Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mansaxel]

34401A or bust 

So far bust 

I've said it before, Stewart of Reading have 34401As from £330 to £390 including VAT. A lot cheaper than the ones on ebay.

Code: [Select]

[bd139]Where's the Ferengi Fun in that?[/bd139]

[Ice-Tea]

34401A or bust 

So far bust 

I've said it before, Stewart of Reading have 34401As from £330 to £390 including VAT. A lot cheaper than the ones on ebay.

Not necessarily the best place to buy such an item. They have virtually no warranty and you don’t get to pick and choose. There are good and bad 34401’s and you can’t see what you’re getting. On eBay you can usually get the seller to pull the HW Rev off it and can check the serial against keysight’s service database. That can save you the £150+VAT for the display module replacement. Then there’s the HP/Agilent/Keysight design changes over the series so a later one is probably better now.

Plus I’m going to have to plug £100 on cal straight up.

I’m budgeting £250-280 which is doable if you have the eBay setup I do and are patient 

**raises Ferrengi hand**

Sir? A moment of your time?

[mansaxel]

As a follow-up to the precision power supply discussion, here's a parts-only 6114 that probably suffers more from PEBKAC than anything else: eBay auction: #124610112658

As usual, NAWTS.

[mansaxel]

Finally managed to install https://wiki.partkeepr.org/wiki/Main_Page PartKeepr, the most famous Mannheim inventory software, on my Ubuntu 20.04 machine, works like a charm.
Now filling it up with all the stuff I have is a real    thing.

  Cheers,
  Dc1MC

While the idea of Partkeepr is  the implementation is 10x -- the requirements list reads like the 7th circle of luser FLOSS projects hell:

PHP is installed and activated on your webserver
PHP is at least version 5.3.0 and has the function json_encode
Some PHP settings: safe_mode is OFF, allow_url_fopen is ON, curl_init is available, the finfo-extension is installed
DoctrineORM is installed and at least version 2.1.0
Specific directories are writable by the webserver

I took one look at that list and decided that I rather buy 100 extra 10MΩ resistors one or two times without realising I already got them than operate such software.

[DC1MC]

Finally managed to install https://wiki.partkeepr.org/wiki/Main_Page PartKeepr, the most famous Mannheim inventory software, on my Ubuntu 20.04 machine, works like a charm.
Now filling it up with all the stuff I have is a real    thing.

  Cheers,
  Dc1MC

While the idea of Partkeepr is  the implementation is 10x -- the requirements list reads like the 7th circle of luser FLOSS projects hell:

PHP is installed and activated on your webserver
PHP is at least version 5.3.0 and has the function json_encode
Some PHP settings: safe_mode is OFF, allow_url_fopen is ON, curl_init is available, the finfo-extension is installed
DoctrineORM is installed and at least version 2.1.0
Specific directories are writable by the webserver

I took one look at that list and decided that I rather buy 100 extra 10MΩ resistors one or two times without realising I already got them than operate such software.

Well, if it's good enough for the guys at CERN, it's good enough for me as well, the installation instructions for current Linux distributions are pretty "copy&paste"-y here:
https://readthedocs.web.cern.ch/display/PARTK/Install+PartKeepr+on

also Installing != Operating, the operation is very simple and, at least to me, pretty obvious, have a look at the demo site:
https://demo.partkeepr.org/

and now I'll install Kicad to Pk add-on:
https://wiki.partkeepr.org/wiki/PartKeepr_Community_Tools

 Cheers,
 DC1MC

[DC1MC]

Using the collective wisdom of this group, does anybody knows of a DE/EU reseller, or similar product, of MePads and MeSquares  from QRPme http://www.qrpme.com/?p=product&id=MESB ?

I wish to support them, but the shipping is increasing exponentially  and this is not the worst part, I have foreign letters and package form outside EU that reached Germany in 5 days, but are blocked in customs for more than three weeks 

 Thanks,
 DC1MC
 

[med6753]

Finally managed to install https://wiki.partkeepr.org/wiki/Main_Page PartKeepr, the most famous Mannheim inventory software, on my Ubuntu 20.04 machine, works like a charm.
Now filling it up with all the stuff I have is a real    thing.

