new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004

[LaurentR]

Yeah fan noise is not as good as I thought it would be either - my initial impressions were in a room with aircon and I thought it was fine, but now it's at home in a quiet environment it's louder than I'd like (though much better than my rigol before it's fan swap).
I also noticed that during boot it runs at different speeds, including a nice quiet one - wish it would pick that speed when the ambient isn't too warm!

I'll have a look at what it's doing with the fan next time I have the cover off.

Hydron,
I'm wondering if something isn't right, my scope is dead quiet and I'm very particular about noise. I just  turned everything in my lab off, shut the door to block any outside noise and I have to put my ear up to the scope to hear it. Even then it's not annoying. Could you have jostled it in your travels?
Rob

Same for me. Cannot hear anything. Might it be that you "changed" something while you altered the defends?

I haven't modified anything yet - will query the fan noise with R&S and hold off fixing the detents until I get the noise sorted out.

Let me know how it goes. Not sure about the screwdriver method, but I'll pop the box open and see if there is anything wrong with the fan.

The funny thing is that I remember thinking that the scope was very quiet when I first turned it on, but later noticed it wasn't. It's possible something has changed in between.

[nctnico]

That sounds like a temperature controlled fan to me. They start quiet but get increasingly louder.

[Robaroni]

That sounds like a temperature controlled fan to me. They start quiet but get increasingly louder.

I believe it is heat controlled fan. I would say it is quieter than my 34465A that sits above it. Is it possible that some of you have your scopes in an enclosed area? All those large holes are there for a reason.
Rob

[Robaroni]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/352053924341?ul_noapp=true

Gone!

[gslick]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/352053924341?ul_noapp=true

Gone!

Next up, asking $3,795.00
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152545370074

I have one arriving on Monday. Hmm, keep it or flip it?

[Robaroni]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/352053924341?ul_noapp=true

Gone!

Next up, asking $3,795.00
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152545370074

I have one arriving on Monday. Hmm, keep it or flip it?

You have to decide whether you want a great scope or the money. OK, so you make $2k, what do you buy that competes with it for your initial investment plus your profit?

I've already made provisions, mine goes in the ground with me!

Rob

[LaurentR]

Checked the fan voltage at the connector with long probes and got 10.7V. Basically running full blast despite an ambient of 21C. I don't think that's right. Anybody else with a quiet one can check voltage at runtime?

During boot, it briefly cycles through 4V (very quiet) and 7V (quiet) then back to 10V (not quiet).
Interestingly, the fan is very nicely mounted on a full rubber bed, so they clearly paid attention to fan vibration. Impressive.

BTW, is there any source for FW 01.204? I tried flashing the old 01.203 to see if it would solve the issue and now I have an error when booting...

[nctnico]

I have one arriving on Monday. Hmm, keep it or flip it?

You have to decide whether you want a great scope or the money. OK, so you make $2k, what do you buy that competes with it for your initial investment plus your profit?

Lots of really nice scope for $4k on Ebay. Getting one with a bandwidth over 1GHz and lots of options isn't out of the question.

[Hydron]

Checked the fan voltage at the connector with long probes and got 10.7V. Basically running full blast despite an ambient of 21C. I don't think that's right. Anybody else with a quiet one can check voltage at runtime?

During boot, it briefly cycles through 4V (very quiet) and 7V (quiet) then back to 10V (not quiet).
Interestingly, the fan is very nicely mounted on a full rubber bed, so they clearly paid attention to fan vibration. Impressive.

BTW, is there any source for FW 01.204? I tried flashing the old 01.203 to see if it would solve the issue and now I have an error when booting...

Just checked and my fan is at 10.62V when in normal operation. Could anyone with a quiet fan check theirs? I will be sending an email to R&S shortly about this and other bugs, and would be good to know what the "quiet" units measure (would reveal if it's the fan or the firmware at fault).

[Robaroni]

I have one arriving on Monday. Hmm, keep it or flip it?

You have to decide whether you want a great scope or the money. OK, so you make $2k, what do you buy that competes with it for your initial investment plus your profit?

Lots of really nice scope for $4k on Ebay. Getting one with a bandwidth over 1GHz and lots of options isn't out of the question.

I saw some used scopes, some older used scopes but nothing with a 10" touch screen, MDO, built in gen, etc. And the R&S is new with warranty, still the best deal I've found for $3,795.

Another one just got listed, bet it doesn't last long.

[ws2812b]

Another one just got listed, bet it doesn't last long.

