Siglent SDS1000X HD 12bit DSO's

[2N3055]

He doesn't mean low for his budget, he means low for price + features + performance.

There is no way 20% higher price can be "too low" when features are worse - as far as I can tell, Rigol has serial decodes, Siglent does not. You've gotta be a complete shill to say otherwise.

No we don't have to be complete shills.
All you need is to be able to read datasheets.

Siglent was first manufacturer that started giving avay serial decoders for free years ago. Made Keysight and R&S really unhappy.

If you are comparing SDS2000X HD and DHO4000, SDS2000X HD gives one protocol more for free (LIN) and has 2 more optional protocols to choose from (SENT and MANCHESTER)..

DHO4000 has about 50-60% of analytic capability of SDS2000X HD. Just the difference in implementation of math channels is huge. And many more features. DHO4000 has edge only in fact that it's fastest version goes to quite high frequencies. It seems to be good scope. But not even close in measurement capabilities.

For people that just want 12bit scope big screen, active probes etc but not advanced math it would be decent choice.
But generally you don't buy 12 bit scope to just use it as CRT analog scope. You don't need that analog performance to not use that info.
And that is where DHO4000 fails short. Close but no cigar.

[ebastler]

For people that just want 12bit scope big screen, active probes etc but not advanced math it would be decent choice.
But generally you don't buy 12 bit scope to just use it as CRT analog scope. You don't need that analog performance to not use that info.
And that is where DHO4000 fails short. Close but no cigar.

A big differentiator in my book is the ability to add MSO capability and Bode plotting (via internal or external AWG) to the SDS2000X HD. Surprising for a scope in its class, the DHO4000 supports neither, if I am not mistaken.

But what am I dreaming about... For my hobby needs I could not justify the budget for either of them. Can we please have a price and ship date for the SDS1000X HD (which happens to be the scope this thread was originally talking about)? 

[2N3055]

For people that just want 12bit scope big screen, active probes etc but not advanced math it would be decent choice.
But generally you don't buy 12 bit scope to just use it as CRT analog scope. You don't need that analog performance to not use that info.
And that is where DHO4000 fails short. Close but no cigar.

A big differentiator in my book is the ability to add MSO capability and Bode plotting (via internal or external AWG) to the SDS2000X HD. Surprising for a scope in its class, the DHO4000 supports neither, if I am not mistaken.

But what am I dreaming about... For my hobby needs I could not justify the budget for either of them. Can we please have a price and ship date for the SDS1000X HD (which happens to be the scope this thread was originally talking about)? 

MSO and bunch of other stuff...

I 'm pretty sure nobody will be able to stop Tautech from telling you and the rest of the world as soon as official date is known .....
 

[Martin72]

I 'm pretty sure nobody will be able to stop Tautech from telling you and the rest of the world as soon as official date is known .....

Yepp...  

For me, with another model, it would be to know when and IF it comes....

A big differentiator in my book is the ability to add MSO capability and Bode plotting (via internal or external AWG) to the SDS2000X HD. Surprising for a scope in its class, the DHO4000 supports neither, if I am not mistaken.

You´re not.
To put it bluntly, you have to think of the dho4000 as a larger dho800.
More memory, more bandwidth, one more adc, more decoder, PA, bigger screen and one more acquisition (hi-res).
Same software, same adc, same cpu....

[tautech]

I 'm pretty sure nobody will be able to stop Tautech from telling you and the rest of the world as soon as official date is known .....

Yepp...  

For me, with another model, it would be to know when and IF it comes....

SDS3000X HD, early 2024 is the whispers...... 

[asmi]

No we don't have to be complete shills.
All you need is to be able to read datasheets.

Yes you are.

Siglent was first manufacturer that started giving avay serial decoders for free years ago. Made Keysight and R&S really unhappy.

So what?

If you are comparing SDS2000X HD and DHO4000, SDS2000X HD gives one protocol more for free (LIN) and has 2 more optional protocols to choose from (SENT and MANCHESTER)..

Those are useless for me, unlike I2S, which Siglent doesn't give (but DHO4000 does).

DHO4000 has about 50-60% of analytic capability of SDS2000X HD. Just the difference in implementation of math channels is huge. And many more features. DHO4000 has edge only in fact that it's fastest version goes to quite high frequencies. It seems to be good scope. But not even close in measurement capabilities.

Don't care about fluff and paper features which I will never use anyway - I'm only interested in the main functionality. Analog bandwidth is the most important thing for me, with occasional serial decodes (but I'm hopefully going to buy an LA for that, so that won't be as important either). That's what I use the scope for. Everything else is not important.

