Author Topic: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs  (Read 84534 times)

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Offline 2N3055

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #200 on: June 08, 2023, 09:04:05 am »
Hi,

Maybe I´ve found a bug:
Decoding..
Thresholds of the signals are getting lost after restarting the scope.
Example you set the threshold on both channel used (UART, RX/TX) to 1.6V and data will be displayed, after restart no data because the thresholds are now 3.63V on one channel and 743mV on the other.

Martin

hmm..

I will check later...
 
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Offline 2N3055

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #201 on: June 08, 2023, 07:58:47 pm »
Hi,

Maybe I´ve found a bug:
Decoding..
Thresholds of the signals are getting lost after restarting the scope.
Example you set the threshold on both channel used (UART, RX/TX) to 1.6V and data will be displayed, after restart no data because the thresholds are now 3.63V on one channel and 743mV on the other.

Martin

hmm..

I will check later...

Just checked.. went to trigger settings, serial trig, UART, 19200. CH1 and CH2. Levels set to 3V and 2V respectively. Then went to analyze, decode , uart, copy from trigger..
Shutdown.
Reboot and it all came back to same settings.. all OK.
But.. I'm not running same FW as you....
 
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Offline Martin72Topic starter

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #202 on: June 08, 2023, 08:06:26 pm »
Aha...
An hour ago I got the same "Issue" with the SPI decoding, must readjust the threshold.
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Siglent SDS800X HD Deep Review
 

Offline Martin72Topic starter

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #203 on: June 08, 2023, 09:33:08 pm »
Regarding the decoder gimmick with the demo boards:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-scope-demoboard-from-batronix/msg4900373/#msg4900373

There are things on this planet that I just don't understand. :P
I wanted to upload videos, once from home two hours ago, how I have a stable signal with the STB-3 on the HD, then the videos from work with the Xplus and the Batronix board, where I had the best will not get a stable signal.
Then I thought, that's not a real comparison, do it again here and with the HD.
So I turned it on again and connected the STB-3 with the SPI demo.
The thresholds were wrong again after startup, I know that by now.
What can I say, still no stable signal with the STB-3...
Tried around, no idea what is different now than before.
Then I changed something that I would never have thought of otherwise.
The signal was stable again, I couldn't believe it.
OK, then I try this now with the Batronix board and lo and behold, with the setting I have a pretty stable signal, the first time ever.
What did I do ?
I set the memory from auto to fixed memory.... :o
100Mpts and the signals become stable.... ???
Final:
Back to auto, the signals remain stable.... ???
This is all very confusing.
I'll summarize again:
-After each restart, the previously set thresholds are no longer correct.
-And I only managed a stable triggering when I set the memory to fixed and max.
-It remained stable even after I set it back to auto.

That's enough for me for today, I'll do another calm and systematic re-try tomorrow or the day after.
"Comparison is the end of happiness and the beginning of dissatisfaction."
(Kierkegaard)
Siglent SDS800X HD Deep Review
 
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Offline Ulrich.G

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #204 on: June 13, 2023, 11:12:38 am »
FFT-tools options

I was testing the FFT-tools options (user manual page 197). From my understanding, the options "Show Frequency" and "Sort By" shouldn't be visible in case the option "Show Table" is off... In this case they are making no sense, or is it a misconception in understanding this menu from my side?
 

Offline dpenev

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #205 on: June 13, 2023, 01:28:46 pm »
Martin, do you have your trigger time start in the main screen?
 

Offline 2N3055

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #206 on: June 13, 2023, 01:38:13 pm »
FFT-tools options

I was testing the FFT-tools options (user manual page 197). From my understanding, the options "Show Frequency" and "Sort By" shouldn't be visible in case the option "Show Table" is off... In this case they are making no sense, or is it a misconception in understanding this menu from my side?

You misunderstood. It might not have been explained into details.. Both "Peaks" and "Markers" and are type of markers.

Difference between "Peaks" markers and "Markers" markers  is that "Peaks" are just that. Scope detects them and puts a marker on them. You can sort by frequency or amplitude and can have a table or not. And that is all control. Those are dynamic and will follow changes in signal.

With "Markers" markers , you have more control. Once you enable them, you manually tell scope to make analysis on current snapshot and it will place markers on signal. If signal changes in frequency it will not follow it. Those are stationary markers, and you can also manually add, delete and edit them...

