Author Topic: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG  (Read 259705 times)

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Offline harddkyss

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #275 on: January 31, 2022, 12:47:49 am »
Damn, forgot about that. I emailed them 'bout a week ago, still hadn't heard anything. There was someone on here who received 3.1 or 3.2 via email from them, for the life of me can't find that person.
I tried 1.7 with no luck.
 

Offline eti

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #276 on: January 31, 2022, 01:39:21 am »
Please I need Help!! I flashed V5 firmware on an older version board (2.0 stupid me didn't know owon had different board rev's) and it essentially bricked the display portion. I do have button functions but no display and can still flash new firmware so if anyone has ver 3.1-3.2 for VER 2.0 board HDS272S, PLEASE I need it badly!! it would be extremely appreciated :-+
Thank you very much!
Daniel
You need send e-mail to this info@owon.com.cn adres and request last firmware fore you h/w vercion pcb.

It’s not April fools day quite yet. Nice to see guy have a sense of humour though. 😁

One has more chance of Freddie Mercury serenading them at the kitchen window than Owon fulfilling a basic support request.
 

Offline tly

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #277 on: January 31, 2022, 01:40:57 am »
Please I need Help!! I flashed V5 firmware on an older version board (2.0 stupid me didn't know owon had different board rev's) and it essentially bricked the display portion. I do have button functions but no display and can still flash new firmware so if anyone has ver 3.1-3.2 for VER 2.0 board HDS272S, PLEASE I need it badly!! it would be extremely appreciated :-+
Thank you very much!
Daniel
You should add the first 4 digits from S/N off device too.
Good luck.
 

Offline luma

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #278 on: January 31, 2022, 02:21:45 am »
Just maybe.... this is exactly why they don't just post the firmware images to their web site.  Too many combinations of options and users will just flash anything they download.
 
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Offline eti

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #279 on: January 31, 2022, 04:10:28 am »
Just maybe.... this is exactly why they don't just post the firmware images to their web site.  Too many combinations of options and users will just flash anything they download.

It seems you’re not familiar with their other support page, which offers exactly this same mix of hardware versions, firmware variants and serial number requirements for updating - and yet, sure as I sit here, it sits there and offers firmware.

Let’s not dance around the elephant in the room any more, and keep on naively pretending - they’re useless, and don’t care one bit about support. Simple as.

 L👀K: ————> https://www.owon.com.hk/supports_firmware_upgrade

No further proof required. 
« Last Edit: January 31, 2022, 04:12:21 am by eti »
 

Offline harddkyss

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #280 on: January 31, 2022, 04:56:02 am »
@eti So that's what I've heard about OWON.

I own this, this is all on me. I thought perhaps maybe they would have a message like "incorrect firmware for board model" or something, at least that's what I do so as to prevent incorrect firmware for different board revisions that roam the internet.

If they email me back with firmware or I find it somewhere I'll be sure and post it so that others will have it (if I can post files) and let everyone know if it was successful or not.
Thanks to everyone for the help.
Daniel
 

Offline eti

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #281 on: January 31, 2022, 05:11:33 am »
@eti So that's what I've heard about OWON.

I own this, this is all on me. I thought perhaps maybe they would have a message like "incorrect firmware for board model" or something, at least that's what I do so as to prevent incorrect firmware for different board revisions that roam the internet.

If they email me back with firmware or I find it somewhere I'll be sure and post it so that others will have it (if I can post files) and let everyone know if it was successful or not.
Thanks to everyone for the help.
Daniel

Yes, one would hope they’d have had the sense to employ such checks, hmm? Never underestimate human laziness (esp programmers - it’s a known fact)
 

Offline optotester

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #282 on: January 31, 2022, 07:39:55 am »
An alternate way could be to buy the screen being used in 3.0 board (or at least screen with same resolution and driver). You may have to reorder some pins though, but after that you may be able to use the last firmware version with all fixes. Could you post pictures of your board and screen PCB ?
 

