Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Saskia]

The probe was located in Vienna, Austria. Austrian courts do not necessarily recognize the authority of the German Bundesgerichtshof.
Zucca would need an Austrian lawyer to pursue this. This might not be worth the hassle and the associated risk.

The rules look similar, though.

Finding a case history such as the one from Stiftung Warentest but for Austrian cases would be optimum, though.

"Pacta sunt servanda" - this applies in Austria as well as far as I know.

Let's see, if the seller is dumb enough to relist this item again.

The question is if it is worth the hassle and the effort and risk to pursue this issue in an Austrian court.
Quick calculation:
same probe available via Amazon (used, very good) for 1200 USD which is close to 1100 €.

Calculation based on 1000€ ...

Gerichtskosten   €   102,00
Anwaltskosten   €   310,90
Vorbereitender Schriftsatz   €   225,05
1. Streitverhandlung
1 Stunde
€   222,53
2. Streitverhandlung
keine
€   0,00
3. Streitverhandlung
keine
€   0,00
Summe ohne Berufung   €   860,47
Berufung (wenn notwendig)    €   628,45
Ergebnis mit Berufung¹   €   1.488,92


You risk cost (just your cost) of 860€ for your lawyer only (plus the same amount for your opponent, if you do not win your case. If you need to appeal, cost will increase to about 1500€ just for your part of the story.

Unless you have insurance coverage which covers legal fees in the EU instead of Germany alone, you run a pretty high risk.

To me, this would not be worth it. But it's Zucca's call.
And no, I did not pursue the tape deck issue, either. Too much hassle.

[Ice-Tea]

Prrff.. in essence, pick your poisson. Pick a category and I have something that needs repair. But... what about a Datron 1071? I actually have a series of these that seem to work fine but all throw selftest errors. They all have depleted batteries in common but simply replacing them does not work. So, my working theory is that it needs at least halfway right correction parameters to pass selftests. And that's how far I got.

Oooh, a Datron 1071! Would love to have one.   

Have you seen this page (sorry, it's in German)?

http://www.friedrich-messtechnik.de/index.php/2012-11-20-02-38-33/datron-labormultimeter

No, I haven't. Defpom has a series on them too, saw some of that. I could probably fix it in the end myself but I simply don't have the time. Juggling three jobs atm (more, if you count the stuff my wife wants me to do...) and I need to stick to the stuff that *must* be done rather than what I would *like* to do...

I'd like to give the opportunity to the Capt'n if he wants it but if not I'd be happy to send one to you...

[BU508A]

The probe was located in Vienna, Austria. Austrian courts do not necessarily recognize the authority of the German Bundesgerichtshof.
Zucca would need an Austrian lawyer to pursue this. This might not be worth the hassle and the associated risk.

The rules look similar, though.

Finding a case history such as the one from Stiftung Warentest but for Austrian cases would be optimum, though.

"Pacta sunt servanda" - this applies in Austria as well as far as I know.

Let's see, if the seller is dumb enough to relist this item again.

The question is if it is worth the hassle and the effort and risk to pursue this issue in an Austrian court.

Yes.
But on the other hand it really annoys me when such douchebags are getting away with it.

[Ice-Tea]

General notice to bored people: feel free to PM with the poison of your choice (PSU/Scope/counter/DMM/DSA/other) and I can probably set you up with a nice repair project

[AVGresponding]

Prrff.. in essence, pick your poisson. Pick a category and I have something that needs repair. But... what about a Datron 1071? I actually have a series of these that seem to work fine but all throw selftest errors. They all have depleted batteries in common but simply replacing them does not work. So, my working theory is that it needs at least halfway right correction parameters to pass selftests. And that's how far I got.

Oooh, a Datron 1071! Would love to have one.   

Have you seen this page (sorry, it's in German)?

http://www.friedrich-messtechnik.de/index.php/2012-11-20-02-38-33/datron-labormultimeter

No, I haven't. Defpom has a series on them too, saw some of that. I could probably fix it in the end myself but I simply don't have the time. Juggling three jobs atm (more, if you count the stuff my wife wants me to do...) and I need to stick to the stuff that *must* be done rather than what I would *like* to do...

I'd like to give the opportunity to the Capt'n if he wants it but if not I'd be happy to send one to you...

Well, don't send one to me, I'd never want to send it back!   

All your dot matrix VFDs are belong to us now!

[Saskia]

@Mounty I added a court cost calculation ...
and I concur, if someone is too cheap to pay for the reserve fee, then it should read "pacta sunt servanda".

