Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[tggzzz]

JC = Job Centre. The only place you go when you don't want a job here or really want to work in the Job Centre

I take people on individual merit not qualifications. Had to tell a couple of grads from fairly respectable universities to piss off recently.

Oh hell yes, I keep clear of grads, experience has taught me that they are great at theory but utter shit at doing anything with their hands. I really don't think you can beat the type of training I got, hands on the job training and also day release to college, doing the theory and practical side by side, enhancing each other.

I keep clear of non-grads, experience has taught me tha they are great at bending wires but utter shit at doing anything anstract or theoretical. I really don't think you can beat the type of training I got, solid theory that lasts a working lifetime plus practicals that cement why the theory is important, enhancing each other.

In other words, "horses for courses" and "there are good and bad university courses and students".

[tggzzz]

Now I just need to decide how to case them up. I've got quite a few expired devices that could donate their housing, but finding one that's just right might take me a while.
I see no need to put them in a metal case, but I do want to automate the switching of the reference outputs, using some of the hundreds of old telecoms relays I have.

... another source of thermal EMF

I don't think thermal EMF matter much for the AD584.

300ppm (30mV in 10V) plus 25ppm per 1000 hours (250uV). Yes, you are right!

[Specmaster]

Just checked the delivery of BC182's and I pulled this data sheet from the web and its utter shit, anyone following would be installing them with the Emitter and Collector leads reversed 

[med6753]

Now I just need to decide how to case them up. I've got quite a few expired devices that could donate their housing, but finding one that's just right might take me a while.
I see no need to put them in a metal case, but I do want to automate the switching of the reference outputs, using some of the hundreds of old telecoms relays I have.

... another source of thermal EMF

I don't think thermal EMF matter much for the AD584.

No, but ambient temperature does. As I recently demonstrated with an AD584 on a hot plate.

Yeah well, I can show you a graph of my AD584 following the ambient temperature 

You did, remember? Then I demonstrated more acutely by putting it on a hot plate.  Search back....

Yes I remember, we are both saying the same thing. Sorry if it looks like I was arguing. I was not.

Still trying to wake up drinking my coffee 

I didn't take it as arguing, I just thought you forgot. It's all good.   

[BU508A]

Just checked the delivery of BC182's and I pulled this data sheet from the web and its utter shit, anyone following would be installing them with the Emitter and Collector leads reversed 

Hmm, I checked your datasheet and looked in the web for other sources. They are all agreeing.







Edit:
screenshot from your datasheet:

[Cerebus]

I take people on individual merit not qualifications. Had to tell a couple of grads from fairly respectable universities to piss off recently.

Same here. Being able to accrue qualifications and being able to actually do something are two completely different beasts. I mean, look at the people running the country - typically primary and secondary education at the best schools that money can buy (expensive prep school then Eton, Harrow, etc*) and then a degree from Oxford or Cambridge. Yet still they can't manage the comparatively simple job of getting some PPE to our hospitals - even when equipped with emergency powers that basically mean they can turn around to any suitably equipped factory and say "make this". I could name several people from this thread alone who I'm certain could get the job done inside a week as long as their hands weren't tied behind their backs.

And don't get me started on industry qualifications. Show me someone with a CCNA and I can guarantee that, thrown in at the deep end, they don't have a clue what to do. Back in my ISP days after a few disastrous interviews I started using a CCNA qualification on someone's CV as a marker for the reject pile. Doubly so if they had any Microsoft certifications. My experience has been that if someone is any good they are far too busy doing real work to piss about acquiring a mountain of paperwork from vendor's various training arms. Nowadays the only reason I'd take someone on with a vendor's professional qualification is either if they had a bloody good excuse for having it ("the boss made me get it", "I was young and stupid") or came on a personal recommendation from someone that I trust. OK, I'm probably not really quite that extreme, but damn close.

