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Having had extensive use of both the Rigol MSO5000 & 7000 models you could say I have a soft spot for these model ranges, I find them easy to use, responsive, and nicely constructed (at their relevant price points), they (the) 5 and 7 thousand series scopes had some nice features and made decent daily user scopes for a wide range of measurement applications.
No they are not 12bit+ machines with ultra low noise floors, we have other scopes for these particular areas we need to look deeper into, but that is not so often these days. However they do offer a lot of real usable performance for the cost.
The 8000 particularly feels really good, greatly improved GUI (even over the 7000) , for myself the eye and jitter measurements are especially useful.That said having a decent 2Ghz + BW at this cost range is very appealing as well. Coupled with a 500Mp deep memory and 10G/s (single channel) shared between the rest.
To put this into perspective if we take the Tek and R&S models which have USEFUL eye and jitter at this BW you are looking at around the £30K mark for the RTB2000 (plus high res option another £1500) though I did not realize at first it is an 8 bit adc that is software enhanced to 16bit) with 2 Ghz BW and memory upgrades, I2S options plus power analysis with the correct probes you are looking at £40K. Now I am not suggesting for one moment that the MSO 8000 is a giant killer in relation to the big four offerings, its not. But what you do get is a very decently appointed scope with decent everyday usable features with seriously good BW and deep memory and a decent sample rate plus eye and jitter facility.
The Jitter/eye option on the Tek 5 series is £4K plus £1800 for the I2S/L/RJT suite, for the 6 series the same apps cost £6300 + £1800 for the audio app. That is the price of the basic MSO8000!
That said they are pretty decent scopes without question, my point is what do you exactly require for the applications you use daily? R&D is a different matter!
Last week the 8000 arrived although we have been busy, have managed to try a few bits and pieces on the scope see below, we have been pleasantly surprised, especially with the GUI and overall feel of the unit, I know the 7000 uses the same casework, but the 8000 is another level.
Will be trying out some multi domain analysis later in the week as well so will post this up to
Used a HP4433B vector signal generator with OXCO option fully warmed up along with scope, using 18Ghz T-flex 405 cables.
Outputting a 2Vpp sine wave (10.60dbm on the HP), scope set to averaging, Freq counter on, period and second freq counter in the measurement bar on lower left hand screen, along with cursor information box.
First up Bodnar rise time reference test a very respectable 168ps
500Mhz 2Vpp base line start point
Followed by the 1Ghz even at 1.5Ghz (still showing1.92v), then the -3db point on this scope (1.42V) on this scope of 2.216Ghz not bad for a 7200 euro scope. All options are available thanks to the man of a thousand coding scrips
Next I really wanted to see how far I could push this scope before decided enough was enough
Now 2.5ghz still a very usable 1.07v!
This surprised me a viable waveform at 3.2Ghz all be it @-11db seriously though 2.9Ghz is actually very usable! maybe not for precise measurement but its usable and more than visible!
Lastly an FFT plot using a 2.5Ghz signal at the same 2Vpp (from 500Mhz) you can see they are identifiable peaks up to 3.7Ghz
From the brief period I have spent with this new model, the MSO 8000 is shaping up to be a serious scope for sensible mid range pricing with some big ticket features.
One issue I found , the main frequency counter stops at 2.460Ghz, (it actually reads backwards at higher BW, though it is only supposed to have a 2Ghz BW!) the measurement/analyze section does not suffer the same fate.
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Curriculum of one of Rigol's MSO8000/7000 programmers
MSO8000 (maybe also 9000):
"Project description: MartialEagle is an upgrade of the previous flamingo project. The target of the project is 20G sampling rate, 8 channels, 15.6-inch 1080P. A new generation of oscilloscopes with a strong touch experience."
MSO7000:
"Project description: The flamingo project is a major update of the rigol oscilloscope, which completely abandoned the oscilloscope level that has been used for nearly 20 years since the company was founded. Taiwan, software and hardware have been completely updated, the software for the first time using the linux + QT development program under the arm, the project goal is a sampling rate of 10GSa/s, a multifunctional digital oscilloscope with a storage depth of 500Mpts and a bandwidth of 500MHz." -
Time for some follow up on the Rigol MSO 8000. It's been around a month now and confidence in the unit is pretty high now having been used for many a project it has acquainted itself very well.