Offline harddkyss

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #283 on: January 31, 2022, 08:26:09 am »
Yes I agree eti!! and circuit debugging/testing has been lost in the wind.

@optotester Nah it's not that big of a deal I'm sure when I get the OS/FPGA firmware it'll be just fine. Bootloader and OS is all working fine. I know they changed LCD's and the driver for the LCD is in the FPGA firmware file.
Daniel
 

Offline eti

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #284 on: January 31, 2022, 08:17:05 pm »
An alternate way could be to buy the screen being used in 3.0 board (or at least screen with same resolution and driver). You may have to reorder some pins though, but after that you may be able to use the last firmware version with all fixes. Could you post pictures of your board and screen PCB ?

That sounds like a terrible, convoluted idea - the long way round a simple issue.
 

Offline optotester

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #285 on: January 31, 2022, 10:57:27 pm »
I do agree that it might not be the best idea but if firmware is not updated for devices with old screen version, it means you will never get any fix and have to live with bugs if you do not replace the screen. That is not that great either
 

Offline eti

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #286 on: January 31, 2022, 11:07:17 pm »
I do agree that it might not be the best idea but if firmware is not updated for devices with old screen version, it means you will never get any fix and have to live with bugs if you do not replace the screen. That is not that great either

Your idea would have to be an absolute LAST resort, having exhausted absolutely ALL other avenues for many weeks (I speak personally). Fools rush in, and to rush into this would mean making a mountain RANGE out of a molehill, whilst simultaneously voiding the warranty (and then, also, he'd have a hybrid device INCOMPATIBLE WITH FUTURE FIRMWARE VERSIONS which is a VERY short-sighted "solution")

I would counsel to exercise great caution and use wisdom and discernment before heeding any suggestions such as this, as logical and clever as they may seem. This SEEMS a "good idea", but when you think through it with long-range foresight, you will find it seems a poor choice.

« Last Edit: January 31, 2022, 11:10:37 pm by eti »
 

Offline hobbeeist

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #287 on: February 01, 2022, 03:36:14 am »
I do agree that it might not be the best idea but if firmware is not updated for devices with old screen version, it means you will never get any fix and have to live with bugs if you do not replace the screen. That is not that great either

Your idea would have to be an absolute LAST resort, having exhausted absolutely ALL other avenues for many weeks

Maybe if this was a $10k+ unit, but at the <$200 price point, with the warranty already possibly voided by loading software provided by a 3rd party (even if that 3rd party got it from Owon), I'd recommend they just buy another unit (exact replacement, or another brand) with expedited shipping. Better to have a working tool in a day or two, than to waste "many weeks" of productive time, working with tech support who are currently celebrating the Chinese New Year.

And once you've received the new unit and written off the first unit, then I see no reason not to do some thoughtful probing to see if you can mod/fix it. I've got a number of screens in my parts bin. If one of them has a matching pinout (power/ground/signal level+direction), I'd give it a go. I have plenty of experience with these sorts of devices, so while I wouldn't recommend this possible fix to a random person on the street, I'd feel perfectly comfortable trying it myself.

Best case, you now have two working units. I'd argue that the repaired unit *will* be compatible with future firmware versions, but for the "wrong" serial number, since by the definition of this scenario, it's compatible with the software currently loaded (which is also for the wrong serial number). And even if it were not so, you could presumably reverse the mod to restore the original screen after another software load.

Worst case, the unit that's already broken stays broken. Since you diligently checked the pinout before plugging anything else in, no electrical harm was done, so it's not any worse off either. Dave has taken a soldering iron to much more expensive tools in his videos (and not as a last resort). If you're lucky, it might be as simple as replacing the cable in the ZIF connector. That said, I probably wouldn't run off to buy screens I didn't already have on hand until I'd heard back from support (and used my new tool in the meantime).

And despite all my text above, harddkyss said:
it's not that big of a deal
with respect to the screen-swap suggestion. Since it's ultimately their problem to solve, I'd say that's the end of that discussion for now.
 

