Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Neomys Sapiens]

Really, what is happening here? Lots of crappy rolling stock that does not even measure anything! Not a single quantity measured, recorded, analysed.
So let us correct this:

[xrunner]

Just looking at the first part of the cal procedure for the FG503. Power supply voltages spot on. Part 3 Symmetry adjustment, after 30+ years, needed no adjustment - exactly right. However, according to the procedure, I had to "obtain a triggered square wave on the crt". Since I started off using a Rigol DS1054Z, I realized this was not acceptable. I then changed to the Agilent 54622D since it did have a crt. Now the adjustment has been done properly. 

[med6753]

To put that in perspective... I've read that Victorian-era London had 3 mail deliveries a day; it was not unusual to receive a letter at breakfast, respond to it and receive a reply in time for tea.

No at least 6 deliveries a day.

To quote official documentation from the time:

London is divided into 8 postal districts, in which the number of deliveries varies from 12 to 6 daily, between 7.30 a.m. and 7.45 p.m.

So when did Royal Mail go to Royal Shit? 

[med6753]

Hello,

here is, as promised previously, the teardown of my Hameg / Rohde & Schwarz 8112-3    6 1/2 digit DMM.
It is a nice meter and one thing on this meter I'm finding funny are the illuminated input ports.
Depending on what mode you have chosen, the input ports are illuminated.   

And this is the HM 8112-3 in comparison to a Keithley DMM 7510 and connected to a Fluke 732A:


So, I hope you've enjoyed this little teardown.

It would appear that someone is not telling the truth. 

[mnementh]

... to neutralize the alkali with Windex ...

Neutralize?

pH        : 10.7 (at 25ºC)

I knew you'd be along to bust my balls. 

Bottom line: Decent quality Windex (any with enough ammonia you can smell it) is very effective at breaking down battery electrolyte and stopping the corrosion it has caused from progressing; a few cycles of spray/scrub with a toothbrush works like magic. Follow it with water rinse (sometimes alcohol after that to help the water evaporate from under components) and blow with compressed air, then bake in the summer sun a few hours and the corrosion part of the repair is resolved.

While I have no doubt Saskia's process is BETTER, I've been resurrecting battery-fuxxored remote controls and other battery-powered gadgets this way for 40 years; I don't care how many ways you might argue it can't work. IT DOES. And YES, it works better than plain water alone.

mnem
 

[mnementh]

some slight progress with the trashed RockPI.

Received empty SPI ROMS (those pesky serial SOP8 thingies that are too small for comfort and managed to tack it on. Managed to find the RockPI on the USB-Port of a Linux system and flash the SPI with a boot loader.
Now it is trying to PXE-boot, but I cannot find the fucking kernel files and its bloody ethernet address ...
bloody fucking hell.

it would probably have been easier just to jimmyrig a bloody uSD.

mnem
Epoxy & magnet wire: The engineer's Duck-Tape.

[Saskia]

If I did not need the fucking skill to work with those fucking gizmos I would not have bothered. I'm gonna shoot the rabbit to make sure it's full of holes ...
One of the next jobs will be to start effing around with fpgas. It will help me to know my way around the toolchain.

[Wolfgang]

Hello,

here is, as promised previously, the teardown of my Hameg / Rohde & Schwarz 8112-3    6 1/2 digit DMM.
It is a nice meter and one thing on this meter I'm finding funny are the illuminated input ports.
Depending on what mode you have chosen, the input ports are illuminated.   

And this is the HM 8112-3 in comparison to a Keithley DMM 7510 and connected to a Fluke 732A:


So, I hope you've enjoyed this little teardown.

It would appear that someone is not telling the truth. 

... this comparison is a bit unfair, I would say. You need no Sherlock Holmes to find the culprit.
HAMEG always was hobby stuff, rather on the cheap side. I have a lot of Hameg instruments, but I hardly ever use them now (PSU, DMM, Distortion Meter, RF generator, Impedance Bridge, a scope with a fried input channel, ...). This stuff is also hard to sell for a reasonable price, so it will continue to collect dust, I'm afraid.
Now my cheap stuff is Rigol, and the quality instruments are from Keysight or R&S. So far, I'm OK with that.

[BU508A]

It would appear that someone is not telling the truth. 

Yes, but I'm not worried. All three need to be calibrated but before doing that,
the Fluke 732A needs a new battery pack. The one inside is dead as a dodo.
I'm thinking about replacing it with a Li-Ion pack (the original ones are Pb-acid).
The advantages would be:
- less weight
- increased capacity. The Pb-acid batteries are good for 2 days uptime, with the Li-Ion a week could be easily achieved

Disadvantages are:
- needs a different charger, therefore a modification of the PSU of the 732A. Maybe not a so good idea.
- sending in to a cal-lab would be problematic because of the restrictions of the delivery service companies.