For people that just want 12bit scope big screen, active probes etc but not advanced math it would be decent choice.
But generally you don't buy 12 bit scope to just use it as CRT analog scope. You don't need that analog performance to not use that info.

Yes I do. I don't care for "advanced math" (whatever it is). As long as I can export data points to PC, it will trash whatever "advanced math" features scope has without even breaking a sweat.

And that is where DHO4000 fails short. Close but no cigar.

I don't see it yet. But fierce shilling from Siglent makes me strongly suspect otherwise - because good product generally doesn't need any shilling as it sells itself. So far I only see 2000HD praised by confirmed or suspected shills, but very little in the way or actual normal users.
----
<removed>

[tautech]

And I guess we've now established that tautech's post about pricing was a lie So lame - all it takes is a single glance on the website...

Sorry, an honest error.
100 MHz vs 200 MHz pricing

I'll have a SDS2104X HD in ~10 days then I can test its -3dB point to see how it might compare with any 200 MHz model.
SDS2104X Plus was ~185 MHz and SDS2204X Plus was 300 MHz from recent tests....done with 2 sources as double confirmation.

[Martin72]

So far I only see 2000HD praised by confirmed or suspected shills, but very little in the way or actual normal users.

The same applies to dho4000 buyers.
But the posts in the threads of the dho 800 scopes just "explode".
Guess why...

[2N3055]

No we don't have to be complete shills.
All you need is to be able to read datasheets.

Yes you are.

Siglent was first manufacturer that started giving avay serial decoders for free years ago. Made Keysight and R&S really unhappy.

So what?

If you are comparing SDS2000X HD and DHO4000, SDS2000X HD gives one protocol more for free (LIN) and has 2 more optional protocols to choose from (SENT and MANCHESTER)..

Those are useless for me, unlike I2S, which Siglent doesn't give (but DHO4000 does).

DHO4000 has about 50-60% of analytic capability of SDS2000X HD. Just the difference in implementation of math channels is huge. And many more features. DHO4000 has edge only in fact that it's fastest version goes to quite high frequencies. It seems to be good scope. But not even close in measurement capabilities.

Don't care about fluff and paper features which I will never use anyway - I'm only interested in the main functionality. Analog bandwidth is the most important thing for me, with occasional serial decodes (but I'm hopefully going to buy an LA for that, so that won't be as important either). That's what I use the scope for. Everything else is not important.

For people that just want 12bit scope big screen, active probes etc but not advanced math it would be decent choice.
But generally you don't buy 12 bit scope to just use it as CRT analog scope. You don't need that analog performance to not use that info.

Yes I do. I don't care for "advanced math" (whatever it is). As long as I can export data points to PC, it will trash whatever "advanced math" features scope has without even breaking a sweat.

And that is where DHO4000 fails short. Close but no cigar.

I don't see it yet. But fierce shilling from Siglent makes me strongly suspect otherwise - because good product generally doesn't need any shilling as it sells itself. So far I only see 2000HD praised by confirmed or suspected shills, but very little in the way or actual normal users.
----
And I guess we've now established that tautech's post about pricing was a lie So lame - all it takes is a single glance on the website...

You are rude and abrasive. And don't care much for facts and won't let the facts stand in a way of good insult.

Rigol has one less protocol for free. If there is a sales promotion where they give you a bundle good for you. Siglent has those too. They come and go. Basic options are there in datasheet. Go and read.

I also said that if you don't need advanced scope but something simple with 12 bit and larger screen that then DHO4000 will serve you fine. It was right there in that text where you selectively copied only parts that justify your insults..
I didn't say it makes you stupid that you need/want only basic scope. But somehow you think you have right to call names people that want/need scope with more analytical capability. All manufacturers should be forbidden to make scopes that you don't approve of. Whoever makes  or uses a scope differently than you think is appropriate is an idiot.. Quite narcissistic and egocentric way of thinking...

If anybody is shill and troll it is you. You are pushing inferior scope by Rigol in a topic that discusses incoming new Siglent scope and it's similarity to SDS2000X HD.
Go sell Rigol somewhere else.

[asmi]

Sorry, an honest error.
100 MHz vs 200 MHz pricing

Ok, fair enough, we'll consider that incident resolved.

[KungFuJosh]

consider that incident resolved.

I think you're the angriest Canadian on here. 😉

[asmi]

You are rude and abrasive. And don't care much for facts and won't let the facts stand in a way of good insult.

