Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

Can someone sanity check this for me. I am half asleep today.

Two things coming from Amazon: Case is Fractal Meshify C Mini, keyboard is cheap logitech wireless set. Already has an HDMI equipped monitor to plug this into. Dude is moving off a laptop.   Have I forgotten any bits? This needs to get a mid-range GPU in it when they are available, possibly double the RAM and upgrade to an i7 down the line if he needs it.

If there's any chance of it going RTX30x0 or similar Ampere-family Quadro-equivalent GPU in the futire, you need at least a 850W PSU, preferably closer to 1KW, and from a reputable brand so you know you're actually getting that capacity. Obvi, Platinum-rated will be a necessity as well for that kind of current draw.

I personally wouldn't touch that MSI board with a 10-foot pole, and we don't hardly ever grow that tall. While most of the horror stories I've heard with them recently have been AMD builds, my own personal build history with them has been atrocious. Too fucking many cut corners; they are almost as bad as AsRock. Just look at their puny-ass VRM designs and you'll shit yourself.

Also, look at the WiFi versions... recently, for some reason, they have been cheaper than the non-WiFi variants... and often include BT4.xx as a bonus. That may be why; BT 5.xx is just around the corner. I would suggest a Asus PRIME or TUF GAMING family board for a value build.

Also, look into Crucial BALLISTIX for your RAM. Typically $5-10 more speed for speed, but usually also CAS16 vs CAS18 rated for the Corsair Vengeance. And they are a Micron brand, so you know you're getting good chips from the source, not factory floor sweepings.

Good choice on the 970Evo, but the 970EvoPlus has a 5 year warranty vs 3 years, and it is on sale for $80 direct from Samsung:

https://www.samsung.com/us/computing/memory-storage/solid-state-drives/ssd-970-evo-plus-nvme-m-2-500gb-mz-v7s500b-am/

Ultimately... your friend is asking you to build a system for him becuase he knows you'll build quality... and in all my shopping over the last few days, my cheapest cheep-cheep build was at most $120 less than my best choice build. I think that alone speaks volumes.

mnem
As always... take all these suggestions with a grain of salt big enuf to pickle a dwagon... YMMV, DQMOT, DILLIGAF, WTFBBQ...?

[cyclin_al]

Bloody PC market is a complete shit show at the moment. I've been asked to build a PC for someone. Needs to be fairly basic "office and media playback" but silent and will run a 4k monitor. Figured if I bought an AMD CPU with integrated GPU that'd do the job but fuck that, no they are completely unobtainium. So looked for external GPUs and nope, they don't exist at the moment at all. Soooo looks like I'm going to have to build an Intel Comet Lake i5-10600 because it has a GPU on it which will drive the screen. Might as well just buy the poor fucker a NUC. Feeling dirty! 

Welcome to my world. After almost 3 days scouring the intardnet and local vendors for something used but not utter crap at a sane price... just spent almost a grand on the boy's new entry-level Ryzen5-3600/16GB Ballistix DDR4-3600/Aorus EliteWiFi/Evo970 500GB gaming rig build.

I'm kicking down my old tempered-glass case, a 850W Corsair PSU and my old RTX 580 GPU; and haven't even begun shopping monitors/HID.

mnem
*grinding my testicles into a fine paste again...*

Similar situation here.  Patiently waiting for the last couple of parts to finish a build for SWMBO.   Only need CPU and GPU to finish it off.  If I can find a reasonably priced Ryzen 3700X (ie. $400 CAD), then I will add in a temporary GPU.  I figure the temporary GPU will be the best possible GPU for an old Acer Aspire AM3450 (BIOS is not upgradable, similar vintage to what Brumby currently has).  That way, when I later get a good GPU for SWMBO, then I can re-use the temporary GPU to upgrade my old AM3450 home office machine.

EDIT:   Looking for a monitor too, but no rush on this one.

[mnementh]

BALLISTIX RAM, not BALLSTIX, ya silly ol' dwagon. 

mnem
maybe my aching nutsack is trying to tell me something...

[SilverSolder]

I'm still on the same tank of petrol that I filled in Feb. 2020! but the battery seems to be holding up.

McBryce.

I wouldn't be too proud of that. Gasoline after several months starts to break down. It will form varnish and deposits in the fuel pump, fuel filter, and those expensive fuel injectors. Gas powered lawn equipment that's going to sit idle for 6 months over Winter has the remaining fuel in the tank treated with a product called "Stabil" or an alternative is run it until it's out of fuel. I'm sure there's a similar product across the pond. I suggest treating the remaining gas in your tank as soon as you can. And then fill up with fresh gas and treat that too.

