Let’s Talk About LeCroy Scopes, AKA… the “Wuerstchenhund Holds Court” Thread

[Electro Fan]

This thread is intended to stimulate a discussion of LeCroy scopes.  Since LeCroy offers a fairly good size product family the WaveSurfer 3024 is proposed as an initial reference model to help people get oriented to the overall LeCroy product family.  Other models might be more or less capable, older, newer, etc.  – but the 3024 (and the 3000 series) looks to be a good starting point in understanding LeCroy scopes.

http://teledynelecroy.com/oscilloscope/oscilloscopemodel.aspx?modelid=8556

http://cdn.teledynelecroy.com/files/pdf/wavesurfer-3000-datasheet.pdf

A few basic introductory things about the 3024:

4 analog channels seems to be generally preferred but for 2 channel requirements there is the 3022

Touch screen, mouse capable, and conventional UI (see “Maui” UI)

MSO capability – seems to offer not only mixed use (including 16 digital channels) but also pretty good review functions; the toolset and history mode also look interesting

http://teledynelecroy.com/newwave/videos/

As with other products from other manufacturers the documentation and videos, etc. can be compelling but until you actually use a product it’s hard to know what is really what.  So questions from potential new users and feedback from existing users would be great.

Net, net:  Given all the Rigol, Agilent/Keysight, Tektronix, etc. discussions around it would be interesting and useful to better understand the MSOs and DSOs from LeCroy.

Without further ado, here is the “Let’s Talk About LeCroy Scopes”, AKA… the “Wuerstchenhund Holds Court” thread.

All info, comments, questions, etc. regarding LeCroy scopes welcome.

[nctnico]

I looked at the Wavesurfer 3000 but what put me off is that the MSO + decoding options made the 4 channel 200MHz model almost twice as expensive  The price difference will be worse with lower bandwidth and less channels. Getting a second hand Agilent DSO7000 series made more sense to me in the end.

[marshallh]

Can't beat 1ghz ABW for $500.

[Howardlong]

How much of an afterthought is the MSO capability? In some 2nd hand scopes I looked at it seemed to be a USB peripheral.

[Wuerstchenhund]

Without further ado, here is the “Let’s Talk About LeCroy Scopes”, AKA… the “Wuerstchenhund Holds Court” thread.

*hammering gavel to the block*

Silence! The court is in session! 

(sorry, I just couldn't resist, plus I always wanted to try that Shadow font!) 

This thread is intended to stimulate a discussion of LeCroy scopes. Since LeCroy offers a fairly good size product family the WaveSurfer 3024 is proposed as an initial reference model to help people get oriented to the overall LeCroy product family.  Other models might be more or less capable, older, newer, etc.  – but the 3024 (and the 3000 series) looks to be a good starting point in understanding LeCroy scopes.

The WS3k is a good scope, even though the hardware is actually made by Siglent (the software comes from LeCroy). This isn't necessarily a bad thing, as Siglent makes really good hardware (they just really suck at software), but it shows in some areas, i.e. the front panel layout.

It's aimed mostly against the Keysight DSOX3000T, which is a good scope, however there are a few points that speak for the WS3000 (taken from an earlier positing:

• The Wavesurfer comes with a larger screen with higher resolution (10.1" 1024x600 vs 8.4" 800x480 with the DSOX3kT)
• For scopes with bandwidths up to 1GHz I'd say in practical terms 4GSa/s and 10Mpts is probably much more useful than 5GSa/s and only 4Mpts memory
• FFT with the WaveSurfer is up to 1Mpts while the DSOX3kT uses only 64kpts which is pretty poor
• The WaveSurfer allows automatic and manual sample memory/sample rate management while the DSOX3kT is automatic only
• Unlike the DSOX3kT, which feature-wise is not that much better than the DSOX2k, the WaveSurfer 3000 has many features that can be found in LeCroy's high-end scopes, i.e. WaveScan and LabNotebook.
• The DSOX3kT has nothing comparable to WaveScan, which is a very versatile tool to find rare glitches and other issues and which works 'live' as well as on sampled data.
• The DSOX3kT also doesn't offer anything comparable to LabNotebook, which is a documentation tool and pretty neat if you have to document your measurements in some standardized format.
• The WaveSurfer 3000 uses the same probe interface (ProBus) all midrange and high-end scope from LeCroy use since the mid '90s, which means there's a wide range of suitable active probes out there, including a lot of second-hand ones which often sell for reasonable prices because they don't carry the "Tektronix" or "Agilent" label
• Integrated AWG: 25MHz 125MSa/s 14bit with 16kpts on the WaveSurfer, 20MHz 100MSa/s 10bit with 8kpts on the DSOX3kT (both not great, but still)
• LAN is standard on the WaveSurfer 3000 while it's a $400 option on the already expensive DSO3kT
• Not that important, but the WaveSurfer has four (2x front, 2x rear) USB host ports (Keysight two, one front one rear)
• Plus the WaveSurfer 3000 is noticably cheaper than the DSOX3kT

