Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Mr. Scram]

Corrosion is one thing but some are known to spring leaks too. Not very common but also not a lot of fun.

[mnementh]

OMG!!! It MIGHT leak! OMG!!! I MIGHT buy a POS AIO cooler! OMG!!! The angry pixies MIGHT bite me on the nose because I was fiddling around in my computer’s innards!!!

Of the three, the last is the only one reasonably LIKELY to happen.

You know what ELSE might happen? You might get several years out of your AIO with zero issues like most users of the technology, and enjoy the benefits of a much quieter PC with a happier CPU running much cooler for most of its life, which FOR SURE will happen for as long as the cooler operates normally.

Again, you’re talking statistically insignificant numbers. You are both playing the “what if” game as if the odds were an “OMG!!!    BBQ!!!” phenomenon somehow more likely than the statistical outliers those cases are.

   The technology has matured to the point that even cheapies are made of decent glas-reinforced plastics, have a proper micro-grooved copper cold plate, and ceramic bearings on the impeller. Improper design choices like non-PH-neutral coolant with aluminum radiators, etc aside, there is no good reason not to be able to expect at least 2 years of service from a sealed cooler; in which case you either service it or replace it or let it run until you see problems.

Most of us wouldn’t dream of running any PC for 2 years without servicing a conventional cooler; even 1 year for the really attentive among us. The only difference here is the nature of the service.

Seriously; they are a commodity product now, like PSUs and case fans themselves. I’ve seen people spend a lot more replacing case fans than even a name brand AIO costs.

But hey... feel free to stick with whiny dinosaur coolers. Whatever blows your kilt up.

The rest of us will enjoy our nice cool & happy Ryzens that scream silently. 

mnem
*~tzzzzt~*

[med6753]

We don't need no freaking water cooling...

 

[mnementh]

bitch. 

mnem
 

[0culus]

On today's edition of crazy overpriced stuff on fleabay, we have a Tektronix 555 display unit...NO power supply...for north of 4 kilobucks.     

https://www.ebay.com/itm/TEKTRONIX-TYPE-555-DUAL-BEAM-OSCILLOSCOPE-1969-SERIAL-000631/143402679173?hash=item2163773b85:g:oJIAAOSwYsJdl79O

[beanflying]

....
But hey... feel free to stick with whiny dinosaur coolers. Whatever blows your kilt up.

The rest of us will enjoy our nice cool & happy Ryzens that scream silently. 

mnem
*~tzzzzt~*

I have not seen any figures to back up reduced noise claims with even say the current gen stock Ryzen coolers. It may have held some weight when Intel was packaging shit with theirs but a pump and generally 2-3 fans attached to the case and associated resonance I doubt noise reduction is a positive. If noise is a claimed advantage then spend similar $ on an aftermarket air cooler will see it lost if not a negative to water cooling of both main types over air.

Examples of Intel shit air coolers using the @med example

[mansaxel]

Edit: 428B ground fault is in the mains transformer. Wonder what happened to it. Need me a parts unit, because that transformer surely is unobtanium without a donor.

Is the transformer primary or secondary shorted to ground?
If it definitely is the transformer then you will need patience to find a cheap one for parts (usually missing the probe), they do appear in Europe occasionally.

So far I have established that one of the two primary windings is shorted. Unsoldered the secondaries yesterday but did not have time to measure them in isolation. Yeah, a parts unit without the probe is my likely next step.  Some donors probably are good enough that one just moves the probe and realigns the combination to be in spec. I guess. Never done it.

I did buy a parts one a few years that was missing most of the switches, the fuse holder & power neon, I didn't expect to find the transformer missing when I opened it up, a few of the circuit boards were also missing, but they left almost all of the vacuum bulbs. 
It also came with a factory assembly failure, a resistor with the leads left long, almost touching the case.

David

Ouch.

[worsthorse]

At the risk of pissing someone off for being on topic, in this post, I am going to talk about Test Equipment.   

First, on the two 191s I just fixed, the case was held in place with strapping tape. And both had the corners of the case bent in the back to keep the case from sliding.



It bugged me no end. After some noodling, I decided to fasten the case to the frame by drilling and tapping a hole through this bar:



So now the bottom looks like this:



And the case no longer slides. Took about thirty minutes to fix both of them.

