Siglent SSA3000X and SSA3000X-Plus Spectrum Analyzers

[markone]

If you would like to see any particular screen shots then please let me know. I will take a shot of the TG across the full 9 KHz - 3.2 GHz (SSA3032X) or 9 KHz - 2.1 GHz (SSA3021X) if you like.

Steve

Hi Steve,

it would be nice to see a video that shows scan speed / dynamic range with different RBW settings.

Is also the 2.1Ghz version (SSA3021X) interested by new PCB revision issue ?   

[Siglent America]

If you would like to see any particular screen shots then please let me know. I will take a shot of the TG across the full 9 KHz - 3.2 GHz (SSA3032X) or 9 KHz - 2.1 GHz (SSA3021X) if you like.

Steve

Hi Steve,

it would be nice to see a video that shows scan speed / dynamic range with different RBW settings.

Is also the 2.1Ghz version (SSA3021X) interested by new PCB revision issue ?

Hello, Markone.

We will be happy to run some curves and post them here. However, the sweep speed and RBW are both tied to the size of the range you are sweeping. So unless you have a specific sweep range you want us to use we'll use say .1 or 1 MHz every time and then vary the RBW setting - which will automatically set the and sweep speed and change the noise floor. The settings are coupled together (along with the Video Bandwidth) to maintain amplitude calibration but any of the settings can be manually overridden.

The 2.1 GHz version will have the same TG upgrade as the 3.2 GHz version. Of course, it will have the narrower sweep range.
Steve

[Siglent America]

Is there any way to see if the SA has the improved TG or not? Model number? Serial number?

The new TG versions will keep the same model numbers and price. We will know which version any given unit is by the serial number, which we can help you with at that time if you want to know.
Steve

[Siglent America]

You couldn't get it on loan for evaluation at all? I'd try another distributor because IMHO you should be able to evaluate test equipment especially when it costs a couple of thousand dollars/euros.

Hi Bob S,

Third party reviews will be coming some time after the end of April, when the new TG is out.

Did you contact a North American distributor? All authorized NA distributors do have a 30-day return policy. If you would contact us at
info@Siglent.com
then we will try to find out what happened on this distributor.

I would like to know who told you the spectrum analyzer could not be returned, at least if they were a North American distributor. All of our North American distributors should know this.
Thanks.
Steve

[markone]

However, the sweep speed and RBW are both tied to the size of the range you are sweeping.

Yes, of course.

Like many other, i would like to see if it's faster than Rigol DSA815, but right now i do not have any specific request for sweep parameters, maybe some Rigol SA owner could suggest some instrument setup for the purpose.

If i recall correctly the maximun refresh rate for DSA815 is 5/s, so a video showing Siglent SA max refresh rate (small span & large RBW) could be a good start point.

[Siglent America]

I ran some curves but I guess Markone wanted to see some large RBW settings with smaller spans. I'll try to get some of those posted later.

I ran a 100 MHz sine wave from a SDG2122X generator. CW mode. About -30 dBm directly into the SSA3021X Spectrum analyzer. All photos were made using a 1 MHz  frequency span and I varied the RBW setting. You will note The Sweep Time (SWT) in the lower right hand corner of the screen. You will also notice that in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th photos the text "FFT" appears on the left hand side of the screen. This does not mean that the spectrum analyzer has jumped from a swept mode to an FFT mode. What is is telling us is that the internal FFT mode that we use in longer / slower sweeps is in operation. I do't know the exact technical method the analyzer is using beyond the fact that we use this to speed things up. This mode helps to speed up slower sweeps when using low RBWs and/or large spans:

1) RBW = 30 KHz
2) RBW = 3 KHz
3) RBW = 300 Hz
4) RBW = 10 Hz

[Wuerstchenhund]

@Steve: Thanks for the screenshots 

Not sure using a SDG2122X as a source is a good idea, as it's RF performance is pretty poor (like most AWGs), and probably makes the SSA3000X look worse than it is. I assume you have access to a proper RF generator? If so, could you please do another test, this time from a RF generator connected via appropriate cables:

- Input signal 60MHz -10dBm
- Center freq 60Mhz
- Span 2kHz
- RBW 10Hz, VBW 10Hz

And maybe repeat that at 1GHz, 2GHz and 2.5GHz?

[Siglent America]

We don't have an RF generator in this office so we used the SDG2122X.

Markone requested several screen shots with a larger RBW and small scan so I will run those for him next.

[Wuerstchenhund]

We don't have an RF generator in this office so we used the SDG2122X.

I see. What a shame.

[markone]

I ran some curves but I guess Markone wanted to see some large RBW settings with smaller spans. I'll try to get some of those posted later.

Hi Steve,

many thanks for your attention, i have taken note of sweeping times and noise floor level.

If you can, pls repeat the 4th (RBW 10Hz) increasing signal level to -20dBm.

[Siglent America]

I ran some curves but I guess Markone wanted to see some large RBW settings with smaller spans. I'll try to get some of those posted later.

Hi Steve,

many thanks for your attention, i have taken note of sweeping times and noise floor level.