Oh both, displaying a table with details is optional. That is the "Show table" option.
 

Offline tautech

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #207 on: June 13, 2023, 07:54:18 pm »
FFT-tools options

I was testing the FFT-tools options (user manual page 197). From my understanding, the options "Show Frequency" and "Sort By" shouldn't be visible in case the option "Show Table" is off... In this case they are making no sense, or is it a misconception in understanding this menu from my side?

You misunderstood. It might not have been explained into details.. Both "Peaks" and "Markers" and are type of markers.

Difference between "Peaks" markers and "Markers" markers  is that "Peaks" are just that. Scope detects them and puts a marker on them. You can sort by frequency or amplitude and can have a table or not. And that is all control. Those are dynamic and will follow changes in signal.

With "Markers" markers , you have more control. Once you enable them, you manually tell scope to make analysis on current snapshot and it will place markers on signal. If signal changes in frequency it will not follow it. Those are stationary markers, and you can also manually add, delete and edit them...

Oh both, displaying a table with details is optional. That is the "Show table" option.
Yep not a bug. Works as intended.
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Offline Martin72Topic starter

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Siglent SDS800X HD Deep Review
 

Offline krasimir.k

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #209 on: July 19, 2023, 08:38:00 am »
Hi,
I tried to use the mask feature with saved mask file : does not work. After the loading of the saved xxx.smsk file, the vertical range is reset to the minimum and the small part of the mask is visible on the top of the screen.
Used FW version : V1.5.2R1

I tried to load the mask file from python - the loading is not happen at all.

Code: [Select]
import pyvisa
#https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2023/04/SDS-Series_ProgrammingGuide_EN11D.pdf

rm = pyvisa.ResourceManager()
inst = rm.open_resource("TCPIP::10.35.89.136::INSTR")
print(inst.query("*IDN?"))

inst.write(":MTESt ON")
inst.write(":MTESt:MASK:LOAD EXTernal,\"local/mask.smsk\"")
inst.write(":MTESt:OPERate ON")


Kind Regards,
Krasi
 

Offline 2N3055

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #210 on: July 19, 2023, 09:29:31 am »
Hi,
I tried to use the mask feature with saved mask file : does not work. After the loading of the saved xxx.smsk file, the vertical range is reset to the minimum and the small part of the mask is visible on the top of the screen.
Used FW version : V1.5.2R1

I tried to load the mask file from python - the loading is not happen at all.

Code: [Select]
import pyvisa
#https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2023/04/SDS-Series_ProgrammingGuide_EN11D.pdf

rm = pyvisa.ResourceManager()
inst = rm.open_resource("TCPIP::10.35.89.136::INSTR")
print(inst.query("*IDN?"))

inst.write(":MTESt ON")
inst.write(":MTESt:MASK:LOAD EXTernal,\"local/mask.smsk\"")
inst.write(":MTESt:OPERate ON")


Kind Regards,
Krasi

Is this SDS2000X Plus ?   Only publicly available FW for SDS2000X HD is 1.2.1.1 ..
 

Offline tautech

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #211 on: July 19, 2023, 09:38:04 am »
Is this SDS2000X Plus ?   Only publicly available FW for SDS2000X HD is 1.2.1.1 ..
It is and running older firmware than latest: V1.5.2R3
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Offline krasimir.k

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #212 on: July 21, 2023, 05:33:59 am »
I'm sorry!
Yes, it is SDS2000X Plus.
I post in the wrong thread.
I just made the same post in the SDS2000X Plus thread for the bugs.

Kind Regards,
Krasi
« Last Edit: July 21, 2023, 05:40:58 am by krasimir.k »
 

Offline Martin72Topic starter

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #213 on: July 23, 2023, 10:07:54 pm »
Hi,

In my opinion a bug:

Changing Colors...
Default color for F2 is red, so everything is red, makes sense.
Today I want to change it for a better viewing and choosed "white" (looks on the screen like white, in the screenshot light-grey).
Everything changed to white - But the trace changed from red to blue... ???
When I want white I should get white and not blue.

Wish 1:
Cursors....Lecroy have a "absolute" (and relative of course) cursor function for time and amplitude, this means you then have only one cursor moveable horizontal(when choosing time) - But it will also shows the vertical value at this point.
Yes, you´ll have this when you choose "track" in the siglent cursor menu - but you´ll have all cursor lines in the screen, that´s too confusing sometimes.