As with other products from other manufacturers the documentation and videos, etc. can be compelling but until you actually use a product it’s hard to know what is really what.

That is true, which is why for anyone considering spending that much money on a scope I strongly recommend to contact the scope manufacturers and ask for a loaner (and there often is the chance to get a fully loaded demo scope at a large discount), or failing that, buy the scope where it can be returned without problems within a certain period (i.e. a week).

Net, net:  Given all the Rigol, Agilent/Keysight, Tektronix, etc. discussions around it would be interesting and useful to better understand the MSOs and DSOs from LeCroy.

Well, it definitely is pretty Rigol and Keysight centric in this forum, which is a shame as it creates the impression that nothing else is out there or worth considering. Leaving out LeCroy from low end scope discussions is understandable, though, because their low end scopes either suck (WaveAce, Siglent rebadges) or come with outdated specs (WaveJet), however there's also R&S which offers what was formerly Hameg under the Value Instruments moniker (and which has some nice entry-level scopes), and they're regularly ignored as well.

I'm well aware that I'm pretty much the only one who mentions LeCroy in some threads (which has earned me a few funny and not so funny titles), but I'm still surprised that they are rarely even mentioned, aside from the occasional "my colleague doesn't like them because they are complicated" or "LeCrap" BS stories.

At the end of the day, more choice is good, and more choice means we're more likely to find the right scope, plus it keeps prices in check.

[Wuerstchenhund]

How much of an afterthought is the MSO capability? In some 2nd hand scopes I looked at it seemed to be a USB peripheral.

On the WS3000 it's pretty much an integral part of the scope, not an afterthought, and that is also the case for other LeCroy X-Stream (Windows) scopes.

However, there is an exception: after LeCroy came out with the WavePro 7000 and WaveRunner 6000 scopes they also wanted to offer MSO capabilities. For that they bought in some MSO adapter called MS-32 which connects to the scope's BNC input and to its USB port. MS-32 performed badly (and with 'bad' I mean really bad!), and even worse its problems were inherent in its design and therefore couldn't be fixed through software updates. MS-32 was exactly that, MSO as an afterthought. Prospective buyers of used WavePro 7000(A) and WaveRunner 6000(A) scopes should really stay away from a scope equipped with MS-32 at all costs, because not only does the MSO option perform badly, the scope will refuse to boot if the MS-32 adapter isn't connected if the MSO option is installed.

For its successor scopes LeCroy then developed new MSO options (MS-250 and MS-500) which connect through a proprietary high speed bus (L-Bus) and which perform great, and which are fully integral parts of the scope software. The first scopes with the new MSO option were the WaveSurfer Xs and the WaveRunner Xi, and later it also came to the WavePro 7000A successor WavePro 7zi.

TL;DR: the MSO options are great except for MS-32 which should be avoided.

[Howardlong]

I think it must've been the MS-32 that I'd seen. I had my suspicions about how it would perform, you've confirmed them. Thanks for the other details too.

[Wuerstchenhund]

If anyone is interested, here is a old document talking about the technology that went into the LeCroy WaveMaster 8000 and which came out in 2001. The WavePro 7000 is pretty much identical except for the lower bandwidth (1-3GHz for the WP, 3-6GHz for the WM) and the inputs (WP: BNC 50ohms/1M switchable; WM: 50ohms BMA).

[Wuerstchenhund]

Here is a table showing the Parameter Measurement, Analysis, and Math Capabilities of the older WaveRunner2 LT (VxWorks) and the WaveRunner 6000/WavePro 7000/WaveMaster 8000 (Windows).

It shows for example that the WaveRunner2 LT (a scope which came out in 2000) could already do up to 1Mpts FFT, and the WavePro/WaveMaster up to 50Mpts when most other scopes were still limited to 64kpts or 128kpts (or even less).

