Hantek LCR 1832C unlock

[ru_tash]

normally on the 1832 hack 
you have some part values to change and find the correct way to hack it,   and  you may or will need to calibrate it correctly, since the 1832stop at lower than 100khz

I have an issue (or may be feature?) with my Hantek 1832c, when it works with batteries the output measurements signal is interrupted every 20 seconds, the duration of interruptions about 50-60mS, the measured values on display slightly jumping after that (1-3%).
But when device powered through USB power supply this not happened, signal is continuous and readings are more or less stable.

can somebody check their 1832c/1833c for this behavior?

[hexreader]

I tried my 1833C measuring 1000 Ohm resistor, 120Hz, 600mV fast.

The short period of no waveform appears to be normal. Why it should only occur while on battery is surprising, but appears to be totally harmless. I would forget this "feature"

As for poor accuracy when powered from USB, the fix is to remove your oscilloscope leads.
Connecting scope and leads will affect the measurement circuit. You are adding a nice long radio aerial to the circuit. There is a reason that the supplied croc leads are really short.
Furthermore, you are providing a ground loop when scope is attached. There will be capacitance between the mains supply and the USB output of your charger. Not an issue when the output is floating (no scope attached), but will allow 50/60 Hz current flow when output is grounded through scope.

Lesson is: Do not connect scope, or anything else while measuring. A good example of a measuring device affecting the circuit under test.

Your LCR meter should be accurate with short leads and no external connections.

[ru_tash]

I tried my 1833C measuring 1000 Ohm resistor, 120Hz, 600mV fast.

The short period of no waveform appears to be normal. Why it should only occur while on battery is surprising, but appears to be totally harmless. I would forget this "feature"

As for poor accuracy when powered from USB, the fix is to remove your oscilloscope leads.
Connecting scope and leads will affect the measurement circuit. You are adding a nice long radio aerial to the circuit. There is a reason that the supplied croc leads are really short.
Furthermore, you are providing a ground loop when scope is attached. There will be capacitance between the mains supply and the USB output of your charger. Not an issue when the output is floating (no scope attached), but will allow 50/60 Hz current flow when output is grounded through scope.

Lesson is: Do not connect scope, or anything else while measuring. A good example of a measuring device affecting the circuit under test.

Your LCR meter should be accurate with short leads and no external connections.

Ironically, the situation other way around, when powered from battery the readings are jumping each 20seconds, when powered from USB no jumping.
And this is observed when measured component is directly plugged in, please try L-measurements, I used 1.6microH inductance and 40kHz frequency, 600mV, fast, serial.
on USB: it shows initially 1.630 then fluctuating (1.625-1.635)
on battery: it shows initially 1.630 then fluctuating (1.610-1.660)
to make it more demonstrative i turn-on "Compare" with 1% tolerance

[hexreader]

Yes, I see what you mean

Accuracy seems to be better and more stable when using USB power.

The manual suggests that you should expect accuracy of only 4 percent + 5 digits, so you are still within quoted specification values.

Guess I will be using USB power more often in future 


EDIT: - running with USB cable from a 37Wh battery bank seems to be fairly stable, as might be expected.

[ru_tash]

Yes, I see what you mean

Accuracy seems to be better and more stable when using USB power.

The manual suggests that you should expect accuracy of only 4 percent + 5 digits, so you are still within quoted specification values.

Guess I will be using USB power more often in future

I am thinking to remove or disable USB charging part and re-connect battery to USB side.
Before your comments I thought that my device is faulty*, and I tried to find root-cause in the SGM2019 linear voltage regulators (there are two of them, I guess one for USB->3.3V another for battery->3.3V).
Now I am more prone to suspect SW bug.
Taking into account that SW was not updated since 2021, Hantek has no more support.

[MIRW]

Hello! Help needed. Changed the Hantek 1832C firmware to Hantek 1833C. Everything is up. Calibrated. But the inductance measurements are not correct, from 10 kHz and above at 1.10 and 100 kohms instead of zeros, readings from 20 to 30 ohms. Maybe someone has an original Dump from Hantek 1832C. So that you can roll back the firmware. Thank you in advance!

[coromonadalix]

it's not just the firmware you need to change, you have passive parts too

[ru_tash]

Hello! Help needed. Changed the Hantek 1832C firmware to Hantek 1833C. Everything is up. Calibrated. But the inductance measurements are not correct, from 10 kHz and above at 1.10 and 100 kohms instead of zeros, readings from 20 to 30 ohms. Maybe someone has an original Dump from Hantek 1832C. So that you can roll back the firmware. Thank you in advance!

how do you change the firmware?

seems like it is "normal", my shows similar 
set Range to Auto and you will not see this.

[MIRW]

Download the software to change the firmware (http://hantek.com/download?key=fjzl&sid=3019&pid=16180&word=).
Launch the software, connect the cable, simultaneously hold down the power button and (X-R) after the beep, release it, the (compare) button will flash, and upload the firmware.

[MIRW]

it's not just the firmware you need to change, you have passive parts too

You mean replacing C66 and C67 with 10 and 100 pf.

