Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

   Jump to 34 seconds, I guess. 

There you go... gotta strip out the time modifier for SMF.

mnem

[Cubdriver]

It's here, right on time. Gotta love UPS. 

I'd take pictures of a teardown but not sure how to get the cover off. I need to download a manual. True to hp form there's no feet nor a bottom bail. No handles either. Sure bet it was rack mounted. The no feet can be fixed easily but they won't be genuine hp.

And I have to agree with the group. Not liking all input terminals red. But I'm going to leave it. But all those stickers are going bye-bye. 

It's going to be stacked above the Fluke 8505A which in turn is stacked on the Tek Type 535A. That's pushing it as far as total weight is concerned even though the 535A chassis is built like a brick shit house. I'm going to build up supporting frame to take the weight off the 535A.

The 8505A and 3456A are going to have a 12 - 24 hour face off connected to the same source and see whether they agree or differ. I'll post the results.

Mike -

Loosen the screw (likely Pozidriv) in the center of the back edge of the top panel (it /should/ be captive) and the panel can be slid back a bit then lifted off.  If there are bumpers on the back corners, they'll need to come off too.

-Pat

[med6753]

BU058A.....can you explain in simple terms how to get the 3456A into 6.5 digit mode? Right now it's in 5.5 mode. I started reading the manual and so far it is very confusing. 

[bd139]

BU058A.....can you explain in simple terms how to get the 3456A into 6.5 digit mode? Right now it's in 5.5 mode. I started reading the manual and so far it is very confusing. 

[6] [STO] [9]

From memory, which may be faulty. I haven’t used one for 25 years 

[AVGresponding]

I ran this search string or a combination of it in the dim dark parts (also BAMA) of the web and no results other than Bogus manual sites. "Fluke (91, 92, 96, 105, 99)" . Just tried Artek too and only the older models I already have.

Series II ?
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/fluke-105-scopemeter-series-ii-repair/

Mine is the B, not sure but the series II seems to have been more pitched at the Auto industry? I have trawled EEVBlog and read the threads.

OK, 105B yeah you wrote that earlier. 
Found the Fluke 123 service manual....might be similar.
https://www.icsgroup.ru/upload/iblock/376/123_____smeng0300.pdf

I had the same problem with my PM99B Series II, which is very similar internally to the 105. The 123 is a complete redesign afaik.

Although the readily available service manual for the 93-97 doesn't show everything you need, it does give you enough information to figure out what you're looking at for some sections; it pointed me at the right area to look at for my power fault.

BU058A.....can you explain in simple terms how to get the 3456A into 6.5 digit mode? Right now it's in 5.5 mode. I started reading the manual and so far it is very confusing. 

MATH, 9 ?

[med6753]

BU058A.....can you explain in simple terms how to get the 3456A into 6.5 digit mode? Right now it's in 5.5 mode. I started reading the manual and so far it is very confusing. 

[6] [STO] [9]

From memory, which may be faulty. I haven’t used one for 25 years 

You're a genius, got it!   

[Kosmic]

UX is not necessarily the best on the 3456a. Too many functions not enough front panel real estate. The 3455a had a dedicated button for high resolution. each time I use the 3456a I can't remember how to flip it to 6.5digits. I think I'm going to put a sticker on it.

[Cubdriver]

BU058A.....can you explain in simple terms how to get the 3456A into 6.5 digit mode? Right now it's in 5.5 mode. I started reading the manual and so far it is very confusing. 

[6] [STO] [9]

From memory, which may be faulty. I haven’t used one for 25 years 

Yep, that works!

-Pat

[med6753]

They have only been on about an hour and so far looking damn good. 

[med6753]

UX is not necessarily the best on the 3456a. Too many functions not enough front panel real estate. The 3455a had a dedicated button for high resolution. each time I use the 3456a I can't remember how to flip it to 6.5digits. I think I'm going to put a sticker on it.

Doesn't it hold it upon power down or does it reset?

[Kosmic]

UX is not necessarily the best on the 3456a. Too many functions not enough front panel real estate. The 3455a had a dedicated button for high resolution. each time I use the 3456a I can't remember how to flip it to 6.5digits. I think I'm going to put a sticker on it.

Doesn't it hold it upon power down or does it reset?

Mine reset I think

[med6753]

Don’t forget to RIFA check it 

Psst...don't tell anybody but it will eventually get a full PSU re-cap. 