Offline luma

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #288 on: February 02, 2022, 06:21:26 pm »
So my HDS2102S just arrived!



Hooked this up to a pulse generator to try and characterize bandwidth (kinda).

Setup:
  • Bodnar fast risetime pulse gen
  • Rigol ADP0150BNC 50Ω adapter
  • Included OWON OW3100 100MHz probe, compensated w/ internal siggen
  • Some sloppy cable routing and general inattention to detail and process

The measurement features here are a little restrictive so I'm trying to place the cursor at my best-guess for the 10% and 90% voltage points on the waveform below to indicate rise time.



Back of the napkin math has a 2.6ns rise time working out to about 135MHz of bandwidth.
 
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Offline tly

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #289 on: February 02, 2022, 10:04:23 pm »
So my HDS2102S just arrived!


Nice toy. Grats.
How many days did you used it before posting ?
 

Offline luma

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #290 on: February 02, 2022, 10:51:12 pm »
So my HDS2102S just arrived!


Nice toy. Grats.
How many days did you used it before posting ?



How many days did you used it before posting ?



How many days did you used it before posting ?

oh, about a year or so.
 

Offline e1ioan

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #291 on: February 02, 2022, 11:10:03 pm »
I got my HDS272S last week from Amazon (hardware version 2.1.0). I paid $206 for it. I see that for about the same price I can get the HDS2102S from Banggood.
Should I return the HDS272S and get the HDS2102S?
 

Offline eti

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #292 on: February 02, 2022, 11:21:46 pm »
I got my HDS272S last week from Amazon (hardware version 2.1.0). I paid $206 for it. I see that for about the same price I can get the HDS2102S from Banggood.
Should I return the HDS272S and get the HDS2102S?

Well what do YOU think  :-+ :P
 

Offline e1ioan

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #293 on: February 02, 2022, 11:43:55 pm »
So my HDS2102S just arrived!

Where did you order it from?
 

Offline luma

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #294 on: February 02, 2022, 11:55:34 pm »
Ordered Jan 21 from Banggood.
 
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Offline Flopdoodley

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #295 on: February 03, 2022, 12:23:39 am »
So my HDS2102S just arrived!

Nice!  Would love to see photos of the new board.

Just thinking out loud here........  Resetting the firmware number sequence probably means a new generation of PCB was developed for the HAD1511 DAC and tweeks or redesign of the front end to meet the 100+MHz. I'm guessing that at some point in the future this new board will be used in the HDS242/HDS272 (unless they're phased-out completely) and the difference between the models will be strictly software driven (ala Siglent, Rigol, others). That way they could continue to have only one BOM for this line of product, getting their best volume pricing on the components.
Perhaps a potential move up to 120MHz and a memory upgrade down the road?? That would allow them to stay well ahead of Hantek.
Specs in the latest HDS200 series owner's manual already shows the HDS2102S has a 500MSa/s rate for this new DAC compared to the 250MSa/s we have now, maybe this will spill into the 242 & 272?

Wishful thinking...  :popcorn:
 

Offline hobbeeist

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #296 on: February 03, 2022, 05:23:34 am »
I received the HDS2102S earlier today.
S/N 2152*** (presumably built in week 52 of 2021)
SW: V1.3.3
Checksum: 67f52158.

I scanned the earlier parts of this thread, and tested most (if not all?) of the reported shortcomings. Since tly posted the nicest list, I'm using their order, even though not all of the bugs were first reported by them. You can find their postings here:
tly post a-e
tly post f-g
tly post h-i


a) Fixed. "Channel 2 is Off" message never appeared for me during my usage
b) Fixed. I was able to manipulate the frequency after returning to the AWG screen
c) Fixed. Upon returning to the Osc screen, I see a sine
d) Present. Changing from sample to peak affected the frequency measurement (but not the counter). I looked around the waveform after stopping, and didn't see any double edges, but maybe I just didn't look closely enough.
e) Fixed. There are still a number of quirks in the AWG settings (for instance, the allowed adjustment ranges change when toggling between frequency and period), but this particular one is fixed.
f) Fixed. Recalling cursors from a saved config appears to behave as expected.
g) Fixed. Time cursors remain in units of time.
h) Present. Battery indicator jumps from ~6pixels to "low battery" at around 3.76V (measured both cells). This could be intentional, depending on power supply margins needed.
i) Present. However, as explained in an earlier post, an AC trigger coupling with a DC signal coupling doesn't lend itself easily to a reasonable way to display

