buying bench-top multimeter under 1000$

[JoeN]

Why has no one mentioned the Agilent 34460A which is 6 1/2 digit and $945?

http://www.keysight.com/en/pd-2269458-pn-34460A/digital-multimeter-6-digit-basic-truevolt-dmm?cc=US&lc=eng

Latest technology and very nice display.  Dave has reviewed it (34461A version which is a very close meter, it is a little faster, has a better guaranteed YOY drift, and adds rear inputs and LXI)

34461A ($1,097) is slightly over OP's budget.  If he doesn't need LXI and the rear panel he can keep it under a grand with the 34460A.  But look at the specs of both meters, see below.



http://www.mrtestequipment.com/getfile.php?s=Agilent+34450%2C+34460A%2C34461A+Digital+Multimeter+Product+Fact+Sheet.pdf

[JoeN]

You can still get new Keysight 34401A though they have been discontinued.

I believe the discontinue date for this is 12/31/16.  Keysight is making them available, I think, for customers who would have trouble changing over for one reason or another.  Still, I think current stock is going cheap because most of the customers out there want the new model.

[Wytnucls]

Vici VC8145 (4.5 digits). They go for aroung $160 and they feature 20A current measurement, capacitance, temperature and very fast continuity, etc. Feature wise these give many much more expensive bench meters a run for their money so if 4.5 digits is enough (and it usually is for general purpose work) then the VC8145 is nearly impossible to beat.

VC8145 is a joke in a thread about $1000 multimeters. Have you seen the internals (or lack of)?

Try and find a bench DMM which does 20A! Fast continuity isn't also something you should take for granted in any DMM. The OP did not state any accuracy specifications and since the VC8145 offers/combines several features not found in many bench top DMMs it definitely is a good one to consider even if money is not a problem (just buy 2 or 3).

The Keithley 179A-20 does 20A for 1 minute, not a measly 15 seconds. 75$ on eBay. An external shunt is a much better idea, especially if your fuse is only rated for 13A.
Continuity is not latched, it can't display voltage and current at the same time, doesn't do 4 wire resistance measurements and is very limited on current resolution (1uA). Weirdly, AC voltage can only be measured accurately between 10% and 75% of any range. Capacitance measurement is useless (10pF~100uF) at .5%+50! 4 readings per second only, with no filtering available. No USB, no external triggering and no internal memory.
Give the Vici a wide berth and spend your shekels on something a bit more professional.

[nctnico]

Sorry but that old crap Keithley doesn't match up! No capacitance measurements, no dual display (voltage + frequency for example), temperature, continuity?? And if you would have read the specs of the VC8145 more carefully you'll see it is very accurate for RMS measurements up to high frequencies which makes the VC8145 suitable for audio work. Again this is a rather unique feature especially given it's price. I have compared lots of new and used DMMs in the 4.5 digit range and the VC8145 just comes out on top.

You must not confuse an instrument which can do a few types of measurements very accurate versus an instrument which does a lot of things very well.

[cyr]

You must not confuse an instrument which can do a few types of measurements very accurate versus an instrument which does a lot of things very well.

Very valid point, the question is why does the OP want a bench meter? Most often a bench DMM means high precision, high speed, connectivity for automation etc. The VC8145 sounds more like a typical handheld DMM in a bench-style case - which is fine if that's what you want, but very different.

[nctnico]

Most often a bench DMM means high precision, high speed, connectivity for automation etc.

IMHO that is a big misconception. There are and have been loads of bench DMMs with similar specs to a typical handheld DMM. The difference between a bench DMM and handheld is that you can put a bench DMM in a stack of equipment and power it from mains instead of batteries.

[Wytnucls]

Sorry but that old crap Keithley doesn't match up! No capacitance measurements, no dual display (voltage + frequency for example), temperature, continuity?? And if you would have read the specs of the VC8145 more carefully you'll see it is very accurate for RMS measurements up to high frequencies which makes the VC8145 suitable for audio work. Again this is a rather unique feature especially given it's price. I have compared lots of new and used DMMs in the 4.5 digit range and the VC8145 just comes out on top.

You must not confuse an instrument which can do a few types of measurements very accurate versus an instrument which does a lot of things very well.