Do you have a link?  I Ddon't don't see it on eBay? Or is it already gone?

[Robaroni]

Another one just got listed, bet it doesn't last long.

Do you have a link?  I Ddon't don't see it on eBay? Or is it already gone?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rohde-Schwarz-RTB2004-300MHz-4-16-Channel-Oscilloscope-All-Opt-R-S-RTB2K-COM4-/152545370074?hash=item2384699fda:g:NawAAOSwX61ZC0bH

[ocw]

Some numbers from my RTB2004:

50 ohm bandwidth -3 dB:    327 MHz
50 ohm bandwidth -6 dB:    433 MHz
50 ohm bandwidth -10 dB:  594 MHz
50 ohm bandwidth -16 dB:  721 MHz
50 ohm bandwidth -20 dB:  803 MHz
50 ohm bandwidth -26 dB:  968 MHz
50 ohm bandwidth -30 dB: 1083 MHz

Input Impedance:  930.5 kilo-ohms

Amplitude Input      RTB2004 Measurement
   25.0 mV                        25.0 mV
   50.0                              50.0
   75.0                              74.8
   100                               100
   250                               250
   500                               500
   750                               758
   1.00 V                           1.01 V
   2.50                              2.50
   5.00                              5.00
   7.50                              7.50
   10.0                              9.98

10 MHz Square Wave output:  10,000,001.0 Hz Measured

Function Generator Sine Wave Output:
   100 Hz:  0.01% distortion
   1 kHz:    0.01% distortion    Noise:  -72.13 dB
   10 kHz:  0.01% distortion

Negligible fan noise.

[nctnico]

Note that the scope's input capacitance will screw up the input impedance badly so you'd have to adjust the readings to take that into account.

[ocw]

Note that the scope's input capacitance will screw up the input impedance badly so you'd have to adjust the readings to take that into account.

My impedance measurement procedure was:

10 VDC - 1M Ohm Resistor - RTB2004

4.83 VDC was measured on the RTB2004 vs. 4.82 VDC on my Keithley 616 connected to the RTB2004 input.  The RTB2004 measurement did not change when the 616 meter was added.

[nctnico]

For the RF measurements -ofcourse-.

[ws2812b]

Some numbers from my RTB2004:

50 ohm bandwidth -3 dB:    327 MHz
...

How did you get it to 50Ohm?

[ocw]

How did you get it to 50Ohm?

Use a BNC 'T' on a RTB2004 input and place a 50 ohm load on one side of the 'T'.

[Joel_l]

I just bought some 50 ohm feed throughs, less clutter.

[Joel_l]

Has anyone played with looking at modulated signals? I get less that stellar results when looking at even just an AM signal. I've tried the different color modes and settings and can't get a nice clean gradient. From what I understand, scopes labeled as DPO do this well and have an extra memory buffer and processing to do it. I don't think I read anything about the RTB series having this so maybe I just shouldn't expect the performance in this area.

Any thoughts?

Joel

[mikeselectricstuff]

Has anyone played with looking at modulated signals? I get less that stellar results when looking at even just an AM signal. I've tried the different color modes and settings and can't get a nice clean gradient. From what I understand, scopes labeled as DPO do this well and have an extra memory buffer and processing to do it. I don't think I read anything about the RTB series having this so maybe I just shouldn't expect the performance in this area.

Any thoughts?

Joel

I think the density vs. brightness curve could be improved.
One issue is the high screen resolution means that lines, particularly verticals, end up very thin and disproportionally dim- this is particlularly noticeable on square waves, where you have to set the intensity pretty high for them to be visible, negating some of the advantage of an intensity graded display.
A side-by side comparison of an AM envelope looks significantly better on the Keysight,

[mikeselectricstuff]

Fan voltage on mine is 10.5v. It does appear to be under software control, as it varies during bootup.
Yellow wire is a tacho output, though it doesn't give an error ( at least not immediately or at startup if the fan is stalled.

[KrzysztofB]

Can someone tell me how to set up mask testing, so the bad waveforms would end up in History ?
Somehow I have problems setting that.

Also, is it possible to export captured frames comming from UART decoding?
I mean, frame by frame to CSV / XLS rows?

[mikeselectricstuff]

Also, is it possible to export captured frames comming from UART decoding?
I mean, frame by frame to CSV / XLS rows?

Enable Bus Table - that lets you save captured data, but possibly not as useful as it should be until they fix the UART packet framing bug

[KrzysztofB]

Any clue about if they scheduled for releasing firmware update?