[free_electron]

LeCrap.

i still don't like em.

-Plastic rotary knobs that split and then fall off (all of em, the plastic becomes hard and brittle over time),

-Removable frontpanels gimmicks that become a bad contact nightmare (7ZI series)

-Slow as molasses to respond to their UI (7000 series, 7Zi)

-Become more noisy than a hoover vacuum as soon as you do anything with em ( 7Zi series )

-Crappy probes where the pogo-tips break off in the grabber hooks.

-Endless "calibrating" messages and "triggering" messages .. with 4 to 10 seconds blind times. ( come on, make an ADc that doesn't drift will ya ! No other scope manufacturer needs that crap)

- buggy user interfaces. one The 7000 and 7300  DSA's : spin the timebase knob too fast and the scope bluescreens... whoopdedoo. STILL not fixed after 10 years of complaining !

- bass ackwards functionality. Like store traces in memory , perform an acquisition , scroll and you lose time lock between memory and acquisition... duh !

Nope. Not for me. Thank you.

The problem with LeCroy machinery is that these products started as very fast, deep memory samplers to be used in the physics department. They still have that mindset. They don't behave like what you'd normally expect from a scope. They have their strange quirks that make sense if you treat em as deep memory fast samplers. Not so much as you'd expect from a scope. LeCroy also fails miserably when trying to integrate stuff. Their foray into mixed signal ( the want to have 16 or 32 digital channels) was a disaster. They used a third party to design that block and the integration was a disaster. The damn thing was so buggy on its UI that a selected block to zoom in on would show a completely different block. The same goes for their current probes. Overpriced rebadged Hioki's to make em compatible with their crappy 6 pin pinheader scope connector.

[HighVoltage]

I had bought a Lecroy Wavejet 354 500 MHz and was full of anticipation to use it.
It was small and cute and that is where the fun stopped.

- It was soooooo loud from the air ventilation, it was impossible to work next to it
- As soon as any math function was turned on, the scope became not responsive anymore.
- Slow response in general on the GUI
- A huge area of the screen is wasted for menu options, even if they are not used
- Getting data of the scope was possible but not easy.
- and so much more, I am happy I forgot!

Guess what, I returned it after a few weeks!
And I will probably never have a LeCroy again!

[XFDDesign]

I actually picked up a WaveSurver 3054 earlier this year to replace a Tek scope that went into the recycling bin.

I find the probes to be well made, especially compared to the new Tektronix probes which I have a hard time getting repeatable contacts with. The unit on whole is actually pretty silent. I don't much care for the touch screen, if only for the fact it doesn't seem to be as responsive as I would like.

The math operations are quite nice, and LeCroy has done some very clever work with managing the display when you do different tasks (i.e. you can have an FFT get its own part of the window, without being on top of your traces).

I'm very impressed with the fact that the scope still operates as a scope, while the FFT engine crunches numbers. I'll keep getting waveforms while it's computing. My old junked TDS5k couldn't do that. The built in, low freq, arb is actually quite nice as well, having a damn good SFDR compared to most off-the-shelf ARBs.

[Wuerstchenhund]

-Plastic rotary knobs that split and then fall off (all of em, the plastic becomes hard and brittle over time),

Yes, that was pretty common on the 9300 Series (mid ''90s) and the WaveRunner LT (late '90s), falling off knobs was pretty much their trademark. With the WR2LT and WavePro 900 the knobs were changed, and much more durable, and aside from early production runs of the WR(M)Xi (2006) and falling off "Superknobs" on early production runs of the WaveRunner 6zi (2009) that wasn't much of a problem. Plus LeCroy often just sent you a batch of replacement knobs (usually the improved variant).

-Removable frontpanels gimmicks that become a bad contact nightmare (7ZI series)

Yes, the removable frontpanel (the whole panel can be removed and connected to the scope via USB cable so that you can have the controls close to your workspace, which I find pretty neat) on early WP7zi units had contact problems with the USB sockets when they were plugged in the unit. That was fixed pretty quickly out in the field and in production.

-Slow as molasses to respond to their UI (7000 series, 7Zi)

Not really. I worked on 7zi and 7zi-A, and there's nothing slow on these scopes. I also have a WavePro 7000A in my private lab, and again, no slowness here. Some of the earlier WavePro 7000 (non-A) which were sold with Windows 2000 were somewhat laggy when operating the front panel, this was improved in later software updates, and these days these scopes should be upgraded to XP anyways as otherwise they're stuck on an antique firmware.

