Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Specmaster]

Is it just me or are others also experiencing same thing?> What is this thing?

Why it's Ebay of course, I've been amazed just lately by the stupid prices that some people are willing to pay really what I would call stupid money for something that is sold with no warranty or returns allowed where the seller states "powers on" but no further tests have been done. Many many times have I seen this mentioned in the items description but then the photos don't show it powered up, why the fuck not??

I don't know about anyone else, but if it powers up, then I'd expect to see some photographic evidence of that 

[neo]

Well the ID-22 i'm bidding on shows the light lit up and is described as powering on but not tested.

[bd139]

If it says its been powered up and isn't powered up and arrives knackered then it's likely a hefty discount. Hence my Tek 2225 which cost me £29 in the end. Talking of which, bought some probes for that a few days ago. Wittig ones: £13 for two sets including delivery. Nice probes for the money and good to 100MHz.

My Fluke 8000A is being delivered tomorrow by Herpes, oops sorry I mean Hermes. Wonder what that will entail. Will it be the "back fence shot put" or the "front fence javelin"...

[Specmaster]

Yes, sometimes you do get photos that show lights or a display but other times you get photos of what appears to be a dead piece of gear.

Only yesterday there was on Ebay UK, a Keithley 175 sold with that description for £36, the LCD screen could have been useless because of screen bleed etc, 2 Bose Soundlink Mini's, both described as not switching on, one was beaten well beaten up with the metal speaker grill showing cuts in it and scuff marks but they both sold for over £60 and there's no guarantee that they can be repaired and they are now a discontinued item from Bose??

[neo]

 Well i won the ID-22 and i've bought the op-amps for my 8400A. At this point, stick a fork in me, I've blown through this month's budget AND next month's.

[Specmaster]

If it says its been powered up and isn't powered up and arrives knackered then it's likely a hefty discount. Hence my Tek 2225 which cost me £29 in the end. Talking of which, bought some probes for that a few days ago. Wittig ones: £13 for two sets including delivery. Nice probes for the money and good to 100MHz.

My Fluke 8000A is being delivered tomorrow by Herpes, oops sorry I mean Hermes. Wonder what that will entail. Will it be the "back fence shot put" or the "front fence javelin"...

If your Hermes driver reads this post it might be "Drop Kick" or a "Field Goal" from the kerb 

As to a hefty discount if it arrives knackered, might not always work with some of these so called disposal companies, many can't be bothered to answer questions in the first place.

[Specmaster]

Well i won the ID-22 and i've bought the op-amps for my 8400A. At this point, stick a fork in me, I've blown through this month's budget AND next month's.

Well thats taken care of Christmas then, its going to be a quiet one in your house then 

[bd139]

As to a hefty discount if it arrives knackered, might not always work with some of these so called disposal companies, many can't be bothered to answer questions in the first place.

I've had nothing but good service from my regular disposal companies. Got a munted plug and dinked banana socket on a Thurlby power supply and they refunded within an hour of complaining.

These look good for the cash (current line model - just needs a wall wart): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302532282969

[neo]

Well i won the ID-22 and i've bought the op-amps for my 8400A. At this point, stick a fork in me, I've blown through this month's budget AND next month's.

Well thats taken care of Christmas then, its going to be a quiet one in your house then 

Gifts have already been bought, most of what i spent could be seen as my gift in everything except the budget.

[Specmaster]

As to a hefty discount if it arrives knackered, might not always work with some of these so called disposal companies, many can't be bothered to answer questions in the first place.

I've had nothing but good service from my regular disposal companies. Got a munted plug and dinked banana socket on a Thurlby power supply and they refunded within an hour of complaining.

These look good for the cash (current line model - just needs a wall wart): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302532282969

Not bad, but LCD display and anyway, I got a nice frequency counter with LED's and goes upto 1.3GHz, plenty for me as a LF guy.

