Siglent's new product- MSO/SDS2000 Series

[Carrington]

I haven't done a complete test, just have the printscreen. I haven't found the time about sequence,
but the time between history frames is about 25ms.

Exact it's ~ 25us, and sure that it will be improved in the future firmware versions.
I liked the time table, is a good idea. 
Thank you very much Herman. 

[Carrington]

So it has been sold in China for > 12 weeks without these functions?

Maybe it was not specified in the Chinese datasheet. 

[Herman]

First off, when I saw 25ms gaps, I said "ewww".  Luckily you turned List on, and it's really 25us (sometimes 26).  That's respectable.  I'm also glad to see it has a List, where you can check the frame time-stamps.   

Lastly, the 80,000 frames is very good.  But I'm not clear what the difference is between History and Sequence modes?

Added:  Is History like a dynamic, rolling Sequence mode?

I'm ashamed for my careless.
I haven't much time to test the two function right now, I will give a report later.

[Carrington]

I'm ashamed for my careless.
I haven't much time to test the two function right now, I will give a report later.

Please don't worry, for this, is an insignificant mistake. 

[Mark_O]

I'm ashamed for my careless.
I haven't much time to test the two function right now, I will give a report later.

Please don't worry, for this, is an insignificant mistake. 

Right you are.  Only off by 1,000x.  And just the difference between completely useless and quite useful. 

Totally insignificant.   

[It was a trivial typo, easily understandable, but with large consequences.]

[Mark_O]

I haven't done a complete test, just have the printscreen. I haven't found the time about sequence,
but the time between history frames is about 25ms.

Exact it's ~ 25us, and sure that it will be improved in the future firmware versions.

That's fascinating.  How are you sure that it will be improved in future versions? 

It's already respectable... the Agilent DSOX2000 is ~19-20us, so it seems far from certain to me that this will be improved.

[Carrington]

[It was a trivial typo, easily understandable, but with large consequences.]

Yeah right, tomorrow will be the end of the world for this. 
That the gods have mercy on us. 

[Carrington]

That's fascinating.  How are you sure that it will be improved in future versions? 

Just because I have mystical powers.  O0

It's already respectable... the Agilent DSOX2000 is ~19-20us, so it seems far from certain to me that this will be improved.

Yes, that says datasheet. But I think that has a lower value.

[Carrington]

RIGOL DS2000 HW. 1.0.

TB     re-arm    memory ------------------------------ 1us        ~52us    (14K) 1us      ~200us   (Auto) 500ns    ~52us   (Auto) 200ns    ~10us      " 100ns   ~6.5us      " 50ns        ~5us      " 20ns      ~75us  (140K) 20ns        ~7us    (14K) 20ns        ~4us   (Auto) 10ns     ~6.5us      " 5ns       ~6.5us      "

Note: May not be very exact and/or or correct (some values are suspiciously very low).
          For example, DSO6034A min. rearm time is 8us.

Technique used:
  - Train of square pulses (two) spaced in time, not repetitive.
  - Scope mode: normal, and using segmented memory.
  - And the gap between pulses (each whit different width) is increased until triggers occur.

[marmad]

Note: May not be very exact and/or or correct (some values are suspiciously very low).
          For example, DSO6034A min. rearm time is 8us.

Where are you pulling these DS2000 numbers from? Sorry, but I don't believe them - I've never seen a value less then ~20us. The rearm time is never going to be lower than the approximate maximum waveform update rate.

Yes, that says datasheet. But I think that has a lower value.

No, I believe the datasheet - the value corresponds to the maximum waveform update rate of the DSO. If the value was lower, they would put that in the datasheet.

[Carrington]

Where are you pulling these DS2000 numbers from? Sorry, but I don't believe them - I've never seen a value less then ~20us. The rearm time is never going to be lower than the maximum waveform update rate.

That is why I think they are incorrect, but that was the result. But sure that something is wrong.
You know much more about this than I, so...

No, I believe the datasheet - the value corresponds to the maximum waveform update rate of the DSO. If the value was lower, they would put that in the datasheet.

Please wait.
Done:

[Mark_O]

That is why I think they are incorrect, but that was the result. But sure that something is wrong.

Well, at least you took the time to try and run an empirical test.     Even if it was flawed.



Right.  19us re-arm time, corresponding to the 50k refresh rate of the DSOX2000.  Which supports marmad's comment. 

I believe his observation "The rearm time is never going to be lower than the approximate maximum waveform update rate" is correct.  Look at the DSOX3000 series.  An extremely impressive refresh rate of 1M/s (max).  And the rearm time?  1us.  Coincidence?  Of course not.

[Carrington]

@Mark_O: First, sorry for the irony of the replies above.

I believe in his observation too, and of course, it is no coincidence. I can't understand why I got these results.

But once that I found the min time between pulses that allowed the second trigger, I run the test several times, increasing the time between pulses slightly, until that always the second trigger was produced.

So, if this test was correct, then wfrm/s are limited, but this is absurd. 

Note_1: The test was done with the previous firmware version, and seems that there is some relation between wfrm/s and re-arm time, ie if one increases the other also, and vice versa.
Note_2: I no longer have the DS2000, to make this test with new firmware version. But if someone repeats this test would be better if the results will be published in this topic:
              "REVIEW - Rigol DS2072 - First Impressions of the DS2000 series from Rigol".