  Cheers,
  Dc1MC

While the idea of Partkeepr is  the implementation is 10x -- the requirements list reads like the 7th circle of luser FLOSS projects hell:

PHP is installed and activated on your webserver
PHP is at least version 5.3.0 and has the function json_encode
Some PHP settings: safe_mode is OFF, allow_url_fopen is ON, curl_init is available, the finfo-extension is installed
DoctrineORM is installed and at least version 2.1.0
Specific directories are writable by the webserver

I took one look at that list and decided that I rather buy 100 extra 10MΩ resistors one or two times without realising I already got them than operate such software.

Ditto. My "coffee can" inventory system works a lot better than that hot mess. 

[SilverSolder]

Using the collective wisdom of this group, does anybody knows of a DE/EU reseller, or similar product, of MePads and MeSquares  from QRPme http://www.qrpme.com/?p=product&id=MESB ?

I wish to support them, but the shipping is increasing exponentially  and this is not the worst part, I have foreign letters and package form outside EU that reached Germany in 5 days, but are blocked in customs for more than three weeks 

 Thanks,
 DC1MC

How does the political system work in Germany, can you write to your local representative and complain about slow customs processing damaging your business and Germany's economy, that kind of thing?  (Just thinking in general, sorry don't have any specific advice for the particular parts!)

[DC1MC]

Using the collective wisdom of this group, does anybody knows of a DE/EU reseller, or similar product, of MePads and MeSquares  from QRPme http://www.qrpme.com/?p=product&id=MESB ?

I wish to support them, but the shipping is increasing exponentially  and this is not the worst part, I have foreign letters and package form outside EU that reached Germany in 5 days, but are blocked in customs for more than three weeks 

 Thanks,
 DC1MC

How does the political system work in Germany, can you write to your local representative and complain about slow customs processing damaging your business and Germany's economy, that kind of thing?  (Just thinking in general, sorry don't have any specific advice for the particular parts!)

I can, for now there is "one size fits all" answer: Pandemie, and that's it. Previously the time was one week, maximum 10 days around Year End/Christmas/Easter, but now is completely crazy, I'd rather pay more but get the thing faster.

[Mr. Scram]

Ditto. My "coffee can" inventory system works a lot better than that hot mess. 

The problem with inventory systems is that you need to use them fairly religiously to be useful. If I'm going to religiously work a system, I could easily have some nice physical bins and categories without the need for electronic logging. We've seen Dave go through fairly nicely organised hoards. These electronic systems mostly seem to make sense in the case of multiple users and warehouse sized collections. Some may have workflows that better suit the system than I do, though.

[Kosmic]

Canada? Germany? Any sign of the 3456A C5 adapter board yet? It's been a week. Perhaps I'm asking too much of the various postal services. 

Yes, I received your letter yesterday. Thanks again! 

[Cerebus]

......snip


Left to right: Some more measurement after ca. 2h uptime, The two pictures to the left are showing the complete plot so far. The overshoot can be seen very nicely and it seems it want to settle somewhere around 9.997200V (actually it shows 9.997238V). There are also some spikes downwards, no idea actually where they are coming from. Will observe this further. The two pictures to the right are showing the details of these spikes. There are also some spikes upwards. My guess is: they are caused when the heater of the oven gets switched on. will check this as well.

Very nice! I've used those supplies in the past at work but don't own any. Now considering how minutely small those spikes are does it really matter? I don't think even the most sensitive equipment is going to even notice it.

The spike's value is probably the average over the measurement interval. Hence it might be 0V for 0.01% of the time, or whatever.

A good exercise and clean of the switch contacts and probably the cal trimpots might well help.

Quick update:
It is running now since yesterday and it drifts continuously upwards.

If that PSU hasn't been used for some longish time then that might be retrace drift on the voltage reference. i.e. It's [partially] forgotten that it's nicely aged, and is catching back up on all the ageing it did previously, but over a much shorter period of time - hours or days rather than years. Quite common with ovened references, both voltage and frequency, that have sat at room temperature for a long time.