[ru_tash]

Download the software to change the firmware (http://hantek.com/download?key=fjzl&sid=3019&pid=16180&word=).
Launch the software, connect the cable, simultaneously hold down the power button and (X-R) after the beep, release it, the (compare) button will flash, and upload the firmware.

there is no specific software for 1832 and 1833 model.
only one for both.

[Randy222]

I just got he 1833C.

I don't understand the device at all.

What is an "Rs" reading? Why is there a frequency tied to an "R" reading?
L C R meter.
Inductance, Capacitance, Resistance.
The "R" reading should be a DC reading, no?

The only way to derive Inductance and Capacitance is to measure RDC and Z, so how does the unit calculate L or C without doing a true RDC reading?

And what fequency does he unit put out? I put the test leads on scope and got no signal at all.

[ru_tash]

I just got he 1833C.

I don't understand the device at all.

What is an "Rs" reading? Why is there a frequency tied to an "R" reading?
L C R meter.
Inductance, Capacitance, Resistance.
The "R" reading should be a DC reading, no?

The only way to derive Inductance and Capacitance is to measure RDC and Z, so how does the unit calculate L or C without doing a true RDC reading?

And what fequency does he unit put out? I put the test leads on scope and got no signal at all.

Rs is the series resistance measurement via AC.
The AC frequency you set up via menu.

[mawyatt]

Most of the LCR meters we're familiar with don't actually measure resistance, nor capacitance, nor inductance directly, they measure/set the voltage across the DUT and measure/set the current thru DUT. These measurements also includes the phase relationship between the DUT voltage and current for AC.

The DUT impedance is then calculated as vectors V/I, and for DC (no phase relationship) this is simply the DCR, and for everything else this is Impedance Magnitude Z with angle Theta. From here the Real and Imaginary Impedance R +-jX can be computed and then distilled into various additional displayed parameters using the measurement frequency and results in the familiar Cs + Rs, Cp +Rp, Ls +Rs, Lp + Rp and the related admittances.

Some handheld LCR meters such as the DE-5000 utilize a special chip-set that does most of the measurement and computational work with a few precision discrete components, however the bench type LCR meters like the Tonghui and Hioki we have, are more complex and precise, utilizing highly precision discrete components, various analog and digital chip sets and techniques, with high resolution/precision ADCs and various FPGAs, thus the additional measurement ranges and cost factors.

Best, 

[Randy222]

I just got he 1833C.

I don't understand the device at all.

What is an "Rs" reading? Why is there a frequency tied to an "R" reading?
L C R meter.
Inductance, Capacitance, Resistance.
The "R" reading should be a DC reading, no?

The only way to derive Inductance and Capacitance is to measure RDC and Z, so how does the unit calculate L or C without doing a true RDC reading?

And what fequency does he unit put out? I put the test leads on scope and got no signal at all.

Rs is the series resistance measurement via AC.
The AC frequency you set up via menu.

Can you help me understand how the meter works.

Z is really Z(f), and its the vector add of X(f) + R where X= XL(f) + XC(f), and we know XL and XC has phase shift.
We should also expect a reading of L or C to remain constant when changing the test frequency.

We also know only the real components dissipate power.
So, lets say I have a pure resistor, 0XL and 0XC, then AC analysis is ok.
But now I have a wirewound resistor, how does the meter tell me the real component Rdc using an AC signal?

And in real world application, all components have some R, XL, and XC.

[mawyatt]

An ideal capacitor would have an impedance of 1/(jwC), thus purely reactive and at -90 degrees for all frequencies. Real capacitors have some resistance (Real part), and inductance (Z=jwL), so as frequency increases the impedance angle rises towards 0 from ~-90 as the inductive reactance comes into play.

When the capacitor impedance angle equals zero the inductive reactance has canceled the capacitive reactance and only the real impedance part remains, at this frequency the capacitor is at series resonance. Beyond this frequency the inductive reactance dominates and the impedance angle increases from 0.

So the capacitor Impedance Magnitude decreases with frequency (Capacitive) until Series Resonance, where it becomes only the Real part, then increases with frequency (Inductive).

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/lcr-meter-plot-software/msg4774100/#msg4774100

Best,

[Randy222]

An ideal capacitor would have an impedance of 1/(jwC), thus purely reactive and at -90 degrees for all frequencies. Real capacitors have some resistance (Real part), and inductance (Z=jwL), so as frequency increases the impedance angle rises towards 0 from ~-90 as the inductive reactance comes into play.

When the capacitor impedance angle equals zero the inductive reactance has canceled the capacitive reactance and only the real impedance part remains, at this frequency the capacitor is at series resonance. Beyond this frequency the inductive reactance dominates and the impedance angle increases from 0.

So the capacitor Impedance Magnitude decreases with frequency (Capacitive) until Series Resonance, where it becomes only the Real part, then increases with frequency (Inductive).

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/lcr-meter-plot-software/msg4774100/#msg4774100

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=370133.0;attach=1746491;image

Best,

So a freq sweep yields a notch, and the notch for the cap is the ESR point ?
The 1833 does a freq sweep? If it did, is 100Hz-100kHz enough sweep to find the notch?