That's why I "take it for a walk", to make sure the entire system is getting mixed and flushed often enough. As for hygroscopic, there shouldn't be any water other than the air moisture in the tank and the petrol I use has only 5% bio-ethanol in it. A lawnmower is a different story, metal tank with no proper sealing and open filter. I've been driving vintage cars for many many years, so I know what's required. I'd be more worried about the engine oil going bad and causing problems than the petrol.

McBryce.

As far as engine oil change my schedule is every 6000 miles or one year...whichever occurs first. Last year the Civic was driven only 2000 miles so after a year was up the oil was changed. And....synthetic oil only.

*raises a paw*

A fellow Stabil/Store it-Start it true believer right here. I have one of those little Horror Fraught 1.2 KW generators bought for a pittance on Sidewalk Sale over a decade ago; I keep it in the original carton/packing on/under the shelves in the garage. My post-run checklist involves making sure the fuel in the tank has an appropriate treatment of stabilizer and then running the carb dry; something I try to do every 6 months or so.

When I moved to Houston, I knew I'd just done this... so quite confidently just packed the box away with my other stuff in the new garage... but I buried it so deep it was more than a year before I actually unearthed it again. When I did, I dreaded what I would find; to my horror, the date scribbled on the tank in Sharpie was 23 months prior.  Turns out "had just done it" was more like "did it 8-9 months before we moved".

Opened the fuel tank and looked inside with a flashlight; no evidence of water condensed at the bottom, and it didn't smell like old gasoline... just the same dull gasoline smell treated gas always has.

So I took a chance and opened the petcock, primed it and pulled... it snorted on the first pull and started on the second, ran like the ~100 hour machine it was; evidently completely unaware of its 2 years' slumber. Once it cooled off, I filled the tank to the top and added a full-tank dose of Stabil, then turned the petcock off and ran it dry again. If I'm really lucky, I'll get to see it out of the trailer before we hit the 2 year mark AGAIN.

I know of similar amazeballs from dozens of people with their boat motors, and of course from grand-dad who was a true believer with seasonally-used machines like the big diesel tractor (Miss Allis) and the combine.

Also a true believer in full-synthetic oil...tho my personal preference, after seeing how dirty it gets doing a zillion oil changes in the dealership, is every 5K rather than the 6K or even 10K now recommended by the manufacturers. If it is dark but you can still see light through it while it is draining... That is when I feel it is a good time-frame. Also, every 1K for the first 3 changes to get rid of all the break-in detritus before it can do damage. This is part of my formula for a quarter million miles plus on every car I've owned for the last 3 decades.


mnem
"corn-TACT!!!" ~grand-dad sed it long before uncle Bumblefuck...

Another true believer here.   I have a stack of gas/petrol powered garden equipment.  Some of it gets used only very rarely (e.g. chain saw, really only when a tree or branch comes down).  I add the stablizer (Sta-Bil 360 Marine) to the fuel in the 5 gallon jerry can, before making some of it into 2-stroke fuel.

The fuel in the chain saw is now approaching 5 years old - still looks and smells good, and the saw still starts on the first try every time!   I never have a single fuel or carb related problem with any of the other equipment either (granted, their fuel gets max 1 year old as they see more use).

Meanwhile, our neighbour just had to send both his snowblower and his generator in for service due to gummed up carbs / old fuel...   the cost of adding the stabilizer is nearly zero (just a few ml per gallon),  and compared to having to deal with gummed up fuel systems...   it is really a no-brainer overall to just put this stuff in religiously.

[SilverSolder]

[...]
Also a true believer in full-synthetic oil...tho my personal preference, after seeing how dirty it gets doing a zillion oil changes in the dealership, is every 5K rather than the 6K or even 10K now recommended by the manufacturers. If it is dark but you can still see light through it while it is draining... That is when I feel it is a good time-frame. Also, every 1K for the first 3 changes to get rid of all the break-in detritus before it can do damage. This is part of my formula for a quarter million miles plus on every car I've owned for the last 3 decades.

mnem
"corn-TACT!!!" ~grand-dad sed it long before uncle Bumblefuck...

There's an interesting 'side benefit' with a hybrid drivetrain:   Because the engine runs less, the oil definitely lasts a lot more miles.  Another factor is using alcohol in the fuel - if I have been using E30, the oil still looks very clean when it comes out,  slightly darker if running on E10.   I'm sure E85 cars can look very clean (my engine balks at anything more than E30) after quite a few more miles than regular gasoline could do.

