Siglent SDS2104X Plus (100MHz) vs Keysight DSOX1204G 70MHz vs Rigol MSO5074

[jimjam]

For the first time oscilloscope user, I'm currently choosing between these two. What are the pros and cons of these two models, and perhaps suggestion on other models to consider instead. Thanks.



EDIT: I've just come across another possible contender, Rigol MSO5074. Currently offered by Emona in Australia with free MSO5000-BND

[tautech]

SDS2104X Plus has a tested -3dB BW of ~185 Mhz.
200Mpts memory for each of the two 2GSa/s ADC's.

[stafil]

Keep in mind SDS2104X Plus can be hacked to full options + 500Mhz BW

[jimjam]

Keep in mind SDS2104X Plus can be hacked to full options + 500Mhz BW

I thought only the 350MHz one can be upgraded to 500MHz?

[stafil]

Keep in mind SDS2104X Plus can be hacked to full options + 500Mhz BW

I thought only the 350MHz one can be upgraded to 500MHz?

The hack/keygen works for all of them.

[tautech]

And then Dave had to put aside his KS as it didn't come with free decodes like SDS2104X Plus does. 

https://youtu.be/E81hlwciXJU?t=121

[2N3055]

Siglent SDS2104X Plus (100MHz).
And that without hacking it..
Hacked, it can replace Keysight 3034T for many people that don't need special protocols, active probes and really fast re-trigger rate ...

The list what Siglent SDS2104X Plus can do and Keysight DSOX1204G cannot is mile long..
Make note I didn't say "what features it has"  but what it can do...

Siglent has huge screen. Huge. You can see more.
You can get 100X longer samples without sample rate dropping to audio sampling rates..
You can get more protocols decodes.
Segmented mode supports up to 90000 segments with full timing. Same with always running history mode. Keysight has 50 in segmented mode. Yes, 50. No history.
2000X+ has 2 math traces.  DSOX1204G  has one with simpler math.
2000X+ has 2 Mpoint FFT. DSOX1204G   has max 64kpoint.

2000X+ has very nice bode plot. DSOX1204G   has it too, but more limited. 2000X will soon receive new Siglent BodePlot II that is multichannel (more than one channel).
2000X+'s generator goes to 50MHz. DSOX1204G  gen goes to 20 Mhz.

List goes on and on.
There is only one thing that DSOX1204G   does well is that it does great emulation of analog like rendering on the screen. Everything else it is really meh.

DSOX1204G  is a victim of Keysight own marketing strategy. They cannot allow that their cheapest entry level scopes start having features of 3000T series.
It will hurt them. So DSOX1204G  is deliberately AS LITTLE as they can get away with, and counting that Keysight name will sell nice but very ordinary, anemic and unremarkable scope.

Siglent, on the other hand have no problem with trying to grab a market share in 2000 series scopes by being slightly better than A brands in all aspects, making scopes that are somewhere in between 2000 and 3000 established market classes . So 2000X+ has many things from modern 3000 class like 50 Ohm inputs, big touch screen, huge memory, segments, search, long FFT (class leading 2MPoints), 2 math channels, histicons and histograms, measurements on full and gated memory, advanced triggers, MSO, more decodes etc etc..

Times have changed. In entry level scopes market, big brands are not best choice. In mid and high end , yes, entry level, no.

[Fungus]

And then Dave had to put aside his KS as it didn't come with free decodes like SDS2104X Plus does. 

https://youtu.be/E81hlwciXJU?t=121

Let's see if the trend continues.

(instead of it just being the 'scope that was on his bench at the time due to him doing a review of it)

[jimjam]

Siglent SDS2104X Plus (100MHz).

Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. Much appreciated. Decision made! EDIT-added rigol to the mix

[Elasia]

Siglent has no issue taking things from their higher end models and pushing them down... it could be said the current 5k model was more of the basis for the plus than even the non plus 2k was

 

[jimjam]

I've just added Rigol MSO5074 to the list of options, still trying to learn more about it. I wish I could play with them in person

[nctnico]

What is your budget? You might want to consider adding the R&S RTB2004 to the list.

And what do you want to use the oscilloscope for? Selecting the right oscilloscope is not just about price but also highly depends on your use case and personal preferences. What is great for one person absolutely sucks for another person. If you are unsure then at least make a short list with 3 oscilloscopes and simply try all of them.

[jemangedeslolos]

Giving your budget is a good idea otherwise, at this rate, we will offer you a Keysight MXR @ 20k$

[jimjam]

What is your budget? You might want to consider adding the R&S RTB2004 to the list.

And what do you want to use the oscilloscope for? Selecting the right oscilloscope is not just about price but also highly depends on your use case and personal preferences. What is great for one person absolutely sucks for another person. If you are unsure then at least make a short list with 3 oscilloscopes and simply try all of them.