LOL, someone who owns a Vici DMM calling a Keithley meter a piece of crap! That old meter has better voltage accuracy, higher AC bandwidth and a higher 10nA resolution than your 'modern' light box.
Of course, as an only meter, it wouldn't cut the mustard as a jack of all trades and I never suggested otherwise. But then yourself suggested a uCurrent box to supplement the Vici shortcomings.
A reliable 20kHz true RMS voltage bandwidth is nothing unusual. Plenty of cheap meters have the feature, including multiple data displays.
You claim the meter has unusual features but all I notice is that it is missing:
4 wire resistance measurement
latched continuity
useful capacitance range and accuracy
nA resolution
high DC accuracy
fast acquisition and filtering

The old adage rings true: You get what you paid for. If you're on a tight budget and need a mains powered stackable box, fine, otherwise you'd be better off with a handheld DMM of similar value.

[nctnico]

Show me multimeters which do 20kHz AC (RMS) with a better than 1% accuracy on all ranges up to 20KHz for less than $160!  Even your Keithley 179 can't do that! And dare I note the capacitance range on the Keysight 34465A is the same as the VC8145? So what is a useful capacitance range? The Keithley 179 can't even do capacitance to start with. And neither can it do continuity. Where is the Multi from DMM in the Keithley? I have a similar DMM like the Keithley 179 from HP and it has sitting on a shelve since I got a second VC8145.

4 wire resistance may be nice and so does a larger capacitance range but that is LCR meter territory. High DC accuracy and nA resolution are fine but also in a different price class. And do you really need extremely high accuracy for general purpose work? Most components on a board aren't better than 1% so all those extra digits are just a waste. And what are you looking at exactly? By the time you want to measure nA you'll also want to use different (gold plated) wiring due to all kinds of metalurgical effects. A DMM may not even be the right tool. Fast acquistion could be nice for data logging but for just looking at a display 4 updates per second is more than enough. Filtering only helps if your measurement environment is very noisy (there are other ways to deal with that as well) however averaging/filtering won't cancel the error from a reference which is off by X ppm.

[Gyro]

Show me multimeters which do 20kHz AC (RMS) with a better than 1% accuracy on all ranges up to 20KHz for less than $160!

I think that's rather the point, this thread is about High precision, DMMs in the $1000 range. High accuracies are achievable and fully specified to 100kHz or even 1MHz.

Edit: 1% is not high precision in this context.
Edit, Edit: The VC8145 AC current isn't actually specified to more than 5kHz... It's AC voltage range IS specified 50Hz - 20kHZ but is 5%+50 Digits <75% range and a whopping 8% + 50 Digits >75% range and a voltage burden of 800mV 
Sorry, that should have been 0.8%+50 Digits <75% range, the 5% was to 50kHz, the 8% >75% range to 20kHz still stands though.

The point about current ranges is rather moot for all bench DMMs, cheap VC8145s or expensive Keysights, Flukes etc. They all have voltage burdens that render them pretty much a joke for any form of precision measurement. To do accurate current measurement requires accurate external shunts which make use of the high inherent voltage sensitivity and resolution of the meter.

[Macbeth]

nctnico, a bench meter should support SCPI so it can interact with other instruments and your PC. It must also support re-calibration, as a new meter will drift from its factory specs. The vici has a PC connectivity of sorts, but is it one way (read only) or can its functions be programmed? If so at least a SCPI driver could be made for it. What provision is there for calibration/adjustment (out of box hopefully)?

But given OP's budget then I would go for a used Keithley 2000 or 2015 which you can get for $300 and then a brand new SDG3055 which seems to have its bugs being worked out. Best of both worlds. I rule out the Rigol DM3000's as Rigol don't support them, no firmware updates to speak of in years. Old design that I think Rigol has abandoned.

[MadTux]

OP doesn't have a clue, no idea what he really wants and much too much money.

20A on any meter is a joke. Any Pro measures current in circuit by inserting a shunt. Any good DVM has math functions and 4 wire resistance measurement. Which makes current measurement easy and very accurate by using a cheap low tempco shunt. Furthermore, no fancy fuses are required. That also makes the DVM very resistant to abuse, because it can't sink any current.

Sure, you can spend 1k$ for some expensive crap. Or handheld scopemeters....  But certain HP and Keithley bench meters are dirt cheap now and offer far more accuracy.

 BTW, I don't hate hand meters per se. They are useful if I need to be mobile and no accuracy is required. And I don't want to worry about destroying them. Since they are basically all the same, I buy the cheapest so I don't have to be sad, when I destroy them.

[nctnico]

nctnico, a bench meter should support SCPI so it can interact with other instruments and your PC.

Why should a bench meter suddenly be connected to a PC? IMHO that is another misconception about bench DMMs. If you need test equipment for automated measurements then you should buy equipment which allows that. Personally I have no use to connect a DMM to a PC. A bench DMM is a DMM which can be stacked, doesn't need batteries and doesn't auto-shutdown. That's it. Everything else are just extra features but not necessarily ones defining what is a bench DMM.

