-5, ...) should be free of whiskers. Small AC/AF types should be able to replace a 2N2207.
Data is 50mA, 140MHz, Gain 36. Thats no rocket science.

Yep, NTE126 in TO-18 package is a replacement. Just one problem. They go for $11/ea USD on Amazon. Bend over. 

It has always been a bit expensive when you have such an exquisite taste. 
But seriously: You could probably use cheap PNP silicon if you are willing to tweak the surrounding circuit a little bit.

[mansaxel]

For example:
- some references: voltage reference, resistor reference, 10MHz lab refrence ...

A rubidium frequency reference! Dang, I knew that was something I was forgetting.   

And one-of-these-days I'll get a standalone frequency counter.

That's it. Two more items for my bench and I'm DONE. Really. I mean it. This time, for reals...

You need at least three counters. One to compare to the first, and a third as arbitrator. And, you need a GPSDO (and/or) a Cs normal to put some long-time disciplin into the Rb normal. If you feel that the difference between Cs and Rb is too small, there's always the hydrogen maser.

Time nuttery is a very beautiful nuttery, because it like its sibling Volt nuttery, breeds TEA.

[tonyalbus]

For example:
- some references: voltage reference, resistor reference, 10MHz lab refrence ...

A rubidium frequency reference! Dang, I knew that was something I was forgetting.   

And one-of-these-days I'll get a standalone frequency counter.

That's it. Two more items for my bench and I'm DONE. Really. I mean it. This time, for reals...

You need at least three counters. One to compare to the first, and a third as arbitrator. And, you need a GPSDO (and/or) a Cs normal to put some long-time disciplin into the Rb normal. If you feel that the difference between Cs and Rb is too small, there's always the hydrogen maser.

Time nuttery is a very beautiful nuttery, because it like its sibling Volt nuttery, breeds TEA.

GPSDO... a must.

as you may know i am crazy about counter.... and have a few.. sens i have a GPSDO i have so much more peace.
the video is a bit old, when i just started...but it gives you a idea.

[Brumby]

Don't you just love some people on eBay...... 

They had the listing up for a week ... with bids ... and then, after winning it, organising the funds and arranging a pickup address and time, I get this:



Bean found this guy - but I was the one who went in to play.