If you can, pls repeat the 4th (RBW 10Hz) increasing signal level to -20dBm.

Markone,

I ran the same trace with a -20 dBm signal, as you requested. Please see attached.

Also you had asked about sweep times at some larger RBW settings and at some smaller spans.  i did run the following:

100 MHz CW signal at a 100 KHz span setting.

* RBW = 10 KHz.  Sweep time = 1.834 ms

* RBW = 3 KHz.    Sweep time = 8.532 ms

* RBW = 1 KHz.    Sweep time = 19.388 ms

Note: The SSA3032X used the FFT mode in all three cases.
Steve

[markone]

I ran the same trace with a -20 dBm signal, as you requested. Please see attached.

Note: The SSA3032X used the FFT mode in all three cases.

Steve

Thankls a lot Steve, so far so good, scan speed wise the instrument seems promising, of course we expect a complete reeview asap ;-)
 
Now the main problem is that a potential buyer (like me) has to wait for the new HW revision issue.

One obvious question : up to what SPAN width FFT mode is supported ?

[mairomaster]

Hi guys,

I have been using SSA3021X for about two weeks now.

Initially, after a day of use, the firmware froze and the unit was refusing to start. From customer support they sent me a firmware image and instructions, so I can re-flash the firmware, but that didn't help. I needed to ship the unit back so they can fix it.

After they send me the unit back (apparently they needed to flash some different firmware) it was working all good. However, the firmware (I believe the latest version) has lots of bugs. Just to name a few:

- A memory stick (used to transfer screenshots for example) cannot be mounted reliably. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
- After you save some files (limits for example), they cannot be deleted in any way, even if they are not currently used. With screenshots for example that doesn't seem to be a problem.
- Screenshots cannot be saved reliably all the time. If you save a limit file for example and exit the menu, pressing save at any point after that (which normally saves a screenshot) will attempt re-saving the last limit file, without the option to change that.
- The screenshot save windows is visible in the middle of the screen on the saved screenshot. That way it covers a good amount of the spectrum.
- There doesn't seem to be a way to save waveforms.
- You can't create correction files from the menu. You can load correction files, but I don't see any way how to create them (even externally).
- After exiting EMI mode, some of the settings (bandwidth for example) are not remembered but restored to the default value. That could be quite annoying if you often need to switch to EMI mode and back.
- The current version of the user manual is not 100% related to the current version of the firmware. Some option are either different or missing.
- Many other small things.

I hope Siglent will fix the firmware soon, because it is a real pain to work with it in its current state.

[markone]

Hi guys,

I have been using SSA3021X for about two weeks now.

Mentioned bugs apart, how would you rate its RF performance (dynamic range, sweep speed, etc) ?

Which freq span does FFT mode support ?

[nctnico]

Hi guys,

I have been using SSA3021X for about two weeks now.

Initially, after a day of use, the firmware froze and the unit was refusing to start. From customer support they sent me a firmware image and instructions, so I can re-flash the firmware, but that didn't help. I needed to ship the unit back so they can fix it.

I hope Siglent will fix the firmware soon, because it is a real pain to work with it in its current state.

You better return it because it will take Siglent at least 2 years to fix the bugs!

[mairomaster]

I haven't used any other spectrum analyser before, so I can't really speak about its performance. It did an alright job for my purpose (EMC pre-compliance testing). I don't think you have control over the FFT mode. I noticed it switches on automatically in some rare occasions, when I am playing around with the range.

I might consider returning it (if that's an option since it has been used already), but the problem is that there is no other cheap analyser on the market, which goes to 2GHz (I need that range for the particular EMC tests I am doing).

[nctnico]

I haven't used any other spectrum analyser before, so I can't really speak about its performance. It did an alright job for my purpose (EMC pre-compliance testing). I don't think you have control over the FFT mode. I noticed it switches on automatically in some rare occasions, when I am playing around with the range.

I might consider returning it (if that's an option since it has been used already), but the problem is that there is no other cheap analyser on the market, which goes to 2GHz (I need that range for the particular EMC tests I am doing).

Get a second hand Advantest or a used spectrum analyser from another brand. There is a lot out there for sale (even with warranty)! AFAIK Siglent has a 30 day no hassle return policy.

[Wuerstchenhund]

I might consider returning it (if that's an option since it has been used already), but the problem is that there is no other cheap analyser on the market, which goes to 2GHz (I need that range for the particular EMC tests I am doing).

In terms of SAs there are many options out there. Some of my smaller customers use R&S CMU200 test sets for EMC pre-compliance testing. They contain a spectrum analyzer up to 2.7GHz, plus you get one (or two, depending on the installed options) RF generator(s) on top of it. These test sets go somewhere between £500 and £900. They are proven and reliable, made by a manufacturer with a long track record in developing some of the best spectrum analyzers.

Another one uses an Agilent E7495B test set for the same purpose. They also go up to 2.7Ghz (2.5Ghz for the E7495A) and go for roughly similar money as the CMU200 and are portable, although the RF performance isn't as good in some areas as the CMU200). But they have other advantages, plus you not only get a RF generator but also a vector network analyzer (although without phase information).