So, I don't feel bad about 10K oil changes on the hybrid (it has nearly 220K miles on it and still runs sweet) but for a non hybrid running regular E10, I would agree with your observation of ~5K miles being about right, in the real world.

[bd139]

Can someone sanity check this for me. I am half asleep today.

Two things coming from Amazon: Case is Fractal Meshify C Mini, keyboard is cheap logitech wireless set. Already has an HDMI equipped monitor to plug this into. Dude is moving off a laptop.   Have I forgotten any bits? This needs to get a mid-range GPU in it when they are available, possibly double the RAM and upgrade to an i7 down the line if he needs it.

If there's any chance of it going RTX30x0 or similar Ampere-family Quadro-equivalent GPU in the futire, you need at least a 850W PSU, preferably closer to 1KW, and from a reputable brand so you know you're actually getting that capacity. Obvi, Platinum-rated will be a necessity as well for that kind of current draw.

I personally wouldn't touch that MSI board with a 10-foot pole, and we don't hardly ever grow that tall. While most of the horror stories I've heard with them recently have been AMD builds, my own personal build history with them has been atrocious. Too fucking many cut corners; they are almost as bad as AsRock. Just look at their puny-ass VRM designs and you'll shit yourself.

Also, look at the WiFi versions... recently, for some reason, they have been cheaper than the non-WiFi variants... and often include BT4.xx as a bonus. That may be why; BT 5.xx is just around the corner. I would suggest a Asus PRIME or TUF GAMING family board for a value build.

Also, look into Crucial BALLISTIX for your RAM. Typically $5-10 more speed for speed, but usually also CAS16 vs CAS18 rated for the Corsair Vengeance. And they are a Micron brand, so you know you're getting good chips from the source, not factory floor sweepings.

Good choice on the 970Evo, but the 970EvoPlus has a 5 year warranty vs 3 years, and it is on sale for $80 direct from Samsung:

https://www.samsung.com/us/computing/memory-storage/solid-state-drives/ssd-970-evo-plus-nvme-m-2-500gb-mz-v7s500b-am/

Ultimately... your friend is asking you to build a system for him becuase he knows you'll build quality... and in all my shopping over the last few days, my cheapest cheep-cheep build was at most $120 less than my best choice build. I think that alone speaks volumes.

mnem
As always... take all these suggestions with a grain of salt big enuf to pickle a dwagon... YMMV, DQMOT, DILLIGAF, WTFBBQ...?

Thanks for the heads up on that. I've done two ASRock builds and an MSI one recently and they have quite frankly scared the shit out of me a bit. I'll head in the Asus direction.

I've already switched the RAM out for basic Crucial stuff. I used that for a very long time historically. Doesn't need the stupid heat spreader stuff.

I did pick Evo Plus. Decent drive. Have owned a couple

This guy has a lot of money to spend. I'm talking him down to his requirements so I don't have to warranty it myself so will adjust accordingly for quality

[Saskia]

actually I don't have too many problems with my Asrock and MSI boards, they work just fine.
As are my Asus Prime boards.

[SilverSolder]

[...]

Thanks for the heads up on that. I've done two ASRock builds and an MSI one recently and they have quite frankly scared the shit out of me a bit. I'll head in the Asus direction.

I've already switched the RAM out for basic Crucial stuff. I used that for a very long time historically. Doesn't need the stupid heat spreader stuff.

I did pick Evo Plus. Decent drive. Have owned a couple

This guy has a lot of money to spend. I'm talking him down to his requirements so I don't have to warranty it myself so will adjust accordingly for quality

I have had a couple of "heeeelp I need a computer" requests recently,  I ended up buying fully working PCs because it was just too hard to get any decent parts. 

The market hates a vacuum, though, so I'm sure this situation can only be temporary...

[bd139]

actually I don't have too many problems with my Asrock and MSI boards, they work just fine.
As are my Asus Prime boards.

I had a couple of problems here. The ASRock B450M didn't boot the first time and had crap memory slots. The ASRock B550M needs a BIOS update before you can stick the latest CPU in it which was a PITA. The MSI B550M spewed out green crap all over the screen on 4k with a 3400G in it. Fortunately that went away with a BIOS update!

Edit: to be fair those are AMD class issues. I imagine the Intel stuff running a 65W CPU isn't going to give much of a crap about VRMs and the GPU will have a separate power supply.

[cyclin_al]

actually I don't have too many problems with my Asrock and MSI boards, they work just fine.
As are my Asus Prime boards.