Wish 2:
Possibility to change the side of the axis-labeling.
That would be great, because it's not uncommon for the lableling to get "in the way" of the signals, it would be much rarer if the labeling was on the right side.
So a choice left/right would be really useful.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2023, 11:02:33 pm by Martin72 »
"Comparison is the end of happiness and the beginning of dissatisfaction."
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Siglent SDS800X HD Deep Review
 

Offline Martin72Topic starter

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #214 on: July 29, 2023, 11:10:15 pm »
Hi,

Related to what I mentioned there, this is what lecroy looks like with the cursor values.
I find that much more "charming", because there is nothing in the actual screen.
I'm well aware that this can't be realized, for various reasons (one might be that the UI itself would have to be touched again).
But I at least wanted to show how it can be done differently.
The picture shows a WS3024Z (SDS3000X), but with the larger lecroys it is exactly the same.

"Comparison is the end of happiness and the beginning of dissatisfaction."
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Siglent SDS800X HD Deep Review
 

Offline MathWizard

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #215 on: July 30, 2023, 12:54:55 am »
I'm having fun with my new 2204x-plus. When using the trigger, I haven't seen a line displayed on screen, moving up/down as soon as I adjust the level. On my 1204x-e, it usually appears as soon as I move the knob (although sometimes the line seems to not get displayed, IDK why)

But isn't there a line for trigger on these ? I hope so, It's way quicker to spot the line moving, and position it, especially if you have a time offset.
 

Offline tautech

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #216 on: July 30, 2023, 02:34:39 am »
I'm having fun with my new 2204x-plus. When using the trigger, I haven't seen a line displayed on screen, moving up/down as soon as I adjust the level. On my 1204x-e, it usually appears as soon as I move the knob (although sometimes the line seems to not get displayed, IDK why)

But isn't there a line for trigger on these ? I hope so, It's way quicker to spot the line moving, and position it, especially if you have a time offset.
Yep a trigger level line is not available when trigger is AC coupled.
Put it back to DC coupled where it should be.
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Offline MathWizard

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #217 on: July 31, 2023, 02:56:31 am »
Thanks, OK I didn't notice this was the HD thread or that's when it disappears on my other scope. So which is better on these, AC or DC trigger coupling, I just heard EEVblog Dave say AC is better, but he skipped why in that video.


Like right now I'm looking at a common base 2MHz colpitts osc. powered from 10V. So no big DC values, what would be better ?
« Last Edit: July 31, 2023, 03:19:28 am by MathWizard »
 

Offline tautech

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #218 on: July 31, 2023, 04:04:27 am »
Never used AC trigger coupling, AC channel coupling certainly but not that often.
YMMV
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Offline trp806mo

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #219 on: July 31, 2023, 06:26:46 am »
@Math,
He explains it with an example at 10 minutes in the video. To sum up briefly, in AC mode when you configure the level of the trigger depending your signal, what ever the DC offset will be you don't have to readjust the level of the trigger.
In other word if I have a 1 volt Vpp signal with a level trigger at 0v, if with my dc offset the vmin of my signal is at 2 volt , my trigger will stay synchronize
 

Offline Performa01

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #220 on: July 31, 2023, 06:56:23 am »
Thanks, OK I didn't notice this was the HD thread or that's when it disappears on my other scope. So which is better on these, AC or DC trigger coupling, I just heard EEVblog Dave say AC is better, but he skipped why in that video.
I can't remember what Dave said in this video back then, but in any case, other than AC input coupling, AC trigger coupling is useful on rare occasions only.

Have a look at the thorough explanation I gave a while ago for the SDS1000X-E - it applies to all other modern Siglent scopes with digital trigger engine as well, just the corner frequencies for the LFRJ and HFRJ might be a little different. This post also answers the question why we don't get a trigger level indicator when the trigger is AC coupled.

Reply #17:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/sds1104x-e-dc-offset-in-ac-coupling/msg4786517/#msg4786517
 

Offline MathWizard

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #221 on: August 09, 2023, 12:03:54 pm »
Ok I'll have a look that. I was more wondering if there's a hardware/path difference, so maybe slightly different performance. But yeah maybe it says in the video on most DSO's, it's the same signal, just analyzed differently.