As nctnico said, there are lots of options. For example, I just bought an 5yr old Anritsu 13Ghz SA for less than £1500 delivered. Pretty much looks like new.

Especially if you do that for a business I'd ask myself if I could live with investing money in some unproven B-brand kit that very well may turn out to be the next SDS2000 disaster (which is still ongoing as far as I know).

[mairomaster]

^I've seen such units, but buying something old, second hand, without customer support has always seem somewhat dodgy to me. However, it might really turn out to be the better option.

What do you think is the drawback of buying such units, compared to new ones, produced recently? Is documentation readily available?

[rf-loop]

Hi guys,

I have been using SSA3021X for about two weeks now.

Initially, after a day of use, the firmware froze and the unit was refusing to start. From customer support they sent me a firmware image and instructions, so I can re-flash the firmware, but that didn't help. I needed to ship the unit back so they can fix it.

After they send me the unit back (apparently they needed to flash some different firmware) it was working all good. However, the firmware (I believe the latest version) has lots of bugs. Just to name a few:

- A memory stick (used to transfer screenshots for example) cannot be mounted reliably. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
- After you save some files (limits for example), they cannot be deleted in any way, even if they are not currently used. With screenshots for example that doesn't seem to be a problem.
- Screenshots cannot be saved reliably all the time. If you save a limit file for example and exit the menu, pressing save at any point after that (which normally saves a screenshot) will attempt re-saving the last limit file, without the option to change that.
- The screenshot save windows is visible in the middle of the screen on the saved screenshot. That way it covers a good amount of the spectrum.
- There doesn't seem to be a way to save waveforms.
- You can't create correction files from the menu. You can load correction files, but I don't see any way how to create them (even externally).
- After exiting EMI mode, some of the settings (bandwidth for example) are not remembered but restored to the default value. That could be quite annoying if you often need to switch to EMI mode and back.
- The current version of the user manual is not 100% related to the current version of the firmware. Some option are either different or missing.
- Many other small things.

I hope Siglent will fix the firmware soon, because it is a real pain to work with it in its current state.

It is good practise to tell also what is FW version together with this kind of reports.

[nctnico]

^I've seen such units, but buying something old, second hand, without customer support has always seem somewhat dodgy to me. However, it might really turn out to be the better option.

What do you think is the drawback of buying such units, compared to new ones, produced recently? Is documentation readily available?

Documentation (including service manuals) can often been found online or downloaded somewhere. If a unit is less than 10 years old I'd be surprised if you don't get proper support from the manufacturer. IMHO you can't go wrong with an HP/Agilent/Keysight unit where it comes to support but don't rule out Advantest either because of the close relationship with R&S. My Adventest R3131 SA even has 'R&S calibration void' stickers all over it and I bought it for a very reasonable price from an equipment dealer including a 1 year warranty.

[mairomaster]

It is good practise to tell also what is FW version together with this kind of reports.

You are totally right, sorry. Here is all the system info:

SW1   100.01.02.07.01
SW2   20160226-2
SW3   000000C1
HW     04.03.00

[Wuerstchenhund]

^I've seen such units, but buying something old, second hand, without customer support has always seem somewhat dodgy to me. However, it might really turn out to be the better option.

What do you think is the drawback of buying such units, compared to new ones, produced recently? Is documentation readily available?

Well, I had Siglent gear, and I'm not sure their "support" is something to write home about to be honest. Pretty much everything has to go through their resellers which may or may not be helpful if you have a problem (they are all great until they have your money). If not then, well, tough luck I guess.

The only drawback of buying used I can see is the lack of warranty, but that can be overcome by buying from a seller that offers one, or (if you buy a newer unit) you can often just buy new warranty (often called a 'repair agreement') from the manufacturer.

The benefits however more than compensate for that in my opinion. You get more capable kit that is very likely a lot more mature than anything from the B-brands (just look at the Rigol DSA800, as far as I know it still has some issues), you usually also get proper service manuals (do you have a service manual for your Siglent? If not, how will your calibration provider calibrate that thing?). And even for older units you can get repairs and spares.

The best thing however is that you get a device you can rely on.

IMHO you can't go wrong with an HP/Agilent/Keysight unit where it comes to support but don't rule out Advantest either because of the close relationship with R&S.

Just be aware that this relationship ended a long time ago (IIRC around 2004), R&S now only sells their own spectrum analyzers (which in general also perform better than the Advantest ones, which already are good instruments). They still offer repair and calibration services, though.

[bson]

- The screenshot save windows is visible in the middle of the screen on the saved screenshot. That way it covers a good amount of the spectrum.

[Siglent America]

Well, I had Siglent gear, and I'm not sure their "support" is something to write home about to be honest. Pretty much everything has to go through their resellers which may or may not be helpful if you have a problem (they are all great until they have your money). If not then, well, tough luck I guess.

I don't now about Europe offhand but here in North America the customer can certainly obtain an RMA from us and send a warranty repair directly to Siglent in Ohio. No reseller needs to be involved unless a customer wants them to be.

Our goal is to repair any defective instrument within 10 days of receiving it. We take this goal very seriously.