[Mr. Scram]

These look good for the cash (current line model - just needs a wall wart): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302532282969

Does "event counter mode" mean it's a universal counter too? They sure do seem to market it as one.

https://www.aimtti.com/product-category/frequency-counters/aim-tf900series

[Specmaster]

These look good for the cash (current line model - just needs a wall wart): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302532282969

Does "event counter mode" mean it's a universal counter too? They sure do seem to market it as one.

https://www.aimtti.com/product-category/frequency-counters/aim-tf900series

Yes it does, and the seller is a good seller as well, I have purchased from them before and on this type of gear they will take offers as they are out of their comfort zone with test gear, computers and computer bits is their bag. I got a HP3466A for almost half their asking price because it had a broken handle and scratchd face.

[bd139]

Yep universal counter. Current line item as well. 10 digit count. TCXO (1-8ppm).  Not cheap https://uk.rs-online.com/mobile/p/frequency-counters/6654919/

Edit: Fuck it. Merry Christmas to me.

[Specmaster]

Be aware though that if you are thinking of going for it and collecting it, that they ask for at least 24hrs notice of when you are to collect as often these items are not kept at their main site.

[mnementh]

Yep. I do that with stuff I get from China, but so far I have to be honest and say that I've found the quality to be of a reasonable standard, yes some of the traces have been a bit heavy with solder but then that was on a bench power supply so it was to be expected in some areas because of the current involved. Infact I have a HP scope that was made in Germany and some of the joints on it were far worse, in some cases it was like the waved the fumes of the iron over the connections, there was so little solder there to carry the currents and setting up hot spots that over the years have caused some nasty problems.

I've seen some nasty photos on line of genuine items and the counterfeit Chinese items where in many cases they have cut corners and in some cases clearly used parts salvaged from other gear, but I have never seen this in the flesh on the items I have purchased. Could it be that the photos I have seen are some years old and that China has improved in leaps and bounds since then? Many well known western companies have their products made in China, I've said it before, Apple for one does but not many people would be willing to say that Apple's products are craptastic.

No, I'm saying from personal experience that quality of soldering on any of this kind of "China-direct" hobbyist electronic gear needs to be double-checked; especially hand-soldering. I've gotten gear with only one wire out of three on a header actually soldered, and I've gotten solder bridges that would certainly have let the magic smoke out of something had I powered it up. And even their reflow & wave soldering needs to be double-checked; components only soldered on one side or misaligned by 3/4 of a pad are not uncommon.

There seems to be a quantum level of difference in quality control between anything they can sell direct as "hobbyist" gear vs stuff that is contract-manufactured as consumer goods; using Apple as an example is not reasonable, as they have their own engineers and inspectors all over FoxConn to ensure QC, and did the same with Samsung.


Cheers and good luck,


mnem
*Currently being dreadfully domestic*

[Specmaster]

Yep. I do that with stuff I get from China, but so far I have to be honest and say that I've found the quality to be of a reasonable standard, yes some of the traces have been a bit heavy with solder but then that was on a bench power supply so it was to be expected in some areas because of the current involved. Infact I have a HP scope that was made in Germany and some of the joints on it were far worse, in some cases it was like the waved the fumes of the iron over the connections, there was so little solder there to carry the currents and setting up hot spots that over the years have caused some nasty problems.

I've seen some nasty photos on line of genuine items and the counterfeit Chinese items where in many cases they have cut corners and in some cases clearly used parts salvaged from other gear, but I have never seen this in the flesh on the items I have purchased. Could it be that the photos I have seen are some years old and that China has improved in leaps and bounds since then? Many well known western companies have their products made in China, I've said it before, Apple for one does but not many people would be willing to say that Apple's products are craptastic.

No, I'm saying from personal experience that quality of soldering on any of this kind of "China-direct" hobbyist electronic gear needs to be double-checked; especially hand-soldering. I've gotten gear with only one wire out of three on a header actually soldered, and I've gotten solder bridges that would certainly have let the magic smoke out of something had I powered it up. And even their reflow & wave soldering needs to be double-checked; components only soldered on one side or misaligned by 3/4 of a pad are not uncommon.