I should look up trigger jitter too, if it's called that. Some signals are just annoying to look at. IDK when it's the signal, or noise or the scopes I'm using, and then I guess the screen update speed on a DSO most be some of it too. Sometimes hold-off helps, or LP/HP filters.
 

Offline Performa01

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #222 on: August 09, 2023, 01:06:43 pm »
Ok I'll have a look that. I was more wondering if there's a hardware/path difference, so maybe slightly different performance. But yeah maybe it says in the video on most DSO's, it's the same signal, just analyzed differently.
Of course it is the same signal. All modern Siglent DSOs have a fully digital trigger saystem. That means that the trigger signal path splits off the signal path only in the digital domain, i.e. after the ADC. The frontend doesn't even know about the trigger, except for the external one, which is still oldschool analog.

As a consequence, AC-coupling is just an operation in the signal processing, just like the LFRJ and HFRJ filters, that are implemented numerically in hardware, i.e. some FPGA. The same goes for hold-off, where Siglent offers the rather unique "holdoff by event" (greetings from LeCroy!) in addition to the usual "holdoff time".


I should look up trigger jitter too, if it's called that. Some signals are just annoying to look at. IDK when it's the signal, or noise or the scopes I'm using, and then I guess the screen update speed on a DSO most be some of it too. Sometimes hold-off helps, or LP/HP filters.
There is a scope characteristic called "trigger jitter", but that is very low on contemporary Siglent DSOs - we measure it in picoseconds. You won't notice it at all.

What you mean is "unstable triggering", caused by ambigous trigger levels. As long as the chosen trigger level occurs only at the intended trigger event - and only there and then - you have a stable triggering. Once you get this level associated with other (maybe spurious) events, your trigger isn't unique hence not stable anymore.

The first measure is to find an appropriate trigger level, which is unique and provides stable triggering. If this cannot be found, then we choose the next best thing, i.e. the least ambigous trigger level.

If the spurious trigger is somehow synchronous to the signal you want to trigger on, then holdoff can (and will) help - if setup correctly. In such cases the zone trigger can also solve most ambigous situations.

If there are asynchonous events disturbing your trigger, then filters might help, e.g. HFRJ when you want to trigger on a slow signal with HF interference on it and vice versa for the LFRJ trigger.

Sometimes simply chosing the appropriate trigger solves the problem best. If simple edge trigger does not do the job in certain cases, then more advanced triggers like slope, pulse, window or pattern might work like a charm.

Maybe you should study the trigger section of my review, where I've demonstrated a lot of tricky situations, where edge trigger and even holdoff won't cut it anymore - and how to get a stable trigger in those situations. It is for the SDS1104X-E, but is universally true, since this is a subset of the higher class scopes. SDS1000X-E lacks a few advanced triggers and doesn't support zone trigger. Reply #2, first document:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds1104x-e-in-depth-review/msg1371778/#msg1371778

 
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Online mawyatt

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #223 on: August 09, 2023, 02:13:53 pm »
One of the many surprises we had with our 1st Siglent instrument (SDS2000X+) was the triggering features/capability. Coming from an old analog Tektronix background where they had created the finest analog triggering scopes available (cleverly employing ECL gates as analog amps/limiters in the triggering circuitry), we didn't expect these DSOs to behave well wrt triggering, we were pleasantly surprised  :-+

Best,
Curiosity killed the cat, also depleted my wallet!
~Wyatt Labs by Mike~
 
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Offline Martin72Topic starter

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Re: Siglent SDS2000X HD, missing Features and Bugs
« Reply #224 on: August 22, 2023, 09:13:10 pm »
The issue with the thresholds I had a couple of posts here ago seems to affect the 2k+ too:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-plus-coming/msg5024428/#msg5024428
The thing with the wrong setting (1x instead of 10x), I had also experienced.
In addition, there is a unique experience to date:
I had turned on the scope and left the room during booting.
When I came back, it looked like it was ready, but there was a message on the screen:
"Probe disconnected.Channel:3"
Although it was still connected.
The scope was frozen and could only be awakened by turning it off and on again.
Happened over the weekend and as mentioned, only once to date.
Maybe there are sporadic problems with the autodetection of the probe.

"Comparison is the end of happiness and the beginning of dissatisfaction."
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Siglent SDS800X HD Deep Review
 


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