* Contrary to popular suspicions these schools aren't just old boys clubs. Yes, they are that, but there is also very good teaching for those who want to learn. I've had friends who went to Eton (posh, rich family), Harrow (scholarship) and Rugby (rich family) who all clearly got a better education than I did from my own, well thought of, grammar school (Gymnasium for our German readers).

[Cerebus]

Your 2nd toe is longer than your big toe. 


(So is mine)

Ah, the sign of the Devil. Get the kindling boys...

[WastelandTek]

the 561 passed smoke test today, so that's nice

it has a trace, but any working vert plugin pulls it hard down, so I gotta figure that out...

Define "hard down". Causes power issues or forces the trace off screen?

trace off screen

all voltages are correct and are present at the vert connector

if you power the frame with no vert plugin the trace is normal

I'm a bit confused actually, as there is NO deflection circuitry in the frame, it is just a wire from the plugin connector to the CRT pin.

[tggzzz]

I take people on individual merit not qualifications. Had to tell a couple of grads from fairly respectable universities to piss off recently.

Same here. Being able to accrue qualifications and being able to actually do something are two completely different beasts. I mean, look at the people running the country - typically primary and secondary education at the best schools that money can buy (expensive prep school then Eton, Harrow, etc*) and then a degree from Oxford or Cambridge. Yet still they can't manage the comparatively simple job of getting some PPE to our hospitals - even when equipped with emergency powers that basically mean they can turn around to any suitably equipped factory and say "make this". I could name several people from this thread alone who I'm certain could get the job done inside a week as long as their hands weren't tied behind their backs.

Being educated and competent has never been a priority for our ruling classes. The only things they have to be competent at are supervising others and not being ejected from position (royal family) or power (politicians). Dog help us.

And don't get me started on industry qualifications. Show me someone with a CCNA and I can guarantee that, thrown in at the deep end, they don't have a clue what to do. Back in my ISP days after a few disastrous interviews I started using a CCNA qualification on someone's CV as a marker for the reject pile. Doubly so if they had any Microsoft certifications. My experience has been that if someone is any good they are far too busy doing real work to piss about acquiring a mountain of paperwork from vendor's various training arms. Nowadays the only reason I'd take someone on with a vendor's professional qualification is either if they had a bloody good excuse for having it ("the boss made me get it", "I was young and stupid") or came on a personal recommendation from someone that I trust. OK, I'm probably not really quite that extreme, but damn close.

That type of qualification is little more than "on this year's frobnitz, push button X to turn purple into green". Isaac Asimov accurately summed that up in his 1957 novella "Profession", which significantly influenced my career choices and is still worth speed reading: http://www.abelard.org/asimov.php

* Contrary to popular suspicions these schools aren't just old boys clubs. Yes, they are that, but there is also very good teaching for those who want to learn. I've had friends who went to Eton (posh, rich family), Harrow (scholarship) and Rugby (rich family) who all clearly got a better education than I did from my own, well thought of, grammar school (Gymnasium for our German readers).

I've had relations that were Treasurer of Cambridge University (after he retired from his colonial job) and headmaster of Rugby (later emmigrated to Melbourne). One had changed his accent to fit, the other was more down to earth.

[tggzzz]

So, after hacking a fan and controller into my Tek 492 spectrum analyser, what next?:

• fix the 1kV output in my Datron calibrator; no schematic nor manual available
• fix the -70dBc spurs in my HP8562b spectrum analyser, which are almost certainly due to SMPS capacitor ESR

1kV? Hmmm. Chicken out.

So I look at the HP service manual and CLIP, and find that the PSU is buried in the middle of the instrument, under two digital controller boards and two RF boards. Hmmm. Chicken out.

But then I look at how to access the PSU, and it is the usual HP mechanical marvel. The two controller boards hinge out, and the two RF boards also hinge out.

And after doing that, there is the usual in-your-face right-where-it-is-needed guide...