There seems to be a quantum level of difference in quality control between anything they can sell direct as "hobbyist" gear vs stuff that is contract-manufactured as consumer goods; using Apple as an example is not reasonable, as they have their own engineers and inspectors all over FoxConn to ensure QC, and did the same with Samsung.


Cheers and good luck,


mnem
*Currently being dreadfully domestic*

Yeh, I was aware that Apple had their own inspectors looking things over on site, still didn't spot the children being employed though. I wasn't though for a single second suggesting that everything in their garden was rosy, I always open up and check everything from there before powering it up. I have some of things that come out of their hobbyist sector on other peoples Youtube channels like Bigvlivedotcom for instance and he has come across a real mixed bag of goodies. All I was saying, was that personally, I have not come across that made me question the wisdom of buying from China as yet.

[bd139]

Ugh some of the shit from China is awful. It’s fun finding out though.

This thread is my personal facepalm recently https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/how-did-this-even-get-through-qa-(chinese-boost-converter)/msg1364657/

[Specmaster]

Ugh some of the shit from China is awful. It’s fun finding out though.

This thread is my personal facepalm recently https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/how-did-this-even-get-through-qa-(chinese-boost-converter)/msg1364657/

And that also has some of the hallmarks I mentioned, that chip certainly looks like it has been salvaged from something else, but so far I've had nothing like that with my purchases to date.

[bitseeker]

Is it just me or are others also experiencing same thing?> What is this thing?

Why it's Ebay of course, I've been amazed just lately by the stupid prices that some people are willing to pay really what I would call stupid money for something that is sold with no warranty or returns allowed where the seller states "powers on" but no further tests have been done.

It's not just you. Sometimes I watch items just for the spectacle. There are lots of crazy people on eBay.

Many many times have I seen this mentioned in the items description but then the photos don't show it powered up, why the fuck not??

Because it takes time and effort to provide good and meaningful photos. Sellers who shift large volumes of "stuff" don't want to expend one millisecond more than they absolutely have to. Some don't even bother photographing the item — they just put the same logo/generic pic on every listing.

I don't know about anyone else, but if it powers up, then I'd expect to see some photographic evidence of that 

Yep. And some evidence that it actually displays, outputs, measures, etc.

[djos]

Turns out you you can get the OLED equipped T12-952 with the 9501 handle for $70 AUD including 5 tips ... I'm seriously tempted to sell of some Bitcoin and grab one! I've always wanted a station with the JL02 style tip for drag-soldering SMD chips.

Ok I caved and bought the single tip set for $56 plus the 10 tip pack for $30, for $86 delivered it was too cheap to pass up. 

Just had confirmation that my solder station and the 9501 handle has been dispatched, cant wait till it gets here 

Same, I'm looking forward to having a better range of tips to work with plus quick change is gong to be very handy.

[Specmaster]

Yes. The T12/T13/T15 cartridge system is a complete unitized heater and temp sensor hermetically sealed away from the atmosphere inside a stainless steel envelope. This addresses the eternal problem that eventually faces all of the old-fashioned slug-in-a-metal-tube type irons; slow response caused by oxidation between the tip and the heater, and inaccuracy caused by oxidation between the tip and the thermocouple/PTC temp sensor.

My MLiNK S4 is an awesome station that highlights this to the extreme; when the handle and tip are fresh and new it solders like a dream. It uses a high-frequency (switch-mode) power supply and a handle based on the now-defunct T-200 soldering head technology that can deliver 90W actual to the tip, plus has sleep mode and a crisp backlit LCD display with set and actual temps all inside a nice extruded AL case with metal face and back.

Tip and heating element are modular plug-in, which is convenient. But as the tip and the temp sensor age and get crusty response time gets worse, overshoot gets worse, everything runs too hot or too cold until you replace the tip and scrub the temp sensor clean with steel wool. Eventually the sensor gets to a point where it crusts up in a matter of hours and you just have to replace the whole handle; the heater is modular but the temp sensor is not.