[Cubdriver]

UX is not necessarily the best on the 3456a. Too many functions not enough front panel real estate. The 3455a had a dedicated button for high resolution. each time I use the 3456a I can't remember how to flip it to 6.5digits. I think I'm going to put a sticker on it.

Doesn't it hold it upon power down or does it reset?

Mine just forgot when shut down, but it hasn't been on in ages so any backup battery may be pushing up grass by now.

-Pat

[bd139]

BU058A.....can you explain in simple terms how to get the 3456A into 6.5 digit mode? Right now it's in 5.5 mode. I started reading the manual and so far it is very confusing. 

[6] [STO] [9]

From memory, which may be faulty. I haven’t used one for 25 years 

You're a genius, got it!   

Woohoo my brain hasn’t melted yet 

[AVGresponding]

They have only been on about an hour and so far looking damn good. 

Bench meters from these guys and this era are such high quality design and construction I'd expect nothing less.

What does your 3065 say..?   

[Robert763]

How in the hell did these ever remain flying when they had Lucas electrics? 

I don't think they did use Lucas equipment!

Obviously, I wasn't around during the Battle of Britain, but looking at old copies of "The Aeroplane", & other publications of the period, I have the distinct impression that such stuff was made/designed by a different, specialist, manufacturer.
Lucas may have made some parts under contract, like many others did, however.

Joseph Lucas always struck me as having a hubris problem, & were sure they were the best, in the face of mounting evidence that they were not.

I think that is the only explanation as to why they didn't just buy some Bosch stuff & reverse engineer it to find out what that company did right, & Lucas did wrong.

The Solex & Zenith carburettors so beloved of Brit carmakers in the 50s are another example:-

The Stromberg single barrel downdrafts used by Holden were simple, rugged, & reliable, in fact, there was a thriving cottage industry in Oz, back in those days, rejetting Strombergs & fitting them to "Pommy" cars, to replace the fiddly, fussy OEM carbs.

Having worked on them (no, I'm not that old, restored ones) electrical equipment would be  Rotax, Lucas, BTH (British Thomson Houston) or CAV. Mostly made to Air Ministry specifications. I would not say Lucas aircraft parts were any worse than others. It's not well known that Lucas played a big part in early gast turbine (jet) engine designs. Not only did they do the fuel and control systems they did a lot of research on combustion chamber design. The early German engines had very short lives, often said to be due to a shortage of high temperature alloys for blades. In fact they had advanced air cooled blades because of this. Their weak point was the combustion chambers.

[URI]

They have only been on about an hour and so far looking damn good. 

Very nice! 

3456A also tend to be very stable calibration wise. 

Welcome to your next little step t'wards voltnuttery. 
A good reason to extend your collection of reference voltage sources and precision (reference) resistors..

But..
pros:
No backup battery that could leak.
cons:
3456As reset at power up.
But who would power a 3456A down anyway?     

[Ero-Shan]

There's another PM2421 on the german 'bay: https://www.ebay.de/itm/Philips-Digital-Multimeter-PM-2421-altes-Gerat/133651733259

Less than 16 hours to go and standing at less than 16 €.

I'd like to have those claws! 

[Robert763]

Good spot with the HP logo on the back. Frankenmeter. RUN!

I thought they sometimes did that at Keysight as part of certain factory services? Or is that only devices where a firmware upgrade changes the splash screen from HP to Agilent/Keysight etc...?

mnem
 

It’s possible but it’s likely it was bashed in and someone refurbed it. Either way it shouldn’t be missing the serial sticker off the back. That’s only ever intentionally removed.

The back looks a lot older than the front. There is quite a lot of dirt in the connectors and light corrosion on the shells. I'd never knowing buy a modern item with the serial number missing. 

[tautech]

They have only been on about an hour and so far looking damn good. 

Bench meters from these guys and this era are such high quality design and construction I'd expect nothing less.

What does your 3065 say..?   

Med has the SDM3055 and now we have a secret user cal process for them.....if you have a suitable reference. 

[cyclin_al]

I doubt the passengers would leave their seats as there are grab rails in front of them and standing on the top deck was strictly forbidden except for boarding and exiting the bus at all times. Standing was on allowed on the lower deck. As you saw in the video, it was still possible to stand and walk along the top deck even at that angle. Buses never travel fast enough for them to lean anywhere near that angle on bends or turns, whatever the conditions.