The behaviors surrounding channel selection and the auto button, as described by Flopdoodley are also still present.

The buzzer option is still missing, as described by rn777

Similar to luma, I was excited to see how the unit performed when provided a fast edge input from one of Leo Bodnar's fast edge generators. Since the single channel sampling rate is 500MHz, the absolute best case would be 2ns. I measured closer to 2.8ns by eye, but as luma mentioned, it's hard to tell with much certainty on the unit itself. Maybe extracting the waveform and analyzing on a computer might provide some insights. I suspect that due to the sin(x)/x interpolation, the real edge time would be best measured by doing some statistical analysis on a bunch of the measured edges.

I investigated the pulse performance based on how it was input. I tried a direct connection (the pulse generator has a BNC connector), using the spring ground on the included OW3100 probe, and also tested the performance of two cheap Daniu P6100 probes, one on each channel, but only one channel at a time. I saved all four of these configs as reference waveforms, then attached the clip ground on the OW3100 probe to the edge generator, to get the screenshot "pulse_inputs_2.png".

I also tested out the 20MHz bandwidth limiter, by capturing a reference waveform of the (directly connected) edge generator, and then turning on the bandwidth limit. This comparison is screenshot "pulse_bw_limit.png".

I popped the back off, and was surprised to discover that the batteries are literally taped into the unit. I don't recall seeing that on earlier models. I means that in order to swap them out for the first time, you have to first remove the whole back cover. I didn't realize this before attempting to pry them out with a plastic spludger, since I didn't want to open it with power still applied, thus the small scuff marks. The board is dated 2021-09-16, and has a revision of HDS2102x_main_V1.0
« Last Edit: February 03, 2022, 05:28:16 am by hobbeeist »
 
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Offline hobbeeist

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #297 on: February 03, 2022, 06:11:02 am »
Ran another test, to see how closely aligned in time the two channels are. Here, I'm using the fast edge generator as the input to both channels (via the cheap P6100 probes). There is some variation in the alignment from one capture to the next, but they generally stay pretty close to each other, so can't complain too much about relative timing. I suspect some of the variation is due to the interpolation of the exact sample points. Also nice to see that the rise time appears very close to 4ns in two channel mode, which is the best you could get with a 250MSPS rate.
 

Offline hobbeeist

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #298 on: February 03, 2022, 07:12:01 am »
Because there was some doubt as to whether or not it could play "oscillofun", and I said I'd try it out if nobody else did I went ahead and played the "oscillofun" song from my laptop into an audio patch cord, and clipped the probes to the other end of the cord. Sure enough, it shows up on screen! I didn't record a video, since it looks nearly identical to the original video that was posted, but I did take a photo as evidence. I also gave a couple other tracks a try, like YouScope, but results were generally so-so, as one might expect with a cheap DSO.
 
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Offline gtube

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Re: OWON HDS 200 Handheld Oscilloscope w/ builtin DMM/AWG
« Reply #299 on: February 03, 2022, 07:39:03 am »
I also received my HDS2102S today. I hooked it up my 100Mhz OCXO. It can measure 100Mhz quite well.
Using the same 100mhz probe. The measured VPP voltage is bit higher than HP which I think it is more accurate (less roll off).
There is probably a bit of opamp DC offset after it is warmed up, so need to run auto calibration if want to make the center line right on the center. No big deal.

The multimeter AC bandwidth is up to 1Khz according to my test.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2022, 07:43:49 am by gtube »
 
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