I had a couple of problems here. The ASRock B450M didn't boot the first time and had crap memory slots. The ASRock B550M needs a BIOS update before you can stick the latest CPU in it which was a PITA. The MSI B550M spewed out green crap all over the screen on 4k with a 3400G in it. Fortunately that went away with a BIOS update!

Edit: to be fair those are AMD class issues. I imagine the Intel stuff running a 65W CPU isn't going to give much of a crap about VRMs and the GPU will have a separate power supply.

I have done a couple of recent ASRock builds, with another paused in-work.  No problems so far, but these are the latest generation of chipset and also no long-term experience yet.  The ASRock B550M Pro4 and ASRock B550 Pro4 had no issues so long at the 2 sticks of RAM were in the correct slots (opposite what the manual indicated).

EDIT:  The family have some old computers still in use, so I can vouch that some ASUS MBs are 15+ years old and still running fine.  The only MB that failed here was a Gibatype B350.

[mnementh]

Well, the real problem here is multi-fold and global in nature; it is partly electronics manufacturing cycle, and partly a perfect storm of socioeconomic upheaval as a result of the corporate buyout of the government of the largest consumer economy in the history of ever compounded by a global pandemic.

We are right now on the cusp of a generational advance in all consumer-grade computer hardware... the kind that happens once a decade or two.

Normally this would result in old-gen hardware being flushed at substantial discount to make room for the new; however the silicon shortage that was a byproduct of the pandemic has given purveyors of the second-string crap an opportunity to try and get real money out of the old shit, and the recent devolution into utter despotism embodied by the current top-down mismanagement of the entire international economy for the benefit of the few has made it possible to do this with pretty much zero repercussion, so don't expect the situation to improve greatly any time soon.

It's all shit. Pick a flavor and dig in.

mnem
*back to the build*

[Zucca]

Ups I did it again, chinesium won against me.

0603 SMD containers....



a little vibrations and the smd inside jump out. The horrible plastic door on the top has so much clearance that an elephant foot could pass through.

Any ideas how to save my ass? Imagine those containers inside a box upside down on a ship over the ocean to USA (my incoming relocation...)

[bd139]

Well, the real problem here is multi-fold and global in nature; it is partly electronics manufacturing cycle, and partly a perfect storm of socioeconomic upheaval as a result of the corporate buyout of the government of the largest consumer economy in the history of ever compounded by a global pandemic.

We are right now on the cusp of a generational advance in all consumer-grade computer hardware... the kind that happens once a decade or two.

Normally this would result in old-gen hardware being flushed at substantial discount to make room for the new; however the silicon shortage that was a byproduct of the pandemic has given purveyors of the second-string crap an opportunity to try and get real money out of the old shit, and the recent devolution into utter despotism embodied by the current top-down mismanagement of the entire international economy for the benefit of the few has made it possible to do this with pretty much zero repercussion, so don't expect the situation to improve greatly any time soon.

It's all shit. Pick a flavor and dig in.

mnem
*back to the build*

Completely agree with this. It’s all shit so I’ve decided not to play and told him to bugger off for 6 months and see what the situation is then.

Easier solution for me as well.

Edit: the killer was reading about some complaints about 60Hz 4K support from U630 graphics. 

[cyclin_al]

I have been looking for a counter and I have been looking for my first item with nixxie tubes for quite some time.

What do you think is a fair price for a working HP 5326B with option 01 (system volt meter)?
Photo was provided with all tubes illuminated (but not a series of photos showing all digits for each tube).

Looks to be in good shape externally.
Seller is asking $130 CAD.
Seller is semi-local (about 2 hours drive one way).

[cyclin_al]

Ups I did it again, chinesium won against me.

0603 SMD containers....



a little vibrations and the smd inside jump out. The horrible plastic door on the top has so much clearance that an elephant foot could pass through.

Any ideas how to save my ass? Imagine those containers inside a box upside down on a ship over the ocean to USA (my incoming relocation...)

A couple of ideas to experiment with.  Not sure if they would work or not without trying it.

Wrap the whole kit in cellophane (the clingy plastic) wrap.  That would be quick and easy, so long as it succeeds at sealing off each box from the others.

How about opening up a row of the boxes, add a thin strip of rubber or stretchy material to fill the gap (cover the lid opening), then re-close the box lids on top of the strip?

[TSCOLAN]

HP 5326B with option 01 (system volt meter)?

If i'm not mistaking, the A version does not have the voltmeter, the B does. And option 1 is the 8th digit.

At this price i'll buy it !

