Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 16756144 times)

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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8200 on: March 05, 2018, 07:35:43 am »
Was thinking about going for the Anet A8. You can grab it for £170. Lots of meddling and upgrades required but that's what I'm in it for.

If you want, you can tune / mod this printer. In the German version of the "Make:"  magazine is a nice article on how to do this:

https://www.heise.de/make/meldung/Qualitaets-3D-Drucker-selbstgebaut-Upgrades-fuer-den-Anet-A8-3975071.html

To me, this is looking very reasonable.
I can scan the whole article if you want and send it to you as a .pdf
“Chaos is found in greatest abundance wherever order is being sought. It always defeats order, because it is better organized.”            - Terry Pratchett -
 

Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8201 on: March 05, 2018, 07:58:12 am »
"Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them. Those who DO learn these lessons are equally doomed; but to stand by powerless as those around them repeat those mistakes."

So true. ::)
I think that in the case of companies, the rot seems to set in when they get to a certain size ,not sure what that size is but it's at the point when they have reached their potential without organic growth through acquisitions or diversification into new prodycts/markets is when the greed factor kicks in. Before that point the income seems to be reasonable stable and they can see the nest egg pot growing at a reasonable rate. When that egg is is small it doubles in size fairly quickly, but as it grows in size if income remains fairly constant, speed of it doubling again gets slower in proportion.

The rate the wealth is being added pales into insignificance if the owners mindset is that they expect to see a doubling of their assets in a similar time scale to the first one. This is often also exasperated if their personal expenditure goes through the roof on massive homes with loads of land attached,  several holidays a year, not normal ones but ones that the average person can only dream about etc.

That's when they start to reduce business expenses rather than cutting back on profit taking to finance their new found extravagant ways in order to keep appearances up with their other wealthy neighbours and friends that they mix with.

I have witnessed this happening personally where they suddenly think that are far better then the people whose loyalty, blood sweat and tears have built their business upto it's natural potential and without further investment it's growth is limited. It's so often those very loyal people who ultimately pay the price for their bosses greed.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2018, 08:00:27 am by Specmaster »
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8202 on: March 05, 2018, 08:10:56 am »
Everything humans do turns to shit if there are more than three people involved with equal standing.  Best thing is to be a money grabbing disloyal leech underling with a penchant for social engineering of the CxO class. Sell them a new invisible gown for a high fee. Also develop mindshare for the brainwashed by being a good person in contrast. Formidable force against asshattery then. I fight for the users. 

Was thinking about going for the Anet A8. You can grab it for £170. Lots of meddling and upgrades required but that's what I'm in it for.

If you want, you can tune / mod this printer. In the German version of the "Make:"  magazine is a nice article on how to do this:

https://www.heise.de/make/meldung/Qualitaets-3D-Drucker-selbstgebaut-Upgrades-fuer-den-Anet-A8-3975071.html

To me, this is looking very reasonable.
I can scan the whole article if you want and send it to you as a .pdf

Thanks for the link. I’ve found a whole pile of info on these. I’ve got a best price of £139 inc tax/duty so far. Also found a company that will sell me 2020 alu frame parts pre cut so you can replace the acrylic parts. They are perfectly acceptable out of box but longevity is bad due to the acrylic parts apparently and the belt drive is a little crap due to no tensioners.
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8203 on: March 05, 2018, 03:15:59 pm »
https://www.ebay.com/itm/231572342806

https://www.ebay.com/itm/231648714903

https://us.banggood.com/Wholesale-Warehouse-Tevo-Standard-Tarantula-Prusa-I3-DIY-3D-Printer-Kit-200x200x200mm-Printing-Size-175mm-04mm-Nozzle-wp-Usa-1186275.html

The Tarantula is cheapest because they use acrylic for some of the carriage parts. There are aftermarket replacements in aluminum quite cheap; look them up on FB. All these vendors do ship to the UK or have UK warehouses.

mnem
*Off to work*
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8204 on: March 05, 2018, 04:09:26 pm »
Thanks for the links. TEVO tarantula is a no because of the arm guide wheels wear out quickly apparently and make it impossible to level after only a few weeks. If it had a stepper for each side, might be a bit difference. The Anet A8 while wobblier to start with doesn't get any wobblier over time.

What I really want is a hardware kit (frame, extruder, linear bearings etc) and add my own RAMPS board, extruder, hot plate, steppers and power supply to it.