I vaguely remember that last time you listed your "dislikes" you mentioned that they were still on Windows 2000 running an older software. If so then maybe you should try XP and the current firmware, and your problem should be gone.

-Become more noisy than a hoover vacuum as soon as you do anything with em ( 7Zi series )

Yes, they are nosiy. So are pretty much all multi-GHz high end scopes (the DSO90k will blow your brains out). That is mostly because these scopes develop an extensive amount of heat that needs to be removed somehow.

-Crappy probes where the pogo-tips break off in the grabber hooks.

Never happened to me. And I have not exactly the most sensitive hands.

-Endless "calibrating" messages and "triggering" messages .. with 4 to 10 seconds blind times. ( come on, make an ADc that doesn't drift will ya ! No other scope manufacturer needs that crap)

If you get endless "calibrating" and "triggering" messages then your scope is either defective or you're doing something wrong (actually, endless "calibration" was one of the bugs on earlier WavePro 7000 and 8000 scopes).

And if you think that other manufacturer's ADCs don't drift then you're wrong, they pretty much drift exactly the same, just the scope doesn't bother to compensate for it.

BTW, you know that you can disable the auto calibration? You should, as I'm pretty sure I told you before 

- buggy user interfaces. one The 7000 and 7300  DSA's : spin the timebase knob too fast and the scope bluescreens... whoopdedoo. STILL not fixed after 10 years of complaining !

Of course the problem has been fixed, pretty much in one of the earlier Windows 2000 software releases.

- bass ackwards functionality. Like store traces in memory , perform an acquisition , scroll and you lose time lock between memory and acquisition... duh !

Never noticed that, but considering that the other software issues you mentioned have been fixed long ago this could well be another case of outdated software.

BTW, these problems are not limited to LeCroy, I've seen more than my fair share of annoying and aggravating bugs on Agilent scopes as well. That's why the software can be updated.

The problem with LeCroy machinery is that these products started as very fast, deep memory samplers to be used in the physics department. They still have that mindset. They don't behave like what you'd normally expect from a scope. They have their strange quirks that make sense if you treat em as deep memory fast samplers. Not so much as you'd expect from a scope.

I work almost exclusively with high end scopes, mostly with Agilent/Keysight, and aside from UI and functional differences (i.e. some stuff that's available on one scope or but not another) a LeCroy scope pretty much behaves like any other scope. The only "strange" quirk is the swapped horizontal and vertical controls, the rest is pretty straight forward.

LeCroy also fails miserably when trying to integrate stuff. Their foray into mixed signal ( the want to have 16 or 32 digital channels) was a disaster. They used a third party to design that block and the integration was a disaster. The damn thing was so buggy on its UI that a selected block to zoom in on would show a completely different block.

That would be the MS-32 MSO option that I mentioned earlier, and yes, it was buggy like hell and pretty useless. However, that thing came out around 2003, and in the last 12 years things have changed a bit. The later MS-250 and MS-500 MSO options for WaveRunner MXi and WaveSurfer MXs are actually pretty good, and aside from the fact that the MSO boxes are a bit large and cumbersome the MSO performance is pretty much on a similar level as what you can get from Keysight.

The same goes for their current probes. Overpriced rebadged Hioki's to make em compatible with their crappy 6 pin pinheader scope connector.

I can't complain over Hioki, their probes are actually pretty good. I also don't know what is "crappy" on the 6pin header that is part of ProBus, the probe interface they now use pretty much unchanged for over 20 years and which has proven to be pretty solid, but if that's your opinion then fine.

[Wuerstchenhund]

I had bought a Lecroy Wavejet 354 500 MHz and was full of anticipation to use it.
It was small and cute and that is where the fun stopped.

- It was soooooo loud from the air ventilation, it was impossible to work next to it
- As soon as any math function was turned on, the scope became not responsive anymore.
- Slow response in general on the GUI
- A huge area of the screen is wasted for menu options, even if they are not used
- Getting data of the scope was possible but not easy.
- and so much more, I am happy I forgot!

Guess what, I returned it after a few weeks!

Good for you, why keep it if it doesn't satisfy your expectations. That's why one should always ask for loaners of all scopes one considers for purchase.