I hoped, I could discuss this topic at the Metrology Meeting in Stuttgart, but this meeting got canceled for well-known reasons.

[mnementh]

To put that in perspective... I've read that Victorian-era London had 3 mail deliveries a day; it was not unusual to receive a letter at breakfast, respond to it and receive a reply in time for tea.

No at least 6 deliveries a day.

To quote official documentation from the time:

London is divided into 8 postal districts, in which the number of deliveries varies from 12 to 6 daily, between 7.30 a.m. and 7.45 p.m.

Glad to be wrong any time it reinforces my primary point...

Yeah; mostly it was simple manpower and people willing to pay them to do a job rather than trying to find ANY way NOT to pay a person for working.

So now we're comparing 6+ deliveries a DAY to 6 deliveries a WEEK and the GWN annex of Her Majesty's Post can't even manage THAT for as long as I've been here. 

mnem

[ArthurDent]

Really, what is happening here? Lots of crappy rolling stock that does not even measure anything! Not a single quantity measured, recorded, analysed.
So let us correct this:

Measurements? You want measurements with railroads? Here you go. 

[xrunner]

I was thinking of just going with this paper printout for the new dial markings. You think it's good enough guys?




 

[mnementh]

A few more pieces of Scotch tape and she'll be good to go! 

mnem
 

[xrunner]

A few more pieces of Scotch tape and she'll be good to go! 

mnem
 

If it was hp I wouldn't dream of doing it, but since it's just Tektronix meh. 

Med bait ...

[mnementh]

mnem
*waiting for med to come kick both our asses*

[SilverSolder]

I was thinking of just going with this paper printout for the new dial markings. You think it's good enough guys?

(Attachment Link)

Paper yellows pretty quickly, sadly.

[jh15]

HP hand calibrated some of their meter scales to the movement.
Use a freq counter and roll your own custom scale.

[beanflying]

I was thinking of just going with this paper printout for the new dial markings. You think it's good enough guys?

(Attachment Link)

Clearly you need a Laser Cutter and a paintbrush to fill the engraving lines 

[xrunner]

Paper yellows pretty quickly, sadly.

More the better - we call that "weathering" or "distressing", like high dollar furniture. 

[beanflying]

So I actually looked at what my Laser build is going to cost after buying nearly all the bits    $4400 AU Pesos or just on $2800USD. Then there is a Cooler I am making from repurposed commercial fridge gear, Extractor (brought secondhand for $200) and an Airpump (already have a compressor)

So if anyone wants to build a big toy allow $3,500 USD or buy one for about $1000 more without the work but at least I won't have cut the corners

[worsthorse]

Other than my weekly meals on wheels gig, I haven't been more than four blocks from my front yard since mid-February. So when the opportunity to have an adventure arose, I jumped on it...

even though it will probably turn out to be a wild goose chase. For the last month or so, I've been in conversation with a guy who says he has a 100'x100' warehouse filled with electronic test equipment and parts over the last forty years. Used to be (that is, twenty or more years ago) a big seller on ebay and knows a lot about test gear from the 80s and 90s. So I am going to get in my truck and drive for a couple plus hours just to take a look and maybe find an interesting thing or two to bring back. I am mostly going in hopes of finding a stash of components I can use but I also sent him a list of test gear on my wish list.

Does he have any of it? Who knows?  Worst case I will spend five hours in the truck, talking to myself, listening to an audiobook, and wondering where I can find a bathroom that isn't a probable covid death trap.  Best case, I come back with a couple of crates of dual gate mosfets, SBL-1s, and B&W coil stock, along with four or five pieces of nixie tube festooned TE, having found a safe place to take a leak along the way.

[Cerebus]

... to neutralize the alkali with Windex ...

Neutralize?

pH        : 10.7 (at 25ºC)

I knew you'd be along to bust my balls. 

Bottom line: Decent quality Windex (any with enough ammonia you can smell it) is very effective at breaking down battery electrolyte and stopping the corrosion it has caused from progressing; a few cycles of spray/scrub with a toothbrush works like magic. Follow it with water rinse (sometimes alcohol after that to help the water evaporate from under components) and blow with compressed air, then bake in the summer sun a few hours and the corrosion part of the repair is resolved.

While I have no doubt Saskia's process is BETTER, I've been resurrecting battery-fuxxored remote controls and other battery-powered gadgets this way for 40 years; I don't care how many ways you might argue it can't work. IT DOES. And YES, it works better than plain water alone.

mnem
 

Well, if you will say you're neutralizing an alkali with another alkali you can expect at least a hint at a minor correction. (Ammonia, "as any fule know" is an alkali. One doesn't neutralize an alkali with another alkali, one needs an acid.) If I was busting ya balls, you'd be feeling more pain.