I now have three DMMs and four Tek signal generators for the Salem hamfest. All are clean and working to spec. Goal is to get three more done this week but that depends on parts showing up from Mouser, along with the TE gods smiling upon my little corner of the PNW.

edit: I looked at the photos and the fact that I used a non-Tek, non-pozi screw is making me crazy. So tomorrow I will dig out the bag of 8-32 pozi hardware and replace that shiny thing with the proper dull-looking tek-compliant screw.  Even though I hope it is sold in a week.   

[worsthorse]

More TE posting. I am clearly a malcontent...

About my new toy. It used to be something that every ham with a high end Yaesu, Kenwood or Icom rig just had to have...



A multiscope! It goes between the radio and the antenna and allows you to, among other things, inject signals into the audio chain and watch the resulting RF output. This version could also be used as a band scope when seeing 20K of the band was a very big deal. I powered it up today and got an appropriately wiggly line on the screen. I am going to do a full teardown and tuneup; will probably post the thread over in the RF and Ham area.  More to follow.

[beanflying]

At the risk of pissing someone off for being on topic, in this post, I am going to talk about Test Equipment.   

.....

How dare you. Let me get out my wet lettuce leaf to punish you  Gratuitous TEA shot to help keep on topic 

Made 3D printed cable racks decided I needed to re arrange the floor plan of the shack bulk mess not shown

[med6753]

On today's edition of crazy overpriced stuff on fleabay, we have a Tektronix 555 display unit...NO power supply...for north of 4 kilobucks.     

https://www.ebay.com/itm/TEKTRONIX-TYPE-555-DUAL-BEAM-OSCILLOSCOPE-1969-SERIAL-000631/143402679173?hash=item2163773b85:g:oJIAAOSwYsJdl79O

Crazy overpriced doesn't begin to describe the attempted robbery. 

[bd139]

That is certainly taking the piss that one is. I’m starting to see that more often here as well. Something is vintage and weighs more than a couple of kg and this triggers the rip off bastards 

At least it hasn’t got a light bulb screwed to the top.

[BU508A]

At least it hasn’t got a light bulb screwed to the top.

You mean like the gear from this guy?

[BU508A]

Made 3D printed cable racks decided I needed to re arrange the floor plan of the shack bulk mess not shown

In the upper shelf, the thing with the two red binding posts, is this a Fluke 895A?

[beanflying]

Made 3D printed cable racks decided I needed to re arrange the floor plan of the shack bulk mess not shown

In the upper shelf, the thing with the two red binding posts, is this a Fluke 895A?

Yep. Repost pic from early in the week below.

Needs some love on the mechanics and also some recapping but it works ok as is.

WARNING OFF TOPIC BELOW TOO Evil air cooled MITX is heading for the Laser tomorrow '101'

[mansaxel]

Is the transformer primary or secondary shorted to ground?

So far I have established that one of the two primary windings is shorted. Unsoldered the secondaries yesterday but did not have time to measure them in isolation. Yeah, a parts unit without the probe is my likely next step.  Some donors probably are good enough that one just moves the probe and realigns the combination to be in spec. I guess. Never done it.

hp 427 (hi, bd139!) says all secondary and primary windings have a reasonable DC resistance end-to-end.
Hand-crank Megger says that all secondary windings are end-of scale insulated from ground, when unsoldered from PCB.
Megger also agrees that one of the primary windings is OK, while the other one has a short to chassis.

The short appears to be very close to one end of the winding; the resistance to ground as measured by the 427 is way under 1Ω in that end, while a few percent, at most, off of the whole-winding resistance in the other.

(edit: I can't write English without looking at it after it's posted. Long closed feedback loop)

[BU508A]

(edit: I can't write English without looking at it after it's posted. Long closed feedback loop)

Same here.  Even a re-adjustment of the PID params didn't help.     

[med6753]

You guys do just fine with your written English.  Don't fret over it, we understand what you are trying to say.


You should see my Swedish and German. 