This time a few benchmarks to see plus I thought it might be good see how it stacks up against 'real' scope as Martin72 puts it
So a Tektronix MSO64 with 8Ghz BW 25G/s, 16 bit in high resolution mode, segmented memory etc full jitter/eye and power analysis apps, installed so no small task as the Tek is one very decent piece of equipment price around £80+K in this format
Starting off with basic noise floor measurements on both scopes.
Rigol MSO 8000 full bandwidth 2Ghz, no high resolution mode, precision on only, 50mv per div and 200ps in the time domain trigger level set to 2mv, nothing connected histogram on also Vrms shown as well as deviation showing
First image I did at the same time as the Tek then realized I had only 49.5mv per div showing so I took another measurement this morning sorry
The third image is the Tek MSO64, set to 2Ghz BW, no high resolution mode, 50mv per div and 200ps time domain, 2mv trigger and only 500G/s showing (lol) with histogram plots and Vrms, amplitude etc.
As you would expect the Tek is pretty good, but the Rigol isn't bad either
We have been developing a new power supply for a high speed clock application so I have been using both to measure the development process and will keep you posted on the comparison between the two.
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Curriculum of one of Rigol's MSO8000/7000 programmers
Isn't machine translation wonderful?
MSO8000 (maybe also 9000):
"Project description: MartialEagle is an upgrade of the previous flamingo project. The target of the project is 20G sampling rate, 8 channels, 15.6-inch 1080P. A new generation of oscilloscopes with a strong touch experience."
MSO7000:
"Project description: The flamingo project is a major update of the rigol oscilloscope, which completely abandoned the oscilloscope level that has been used for nearly 20 years since the company was founded. Taiwan, software and hardware have been completely updated, the software for the first time using the linux + QT development program under the arm, the project goal is a sampling rate of 10GSa/s, a multifunctional digital oscilloscope with a storage depth of 500Mpts and a bandwidth of 500MHz." (Taiwan roughly translates to platform).
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Following on from the earlier post here are a couple of word clock square wave forms taken on both scopes using T-Flex 405 cabling (50 Ohm) BNC Some further comparison images for you.
Frequency is 44.1Khz , both scopes set to 250Mhz band width, 330m/v vertical scale, trigger is 1.23, both in high resolution mode, the Tek has 12.5G/s here to the Rigol's 10G/s, and both are using 500kpts of memory.
First image is the Rigol, second is the Tek
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Images of a Rigol MSO8000 and a LeCroy WavePro 254 going head to head.
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The Wavepro 254 is a good step above the TekMSO64, will start a new thread on this
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https://int.rigol.com/Public/Uploads/uploadfile/files/ftp/DS/%E8%BD%AF%E5%9B%BA%E4%BB%B6/MSO8000(ARM)Update.rar
Compare the release notes with MSO5000 !!!Code: [Select]v00.01.01.01.06 2020/02/25
- Optimized the connection HDMI start problem optimized the connection HDMI start problem
- Optimize the vertical gear, channel zero elimination error
- Optimization of the inconsistency between SPI CLK and SDA names
- Zoom mode square wave display in optimized 2S time base
- Added command to get pass / fail times
- Delete the default email account and password
- Problems in remote instructions are optimized
- Optimized 1K storage depth, waveform recording
- The problem of too many stuck events in optimized decoding -
So far I can confirm the mouse works with the 8000 no problem ultra responsive, maybe a little too quick!
The screen touch also seems much better as well, pinch and zoom are not twitchy, more positive. On some of the graphical drop down menu's have extra options especially in the parameters.
Boot up time is still pretty much the same 57 seconds, the jitter app is much more stable and dare I say accurate (bench marking to come), the eye diagrams also appear again more stable and faster to happen and after analysis.
I do not connect to net so can't comment on remote access or pass/fail process testing, my UPA software also seems to be smoother and more rersponsive.
Will go into more detail in the week, a couple of large jobs I really need to finish!
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I don't think W ever went away, just spends more time reading than posting, very helpful chap as well
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Maybe he was too busy helping out Owon to improve their products
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MSO8000 (maybe also 9000):
"Project description: MartialEagle is an upgrade of the previous flamingo project. The target of the project is 20G sampling rate, 8 channels, 15.6-inch 1080P. A new generation of oscilloscopes with a strong touch experience."