[Cubdriver]

Oh this has to be the shittest packaging in the universe award contender here.

Another ebay job I needed for my network project (have 5 ciscos now and all the WICs I need)...

So huuuuuuge box arrives. Oooh look there's two boxes just slung inside it.



Ugh this is not looking good. Inner box containing my toy...



Well the inner inner box appears to have basically just got the item stuffed in it and a tape roll for padding. No bubble wrap, nothing 



Looks ok fortunately. The rack brackets are quite frankly mega-overkill and gave it some smsashing around room. Hopefully it's not too wrecked. All I needed was the VDSL card out of it but you know it would have been nice not to have to chuck the rest in the trash.

It's simply unfathomable to me that anyone could look at that and think "This is packaged well enough to ship".  My latest doozy was an HP 8165A that was literally wrapped around the equator with a few turns of that sort of folded up brown butcher paper, then wrapped around the poles with corrugated cardboard.  The open sides were then filled with more of the butcher paper wadded up into a long plug, then the whole thing was liberally wrapped in packing tape.  Amazingly it arrived unscathed, but I've no idea how.  (Unfortunately I was too shocked to take photos, and simply opened it fearing the worst.) 

I suppose in the grand scheme of things it was technically adequate packing given that it arrived in one piece, but seriously?     And this from a vendor with thousands of sales and perfect feedback.   

-Pat

[tggzzz]

So, after hacking a fan and controller into my Tek 492 spectrum analyser, what next?:

• fix the 1kV output in my Datron calibrator; no schematic nor manual available
• fix the -70dBc spurs in my HP8562b spectrum analyser, which are almost certainly due to SMPS capacitor ESR

1kV? Hmmm. Chicken out.

So I look at the HP service manual and CLIP, and find that the PSU is buried in the middle of the instrument, under two digital controller boards and two RF boards. Hmmm. Chicken out.

But then I look at how to access the PSU, and it is the usual HP mechanical marvel. The two controller boards hinge out, and the two RF boards also hinge out.



And after doing that, there is the usual in-your-face right-where-it-is-needed guide...



But I'll leave the PSU itself until tomorrow...

[BU508A]

Isaac Asimov accurately summed that up in his 1957 novella "Profession", which significantly influenced my career choices and is still worth speed reading: http://www.abelard.org/asimov.php

Thanks for that. Books ordered.

[mnementh]

   Let me make you a Dragon style Bed then 

Don't you kindof need your laser cutter to make that bed for your laser cutter...?

Just perfect for a dwagon, get his scales locked into those peaks, then he isn't going to be able to toss and turn all night freting over his flop on the 3DP 

Especially nice when I need to molt in the spring... just around the corner.

   

Rev2 didn't fit... I failed to allow for interference with the belt tensioner.  As there isn't adequate room for material thick enough to redesign (within my skillzz level in Fusion anyways), and I don't want to rebuild my printer with the old stuff AGAIN to print a few parts, I decided to "drop back & punt" and am now doing it the old fashioned-way: saw/file/fettle a piece of aluminum into the desired form. This was my stopping point about an hour ago when I decided it was time for bangerzz, eggzz & coffeez.

And these are very low coil current relays (NEC MR62-24SB).  Been doing some light googling of that ratio transformer I scored, seems it's a very nice piece of kit indeed, with 8 decade versions able to embarrass a 3458A      Even my 7 decade unit seems to be valued by some:
https://www.torontosurplus.com/gertsch-singer-model-1011-ac-ratio-standard-in-stock-z1.html

Yup. They're 20 min from my home.  If y'all find something you desperately want I can MITM it for you; at least save you the first leg of shipping by picking up in person. Their prices are "low resale"; they're in the biz, so they do know what they've got. But for selling to commercial customers, their prices are quite reasonable, at least in my own comparisons against TEQ. Obviously not "Ferengi Low" like the occasional steal of a deal from fleaBay; but if you NEED a piece of equipment with warranty, they should be a good option.

mnem

[med6753]

the 561 passed smoke test today, so that's nice

it has a trace, but any working vert plugin pulls it hard down, so I gotta figure that out...

