Rigol MSO 5000 hardware/software revisions

[sb42]

If I buy an MSO5074, what are the probes that come with it?  Are they 350 MHz probes?

Yes, it should come with four PVP2350 probes.

[Martin72]

If I buy an MSO5074, what are the probes that come with it?  Are they 350 MHz probes?

Yes, in my case it cames with the PVP2350 probes(4pcs.)

[NoisyBoy]

Yes, these are 350MHz probes. 

Martin72, I read your frustration with the probes Siglent packaged with the SDS2000X Plus, I understand your sentiment especially compared to what Rigol has packaged with their scopes.  For low end scope like this, the odd for someone paying for a bandwidth upgrade is pretty low, perhaps that's why they packaged it with the low end probes.  It would be nice if they package the nicer probes with it.

Gandolf_Sr, the MSO5000 is a hobbyist scope compared to the Agilent you sold, so temper your expectation if you have not owned a Rigol scope before.  It is an OK entry level scope with good value, but firmware update is infrequent (which partially drove Martin72 to switch to the Siglent) and its is sluggish at times.  We also discovered hidden phone home behavior buried in the firmware, so I have to keep it on a physically isolated network as it can potentially serve as an attack vector for hackers.  But for the low end models, it is a value buy, the fully loaded model is overpriced.

If your intention is to get a comparable replacement to your Agilent, I would stay with the excellent Keysight MSOX4000A series.  The R&S RTA4000 with its 10-bit architecture is also intriguing, especially when you can get the all-in bundle promo at $12K right now.  But you are also talking about scopes where you pay more in sales tax than what the Rigol costs.

[tautech]

Martin72, I read your frustration with the probes Siglent packaged with the SDS2000X Plus, I understand your sentiment especially compared to what Rigol has packaged with their scopes.  For low end scope like this, the odd for someone paying for a bandwidth upgrade is pretty low, perhaps that's why they packaged it with the low end probes.  It would be nice if they package the nicer probes with it.

It's pretty clear which probes will be supplied here:
https://int.siglent.com/products-annex/sds2000xp/

[Gandalf_Sr]

Yes, these are 350MHz probes. 

Gandolf_Sr, the MSO5000 is a hobbyist scope compared to the Agilent you sold, so temper your expectation if you have not owned a Rigol scope before.  It is an OK entry level scope with good value, but firmware update is infrequent (which partially drove Martin72 to switch to the Siglent) and its is sluggish at times.  We also discovered hidden phone home behavior buried in the firmware, so I have to keep it on a physically isolated network as it can potentially serve as an attack vector for hackers.  But for the low end models, it is a value buy, the fully loaded model is overpriced.

If your intention is to get a comparable replacement to your Agilent, I would stay with the excellent Keysight MSOX4000A series.  The R&S RTA4000 with its 10-bit architecture is also intriguing, especially when you can get the all-in bundle promo at $12K right now.  But you are also talking about scopes where you pay more in sales tax than what the Rigol costs.

Thanks, all advice appreciated.

As it happens, my main scope is a Keysight MSOX4054A with the full application bundle (legit); I bought it used from the eBay store and was lucky to get the App Bundle with it. I have several Agilent probes (passive and active) plus an Agilent LA probe set.  I also own a Rigol DS1054Z and MSO2072A.  I sold the MSO7104B as I never go over 500 MHz and I needed the money.  The MSO5074 is a kind of fill in to mess with.

[Martin72]

Martin72, I read your frustration with the probes Siglent packaged with the SDS2000X Plus, I understand your sentiment especially compared to what Rigol has packaged with their scopes.  For low end scope like this, the odd for someone paying for a bandwidth upgrade is pretty low, perhaps that's why they packaged it with the low end probes.  It would be nice if they package the nicer probes with it.

Especially, when nowadays a 1400 bucks scope wasn´t low-end anymore, but this is off topic here.

@Gandalf_Sr

What excatly you want to do with the rigol, when you have the keysight already?

[Gandalf_Sr]

@Gandalf_Sr

What excatly you want to do with the rigol, when you have the keysight already?

Don't try to talk me down off the ledge, I want to jump!

[NoisyBoy]

Gandalf_Sr, I hate to burst the bubble.  But with the scopes you already have, I would be one who would pull you back on the roof. 

Unless Rigol release a big update with more reliable firmware and new features, I don't see what the MSO5000 has to offer that you don't already have.  Better save the money and spend it on a new equipment type you don't already have.  If you run out of ideas, buy a vintage piece with some historical significance that can serve as a conversation or display piece. 

[nctnico]

Agreed. Or if you really want to try something new then look at the recent Siglent models.

[NoisyBoy]

Agreed, my experience with SIGLENT on its firmware updates is much better.  Tautech is also building a lot of goodwill for the brand.  On the other hand, I have never seen Rigol acknowledging any of the issues we identified on its products.  If I have to choose between the two, SIGLENT wins hands down, just simply for the fact that they care about this forum has to say. 

[Martin72]

Hi,

If I have to choose between the two, SIGLENT wins hands down, just simply for the fact that they care about this forum has to say. 

Mhhhh….yes….but:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/review-rigol-mso5000-tests-bugs-questions/msg2490627/#msg2490627

This list is known by rigol and they wanted to give me a reply to the single points there, whether their were bugs or not, so I could report in the thread.
This should happen with the next firmware update, they told me once and months ago.
Well, now I doesn´t got a rigol anymore, the next update is still missing… I don't think I'm gonna get another answer.

[Gandalf_Sr]

Clearly there are several card-carrying members of the Siglent Fan Club contributing to this thread; be aware I am not a member due to past bad experiences, especially when buying new models that had basic things wrong with them like missing components.