Anyway: The VC8145 has isolated RS232 PC connectivity and someone has already made a protocol implementation and by the looks of it the VC8145 can be read and controlled remotely. There are some trimmers and potmeters inside so I guess it is possible to adjust it. It depends very much on which reference they used whether it will actually need any adjusting ever. Given it's accuracy specs it is very likely they just used a reference which is guaranteed to stay within the specs of the meter.

@Gyro: if you go through the specs of loads of DMMs you'll find that having an AC (RMS) accuracy better than 1% over a wide frequency range is very rare in the low end to medium range DMMs spectrum. This isn't strange because doing RMS right is difficult and you'll need to make a tradeoff to do it cheap. The VC8145 uses a true-RMS converter chip which has a wide frequency range but limitations on signal amplitude. Another option is to use a filtering circuit but that has the disadvantage of allowing only a very limited frequency range (usually between 50Hz and 60Hz for mains). The higher end DMMs use sampling at the expense of more complex and expensive circuitry but even then the accuracy is not stellar.

@madtux: having a 20A range on a >4.5 digit meter is very handy and I'll explain why. There will be enough digits to give an indication in the milli-amp range while you don't have to worry about blowing the fuse in the meter even when drawing several amps. Many bench DMMs only go to 4A which just isn't enough. Having a 20A range gives a lot of room to play with so when there is a need to measure higher currents you have the solution sitting on your bench.

[Gyro]

@Gyro: if you go through the specs of loads of DMMs you'll find that having an AC (RMS) accuracy better than 1% over a wide frequency range is very rare in the low end to medium range DMMs spectrum.

No argument there at all, many low cost DMMs have similar specs - my point is that it is basically a low cost handheld DMM in a bench case. It is not in the same accuracy league as the Kesysights, etc. bench models.True RMS conversion just costs money to do right, it is mature technology. I have a 40 year old Datron bench meter that easily beats the VC8145 by more than an order of magnitude and over a 100kHz bandwidth.

Again the  VC8145 is what it is, it has lots of bells and whistles, it just doesn't compare with the professional bench models when it comes to accuracy when comparing in the <$1000 class.

[Wytnucls]

Although 0.8%+50 up to 20kHz may sound mildly impressive, it is only true from 10% up to 75% of all ranges. Above that level, the RMS converter shoots up to 8%+50. A complete disaster, as one ends up with huge gaps in the RMS voltage accuracy.
The similar priced UT71 manages 1.5%+30 up to 10kHz, without restrictions on range values above 10%.

[JoeB83]

I may catch hell for this, but I'll say it anyway: take a look at the Keysight 34450A. I have a 34450A as well as a 34410A, and while I do prefer the 34410 and trust it's measurements more than the 34450, the 34450 is still a very good bench DMM and may be worth taking a look at. It is substantially less expensive than many or most of the offerings from Keysight/Agilent, Keithley, Fluke, and so forth.

[TheSteve]

I may catch hell for this, but I'll say it anyway: take a look at the Keysight 34450A. I have a 34450A as well as a 34410A, and while I do prefer the 34410 and trust it's measurements more than the 34450, the 34450 is still a very good bench DMM and may be worth taking a look at. It is substantially less expensive than many or most of the offerings from Keysight/Agilent, Keithley, Fluke, and so forth.

I am reasonably pleased with my 34450A but only because I got it insanely cheap. At the new price I don't know if I'd recommend it, kick in the extra funds to get the 34460A - I know I'd happily pay the difference to upgrade.

[nour]

OP doesn't have a clue, no idea what he really wants and much too much money.

I think I have already commented on such a joke before somewhere

may be I don't have such a huge amount of experience that someone in this forum have
or may by I never have a very expensive instrument before
but that doesn't mean I don't know about what I need or don't have a clue !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You don't know me nor know what I am doing so please stop saying such wrong phrases about me.

about what I need I can quote it from here:

I think that's rather the point, this thread is about High precision, DMMs in the $1000 range ...

and who the hell have told you or even mentioned that I have "too much money" 
sorry man but I just have a very limited budget and I only want 3 instruments to buy for now one of them is a good bench-top multi-meter with high accuracy and precision

please stop spreading wrong stuff about me

[nour]

Why should a bench meter suddenly be connected to a PC?

because this is a very handy feature specially when all of your instruments support such a feature simply because you can collect data from all of them at the same time when you are doing some sort of long term measurement and you can write a code to display the measurement in a relationship graph or something similar