I guess this must have been a while ago, probably ten years or more. The WaveJet 300 came out in 2004, and in 2007 was replaced by the WaveJet 300A (which was replaced by the WaveJet 300T Dave reviewed recently).

The WaveJets are rebadged Iwatsu scopes (the 300 is a DS-5000 if I remember right), the only part that comes from LeCroy is the brand name. They are not bad scopes but as you said the original WaveJet was noisy, and the UI was reminescent on the old Tek UIs of the '90s. In 2004 the WaveJet was a very good offer, but these days its specs are pretty unimpressive.

And I will probably never have a LeCroy again!

Well, never say never, each brand has come up with lemons, and while LeCroy's low end scopes are pretty poor, their scopes like the WaveSurfer 3000 and up are really good.

[joeqsmith]

-Plastic rotary knobs that split and then fall off (all of em, the plastic becomes hard and brittle over time),

Yes, that was pretty common on the 9300 Series (mid ''90s) and the WaveRunner LT (late '90s), falling off knobs was pretty much their trademark. With the WR2LT and WavePro 900 the knobs were changed, and much more durable, and aside from early production runs of the WR(M)Xi (2006) and falling off "Superknobs" on early production runs of the WaveRunner 6zi (2009) that wasn't much of a problem. Plus LeCroy often just sent you a batch of replacement knobs (usually the improved variant).

The sent me all new knobs for the old Waverunner and these have not been a problem.  Very tight fit.   I have not hand any problems with my old 7200/As or my WM.   

Said it before but the case on the Waverunner is not the highest quality and don't get me started on those connector failures.   I do like the scope now that I have had it for a while and I will say that LeCroy has really pulled through and helped me out with it.     

-Slow as molasses to respond to their UI (7000 series, 7Zi)

Not really. I worked on 7zi and 7zi-A, and there's nothing slow on these scopes. I also have a WavePro 7000A in my private lab, and again, no slowness here. Some of the earlier WavePro 7000 (non-A) which were sold with Windows 2000 were somewhat laggy when operating the front panel, this was improved in later software updates, and these days these scopes should be upgraded to XP anyways as otherwise they're stuck on an antique firmware.

I vaguely remember that last time you listed your "dislikes" you mentioned that they were still on Windows 2000 running an older software. If so then maybe you should try XP and the current firmware, and your problem should be gone.

Even my old 7200s are fairly responsive when you consider their age.   I was not impressed with that Waverunner when I first got it but again, adding the RAM and putting the SSD in it really woke it up.   You know it's been in there almost a year now?   Not bad for something that was not going to work.     BTW Wuerstchenhund,  did you end up installing that SSD in yours?   If so, any problems?   

-Become more noisy than a hoover vacuum as soon as you do anything with em ( 7Zi series )

Yes, they are nosiy. So are pretty much all multi-GHz high end scopes (the DSO90k will blow your brains out). That is mostly because these scopes develop an extensive amount of heat that needs to be removed somehow.

    I would guess my i7 laptop makes less noise than my first IBM PC.   Really, I think my WM is about as loud as my old 7200A and throws out near the same heat for 10X higher BW and 20X higher sample rate and .......   I don't see this trend changing.   

-Crappy probes where the pogo-tips break off in the grabber hooks.

Never happened to me. And I have not exactly the most sensitive hands.

    I have no complaints about their standard 10X probes I have used.   I have had to repair some of their GHz differential probes that had the tips broke off (not by me). 

-Endless "calibrating" messages and "triggering" messages .. with 4 to 10 seconds blind times. ( come on, make an ADc that doesn't drift will ya ! No other scope manufacturer needs that crap)

If you get endless "calibrating" and "triggering" messages then your scope is either defective or you're doing something wrong (actually, endless "calibration" was one of the bugs on earlier WavePro 7000 and 8000 scopes).

And if you think that other manufacturer's ADCs don't drift then you're wrong, they pretty much drift exactly the same, just the scope doesn't bother to compensate for it.

BTW, you know that you can disable the auto calibration? You should, as I'm pretty sure I told you before 

   Stupid auto cal anyway. 

- buggy user interfaces. one The 7000 and 7300  DSA's : spin the timebase knob too fast and the scope bluescreens... whoopdedoo. STILL not fixed after 10 years of complaining !

Of course the problem has been fixed, pretty much in one of the earlier Windows 2000 software releases.