[Cerebus]

[...]
But at the end of the day, none of my meters will even register that drift 

Well, certainly time for a new meter then? 

I’m working on it. eBay is not being helpful enough in that department at the moment 

There you go the seller is even a good bloke too  eBay auction: #143967147933

Yeah, but first check that your front door is big enough to get the box through. 

[BU508A]

34401A or bust 

So far bust 

We have here in the TEA house another very nice bloke which is currently offering two 34401A:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/143902320920



https://www.ebay.com/itm/143861464540


 

[BU508A]

If that PSU hasn't been used for some longish time then that might be retrace drift on the voltage reference. i.e. It's [partially] forgotten that it's nicely aged, and is catching back up on all the ageing it did previously, but over a much shorter period of time - hours or days rather than years. Quite common with ovened references, both voltage and frequency, that have sat at room temperature for a long time.

Yes, I've thought of that, too. Wondering, if it will hit the 9.998V and will stay then there. 270µV to go, looks doable. 

[Specmaster]

As a follow-up to the precision power supply discussion, here's a parts-only 6114 that probably suffers more from PEBKAC than anything else: eBay auction: #124610112658

As usual, NAWTS.

Excuse my ignorance here, but does NAWTS stand for?

[BU508A]

As a follow-up to the precision power supply discussion, here's a parts-only 6114 that probably suffers more from PEBKAC than anything else: eBay auction: #124610112658

As usual, NAWTS.

Excuse my ignorance here, but does NAWTS stand for?

No Affiliations With The Seller

[bd139]

34401A or bust 

So far bust 

We have here in the TEA house another very nice bloke which is currently offering two 34401A:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/143902320920



https://www.ebay.com/itm/143861464540


 

Thanks but too expensive. I’m not after making someone else some profit (sorry Ice_Tea  )

[Ice-Tea]

34401A or bust 

So far bust 

We have here in the TEA house another very nice bloke which is currently offering two 34401A:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/143902320920



https://www.ebay.com/itm/143861464540


 

Thanks but too expensive. I’m not after making someone else some profit (sorry Ice_Tea  )

Don't worry about it. I'll just find another naive idio... er, esteemed customer for it 

Seriously, though, there wouldn't be eBay charges and I'd obviously be happy to make an additional effort. I actually dont have to charge VAT either but you'd probably be charged local VAT by The Queens Men.

Might not be as sterrible as you imagine. If you wanna see where we might land: let me know.

[med6753]

Canada? Germany? Any sign of the 3456A C5 adapter board yet? It's been a week. Perhaps I'm asking too much of the various postal services. 

Yes, I received your letter yesterday. Thanks again! 

Excellent! The smuggling of parts across borders without the gov knowing worked.  Now let's see if same happens to Germany. 

[bd139]

34401A or bust 

So far bust 

We have here in the TEA house another very nice bloke which is currently offering two 34401A:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/143902320920



https://www.ebay.com/itm/143861464540


 

Thanks but too expensive. I’m not after making someone else some profit (sorry Ice_Tea  )

Don't worry about it. I'll just find another naive idio... er, esteemed customer for it 

Seriously, though, there wouldn't be eBay charges and I'd obviously be happy to make an additional effort. I actually dont have to charge VAT either but you'd probably be charged local VAT by The Queens Men.

Might not be as sterrible as you imagine. If you wanna see where we might land: let me know.

Yes unfortunately I’d get buggered for VAT and duty on that, plus some charges by the courier for handling the buggering  . Not got an appetite for any international purchases due to that at the moment hence the UK gear arriving on and off at the moment. 

[URI]

Corona-times.. home-office..

Need my car for a trip next monday. Didn't move it for ~6 months. Battery measured ~1,7V.   
[I really need to disconnect the battery when leaving the car unused for longer periods of time..]

What could I do?
Two-point strategy:
1. trying to reanimate the dead battery (takes the whole weekend).
2. buying a spare battery to be sure the car can be moved.. (buying a car battery on a Saturday in covid times is pricey, don't ask...)

2. was done quickly at a local shop.   