Define "hard down". Causes power issues or forces the trace off screen?

trace off screen

all voltages are correct and are present at the vert connector

if you power the frame with no vert plugin the trace is normal

I'm a bit confused actually, as there is NO deflection circuitry in the frame, it is just a wire from the plugin connector to the CRT pin.

In order for the trace to be centered there has to be an equal voltage on the vertical deflection plates. Install the vertical plug-in. Center it's position pot, then measure the voltage on the vertical deflection plates. If unequal it will force the trace up or down.

[Specmaster]

Just checked the delivery of BC182's and I pulled this data sheet from the web and its utter shit, anyone following would be installing them with the Emitter and Collector leads reversed 

Hmm, I checked your datasheet and looked in the web for other sources. They are all agreeing.







Edit:
screenshot from your datasheet:

Yep, totally agree with that, I had already checked others and found out my suspicions were right. At first I thought I had been supplied transistors that were incorrectly labelled but nope, a case of duff reference material 

[Cerebus]

I take people on individual merit not qualifications. Had to tell a couple of grads from fairly respectable universities to piss off recently.

Same here. Being able to accrue qualifications and being able to actually do something are two completely different beasts. I mean, look at the people running the country - typically primary and secondary education at the best schools that money can buy (expensive prep school then Eton, Harrow, etc*) and then a degree from Oxford or Cambridge. Yet still they can't manage the comparatively simple job of getting some PPE to our hospitals - even when equipped with emergency powers that basically mean they can turn around to any suitably equipped factory and say "make this". I could name several people from this thread alone who I'm certain could get the job done inside a week as long as their hands weren't tied behind their backs.

Being educated and competent has never been a priority for our ruling classes. The only things they have to be competent at are supervising others and not being ejected from position (royal family) or power (politicians). Dog help us.

Don't forget the people in actual power, the senior civil servants and those who are being groomed to become them. They also went to the same collection of Boy's Clubs and are equally as incompetent (with a very few exceptions - who are usually small unassuming men who could make Niccolo Machiavelli blush and almost always work for the Cabinet Office).

[WastelandTek]

In order for the trace to be centered there has to be an equal voltage on the vertical deflection plates. Install the vertical plug-in. Center it's position pot, then measure the voltage on the vertical deflection plates. If unequal it will force the trace up or down.

I get that

I am, shall we say, respectful, of anything going on with the CRT.

What kind of voltages should I expect on the deflection plates?

[mnementh]

@Cerebus: If you want to find the source of the corruption, follow the money back to the "lifers". Everyone else is just a fucking pawn. They are too; but they sit at the Left Hand of Darkness, so they feel entitled. 

mnem
 

[med6753]

In order for the trace to be centered there has to be an equal voltage on the vertical deflection plates. Install the vertical plug-in. Center it's position pot, then measure the voltage on the vertical deflection plates. If unequal it will force the trace up or down.

I get that

I am, shall we say, respectful, of anything going on with the CRT.

What kind of voltages should I expect on the deflection plates?

Of course, be careful working in that area. Vertical deflection voltage should typically be about +150V on each plate.

[mnementh]

Pee on it and find out.

mnem
tzzzt.

[WastelandTek]

thanks Med

soon as I get it together to put some pants on I'll go out and have a look

[med6753]

Pee on it and find out.

mnem
tzzzt.

You didn't get enough jollies by pissing on electric fences?

[mnementh]

Pee on it and find out.

mnem
tzzzt.

You didn't get enough jollies by pissing on electric fences?

Just sharing the joy, buddy. 

mnem
 

[Saskia]

at school we used to bet with the boys: bet you 10 Marks that you cannot hit the fence with your piss.
I lost the money, but it was totally worth it.