I do care about facts, but you clearly don't. Otherwise you wouldn't beging praising the scope which didn't even came out yet

I didn't say it makes you stupid that you need/want only basic scope. But somehow you think you have right to call names people that want/need scope with more analytical capability. All manufacturers should be forbidden to make scopes that you don't approve of. Whoever makes  or uses a scope differently than you think is appropriate is an idiot.. Quite narcissistic and egocentric way of thinking...

I don't care if you need all that fluff, what I don't agree with is your point that EVERYBODY needs this fluff, and one scope which has less BS features is somehow useless just because of that.

If anybody is shill and troll it is you. You are pushing inferior scope by Rigol in a topic that discusses incoming new Siglent scope and it's similarity to SDS2000X HD.
Go sell Rigol somewhere else.

I'm not selling anything, nor I'm trying to convince Siglent shills to stop shilling - they obviously can't do that. I'm trying to bring some balance to discussion which otherwise is so one-sided that it's not even fully. Just look at the latest Rigol thread - there is some much Siglent shilling there, that sometimes I feel like it's not a thread about Rigol scope at all.
And see even in this post you claim that Rigol scope is somehow inferior, even though I clearly see otherwise - cheaper, better screen, more bandwidth, faster and more responsive UI. Those things are what matters, not useless BS fluff that very few ever use.

[asmi]

I think you're the angriest Canadian on here. 😉

I'm not angry, I'm just tired reading all this shilling.

[KungFuJosh]

shills

[2N3055]

You are rude and abrasive. And don't care much for facts and won't let the facts stand in a way of good insult.

I do care about facts, but you clearly don't. Otherwise you wouldn't beging praising the scope which didn't even came out yet

I didn't say it makes you stupid that you need/want only basic scope. But somehow you think you have right to call names people that want/need scope with more analytical capability. All manufacturers should be forbidden to make scopes that you don't approve of. Whoever makes  or uses a scope differently than you think is appropriate is an idiot.. Quite narcissistic and egocentric way of thinking...

I don't care if you need all that fluff, what I don't agree with is your point that EVERYBODY needs this fluff, and one scope which has less BS features is somehow useless just because of that.

If anybody is shill and troll it is you. You are pushing inferior scope by Rigol in a topic that discusses incoming new Siglent scope and it's similarity to SDS2000X HD.
Go sell Rigol somewhere else.

I'm not selling anything, nor I'm trying to convince Siglent shills to stop shilling - they obviously can't do that. I'm trying to bring some balance to discussion which otherwise is so one-sided that it's not even fully. Just look at the latest Rigol thread - there is some much Siglent shilling there, that sometimes I feel like it's not a thread about Rigol scope at all.
And see even in this post you claim that Rigol scope is somehow inferior, even though I clearly see otherwise - cheaper, better screen, more bandwidth, faster and more responsive UI. Those things are what matters, not useless BS fluff that very few ever use.

It is called paranoia. Take the meds.

[asmi]

It is called paranoia. Take the meds.

It's not paranoia if it's the reality. Do you want to count how many posts of yours are in the thread about Rigol scopes, even though you are clearly not interested in one? Do that, return with the number, and then we'll discuss who has paranoia and who needs to take meds.

[KungFuJosh]

It's not paranoia if it's the reality. Do you want to count how many posts of yours are in the thread about Rigol scopes, even though you are clearly not interested in one? Do that, return with the number, and then we'll discuss who has paranoia and who needs to take meds.

My first scope was a Rigol. That made me absolutely hate Rigol. I can't stand their scopes, I think their interfaces are poor at best, their graphics and layouts are crap, and their support is embarrassing. But you know what I don't do? I don't go hijacking Rigol threads with my unwanted opinion on their scopes. I don't like Rigol, so I don't buy their stuff, as simple as that.

There are no shills here. There are people here that own and are happy with Siglent products, discussing new products they're interested in.

You speak for NOBODY but yourself. You may not be interested in a plethora of features, but others are. Every user has different needs.

If you're not just trolling, you don't make any sense. If you're not interested, then go buy the Rigol you want and ignore this fake shill thread.

[2N3055]

It is called paranoia. Take the meds.

It's not paranoia if it's the reality. Do you want to count how many posts of yours are in the thread about Rigol scopes, even though you are clearly not interested in one? Do that, return with the number, and then we'll discuss who has paranoia and who needs to take meds.

You count them. And then count ones that I mention Siglent when it was not an answer to the question.
I think you confuse me with somebody else..