[VK5RC]

Sorry to go off topic, but not PC cooling.
No drummer worth his salt plays for money - he plays for booze! Any one can do it singly - doing it as a corps - much cooler!
Below is a classic.
https://youtu.be/EQyGjRW63EE

[Specmaster]

@bd139 You say you want a decent keyboard, let me suggest one that I think is well worthy of consideration, I have tried and had many keyboards over the years, membrane and mechanical types in all price ranges from almost give away free types upto ones costing well over £100 and I have to say that I think I have come across a real gem of a keyboard which I have been using for about a year now and it is a real joy to use. Its a mechanical gaming keyboard with many features and well constructed with key roll over and lighting effects etc and can be sourced from aliexpress and many other places

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33004368373.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000060.3.df5c6d78iMlHWm&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.128609.0&scm_id=1007.13339.128609.0&scm-url=1007.13339.128609.0&pvid=594ba315-9c01-41c4-b7a3-68983631a4b4 

I also agree with the 32GB RAM, it does make a lot difference to certain programs but in normal day to day usage then 16GB is plenty. One of the first things I do with all of my PC's is max out the RAM and when using AutoCAD the 32GB I have is certainly noticeable     


EDIT:
On the topic of air/water cooling, I've used both and I have to say that it is now my preference to go with water cooling as I have discovered, yes it is more expensive than the supplied stock air cooler but is often not that much more expensive then some of the better after market air coolers but are far quieter and certain achieve a greater cooling effect, often get typically temps at least 15 to 20C lower from water cooling which if your into over clocking provides a greater margin for overclocking and retain stability. The first water cooler I installed was 11 years ago and that particular PC one of my sons now has and the water cooler is providing good effective cooling and has never leaked.

[tggzzz]

(edit: I can't write English without looking at it after it's posted. Long closed feedback loop)

Neither can many English people, whether or not they realise it and whether or not they have any feedback loop The worst choose to open the feedback loop.

[med6753]

(edit: I can't write English without looking at it after it's posted. Long closed feedback loop)

Neither can many English people, whether or not they realise it and whether or not they have any feedback loop The worst choose to open the feedback loop.

So true. 

[mansaxel]

The short appears to be very close to one end of the winding; the resistance to ground as measured by the 427 is way under 1Ω in that end, while a few percent, at most, off of the whole-winding resistance in the other.

Very close to the end indeed.  Our friends at -- hp -- apparently had some assembly quality issues with late-model 428b's. First we read about the non-finished solder job here and then this. This, of course, is much harder to locate; if the insulation is still soft and not squeezed out it will of course not arc over until the unit is shipped to the customer. I suspect it was the TE equivalent of a hangar queen where it was used. Just stood on a shelf and noone wanted to use it. 

Looking at the otherwise spotless chassis there is evidence of arcing where this was pressed onto chassis:



Some thin shrink tubing and careful wire dressing should fix this, I hope. But first, I got so excited that I had to tell you.

[BU508A]

Yep. Repost pic from early in the week below.

Needs some love on the mechanics and also some recapping but it works ok as is.

Looks like yours is in a better shape than mine. I have here one sitting in my queue for some time.
When I opened it the first time and looked a bit closer I decided do put it together again and wait
for a second one. Explanation is in the pictures below. And if I could find this chap who did this
bodge, he has to answer some serious questions! 

Front view, looking for cleaning


Damaged binding posts:


Backside, wired for 115V AC. And this nightmare of an AC mains connector will be replaced. 


The PSU on the backside, the date code of the power transistors is 8616, seems there was a repair.
The instrument itself has been probably built in 1972, some caps have a date code of 7117.


Yep. Compared to the other solder joints it looks newer.


Candidates for recapping.


Transformers.


They are wired, of course! 


Nice PCB with some more candidates for recapping.


Burnt PCB! Honestly, I don't understand why the PCB is burnt at this place.
I suspect a massive abuse of this poor little instrument.    


Here is a more detailed view of it.


Missing transistor (below the left blue capacitor)


This! This is a really ugly bodge! Really, who is doing this?
Cutting the wire like that of a valuable and high precision resistor?   


The other side of this ugly bodge.


To bring down my blood pressure, a nice picture of these golden trimpots. Like them.


Rotating switch with some 0.5% resistors.


Mechanics of the switches. Very nice!


A more detailed view.


Now let's see what I can find in the bay ...   

[beanflying]

Mine is still a few down the list to get to. Getting one with a working photo chopper seems to be part of the luck of the draw. The paint and main case on mine is fairly rough but the rest of it is not to bad.