I would welcome the PoS seller to my blacklist.

[Ice-Tea]

Didn't you PM me earlier about those? Slipped my mind I'm afraid.. Not sure when I'll be back in the lab, but I'll have a look around if there's something that can make you happy..

[capt bullshot]

So I found this amplifier alike box at some other departments scrap box, free for take away:
**snip**

Dude, if you're so desperate for stuff to tinker with, I got **stuff** for you...

What kind of stuff 

Prrff.. in essence, pick your poisson. Pick a category and I have something that needs repair. But... what about a Datron 1071? I actually have a series of these that seem to work fine but all throw selftest errors. They all have depleted batteries in common but simply replacing them does not work. So, my working theory is that it needs at least halfway right correction parameters to pass selftests. And that's how far I got.

Try calibrating them more than once.  What you describe sounds familiar, I have a 1061A that lost its calibration and needed two or three calibration iterations to final success.
These things can have quite interesting and subtle faults:
http://wunderkis.de/datron1061a/index.html
https://amplifier.cd/Test_Equipment/other/Datron1061/Datron_1061.html

So if you can't get any further with them, I should be able to help you. As I've already got two 1061, you'd most probably get them back.
I've got no dedicated wish list, It's more a "I see it, repair it and I like it" process. Some stuff that I don't have yet: an SMU, a general purpose SA with 9k to maybe 2G range and narrow RBW, something like a HP53310A ...

[Robert763]

A perfect looking HP 5335A with option C 1.2GHz input for £74.99 Buy It Now. How could I resist?

Who COULD have resisted? Also Jammy Git territory!

I'll call Jammy Git if it has the OXCO option. A  10811-60111 is worth more than £75.

[ch_scr]

Finally got my power supply from the mail today. Clean, warranty sticker still intact. Had some woes making up the RS232 adapter cable for it (In the manual they do give the pinout, which is admirable. But they insist on numbering the pins on the RJ45 right-to-left which I had obviously overlooked so I had to redo the DB9 . Then it was just to figure out it only liked one of my USB-to-RS232 adapters to make it work )
Here it can be seen pushing 10A in a 1\$\Omega\$ resistor, fan barely above idle at 1/4 max power . Voltage accuracy checks out good too.

[bd139]

A perfect looking HP 5335A with option C 1.2GHz input for £74.99 Buy It Now. How could I resist?

Who COULD have resisted? Also Jammy Git territory!

I'll call Jammy Git if it has the OXCO option. A  10811-60111 is worth more than £75.

If you lurk around these parts you can pick up an HP OCXO for 50 quid, usually from a suitably knackered HP frequency analyser.

[tggzzz]

The next guessing game is, what condition did the meter arrive in?

The trap is baited.
Our breath is baited, and we are waiting - for the next thrilling installment of AVG journey of a lifetime.

Or something like that.

[mansaxel]

Let's see, if the seller is dumb enough to relist this item again.

The question is if it is worth the hassle and the effort and risk to pursue this issue in an Austrian court.

My idea would be that the relevant level of effort would be to rattle your weapons in form of prior case law, and see whether the seller folds. The german cases are indeed very clear.

I agree that it is Zucca's call.

[AVGresponding]

Received an 8050A today, sold as "used". I believe a more accurate term would be "borked".

Think i have a 8050A around in my pile if you need comparison material when you decide to repair.

I'd like to take you up on this offer if I may.

I'd like your measurements of RV1, 2, and 3 to start with. They show infinite resistance here, which I'm sure is not correct...

[bd139]

Let's see, if the seller is dumb enough to relist this item again.

The question is if it is worth the hassle and the effort and risk to pursue this issue in an Austrian court.

My idea would be that the relevant level of effort would be to rattle your weapons in form of prior case law, and see whether the seller folds. The german cases are indeed very clear.

I agree that it is Zucca's call.

Best to shrug and walk away 

This is incidentally one reason why I never use auctions to sell stuff. BIN inflated price, fish hook all the bastards as watchers then send them a 10% discount offer and watch them worry over someone else getting it and wait for the jump 

[Cerebus]

The probe was located in Vienna, Austria. Austrian courts do not necessarily recognize the authority of the German Bundesgerichtshof.
Zucca would need an Austrian lawyer to pursue this. This might not be worth the hassle and the associated risk.

Under the EU Distance Selling Directive the law of the buyer's country is the applicable one since 1997 for business to customer transactions - I don't know if that's applicable in this case as I don't know of the seller is selling as a business.