I have never seen this and use the 7300.   I have not had a bluescreen on both my WR and WM.   Even with the added Ethernet board in the WM with it's SSD, it is rock solid.... After all the negative comments about the Ethernet I just figured I would throw that one in there.         Well.  I guess that's not 100% true.  I did have to change the CMOS battery in the WM this summer.   

- bass ackwards functionality. Like store traces in memory , perform an acquisition , scroll and you lose time lock between memory and acquisition... duh !

Never noticed that, but considering that the other software issues you mentioned have been fixed long ago this could well be another case of outdated software.

BTW, these problems are not limited to LeCroy, I've seen more than my fair share of annoying and aggravating bugs on Agilent scopes as well. That's why the software can be updated.

We have some LeCroy somewhere at work that has some crazy UI.  I have never figured out where or what that thing was.   We bought a brand new one not too long ago.  What I would call a low end unit, not sure the model.  Looks nice and drove just fine.   

I have ran into problems with their software being buggy but these newer releases I must admit have been very nice.   Wish it was this stable when we bought the WP7300.   

One last thing I would like to mention is that Teledyne/LeCroy really has stepped up and helped me out.     

[marshallh]

LeCrap.
-Crappy probes where the pogo-tips break off in the grabber hooks.

Thought I was the only one. At least it was only a $90 used probe.

[Wuerstchenhund]

The sent me all new knobs for the old Waverunner and these have not been a problem.  Very tight fit.   I have not hand any problems with my old 7200/As or my WM.

Said it before but the case on the Waverunner is not the highest quality and don't get me started on those connector failures.   I do like the scope now that I have had it for a while and I will say that LeCroy has really pulled through and helped me out with it.

Yes, the Malaysian vendor who built the first WR(M)Xi did a pretty poor job with the chassis and the quality of the plastics parts, but the later production runs (made in USA) were much better.

I doubt your replacement knobs will fall off anytime soon.

Even my old 7200s are fairly responsive when you consider their age.   I was not impressed with that Waverunner when I first got it but again, adding the RAM and putting the SSD in it really woke it up.   You know it's been in there almost a year now?   Not bad for something that was not going to work.     BTW Wuerstchenhund,  did you end up installing that SSD in yours?   If so, any problems?   

Well, I did get a Transcend PSD330 IDE SSD (the same one you used), and it's sitting here and waiting to be installed for a few months now 

I'm pretty sure it will work, though, as Transcend fixed the UDMA issues that occurred with the older PSD320 in these scopes.

-Crappy probes where the pogo-tips break off in the grabber hooks.

Never happened to me. And I have not exactly the most sensitive hands.

    I have no complaints about their standard 10X probes I have used.   I have had to repair some of their GHz differential probes that had the tips broke off (not by me). 

The hand piece housings of older AP-033 and AP-034 Differential probes are often broken (the underside tends to crack), however a new replacement housing is $17 or so (and its the newer, improved and more modern looking design which won't crack). Probes without housing or with parts of the housing missing can often be found on ebay and are a good way to get a very good probe for cheap.

  Stupid auto cal anyway.

Yes, it would be better if it was opt-in (i.e. off by default until enabled).

BTW, the Siglent-made WaveSurfer 3000 doesn't do auto-cal any more (I guess they figured these days its no longer a benefit for a 4GSa/s ADC) 

[XFDDesign]

BTW, the Siglent-made WaveSurfer 3000 doesn't do auto-cal any more (I guess they figured these days its no longer a benefit for a 4GSa/s ADC) 

At least as far as my WaveSurfer 3054 goes, it does actually do auto-cal. Once. Around 30m of being on, it does one very quick self-cal cycle and then comes back. I think their method is to simply do it once the instrument is to temp.

[tautech]

BTW, the Siglent-made WaveSurfer 3000 doesn't do auto-cal any more (I guess they figured these days its no longer a benefit for a 4GSa/s ADC) 

At least as far as my WaveSurfer 3054 goes, it does actually do auto-cal. Once. Around 30m of being on, it does one very quick self-cal cycle and then comes back. I think their method is to simply do it once the instrument is to temp.

Is the Auto-Cal feature able to be disabled as the Siglent SDS2000 series allows?
If it's in anyway a similar UI, this feature is within one of the Utilities pages.