Budget: no more than A$3k

R&S RTB2004 seems to be almost double the price of the others I've listed here so just based on that, it's out of the question. I don't have any specific needs other than just learning to use a scope and using it as and when the need arise. The most basic model would probably suffice, but I do like having a bigger screen, easier to see and all. It's a good question though. It makes me re-evaluate whether I should spend A$2400 on a scope or just get a cheaper model.

[nctnico]

Perhaps the Micsig TO1104 or STO1104C would be a good fit. The first is a touch-screen only model, the latter has knobs. These have a big 8" 4:3 800x600 screen, have solid firmware and can run on batteries as well. These models are useful as both a bench top and portable oscilloscope.

I only found the TO1104 in an Australian webshop. Maybe they can order the STO series as well.
https://emona.com.au/products/electronic-test-measure/oscilloscopes/to-1104.html

Another option is to buy directly from MicSig through their Aliexpress factory store:
https://micsig.nl.aliexpress.com/store/1293611

[Fungus]

I don't have any specific needs other than just learning to use a scope and using it as and when the need arise. The most basic model would probably suffice, but I do like having a bigger screen, easier to see and all. It's a good question though. It makes me re-evaluate whether I should spend A$2400 on a scope or just get a cheaper model.

...

Perhaps the Micsig TO1104 or STO1104C would be a good fit.

Seconded. No need to spend a fortune on something you don't even know you even need, it's like saying you're going to buy a Mercedes just to find out what driving a car is like and to do some shopping.

The STO1104C has the best of most worlds (knobs and a big, multi-gestural touch screen thing) and won't break the bank. The 100Mhz version is a lot of 'scope for the money.

[maginnovision]

I'd also say a Micsig is probably right up your alley since you don't need anything specific. It will likely do everything you need, be useful for learning, and save you money.

I really think the 3 options you have are good scopes but you don't need them and they're fairly expensive for what you want. Hacks don't really matter when the features of the hack do nothing for you.

[Elasia]

Big screen is worth every penny... thats probly my favorite part of the sds2k+

It's huge and i can overlay a ton of stuff on it and its not super tiny and over crowded

If you got the spare cash to burn either a SDS2104X or a MSO5074 is a fine scope to both learn on and keep for years

Cant really go wrong with either

Another plus with either of them is they come with a function gen, another piece of kit you then dont have to buy. Also 16 digital ports, a MSO is worth every penny if you are getting into pics/arduinos


If you want a tablet then micsig.. probly the best tablet scope floating around

[Fungus]

If you just want a toy to play with then the Analog Discovery 2 should also be on your short list.

It uses your PC screen for display so the screen can be as big as you want. 

[tv84]

Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. Much appreciated. Decision made! EDIT-added rigol to the mix

   Did you felt the thread was going down too short?

If you want to spend $1000 buy the Rigol. If you want to spend $1500 buy the Siglent!

BUT, and the best advice was from maginnovision: if you buy a Veyron, hack to a Chiron but all you need is to drive in downtown then it's wiser to buy a Smart without any extras. Unless you want to show off your big machine... In Covid times, keep the money.

[stafil]

   Did you felt the thread was going down too short?

 

OP: You will probably never outgrow the SDS2104X+. Buy it, hack it, and don't worry about scopes ever again.

[Elasia]

   Did you felt the thread was going down too short?

 

OP: You will probably never outgrow the SDS2104X+. Buy it, hack it, and don't worry about scopes ever again.

That's the same I was getting at, if money to spare one and done...

If broke.. well.. probly not the best idea but i dont judge

[nctnico]

   Did you felt the thread was going down too short?

 

OP: You will probably never outgrow the SDS2104X+. Buy it, hack it, and don't worry about scopes ever again.

That is a bit short-sighted. There are important differences between the oscilloscopes. The way they manage memory for example.

[Martin72]

Perhaps the Micsig TO1104 or STO1104C would be a good fit.

We recommend Micsig TO1104 Plus if you are looking for a mobile oscilloscope or if you would like to have a touch oscilloscope. Compared to the desktop oscilloscopes like the Rigol DS1000Z series, the measurement technology and the range of functions of the Micsig devices cannot yet keep up.

This is what Batronix says to the micsig, they see it under the DS1000Z, this means under the low-entry level scope range.
On the other side, actually I´m surprised from the quality of their current probe CP2100B.
So if he needs a mobile scope...why not.

But he wrote, he could spend several dollars more…

And therefore:

If you want to spend $1000 buy the Rigol. If you want to spend $1500 buy the Siglent!

I agree to this, got both scopes in use (actual the siglent).

[TK]

Siglent, hacked or not has a lot more features (and also bugs) than KS, but it cannot do good waveform updates per second. And if you add measurements, it pauses with deterministic interval to do the calculations stopping screen refreshes