Is it just not more simple to do an Rdc measurement to find the real component, then do AC sweep to characterize Z, and from there simple math to get L and C ?

[mawyatt]

So a freq sweep yields a notch, and the notch for the cap is the ESR point ?
The 1833 does a freq sweep? If it did, is 100Hz-100kHz enough sweep to find the notch?

Is it just not more simple to do an Rdc measurement to find the real component, then do AC sweep to characterize Z, and from there simple math to get L and C ?

The sweep shows the resonance notch if extended in frequency range far enough, this is why we have the $4600 Hioki IM3536 which extends to 8MHz. The ESR is always within the capacitive impedance, just shows singly when capacitor is in series resonance as shown, where and only where the capacitor Impedance is ESR.

Using DCR for a capacitor ESR likely won't work, since after all it's a capacitor

Most LCR meters we're familiar with show the Capacitance and ESR at frequency, so they do the math for you, some even show 4 parameters!!

We created these capacitor frequency sweeps with a custom python program we wrote for the Tonghui and Hioki LCR meters we have, see link above.

Best,

[Randy222]

I can freq sweep for Z out to about 6GHz with good results, up to 8GHz with ok results, using a $150 VNA.

But that's not really what I am asking about.

The 1833 has the 5wire Kelvin connection (4w test). If I clamp a simple carbon resistor and measure Rs, Rs should not change when I go from 10kHz to 100kHz.

How about just 10cm of cat5 twisted pair (one pair) with the ends tied. There's some L there, along with wire Rdc.
Slow speed, 300mV:
On 100Hz
Rs not even stable, jumps around from 0.3746 to 0.4204
Ls reads -28uH to 6uH

On 10kHz
Rs 0.2143 to 0.2407
Ls 2.36uH to 2.47uH
X 0.1553

on 10kHz, 1833 tells me Z is 0.3859
sqrt(X_L² + Rs²) != 0.3859


With an LCR meter, it would be good to have all 4 values on screen at same time (LCRZ) so when you press HOLD you can validate the HOLD numbers using math.

1833 is not right, math not adding up right.

I have two interesting links to share, I have to go grab them from another laptop.

 

[Veteran68]

The 1833 has the 5wire Kelvin connection (4w test). If I clamp a simple carbon resistor and measure Rs, Rs should not change when I go from 10kHz to 100kHz.

I posted these results from my 1833C in the EastTester thread. For the 10K 1% metal film resistor I used, Rs was constant from 100Hz to 10KHz. Once I hit 40KHz, Rs increased about 10 Ohms up through 100KHz. So +0.1% at the higher frequencies. At these values, there was no difference between 2W and 4W measurements.

EDIT: Fixed forum link

[Randy222]

From Vishay datasheet on their carbon film made items

Code: [Select]

Generally as far as HF characteristics on film
resistors are concerned, we noted that up to approximately
10MHz they operate as real resistors. By increasing the
frequency, more and more reactive components can be produced.

1. Resistors < 100 Ω are all inductive.
2. Resistors between 100 Ω and 470 Ω are "almost real".
3. Resistors > 470 Ω are capacitive.
It's an odd statement by Vishay, because when the DUT has some L or some C, the L or C does not change with frequency. 0.1uH at 2Hz is 0.1uH at 500MHz.
I guess below 10MHz the Xl or Xc is very small, perhaps not significant in any measurements?

[Randy222]

Two links. One kinda a repeat, the other a link about cloned 183X.

Albeit 3yrs old, worth a read:
Deep dive into the firmware with Ghidra --> https://www.creationfactory.co/2021/03/reverse-engineering-and-unlocking.html
And yep, URL is in this very thread, sorry for repeating it.

Then in the comments one user suggests washing PCB with rubbing alcohol will help stabilize measurements. Maybe some PCB fab junk leftover? Not sure if a wash has been validated in any way?
Note: apparently "rubbing alcohol" a liquid that varies in composition depending on country, so be careful.

******
The clone link --> https://community.element14.com/members-area/personalblogs/b/frank-milburn-s-blog/posts/quick-review-multicomp-pro-handheld-lcr-meter

"Multicomp Pro", rather weak website, little or no info, looks like a JPG as a homepage.

[Randy222]

Until I can figure out the correct FW for the 183X, and fully understand how it's measuring things, it's a paperweight on the desk.

[Veteran68]

There hasn't been a firmware update since 2021, at least not at Hantek's site.

The clone link --> https://community.element14.com/members-area/personalblogs/b/frank-milburn-s-blog/posts/quick-review-multicomp-pro-handheld-lcr-meter

"Multicomp Pro", rather weak website, little or no info, looks like a JPG as a homepage.

MultiComp Pro is Element14's house brand for cheap test equipment. They're basically rebranded Owon, Hantek, and others.

[Randy222]

Some others were posting their 183X FW was a "2023...." version.
I never checked what my 1833 had, I downloaded the one from Hantek site and flashed it.
The meter just does not appear to work correctly.