[tggzzz]

This is incidentally one reason why I never use auctions to sell stuff. BIN inflated price, fish hook all the bastards as watchers then send them a 10% discount offer and watch them worry over someone else getting it and wait for the jump 

What's the mechanics of that on fleabay?

Offer+BIN rejecting anything below 90% of BIN? But if you do that, can a punter that made two unacceptable offers still buy it for your "reduced price"?

[bd139]

This is incidentally one reason why I never use auctions to sell stuff. BIN inflated price, fish hook all the bastards as watchers then send them a 10% discount offer and watch them worry over someone else getting it and wait for the jump 

What's the mechanics of that on fleabay?

Offer+BIN rejecting anything below 90% of BIN? But if you do that, can a punter that made two unacceptable offers still buy it for your "reduced price"?

I make an offer as a seller. I never allow offers from buyers on my auctions because quite frankly everyone wants too much of a bargain.

ebay flow chart:

1. Take photos.
2. Decide how much you want in the bank from it. This is usually a case of researching the sold prices historically and making an educated guess.
3. Add 5% for paypal mugging. Add £1 for sellers fees.
4. Add £2 for a box and packaging (I usually recycle boxes but buy new bubble wrap)
3. Pack it and weigh it
4. get an actual quote for postage from packlink including insurance (I usually wing this TBH) and add that
5. List it at the cumulative price + 15%
6. Wait until there are a few watchers.
7. Send a seller offer out at 15% off.
8. Wait for them to all panic that someone else is going to buy it and jump in.

I used to include postage in the total cost and say "free postage" but that screws you on returns so I'm never doing that again. They can bloody pay for it 

[Cerebus]

I make an offer as a seller. I never allow offers from buyers on my auctions because quite frankly everyone wants too much of a bargain.

You couldn't possibly be hinting at any of your TEA colleagues here. No, you couldn't be. Perish the thought.

Reminds me of those irregular verbs and phrases from "Yes, Minister":

• I brief
• You leak
• He is being prosecuted under the Official Secrets Act

vis:

• I keenly pursue a good deal
• You like a bargain
• He is a miserable skinflint

[mnementh]

Yes ... "just a little crazy" is so pedestrian.

This place has so much more!

mnem

[mansaxel]

You couldn't possibly be hinting at any of your TEA colleagues here. No, you couldn't be. Perish the thought.

Those versed in BD139 antics PM him. Now we know the peeling we can do on the price potato... 

[tggzzz]

This is incidentally one reason why I never use auctions to sell stuff. BIN inflated price, fish hook all the bastards as watchers then send them a 10% discount offer and watch them worry over someone else getting it and wait for the jump 

What's the mechanics of that on fleabay?

Offer+BIN rejecting anything below 90% of BIN? But if you do that, can a punter that made two unacceptable offers still buy it for your "reduced price"?

I make an offer as a seller. I never allow offers from buyers on my auctions because quite frankly everyone wants too much of a bargain.

ebay flow chart:

1. Take photos.
2. Decide how much you want in the bank from it. This is usually a case of researching the sold prices historically and making an educated guess.
3. Add 5% for paypal mugging. Add £1 for sellers fees.
4. Add £2 for a box and packaging (I usually recycle boxes but buy new bubble wrap)
3. Pack it and weigh it
4. get an actual quote for postage from packlink including insurance (I usually wing this TBH) and add that
5. List it at the cumulative price + 15%
6. Wait until there are a few watchers.
7. Send a seller offer out at 15% off.
8. Wait for them to all panic that someone else is going to buy it and jump in.

I used to include postage in the total cost and say "free postage" but that screws you on returns so I'm never doing that again. They can bloody pay for it 

OK, thanks. Nothing I haven't thought of, and occasional applied

[AVGresponding]

This may well be the pricing structure for a 2465 on eBay at the moment.

£365 + £40 shipping, and listed as parts, because the seller is too lazy to calibrate it properly...   

[BU508A]

Anybody interested in a 4ch arbitrary function generator?
Got a price offer from the seller and I'd have considered it, but with that R&S on it's way I have no use for it.
Price offer was EUR 350.-  No affiliations with the seller.

Addendum: It is more an IQ Signal generator, the 4ch arbitrary function gen is more like a "side effect"

https://www.ebay.de/itm/114298992207

[AVGresponding]

Keithley 2000 update:

It has arrived...

Full story (and pics) to follow, but as I've been waiting in for it since 8am, I really need to go to the loo right now...