1 year later, we know what MSO8000 (just another rendition of the same platform) and project MartialEagle will be a few years out. If we look that it took Project Flamingo from 2013-ish as a start, to 2018 to come to market, that's 5 years, after having used the previous platform for 20 years (DS1052 and DS1054Z) they aren't going to release the eagle just yet. They'll wait until either the competition has something along those lines ready. For me, I like that better, don't want to have an outdated scope already :p it's only 2 years old :(I Had my DS1052 for 10 years :p) -
1 year later, we know what MSO8000 (just another rendition of the same platform) and project MartialEagle will be a few years out. If we look that it took Project Flamingo from 2013-ish as a start, to 2018 to come to market, that's 5 years, after having used the previous platform for 20 years (DS1052 and DS1054Z) they aren't going to release the eagle just yet. They'll wait until either the competition has something along those lines ready. For me, I like that better, don't want to have an outdated scope already :p it's only 2 years old :(I Had my DS1052 for 10 years :p)
Hello oliv3r
As the say the (Martial) Eagle has already landed
Realistically April/May next year several platform s available including a stand alone 5Ghz rf genny
There is also this unit the Max7000 which can be configured to multi instruments I suspect including a RTA and quality VNA as well as the scope
https://www.rigol.com/products/oscillosopes/MAX70000.html
"The MAX70000 series of time domain workstations are software-definable measuring instruments based on data acquisition and analysis systems and arbitrary signal synthesis. Equipped with the "Phoenix" chipset of RIGOL's independent intellectual property rights, it has four 4GHz analog bandwidth receiving channels and four 5GHz analog bandwidth transmitting channels, and can be flexibly configured into a variety of high-performance instruments according to customer applications."
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Hello, The Rigol MSO8000 looks very competitive. For general purpose applications (1Ghz BW, everyday use, exclude price), which would series of oscilloscope would be your preference a Rigol MSO8000, a R&S RTM3004 or Keysight 4000X.
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Hello, The Rigol MSO8000 looks very competitive. For general purpose applications (1Ghz BW, everyday use, exclude price), which would series of oscilloscope would be your preference a Rigol MSO8000, a R&S RTM3004 or Keysight 4000X.
The new MAX also looks awesome; but my budget is 500 ish for a scope for home/basic office use. I went overboard on the MSO5k as it where
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Does the MSO8000 come with Bode plot, I don't recall it being on the 7000 or 8000. Is it that Rigol feels this is not something for more professional scopes.
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Does the MSO8000 come with Bode plot, I don't recall it being on the 7000 or 8000. Is it that Rigol feels this is not something for more professional scopes.
I believe it is planned with then next firmware update (when ever that maybe!) It is a great everyday and back up scope, lots of features genuine 2.3Ghz bw, while its not the quietest scope in the lower orders below 20mv it stands really well than some of the more illustrious marques after this point/
Plus you have half decent jitter and eye pattern options, 10G/s sample rate and 500Mts of memory to play with and its pretty fast as well.
Makes for good quick look at serial data trans mission issues with larger bandwidth investigations, its nice quiet (MXR lol) and has hdmi output.
For the outlay you really do obtain a lot of really useful features, I also like the GUI as well currently my second favourite after Lecroy.
The MSO8000 does gets used regularly in the lab a very underrated device imho -
I was just wondering why they would have implemented Bode plot on the lower end 5000 but not the higher end scope since it would be fully capable of doing it and the firmware is similar.
Other users have reported that the 7000 is shipped with newer firmware than what is on the Rigol site, I have not found out if it comes with additional features but it is possible that they may have firmware available if you request it. I have also gotten firmware for the 5000 that corrects issues with XY mode and agent was using a later beta firmware on their test scope. I was not able to get any response if a firmware would be released. -
Other users have reported that the 7000 is shipped with newer firmware than what is on the Rigol site, I have not found out if it comes with additional features but it is possible that they may have firmware available if you request it.
The target customers for these 'scopes don't download firmware off the internet like the poor people do, everyone knows that things you download are always full of viruses.
Nope, they only get it through their trusted customer support programs.