I wouldn't wait on ordering the Ayima FX-9501 handle; it's on sale right now, and you'll want a spare handle even if your deal falls through and you order a different kit that comes with the right handle. The hack 907/937 handle that comes with is hazard to the controller; if the contacts jam and bend inward, which they eventually always do, they can short out the main power to the heating element. I was just lucky with mine.

mnem
Lessons learned the hard way...

Your point about the oxidisation was well proven today while attempting some modifications to my Heathkit V-7AU I thought to myself that my iron was not responding much to the heat I was putting into it, I had to turn the heat upto 420 to complete a joint that was simple to do. After letting it cool down, I took the tip off and you was right, the slug in the tip was loose and oxidised, so I took a new tip and fitted it and I was now able to solder the same joint at 300 on the display, and the old tip showed no signs of degradation on the outside.

With that, I'm now looking forward to getting my new T12 setup even more and waving that drop in performance goodbye.

Now I know that my Hakko 936D is a clone but I really can't see that a genuine Hakko 936D would have performed much differently given the conditions of the tip which was a genuine Hakko one anyway.

It makes me shudder now thinking back to how I used to use mains heated irons made by famous brands like Salon and Weller before, and even fitting new tips to them, never restored their performance they had when they were new. That makes the sound of the hermetically sealed T12 tips with their integrated heaters even more enticing. Looks like the thread about soldering stations taught me a lesson and did me a favour, so who says that you can't teach an old dog new tricks?     

[Mr. Scram]

According to the tracking, they attempted delivery just after 9, attempted delivery again a little over an hour later and actually delivered it two minutes later. However, they also advise me to pick up the item, but neglect to tell me where. The only city mentioned is quite a large distance away and not the obvious choice for something like this.

These guys do understand I actually need the package here, not somewhat near to where I am, right? "Close enough" doesn't really cut it in the packages business.

Package located. I repeat, package located! After running into a wall trying to contact the shipper, I decided to enter the tracking number into the trackers of a few random major shippers around here. Sure enough, one returned a hit, with an actual collection point and associated address.

Man, I love paying good money for no service at all

[djos]

Yep. I do that with stuff I get from China, but so far I have to be honest and say that I've found the quality to be of a reasonable standard, yes some of the traces have been a bit heavy with solder but then that was on a bench power supply so it was to be expected in some areas because of the current involved. Infact I have a HP scope that was made in Germany and some of the joints on it were far worse, in some cases it was like the waved the fumes of the iron over the connections, there was so little solder there to carry the currents and setting up hot spots that over the years have caused some nasty problems.

I've seen some nasty photos on line of genuine items and the counterfeit Chinese items where in many cases they have cut corners and in some cases clearly used parts salvaged from other gear, but I have never seen this in the flesh on the items I have purchased. Could it be that the photos I have seen are some years old and that China has improved in leaps and bounds since then? Many well known western companies have their products made in China, I've said it before, Apple for one does but not many people would be willing to say that Apple's products are craptastic.

I've had a pretty good run with my Chinesium purchases too - that said, I always inspect them before I power them on.

[Specmaster]

According to the tracking, they attempted delivery just after 9, attempted delivery again a little over an hour later and actually delivered it two minutes later. However, they also advise me to pick up the item, but neglect to tell me where. The only city mentioned is quite a large distance away and not the obvious choice for something like this.

These guys do understand I actually need the package here, not somewhat near to where I am, right? "Close enough" doesn't really cut it in the packages business.

Package located. I repeat, package located! After running into a wall trying to contact the shipper, I decided to enter the tracking number into the trackers of a few random major shippers around here. Sure enough, one returned a hit, with an actual collection point and associated address.

Man, I love paying good money for no service at all

Thats good news, so where was it in the end

[Mr. Scram]

Thats good news, so where was it in the end

A collection point at walking distance, though some people would vehemently disagree with the latter. I'm just very glad this isn't one of those 20 kilogram packages.