[Wuerstchenhund]

At least as far as my WaveSurfer 3054 goes, it does actually do auto-cal. Once. Around 30m of being on, it does one very quick self-cal cycle and then comes back. I think their method is to simply do it once the instrument is to temp.

Interesting. It wasn't the case on the one I had for a day (it calibrated after power-up and that was it), but then this has been shortly after they came out so I guess it might have been introduced with one of the several firmware updates this model got.

I think that's a good change, calibrating after a 30min warm-up is a much better than calibrating when the scope is cold and then seing drift the parameters when its warmed up.

If it's in anyway a similar UI

Thank god it isn't 

[joeqsmith]

Well, I did get a Transcend PSD330 IDE SSD (the same one you used), and it's sitting here and waiting to be installed for a few months now 

I'm pretty sure it will work, though, as Transcend fixed the UDMA issues that occurred with the older PSD320 in these scopes.

The one in my WM has not been a problem as well.  However, this DSO does not get much use.  For the WM I changed some of the settings to help the drive life.  For the WR, I did nothing except to mirror it.    Give it a try and post your results. 

The hand piece housings of older AP-033 and AP-034 Differential probes are often broken (the underside tends to crack), however a new replacement housing is $17 or so (and its the newer, improved and more modern looking design which won't crack). Probes without housing or with parts of the housing missing can often be found on ebay and are a good way to get a very good probe for cheap.

These are the probes I have had to repair.
http://teledynelecroy.com/images/dx00a-at.png

Amazed but the tips have been bent, chipped and broken off.  I have not had an eBay account for several years, but for fun I looked to see if I could find a working probe under $2000.   No luck. 

[Electro Fan]

W-Man, maybe you could use your good will with LeCroy to convince them they should consider adding the $1500 MSO probe harness for the digital channels to their bundle deal.  I know the incremental cost of software is close to zero but this accessory doesn't look like it's a super long way from zero.  If they had more people using their scopes and reporting how happy they are with their scopes you could get a rally going.  Seriously, there is an opportunity for MSOs in the market between Rigol and 5k.

[pascal_sweden]

Without further ado, here is the “Let’s Talk About LeCroy Scopes”, AKA… the “Wuerstchenhund Holds Court” thread.

*hammering gavel to the block*

Silence! The court is in session! 

(sorry, I just couldn't resist, plus I always wanted to try that Shadow font!) 

So funny! Cool to have people like you guys on this forum!

It's really learnful, and discussions are nice!

[Wuerstchenhund]

W-Man, maybe you could use your good will with LeCroy to convince them they should consider adding the $1500 MSO probe harness for the digital channels to their bundle deal.

I doubt I can. But then, getting the MSO probe kit for free should be achievable, especially if you buy one of the larger WS3k scopes. Just because it's not part of the official bundle doesn't mean LeCroy can't be convinced to include it.

Don't forget, how much you pay for big brand T&M gear is pretty much down to your negotiation skills (and how often you mention Keysight, especially when they have a promo!) 

Another alternative might be to import the harness from the Siglent SDS3000 (which is the same scope) that is only sold in China. I haven't seen any prices or availability but I guess that this isn't impossible.

I know the incremental cost of software is close to zero but this accessory doesn't look like it's a super long way from zero.

I see what you mean, and you're right, it doesn't look like a very complex or expensive item.

If they had more people using their scopes and reporting how happy they are with their scopes you could get a rally going.  Seriously, there is an opportunity for MSOs in the market between Rigol and 5k.

True, but it's not that there isn't anything else besides Rigol. On the cheaper end there's the Hameg R&S HMO Series MSO scopes, and there's also the R&S RTM (although with MSO option the 200MHz 2ch variant is very close to $5k).

[Howardlong]

I know the incremental cost of software is close to zero but this accessory doesn't look like it's a super long way from zero.

I see what you mean, and you're right, it doesn't look like a very complex or expensive item..

While I agree that there'll certainly be some gouge on such an option, if it's a passive unit some of the "cost" will be in the cable itself: if it's anything like the Tek MSO LA cables, the multi-way coaxial cable and the final probe wires themselves have damped distributed resistance of one or two hundred ohms. For smallish volumes and runs, the tooling to make such cables is going to be a very significant factor.

As a comparison, the Rigol MSO1000 cables (RPL1116) take a different approach, they use active pods with comparators and simple ribbon cable to avoid the need for special cable and counter intuitively these are almost certainly much cheaper to make than a passive cable with distributed resistances.