Magnova oscilloscope

[joeqsmith]

The 1 M input termination must be used with the supplied passive probes.

Reading the manual, is the above statement accurate?  Does the scope have proprietary 10x probes that must be used?   Other probes that would meet the required compensation are not supported?


***
After reading the manual, there are a few minor things that may need cleaned up but these could be from running the translator (see previous post for attached English translation).   For my purposes, this manual was good enough. 

It's one thing to read how that UI works but I think I would just need to try and run it.   Having used a mechanical UI since my first Dumont oscilloscope, I can see really liking it or hating it. 

The one thing I really see missing is a programmers manual.   I commonly will use test equipment as part of a larger test and am used to rolling custom software to automate them.  I would like to see this interface well documented.  I also would like to see metrics published on what sort of data transfer rates we could expect.   

All in all,  it looks good and I am still very interested.   Get that thing certified for sale in the USA or just ship one of the prototypes and lets have a look.   

[Martin72]

Where did you find this, which page?

[Martin72]

I found it(page17).
It only says that you have to switch the input to 1M if you want to use the supplied probes.
Which makes sense, because they are designed for 1M.

[egonotto]

Hello,

there must be a few owners of a Magnova by now. It would be nice if one of them would write here.

Best regards
egonotto

[egonotto]

Hello,

Question for Batronix and Martin72:

@Batronix: Is it possible to operate the Magnova from remote via internet?

If so, you could connect an interesting signal to each input and give Martin72 access for a certain time.

@Martin72: Would you participate?

Best regards
egonotto

[ebastler]

If so, you could connect an interesting signal to each input and give Martin72 access for a certain time.

I'm not sure that would that do justice to a scope where the UI is one of the distinguishing features. You could not really experience the user interface with the large screen and the four flexible rotary encoders right next to it, acting as "soft knobs". And you could not experience screen update rates and smoothness (or lack thereof) when moving things around either.

These aspects don't matter that much if you are purely after an "analytical scope". But my feeling is that the Magnova -- while hopefully providing comprehensive and accurate measurements and analytics -- puts a lot of focus on interactive use and how that handles and feels.

[joeqsmith]

The 1 M input termination must be used with the supplied passive probes.

Reading the manual, is the above statement accurate?  Does the scope have proprietary 10x probes that must be used?   Other probes that would meet the required compensation are not supported?

I found it(page17).
It only says that you have to switch the input to 1M if you want to use the supplied probes.
Which makes sense, because they are designed for 1M.

Note the quotation, this was copied from the Google translated manual verbatim.   So, are you suggesting that this is a problem with the translation and that the original language tells us something different?   This would make sense but I have no way of knowing, which is why I asked. 

[egonotto]

Hello,

On page 17 under 4 it says: “Bei den mitgelieferten passiven Tastköpfen muss die 1 MΩ Eingangsterminierung verwendet werden”.

This means that if you use the supplied passive probes, than you must set the input to 1 MOhm.

It does not say that you have to use the supplied probes. So this is no different to most other scopes.

Best regards
egonotto

[joeqsmith]

Ok, so a Google translation problem.   Thanks as I was thinking this was going to be a deal breaker.   Imagine a scope that couldn't use standard 10X probes....  

[LoneWolf6912]

Sadly, I still didn't received the scope.

[DK3BH]

At least I can confirm: Its real and it works
I received my magnova scope yesterday.
The boottime is rather quick (~29 seconds) and the unit is well put together.
The display is indeed really crisp and the UI seems even more responsive than the UI of the Tektronix Series 5 we have at work.

Any suggestions what I should test first during the weekend?

[Martin72]

Looks like a TV....

[woody]

Looks like a TV....

Go wash your mouth! 

[FloBX]

The English-language manual is almost ready and will also be made available online in a few days.

Looking forward to reading it. 

An English-language manual is now available at https://www.batronix.com/magnova/en/downloads or via the Magnova product pages.

@Batronix: Is it possible to operate the Magnova from remote via internet?

We will need a few weeks before we can provide documentation of remote control features (Rest API/USBTMC/HiSLIP/Raw). We have just joined the LXI Consortium but do not yet have a certified product.

Looks like a TV....

I personally prefer applying some tilt to the screen.

We are now looking forward to the first customer feedback. Thanks to DK3BH so far!

Best regards,
Florian
(Batronix)

[nctnico]

Looks like a TV....

Go wash your mouth! 

Learn to recognise a compliment  If it looks like a TV, it has a very high WAF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wife_acceptance_factor

[woody]

Looks like a TV....

Go wash your mouth! 