Thanks for all the efforts to talk me off the ledge though, I'm feeling the lovEE

Rigol may be slow to fix things but I have several pieces of Rigol gear and they all get the job done.

Part of my thinking goes like this; I am close to retirement and won't need high end gear like the MSOX4054A when I get there.  If I get the MSO5000 and gradually iron out the bugs, I could sell the Agilent scope (and probes) in a year or so.

[nctnico]

Clearly there are several card-carrying members of the Siglent Fan Club contributing to this thread; be aware I am not a member due to past bad experiences, especially when buying new models that had basic things wrong with them like missing components.

If there is anyone here who got really f***** by Siglent it is me. I wish my problems where a few missing capacitors and poor quality binding posts. Easy to fix. You have no reasonable cause to complain at all compared to me  . There is 2k euro in Siglent's pocket for which I got nothing at all. Still even I can't ignore Siglent oscilloscope firmware and update frequency has improved a lot since then. So one of their scopes is likely to be a replacement for your Keysight a lot sooner than a Rigol. Which in turn means you can free up the cash tied up in it a lot sooner (and get more).

[Gandalf_Sr]

Clearly there are several card-carrying members of the Siglent Fan Club contributing to this thread; be aware I am not a member due to past bad experiences, especially when buying new models that had basic things wrong with them like missing components.

If there is anyone here who got really f***** by Siglent it is me. I wish my problems where a few missing capacitors and poor quality binding posts. Easy to fix. You have no reasonable cause to complain at all compared to me  . There is 2k euro in Siglent's pocket for which I got nothing at all. Still even I can't ignore Siglent oscilloscope firmware and update frequency has improved a lot since then. So one of their scopes is likely to be a replacement for your Keysight a lot sooner than a Rigol. Which in turn means you can free up the cash tied up in it a lot sooner (and get more).

I sympatize with all that have been f***** by Siglent; so how do you reconcile the above with your previous post that "agreed" that I didn't need another scope but then said...
"...if you really want to try something new then look at the recent Siglent models"?

FYI, I unburdened myself of all my Siglent gear.

[nctnico]

At some point you just have to be practical and look at things on a case-by-case basis. I get that you may want to avoid Siglent gear out of principle. I always say: Principles cost money. OTOH there are plenty of people around here who are warning not to buy newly released test equipment because it will have flaws.

Rigol will likely take even longer to fix firmware so I don't see any added value of choosing Rigol over Siglent (to put it mildly). If your goal is to replace your Keysight scope then it is better to do that sooner than later because of devaluation.

My previous remark was aimed at the notion that you where seemingly looking for a piece of equipment to toy around with. Not replace an existing piece of gear. Probably it is a bit of both but getting some fixer-upper vintage gear may not be the best replacement for a higher end oscilloscope.

[TK]

Everyday use will be slow, every knob turn, every button pressed... that accounts for lots of wasted time in my opinion.

[luma]

I think threads like this tend to attract the posters who have problems, so let me crawl out of the woodwork and say I've had zero problems with this scope in the past year of use.  The firmware update schedule isn't a problem for me, I don't want to be on a monthly update cycle for my test gear.  The screen size is just right - it leaves room for individual channel controls and if I want a bigger screen it has HDMI out (which I have connected but never need to use) and a functional web UI (which I find super handy for documenting things I'm seeing on the screen). 

UI response time is fine, and I feel like I got an incredible value for the money spent on this instrument.  Despite the complaints here, I suspect there is a sizable community of users who are going on about their day with this tool without experiencing the sorts of issues reported by a handful of users above.  That's not to detract from their own experience, rather to balance it out with a different viewpoint.

If I were going to make the decision again, I'd buy the 5000 again.

[TK]

I had the MSO5000 2 times, both times ended up selling it. For me it was just not worth $999, when I can have a similar user experience for $350 with the DS1054Z.  If you don't need all the extra features, you are just fine with the lower cost model.  It all depends if you had experience with other scopes or not.  I tried the Keysight 1000X, 2000X, 3000T, micsig, siglent SDS1104X-E and GW Instek 1054... any of these scopes offer better UI experience than the Rigol.

[Gandalf_Sr]

I had the MSO5000 2 times, both times ended up selling it. For me it was just not worth $999, when I can have a similar user experience for $350 with the DS1054Z.  If you don't need all the extra features, you are just fine with the lower cost model.  It all depends if you had experience with other scopes or not.  I tried the Keysight 1000X, 2000X, 3000T, micsig, siglent SDS1104X-E and GW Instek 1054... any of these scopes offer better UI experience than the Rigol.

This is kind of silly, you're allowed to say you don't like the UI of the MSO5000 but saying a Keysight 3000T is "better" is  ludicrous.

The MSOX3034T (350MHz, 5GspS, with no free features) costs $10,759 and you could buy the bundle to add most serial decodes and the AWG for another $3,600

Assuming you didn't want to hack, right now you can buy the Rigol MSO5204 with a free upgrade to 350 MHz (350MHz, 8GspS) and free serial decode bundle for $2,699

Or you can pay $999 and hack it

[nctnico]

The 3000T is the most expensive one from the bunch. The MicSig and GW Instek scopes cost about half or even less compared to the MSO5000. The way I read TK's post: you can leave about $500 in your pocket and still get a scope which is more pleasant to use.

[Martin72]

For him...

[nctnico]

Well, if you have had that many different types and brands through your fingers then you are entitled to have a more generic opinion because of the broader perspective.

[TK]

Nobody has the absolute truth, so you must take any post as being personal to the poster.   I really would like to hear what Gandalf_sr says after experiencing the MSO5000.

[TK]

I did not buy the 2000x and 3000t at retail price. Actually i got them “broken” for a small fraction of the retail price and fixed them. You just need a lot of patience.

[Gandalf_Sr]

I just ordered a MSO5074 from Tequipment.net