I'm considering building one from scratch if I'm honest as I can get 2020 frame parts and fitting cut to order for it for £105 here in the UK delivered to my door. Might cost more but everything will be repairable. I've noticed that some of the cheaper ones are impossible to get bits for.
 

Offline ChrisLX200

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8205 on: March 05, 2018, 05:50:53 pm »
For £253 you can currently get the Wanhao 4S - same as the one I have now - it's a very good printer and I paid an awful lot more than that. Look up the reviews if you like.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wanhao-4S-Duplicator-Printer-Extruder/dp/B00NZT8O9W/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1520272067&sr=8-1&keywords=Wanhao+4S
 

Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8206 on: March 05, 2018, 06:18:30 pm »
That is on the short list as well  :-+

I’ve got a big spreadsheet going  ;D
 

Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8207 on: March 05, 2018, 06:40:06 pm »
That looks like a nice and sturdy printer.
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8208 on: March 05, 2018, 06:42:45 pm »
Also has a higher wife acceptance factor as well  :-DD
 

Offline ChrisLX200

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8209 on: March 05, 2018, 06:44:46 pm »
It is. The rigid steel box-frame is what makes it accurate. Plenty of DIY upgrades if you are so inclined but I just used it mostly as-is, I wanted good quality output without much messing about. Frankly at that price I would snap their arm off because it still sells at over twice that (and worth it even compared to others at the original price). No idea why these are being sold off at this price - it grates to think I paid ~£700 a couple years ago.
 

Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8210 on: March 05, 2018, 06:44:56 pm »
Arh, yes smaller footprint always helps there, but is it big enough for your needs?
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8211 on: March 05, 2018, 06:47:03 pm »
ALL of the cheapie 3DPrinters are a compromise, but I can tell you from personal experience that the acrylic frame design is not a "does not hold up well" problem; it is a "breaks while you're building it and costs you lots of assache and delay" problem. Seriously: RUN, DO NOT WALK in the opposite direction.


The Tarantula was my 2nd machine; I can recommend it as an entry-level unit. Next step up is the Geeetech or the FolgerTech, depending on which architecture you prefer. All are Prusa i3 based. The "Wobble issue" is greatly overblown and directly related to how carefully you build. Arm guide wear is "armchair QB" hooey; IRL it holds up well over time. The aluminum upgrade kit has a version with all the hardware to easily add a second Z-axis stepper, or you can do it yourself with generic stepper motor mounts or make duplicates of the existing plates yourself.

Strengths of the Tarantula are: works out of the box (unless you get duff electronics; these are all made of the cheapest generic 3DP parts available) solid frame, very fine resolution for the price point, uses real leadscrew on the z-axis, 200 x 200 x 280 build volume for dirt cheap and most of all, a solid base design that is easily upgraded in cheap increments.

Weaknesses are: Single rail on Y-axis works, can be fiddly but is easily and cheaply upgradable. Getting/keeping frame square can be fiddly, you have to be willing to drill/tap some end screws and add some 20¢ angles; recommended as part of initial build. Getting carriage square can be fiddly ( I believe this is entirely dependent on getting main frame built square first); I had zero problem with mine first try, but others reported unable to get tight & square and breaking acrylic carriage parts as a result.

Given the cost, I feel I did well. If I'd had a little more money at the outset, I'd have gone with the FolgerTech base 4020 model or the GeeeTech all-Aluminum model with LCD, or one of their middle-range models if I had a little more money still.

When I was shopping them, the GeeeTech used threaded rod instead of leadscrews; not sure if this is still the case. It's great strength is that ALL axes are built in relation to one single piece of flat plate; if that plate arrives perfectly flat, it's hard NOT to get a perfectly square build. If not... well, you can spend forever trying to get it right. This geometry is what the acrylic designs try to capitalize on, but you'd have to build out of 1/2" sheet to get the rigidity and strength you really need.

The FolgerTech has a little better hardware for a little more money, is dual Z-stepper and dual Y-axis rails out of the box, but of course you have to assemble a 4020 frame and get it perfectly square, just like the Tarantula.

The current version Large-volume Tarantula appears to come with the same capacitive proximity sensor for auto-leveling I added to mine; it also appears to have a better head and Bowden drive. If I had room for a 2nd unit, I'd still consider another one over the FolgerTech & GeeeTech simply due to cost.