1. is still in progress but seems to bring back the battery (52Ah):
First try: Special car battery charger with 14.6V but practically no current draw.   
Second try: HP 6643A at 35V, 5A, CC mode: Battery started at ~26V, went down and settled at ~11.9V after 4h.
After the voltage had dropped to under 12V I noticed that the HP6643A put out loads of heat.
So I switched to my HP 6632B at 14.4V, 4A, CC mode to charge the battery from that ~11.9V to 14.3V at 0.7A now after roughly 11h.
Seems to have lost some capacity (charging isn't lossless..), put in ~55Ah.

Will test tomorrow by putting it back into the car and check voltage while starting the motor etc. Curious..   

For measuring the battery's voltage I used one of my 34401 DMMs at 6 1/2 digit resolution.      

[SilverSolder]

Corona-times.. home-office..

Need my car for a trip next monday. Didn't move it for ~6 months. Battery measured ~1,7V.   
[I really need to disconnect the battery when leaving the car unused for longer periods of time..]

What could I do?
Two-point strategy:
1. trying to reanimate the dead battery (takes the whole weekend).
2. buying a spare battery to be sure the car can be moved.. (buying a car battery on a Saturday in covid times is pricey, don't ask...)

2. was done quickly at a local shop.   

1. is still in progress but seems to bring back the battery (52Ah):
First try: Special car battery charger with 14.6V but practically no current draw.   
Second try: HP 6643A at 35V, 5A, CC mode: Battery started at ~26V, went down and settled at ~11.9V after 4h.
After the voltage had dropped to under 12V I noticed that the HP6643A put out loads of heat.
So I switched to my HP 6632B at 14.4V, 4A, CC mode to charge the battery from that ~11.9V to 14.3V at 0.7A now after roughly 11h.
Seems to have lost some capacity (charging isn't lossless..), put in ~55Ah.

Will test tomorrow by putting it back into the car and check voltage while starting the motor etc. Curious..   

For measuring the battery's voltage I used one of my 34401 DMMs at 6 1/2 digit resolution.      

The battery will probably have been sulfated, but it can be brought back to life again (pretty much like you did) by "forcing the issue" with the coating on the lead plates.

It will never be quite as good as it was pre-sulfation, but it can definitely be "good enough for Australia" for several more years, in my experience.

It depends how long it was standing around in a brutally discharged condition...

[tautech]

Discord ! 

[URI]

Corona-times.. home-office..

Need my car for a trip next monday. Didn't move it for ~6 months. Battery measured ~1,7V.   
[I really need to disconnect the battery when leaving the car unused for longer periods of time..]

What could I do?
Two-point strategy:
1. trying to reanimate the dead battery (takes the whole weekend).
2. buying a spare battery to be sure the car can be moved.. (buying a car battery on a Saturday in covid times is pricey, don't ask...)

2. was done quickly at a local shop.   

1. is still in progress but seems to bring back the battery (52Ah):
First try: Special car battery charger with 14.6V but practically no current draw.   
Second try: HP 6643A at 35V, 5A, CC mode: Battery started at ~26V, went down and settled at ~11.9V after 4h.
After the voltage had dropped to under 12V I noticed that the HP6643A put out loads of heat.
So I switched to my HP 6632B at 14.4V, 4A, CC mode to charge the battery from that ~11.9V to 14.3V at 0.7A now after roughly 11h.
Seems to have lost some capacity (charging isn't lossless..), put in ~55Ah.

Will test tomorrow by putting it back into the car and check voltage while starting the motor etc. Curious..   

For measuring the battery's voltage I used one of my 34401 DMMs at 6 1/2 digit resolution.      

The battery will probably have been sulfated, but it can be brought back to life again (pretty much like you did) by "forcing the issue" with the coating on the lead plates.

It will never be quite as good as it was pre-sulfation, but it can definitely be "good enough for Australia" for several more years, in my experience.

It depends how long it was standing around in a brutally discharged condition...

Yes, I'm sure it has been sulfated.
I'm really not sure how dead it is still after that forced reanimation, I think it has been down at 1,7V for >1 month. Normally my battery starts getting too weak to start the car after 2-3 months without any charge.
I just forgot about it.