You obviously haven't been on a London bus recently, some of the yahoos driving them exhibit skills more appropriate to a dogem car at the fair than a "London transport, diesel engine, ninety-seven horsepower omnibus".

https://youtube.com/4UgBZfInBlU?t=34

With some streets in London, if that were true, they would be smashing into buildings and road signs etc, except that they don't because as I said, they never travel fast enough, nor capable of turning that quick (too many turns of the steering wheel, lock to lock) to be able to exert sufficient centrifugal force for them to lean enough. The only time I hear of buses striking a building etc it is the result of an accident where the bus has mounted the pavement and the bus gets damaged from top to bottom. Other than that they can and do at times get driven down roads with low bridges and overhanging trees when the top deck receives structural damage, but that is not as a result of the bus tilting, just the moron driving it getting lost or not looking out for trees 

We have those busses over here.  None here have tipped.  However, the traction seems to be not great enough to remain on the road surface.  They are well known for "departing the lane" in windy conditions and end up in the ditch.  That is not necessarily even in slippery conditions.  In winter conditions, testing also indicated that a double lane change (over & back) was an unsafe manoeuvre over 40 km/h.  Main arterial routes have a limit of 60 km/h and they also get used on one highway with a limit of 100 km/h...

[Specmaster]

They have only been on about an hour and so far looking damn good. 

Very nice! 

3456A also tend to be very stable calibration wise. 

Welcome to your next little step t'wards voltnuttery. 
A good reason to extend your collection of reference voltage sources and precision (reference) resistors..

But..
pros:
No backup battery that could leak.
cons:
3456As reset at power up.
But who would power a 3456A down anyway?     

Yeah, the reset is not a big deal now he knows what to do to re-activate it. My 4503 does the same when you power it down, but 2 button presses later and its back in 6.5 digit mode.

[bd139]

From experience most people who had those on benches where i momentarily worked left them on overnight. And their soldering irons 

[Specmaster]

I doubt the passengers would leave their seats as there are grab rails in front of them and standing on the top deck was strictly forbidden except for boarding and exiting the bus at all times. Standing was on allowed on the lower deck. As you saw in the video, it was still possible to stand and walk along the top deck even at that angle. Buses never travel fast enough for them to lean anywhere near that angle on bends or turns, whatever the conditions.

You obviously haven't been on a London bus recently, some of the yahoos driving them exhibit skills more appropriate to a dogem car at the fair than a "London transport, diesel engine, ninety-seven horsepower omnibus".

https://youtube.com/4UgBZfInBlU?t=34

With some streets in London, if that were true, they would be smashing into buildings and road signs etc, except that they don't because as I said, they never travel fast enough, nor capable of turning that quick (too many turns of the steering wheel, lock to lock) to be able to exert sufficient centrifugal force for them to lean enough. The only time I hear of buses striking a building etc it is the result of an accident where the bus has mounted the pavement and the bus gets damaged from top to bottom. Other than that they can and do at times get driven down roads with low bridges and overhanging trees when the top deck receives structural damage, but that is not as a result of the bus tilting, just the moron driving it getting lost or not looking out for trees 

We have those busses over here.  None here have tipped.  However, the traction seems to be not great enough to remain on the road surface.  They are well known for "departing the lane" in windy conditions and end up in the ditch.  That is not necessarily even in slippery conditions.  In winter conditions, testing also indicated that a double lane change (over & back) was an unsafe manoeuvre over 40 km/h.  Main arterial routes have a limit of 60 km/h and they also get used on one highway with a limit of 100 km/h...

Yeah, but that I put down to the fact that modern buses are built lighter than they used to be, and they are such a large flat sided vehicle that the wind can catch them badly. There is another possible reason why they end up in ditches, but not sure if this still applies today or not, but back in the 60's the tyres were looked after by a resident team from the manufacturer of tyres that the bus company selected as their standard. When a tyre wore down to the legal limit, they would be recut by hand and they may not always be to the same pattern as new tyres and thus could have reduced grip as a result. Add to that mix the fact that in the 60's they used to half cabs and only had a length of 27 feet and these days they are 30 feet and even 36 feet long and they also tend to come in 2 heights, low bridge and high bridge so obviously a longer non half cab, high bridge version will catch a greater wind force than low bridge one will.

[AVGresponding]

Med has the SDM3055 and now we have a secret user cal process for them.....if you have a suitable reference. 

My bad, I misremembered.

Do you know whether the factory calibration process is manual or automated? A person having a bit of brain fade would explain a lot.