[asmi]

My first scope was a Rigol. That made me absolutely hate Rigol. I can't stand their scopes, I think their interfaces are poor at best, their graphics and layouts are crap, and their support is embarrassing. But you know what I don't do? I don't go hijacking Rigol threads with my unwanted opinion on their scopes. I don't like Rigol, so I don't buy their stuff, as simple as that.

I'm not talking about you, but go and open any Rigol thread - you will see all the same people who are praising Siglent here. One might ask a question - what the hell they all are doing there?

There are no shills here.

Yes there are. Some are open, others are trying (unsuccessfully) to pretend to be "objective".

There are people here that own and are happy with Siglent products, discussing new products they're interested in.

I don't see many posts from those people. But it's always the same faces, saying the same things.

You speak for NOBODY but yourself. You may not be interested in a plethora of features, but others are. Every user has different needs.

Yep, but unlike others I'm not saying that everybody absolutely needs all of that BS fluff.

If you're not just trolling, you don't make any sense. If you're not interested, then go buy the Rigol you want and ignore this fake shill thread.

I am interested in honest opinions of regular users, but not all the same people which clearly have some agenda here.

[tautech]

asmi
I see the market very differently from where I sit.
We have inquiry for mid entry range DSO's that when I judge the buyers experience might suggest a cheaper nearly as capable model. Rare is it they take that advice although it might save a $ that they can put towards other equipment.

Others are just adamant the want all the fluff, bells and whistles so to have an instrument they can grow into and it serve them well as their skills develop and grow.

No one size fits all irregardless of the entry cost.
YMMV

[Veteran68]

I think you're the angriest Canadian on here ever. 😉

FYP 

[KungFuJosh]

I'm not talking about you, but go and open any Rigol thread - you will see all the same people who are praising Siglent here. One might ask a question - what the hell they all are doing there?

I know you didn't mean me. My only comment about a Rigol in a Rigol thread was to praise their adding VESA mounts. I didn't like anything else I saw about the scope, but that one feature was cool, so I mentioned that.

There are no shills here.

Yes there are. Some are open, others are trying (unsuccessfully) to pretend to be "objective".

The onus is yours to prove that opinion. But first look up the definition of what a shill is. Objectivity is irrelevant. I'm not objective. I don't have to be. I like what I like, and I lean that way. I'm not a brand whore, but when a brand makes great products and treats me right, it might be easy to think that. My experience with Siglent has been nothing but fantastic. Except for the bug in my scope firmware that still annoys me. 😉

Yep, but unlike others I'm not saying that everybody absolutely needs all of that BS fluff.

Quite the opposite. You're saying that nobody needs those features. Guess what? I don't need most of them either! Guess what else? I want them! I want to learn and grow. If my SDS2504XP only had the features I need, I wouldn't have been able to do most of the learning stuff with the Batronix demo board. I enjoyed that a lot, and I learned a lot too.

I am interested in honest opinions of regular users, but not all the same people which clearly have some agenda here.

This is where you lose everybody, myself included. You claim to want honesty, but when you receive it, you don't accept it for what it is. We don't all have to agree on everything. There's nothing wrong with disagreeing opinions. There is something wrong with attacking and insulting the people you disagree with.

[asmi]

The onus is yours to prove that opinion. But first look up the definition of what a shill is. Objectivity is irrelevant. I'm not objective. I don't have to be. I like what I like, and I lean that way. I'm not a brand whore, but when a brand makes great products and treats me right, it might be easy to think that. My experience with Siglent has been nothing but fantastic. Except for the bug in my scope firmware that still annoys me. 😉

Of course it is relevant. But because people are not objective, it's important to know their biases. And I commend those who disclose them openly. Others pretend to be objective.

This is where you lose everybody, myself included. You claim to want honesty, but when you receive it, you don't accept it for what it is. We don't all have to agree on everything. There's nothing wrong with disagreeing opinions. There is something wrong with attacking and insulting the people you disagree with.

I don't see objectivity, I see shilling. All the same 5 people go from thread to thread and say the same things. Don't they have anything better to do? Maybe not, if they have interest is saying what they are saying.

BTW list of people thanking your post is also very telling - all the same shillspeople again

[Martin72]

All the same 5 people go from thread to thread and say the same things. Don't they have anything better to do? Maybe not, if they have interest is saying what they are saying.

Reminds me of an old joke:
A wrong-way driver ? Hundreds !!!

[sebyon]

SDS3000X HD, early 2024 is the whispers...... 

So I'm guessing the SDS1000X HD will be released at the same time or earlier?