The Wanhao has a lot of fanatical users, but it is known to have bed leveling inconsistency issues inherent in the design. The frame is sturdy enough to stand on, but it is easy to build a parallelogram instead of a cube if the machine stamping the holes cocks up. Yes, this is a thing with these. And of course, it costs considerably more than the above entry level machines for a very small build volume.

Cheers,

mnem
*Reflecting deeply on my pants*
« Last Edit: March 05, 2018, 06:50:33 pm by mnementh »
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8212 on: March 05, 2018, 06:47:58 pm »
Maybe its another Amazon pricing like the Drot items a week ago?
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline ChrisLX200

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8213 on: March 05, 2018, 06:49:41 pm »
It's build size is less than some others, but big enough for my needs. And larger projects can be broken down to components:

 

Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8214 on: March 05, 2018, 06:52:45 pm »
Neat power supply enclosure, can't find what you want? 3D print it then, really handy. 
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8215 on: March 05, 2018, 06:53:28 pm »
I'm sorry... for the money the Wanhao usually costs, I'd get 2 FolgerTechs in a heartbeat. Simply no comparison. No, actually, one FolgerTech and a year's worth of filament.  :-DD


mnem
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Offline ChrisLX200

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8216 on: March 05, 2018, 07:01:31 pm »

...

The Wanhao has a lot of fanatical users, but it is known to have bed leveling inconsistency issues inherent in the design. The frame is sturdy enough to stand on, but it is easy to build a parallelogram instead of a cube if the machine stamping the holes cocks up. Yes, this is a thing with these. And of course, it costs considerably more than the above entry level machines for a very small build volume.

Cheers,

mnem
*Reflecting deeply on my pants*

Never had an issue with bed levelling myself so didn't go to the trouble of installing a self-levelling mod.

Much of what you say is correct with reference to the budget end of the 3D printer range available today. All have some issues but so long as the fundemental mechanics and structure is sound then DIY mods will cure them. There's nothing you can do with something that is basically flimsy and which flexes. For myself, it was just the cooling (for PLA) so I added a fan for the extruders, computer controlled during printing via Simply3D. An all-metal hot end would be nice but again, never found the need. There are some crappy fans inside which rattle eventually and I replaced a couple of them.

Got to use decent filament and once you find one (manufacturer) that works stick with it. Cheap filament is more trouble than it's worth.
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8217 on: March 05, 2018, 07:57:47 pm »
Well, no... the bed leveling/wobbling issues on the Duplicator series are a matter of how the Y-Z axes work; just google "Wanhao grinding"  or "Wanhao grinding bed" and you'll get oodles of hits. IMO it's a fundamentally flawed design, and it carries through from the first revisions to the current ones.

Filament is a tradeoff; price vs convenience. Get a good printhead with clean, smooth insides set up and sealed up properly and you can print well with the cheapest stuff out there; it just takes a willingness to do a number of test prints to get it dialed-in. I've seen people print with weedeater filament.   :o

Of course, this isn't the kind of experimentation that the average noob wants to get into.  :-DD

mnem
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« Last Edit: March 05, 2018, 08:18:03 pm by mnementh »
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Offline URI

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8218 on: March 05, 2018, 08:22:06 pm »
I bought a HP 6114A from a guy in the US.
Found it on *bay as buy now/make an offer. After negotiating a little I got it for $41.
Ok, Buyer's Premium plus taxes are more than double of the price*.   :palm:

And I don't really need it, I just wanted it for quite a while..   :palm:
(I've got powerful supplies and an DC voltage/current calibrator accurate to 10-5V)

On the other hand it's a very nice power supply with outstanding accuracy in a relatively compact form factor that will fit on my bench nicely.  :-+

It has an issue and it's now sitting on my repair list.   :)
(Will post with pics..)

*-Over here in Germany it's offered quite rarely for an interesting price. Most offers are far more expensive than the over all cost of my recently acquired unit.
A life without TEA is possible but pointless.
 

Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8219 on: March 05, 2018, 08:33:26 pm »
Just a heads up for anyone in the UK who picked up one of those TT TF930 counters on ebay a while back and then didn't get to replace the knackered NiMH batteries because one certain BD139 cleaned out CPC's stock of them - they have some more in stock now. Part number is GP250AFH1A1P.
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8220 on: March 05, 2018, 08:34:30 pm »
I bought a HP 6114A from a guy in the US.
Found it on *bay as buy now/make an offer. After negotiating a little I got it for $41.
Ok, Buyer's Premium plus taxes are more than double of the price*.   :palm:

And I don't really need it, I just wanted it for quite a while..   :palm:
(I've got powerful supplies and an DC voltage/current calibrator accurate to 10-5V)

On the other hand it's a very nice power supply with outstanding accuracy in a relatively compact form factor that will fit on my bench nicely.  :-+

It has an issue and it's now sitting on my repair list.   :)
(Will post with pics..)

*-Over here in Germany it's offered quite rarely for an interesting price. Most offers are far more expensive than the over all cost of my recently acquired unit.

These are a rock-solid unit; they typically go over here as low as US$60-80 plus ~$45 shipping in working condition. Easy to upgrade to digital meters if you have a mind to as well.


*Wanders off after his mind which is already wandering...*
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Offline URI

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8221 on: March 05, 2018, 09:00:55 pm »
I bought a HP 6114A from a guy in the US.
Found it on *bay as buy now/make an offer. After negotiating a little I got it for $41.
Ok, Buyer's Premium plus taxes are more than double of the price*.   :palm:
[..]

These are a rock-solid unit; they typically go over here as low as US$60-80 plus ~$45 shipping in working condition. Easy to upgrade to digital meters if you have a mind to as well.

Shipping costs and customs are hurting me a bit..   :rant:
But what I already read about the 6114A it's an outstanding power supply regarding accuracy and useful voltage/current span.   :-+

And I like the design -I won't mess that up by changing the meter to digital.

It's the classic version with metal toggle switch and precision current dial.
A life without TEA is possible but pointless.
 

Offline ChrisLX200

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8222 on: March 05, 2018, 10:09:30 pm »
Well, no... the bed leveling/wobbling issues on the Duplicator series are a matter of how the Y-Z axes work; just google "Wanhao grinding"  or "Wanhao grinding bed" and you'll get oodles of hits. IMO it's a fundamentally flawed design, and it carries through from the first revisions to the current ones.

Filament is a tradeoff; price vs convenience. Get a good printhead with clean, smooth insides set up and sealed up properly and you can print well with the cheapest stuff out there; it just takes a willingness to do a number of test prints to get it dialed-in. I've seen people print with weedeater filament.   :o

Of course, this isn't the kind of experimentation that the average noob wants to get into.  :-DD

mnem
"Hello; you've reached mnem's pants. mnem isn't currently in his pants; can I take a message?"

Not seeing that particular issue over the last few years of use, though I did get a bad ball bearing which I had to replace. Z-axis and bed have been fine.

Cannot agree with the 'any filament will do' comment, experience tells me that is simply incorrect. I have two spools of 3D Prima ABS which will not print well with any settings whatsoever. If you were in the UK I would mail the damn things to you to prove it.
 

Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8223 on: March 05, 2018, 10:29:48 pm »
Just a heads up for anyone in the UK who picked up one of those TT TF930 counters on ebay a while back and then didn't get to replace the knackered NiMH batteries because one certain BD139 cleaned out CPC's stock of them - they have some more in stock now. Part number is GP250AFH1A1P.

Mwuhahahaha  >:D

And on the subject of counters, I got my QRP Labs QCX transceiver today so will be disappearing for a few days to build and play with it. 3 hours in so far. I've got an excuse to actually use my TEA acquisitions on this one. The big test point marked FREQ in the middle of the board is demanding that I need my TF930 counter plugged into a 10MHz GPSDO however.

Now on that subject, and more TEA, this is the fucking business (to speak in Londonese): http://www.qrp-labs.com/vfo.html .... you can put their GPS kit (!) and OCXO kit (!) in it and it's a GPS backed frequency synthesizer which has two outputs. One can go to your counter as a 10MHz reference. Bingo!

 :scared: I neeeeeed that!  :scared:

Their kits are really nice quality too. Here's the QCX so far:



And no I couldn't be arsed to wind the toroids tonight :D
 

Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #8224 on: March 05, 2018, 10:40:10 pm »
Looking really good so far, and even old school method of mounting resistors in an effort to keep the PCB as small as possible, nice and neat but makes reading the ratings a little difficult once the board is fully populated  :-+
Who let Murphy in?

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