[Mark_O]

Well, just to end this on a positive note, if the SDS2000 can maintain 80k/s refresh rates, that suggests that the 25us currently observed for rearm times might eventually be cut approximately in half.

[marmad]

Well, just to end this on a positive note, if the SDS2000 can maintain 80k/s refresh rates, that suggests that the 25us currently observed for rearm times might eventually be cut approximately in half.

Although again, the DSO is not going to capture segments faster than the maximum rate it can capture waveforms at a given time base. If it captures a maximum of ~1300 wfrm/s, it's re-arm time is not going to be less than ~770us at that time base.

[Herman]

 I made a simply test about HISTORY function on my SDS2102, software version 1.1.1.26.2, hardware version 2-2.
Time Base    Re-arm time
1ns                   123us
2ns                   60us
5ns                   32us
10ns             24us
20ns            28us
50ns                  9us
100ns          17us
200ns          33us
500ns          59us
1us                 118us
2us                220us
5us                526us


 

[marmad]

I made a simply test on my SDS2102, software version 1.1.1.26.2, hardware version 2-2.

Is this Dots or Vectors mode?

[Herman]

I made a simply test on my SDS2102, software version 1.1.1.26.2, hardware version 2-2.

Is this Dots or Vectors mode?

dots, two channel

[MSuarez]

Hi guys, i'm new here. I read your comments and i don't have clear if siglent 2000 series is reliable.

I'm thinking in buy a oscilloscope. My first option is the rigol1104z-s because i need 4 channel, but after i found the Siglent. The MSO/sds 2104 (100Mhz, 4 channel) looks like cheaper if we take in to account the performace that they show in the datasheet:  4ch, 2Gs shared (1Gs/channel), a little more 28Mpoint, Arbitrary waveform and LA... by the same price than a rigol DS2000.

The rigol look like much better ended devices while the video of the siglent 2000 dont look like so (the pictures from siglent website and the videos posted here dont look like the same oscilloscope: the white look like yelow and the colors poor). I know, the important is how good it works. And here is my question, mainly for the people that know the sds2000.

How is the quality of the sds2000? it is reliable? the interface is intuitive and fast?

i  worked with a agilent dso3000x, Can someone tell me how better/worse is the siglent compared to this one in order to have a reference?(siglent should be worse)

Just now my maind is a sea of doubts to choose by one: rigol 1104z-S or siglent MSO/SDS 2104? i prefer spend a little more is the siglent its good.

thanks in advance by help

[tautech]

Welcome to EEvblog MSuarez.
All the stuff here about SDS2000 series is pre-release info. There are number that have been sent to people to appraise and report bugs and faults to Siglent. They are not available for sale yet.
I have one and have just received updated firmware for it. Hopefully extra functionality will be enabled and some bugs fixed. Last I heard for a release date was March, but best its all as bug free as Siglent can make it.

[MSuarez]

oh yes, you can buy some models: http://www.siglent.eu/oscilloscopes/sds-2000-series.html.

I chat with Siglent customer support to ask about sds2104 and for this model i have to preorder it.

They told me that if i want it, i have to wait 40days to have it in home(if my memory is ok). But the last two weeks were holidays in china.


 

[marmad]

oh yes, you can buy some models: http://www.siglent.eu/oscilloscopes/sds-2000-series.html.

I chat with Siglent customer support to ask about sds2104 and for this model i have to preorder it.

They told me that if i want it, i have to wait 40days to have it in home(if my memory is ok). But the last two weeks were holidays in china.

You're wrong - the firmware isn't even ready. Read the thread - there are a few Siglent employees/dealers testing it here. You are being given a line of bullshit in order to entice you to preorder it. The DSO is already a few months past the date it was originally supposed to be released.

[MSuarez]

By this is good ask to people with a deep experience with these devices. I dont want buy something that later can give me problems. 

The best idea will be wait that they debug it properly.

But, how i cant wait so, the choice looks like done.

Thanks by answer

[tautech]

oh yes, you can buy some models: http://www.siglent.eu/oscilloscopes/sds-2000-series.html.

I chat with Siglent customer support to ask about sds2104 and for this model i have to preorder it.

They told me that if i want it, i have to wait 40days to have it in home(if my memory is ok). But the last two weeks were holidays in china.

Ask them for a demo unit for immediate appraisal and see what you get......nothing!

[kebogen]

oh yes, you can buy some models: http://www.siglent.eu/oscilloscopes/sds-2000-series.html.

I chat with Siglent customer support to ask about sds2104 and for this model i have to preorder it.

They told me that if i want it, i have to wait 40days to have it in home(if my memory is ok). But the last two weeks were holidays in china.

You're wrong - the firmware isn't even ready. Read the thread - there are a few Siglent employees/dealers testing it here. You are being given a line of bullshit in order to entice you to preorder it. The DSO is already a few months past the date it was originally supposed to be released.

I don't think so, siglent has sold SDS2000 series in China several month ago, maybe there are some troubles to sell this one in USA and Europe. So we just need to wait and hope will get a great and high rate of quantity and price scope.