I suspect that the Windex is doing you good because it contains water and some surfactant/detergent/soap, but most definately not becuase it contains ammonia. (I actually had to check the MSDS for Windex because although I suspected it contains ammonia I couldn't be sure. Ammonia based window cleaners were once common here, but the ammonia was phased out years ago*.

I don't care how many ways you might argue it can't work.

C'mon, nobody said that. I would have thought that using a Strawman argument was beneath you.

* I suspect because back in the 60s spraying ammonia in someone's face was the favoured method of robbers of armoured cars, banks and Post Offices here in the UK. So much so that in the 1968 Firearms Act "any weapon of whatever description designed or adapted for the discharge of any noxious liquid, gas or other thing" was classified as a "Section 5" prohibited weapon and inter alia also a firearm by dictat, carrying additional penalties above and beyond mere misuse of a firearm. A classic case of unintended consequences as those gentlemen who had been civil enough to use noxious, but non-lethal, ammonia graduated to real firearms instead - seeing as if they used ammonia they were going to be prosecuted for all the firearms offences and possession of a Section 5 prohibited weapon as well.

[Cerebus]

I was thinking of just going with this paper printout for the new dial markings. You think it's good enough guys?

(Attachment Link)

Clearly you need a Laser Cutter and a paintbrush to fill the engraving lines 

Rubbish! A lathe to make a new dial, a milling machine and a spindexer to engrave the dial and then a paintbrush to fill the markings in. And obviously the test gear necessary to the process, an engineers square, vernier calipers, edge finder, micrometer and a couple of dial test indicators.

[beanflying]

I was thinking of just going with this paper printout for the new dial markings. You think it's good enough guys?

(Attachment Link)

Clearly you need a Laser Cutter and a paintbrush to fill the engraving lines 

Rubbish! A lathe to make a new dial, a milling machine and a spindexer to engrave the dial and then a paintbrush to fill the markings in. And obviously the test gear necessary to the process, an engineers square, vernier calipers, edge finder, micrometer and a couple of dial test indicators.

I was only floating an 'affordable and simple' solution 

[mnementh]

... to neutralize the alkali with Windex ...

Neutralize?

pH        : 10.7 (at 25ºC)

I knew you'd be along to bust my balls. 

Bottom line: Decent quality Windex (any with enough ammonia you can smell it) is very effective at breaking down battery electrolyte and stopping the corrosion it has caused from progressing; a few cycles of spray/scrub with a toothbrush works like magic. Follow it with water rinse (sometimes alcohol after that to help the water evaporate from under components) and blow with compressed air, then bake in the summer sun a few hours and the corrosion part of the repair is resolved.

While I have no doubt Saskia's process is BETTER, I've been resurrecting battery-fuxxored remote controls and other battery-powered gadgets this way for 40 years; I don't care how many ways you might argue it can't work. IT DOES. And YES, it works better than plain water alone.

mnem
 

Well, if you will say you're neutralizing an alkali with another alkali you can expect at least a hint at a minor correction. (Ammonia, "as any fule know" is an alkali. One doesn't neutralize an alkali with another alkali, one needs an acid.) If I was busting ya balls, you'd be feeling more pain.

I suspect that the Windex is doing you good because it contains water and some surfactant/detergent/soap, but most definately not becuase it contains ammonia. (I actually had to check the MSDS for Windex because although I suspected it contains ammonia I couldn't be sure. Ammonia based window cleaners were once common here, but the ammonia was phased out years ago*.

I don't care how many ways you might argue it can't work.

C'mon, nobody said that. I would have thought that using a Strawman argument was beneath you.

* I suspect because back in the 60s spraying ammonia in someone's face was the favoured method of robbers of armoured cars, banks and Post Offices here in the UK. So much so that in the 1968 Firearms Act "any weapon of whatever description designed or adapted for the discharge of any noxious liquid, gas or other thing" was classified as a "Section 5" prohibited weapon and inter alia also a firearm by dictat, carrying additional penalties above and beyond mere misuse of a firearm. A classic case of unintended consequences as those gentlemen who had been civil enough to use noxious, but non-lethal, ammonia graduated to real firearms instead - seeing as if they used ammonia they were going to be prosecuted for all the firearms offences and possession of a Section 5 prohibited weapon as well.

None of that negates the fact that my procedure does, in fact, neutralize the electrolyte’s attack on the device in question, and that it does so better than water and a toothbrush alone.

I don’t care WHY or HOW it works. I only care THAT it works, and that I have the materials on hand to NEUTRALIZE the damage.

Empirical evidence is valid too; there’s a lot more than just alkali in alkaline battery chemistry, just as there’s a lot more than just ammonia and water in Windex.

That’s not a straw man; that's just using what works. Maybe you should try it; maybe you can tell me why.

mnem