Thomas

[25 CPS]

I have been looking for a counter and I have been looking for my first item with nixxie tubes for quite some time.

What do you think is a fair price for a working HP 5326B with option 01 (system volt meter)?
Photo was provided with all tubes illuminated (but not a series of photos showing all digits for each tube).
(Attachment Link)
Looks to be in good shape externally.
Seller is asking $130 CAD.
Seller is semi-local (about 2 hours drive one way).

At first glance it looks good and $130 sounds reasonable.  Do you have a small function or signal generator you can take along to test it with?  $130 for that counter and a good long get out of the house, change of scenery drive sounds good especially now that the days are getting a bit longer.

[Zucca]

Wrap the whole kit in cellophane (the clingy plastic) wrap.

It seems the best solution, not the whole thing but all the containers separated as single elements.

Long term solutions:

1) Design a 3D printed door (I do not care if it is not transparent)
2) Buy not a cheap ass chinesium SMD container.

[McBryce]

Bloody PC market is a complete shit show at the moment. I've been asked to build a PC for someone. Needs to be fairly basic "office and media playback" but silent and will run a 4k monitor. Figured if I bought an AMD CPU with integrated GPU that'd do the job but fuck that, no they are completely unobtainium. So looked for external GPUs and nope, they don't exist at the moment at all. Soooo looks like I'm going to have to build an Intel Comet Lake i5-10600 because it has a GPU on it which will drive the screen. Might as well just buy the poor fucker a NUC. Feeling dirty! 

Is that a "Brexit thing"? I'm looking at building a PC at the moment and anything I've looked at so far has been available and in stock.

McBryce.

[bd139]

I bet you can’t get a graphics card that isn’t rubbish or a Ryzen 3400G at the moment. The discrete graphics market is borked globally.

[Saskia]

https://www.amazon.de/dp/B087GX6J5T/?smid=A2HQGEFTWZP6VV&tag=idealode-mp-pk-21&linkCode=asn&creative=6742&camp=1638&creativeASIN=B087GX6J5T&ascsubtag=uD7exq1eKkiprw7JrTsvng&th=1&psc=1

12 in stock, albeit at an absolutely insane premium.

Graphics cards are a different matter. You can get a reasonably priced 2060, or you can get scalped.

1660super for 760€ ? umm, no.
RX580 350 ? ummmm ....
3090 for over 3200 ?


What you could get is a Quadro. Decent size, enough RAM, comparable to 2070 for the equivalent of 850€.

[Zucca]

I wait to upgrade my PC until the earth starts to rotate in the right direction again

[mnementh]

Ups I did it again, chinesium won against me.

0603 SMD containers....   

a little vibrations and the smd inside jump out. The horrible plastic door on the top has so much clearance that an elephant foot could pass through. Any ideas how to save my ass? Imagine those containers inside a box upside down on a ship over the ocean to USA (my incoming relocation...)

Break the modules up into strips, then 2" wide masking tape across the top and the holes. Fold the end of each strip over so you have a pull-tap. Spend the money on 3M so you know you're getting decent tape that will release properly when it comes time to defuckerize the thing.

mnem
 

[mnementh]

https://www.amazon.de/dp/B087GX6J5T/?smid=A2HQGEFTWZP6VV&tag=idealode-mp-pk-21&linkCode=asn&creative=6742&camp=1638&creativeASIN=B087GX6J5T&ascsubtag=uD7exq1eKkiprw7JrTsvng&th=1&psc=1

12 in stock, albeit at an absolutely insane premium.

Graphics cards are a different matter. You can get a reasonably priced 2060, or you can get scalped.

1660super for 760€ ? umm, no.
RX580 350 ? ummmm ....
3090 for over 3200 ?

What you could get is a Quadro. Decent size, enough RAM, comparable to 2070 for the equivalent of 850€.

RX580/RX590 are still a helluva card and will do 4K/30FPS all day long in gaming at ultra everything; not sure in cinema mode. I'd look into them as they are seriously undervalued GPUs right now. Remember too you can get a big increase in performance dropping down to 10-bit 4:2:2 or 8-bit 4:4:4. Certainly not cutting edge, but great bang/buck for an interim card. That's why I'm passing mine on to my son.

mnem
*toddles off to look for some long heat-shrink tubing*

[ch_scr]

I bet you can’t get a graphics card that isn’t rubbish or a Ryzen 3400G at the moment. The discrete graphics market is borked globally.

Why a Ryzen 3000G? Ryzen 4350G is ~150€ and in stock, 4650G is also in stock for a while. Only Top-shelf 4750G is hard to come by...