Learn to recognise a compliment  If it looks like a TV, it has a very high WAF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wife_acceptance_factor

But is that what you really want? Honey, that tiny TV set you left on your desk, that did not work. I tried it but only got static on all channels. As I was going into town anyway I dropped it at the recycling plant for you. Saves you a ride, no?

[egonotto]

....
Any suggestions what I should test first during the weekend?

Hello,

have fun with the Magnova.
What bandwidth does your device have?
Did you buy a function generator with it?
Did you buy one or two logic probe sets?
How do you cope with the position of the BNC connectors on the right?

Best regards
egonotto

[joeqsmith]

Thank you for turning around that English manual so fast.   It is much better than the Google translated version.   

For the software interface manual,  even if you just have a list of the basic commands and not the full documentation, I would like to see it.  Just to have some idea how to interface with it.   

In the long term, do you plan to provide sample test software in various languages to get people started with writing their own custom software?

I notice your avoidance to respond to my question about availability to the USA.  If certification is the concern and you would like to have it tested, maybe we could help out.  Shoot me a PM if interested and we can talk about it.

[Martin72]

We are now looking forward to the first customer feedback.

Well, I guess I will too, then.

[DK3BH]

....
Any suggestions what I should test first during the weekend?

Hello,

have fun with the Magnova.
What bandwidth does your device have?
Did you buy a function generator with it?
Did you buy one or two logic probe sets?
How do you cope with the position of the BNC connectors on the right?

Best regards
egonotto

Hi,

I brought the 200 MHz version of the Magnova.
So far I didn't go for the optional wave-gen, because I already own an old Marconi signal generator which can do all modulations I need.
But I ordered one of the logic analyser probes, but they seem to be delivered later.

My model showed a -3dB point around 334 MHz when directly supplied by the signal generator.
It was around 194 MHz when using the supplied probes.
Those are a good step up from the ones which came with my Siglent SDS2104x plus.
They have a much better feel of quality to them.

I'am still not convinced by the side mounted BNC connectors.
When using my scope, I mostly use hands free probes.
And so far the front BNCs on a "traditional" scope were never an issue for me.

The somewhat odd shape takes away more bench space, but there are VESA mounting holes on the back.
Maybe I will get a small arm to have it floating above the bench.

A point to keep in mind: The Magnova gets quite warm during operation.
You can see it in the offset drift in the lower voltage ranges.
That settles around 30mins and in the mean time, an offset cal fixes the issue.

Best regards,
DK3BH

[Geofrey]

Hi,

Thanks for the first impressions.

How do you like the UI ? And the scope so far overall ?
Do the noise look consistent with the datasheet values ?
How responsive is the FFT ?

Best,

[nctnico]

Looking at the screenshots I must say that I'm missing a clear distinction between information and buttons. It is because I know what should be buttons and what should be information, I can tell the difference but I think some differentiation in the graphical representation would be nice.

[DK3BH]

The UI is a bit overwelming at first. Its much easier when you sit in front of it and can just fiddle around with the touch screen

The UI itself is super responsive.
Even with low waveform update rates, the scope remains responsive (that really bugged me out on my former siglent scope).

I will try to get you guys a small video from the UI interaction (and measure the noise floor as well) when I'am back from the office tomorrow.

Till now I'am quite happy the the scope.

[nctnico]

I'm also noticing something I call 'trigger lensing'. Around the trigger point, the trace gets thinner but beyond that, it get much thicker. I don't think this is a true representation of the signal as noise around the trigger point makes the trace move left/right more than it should. A trigger condition should be targeted at an edge of a signal (IOW a section of the signal) around the trigger level crossing which to some extend (=the trigger hysteresis boundaries) cancels noise, not just the single point where the signal crosses the trigger level. Maybe this can be adjusted with a trigger hysteresis setting.

[DK3BH]

I'm also noticing something I call 'trigger lensing'. Around the trigger point, the trace gets thinner but beyond that, it get much thicker. I don't think this is a true representation of the signal as noise around the trigger point makes the trace move left/right more than it should. A trigger condition should be targeted at an edge of a signal (IOW a section of the signal) around the trigger level crossing which to some extend (=the trigger hysteresis boundaries) cancels noise, not just the single point where the signal crosses the trigger level. Maybe this can be adjusted with a trigger hysteresis setting.

Thats interesting. Is there a paper about that topic to dive a bit deeper?
I saw that issue on various oscilloscopes but never saw that as an issue.
I thought its something related to the sample rate / waveforms per second update rate ratio and never thought about it in detail.

But I put our mighty Tek Series 5 scope at the office though the same challenge and even here its visible (but of course at a much lower extend):