Fluke 189 with leaking surface mount supercap (also Fluke 287, Fluke 289)

[JohnDee]

I have a Fluke 189 multimeter.  It suddenly died (nothing shows on the LCD display).  I changed the 4 batteries (the old batteries were only slightly below normal).  The two fuses checked OK.  Inspection of the circuit board shows some leaking on a small (6.5mm diameter) surface mount battery.  The marking of this two-tab coin cell has the logo of Matsushita (now Panasonic) and the numbers 3709.  I could not identify this cell on the web in order to find a suitable replacement.  I am hoping somebody can help...

[retiredcaps]

Inspection of the circuit board shows some leaking on a small (6.5mm diameter) surface mount battery.  The marking of this two-tab coin cell has the logo of Matsushita (now Panasonic) and the numbers 3709.  I could not identify this cell on the web in order to find a suitable replacement.

I suggest you clean up the leakage with a q-tip/toothbrush with a generous amount of IPA.

I remember seeing an ebay auction for what you are talking about ...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281103728372

Right now, I can't find any more information regarding the specifications.

[retiredcaps]

It might be the Panasonic EN gold capacitor?

http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/components/pdf/goldcap_tech-guide_052505.pdf

[JohnDee]

You are right !!!   It is indeed a Panasonic EN gold capacitor.  I see that it is available at Mouser ($2.84 unit price).  I will order it and hopefully it will fix the problem.  I also read the Panasonic Technical Guide you sent me and reading at sections 4.1 and 4.2 on expected lifetime it seems to me that selecting that capacitor was a poor design choice with a surface mounted component having to be changed after barely a few years of usage...
Thanks for the great help !

[BravoV]

Damn, is this leaking supercap at the board is a serious problem plaguing the fluke dmm 180 & 280 series ? 

As a new owner of 287,  this makes me worry as I just knew it.

JohnDee, please post the photo of that leaked cap and the damages at the pcb if any.

[M. András]

Damn, is this leaking supercap at the board is a serious problem plaguing the fluke dmm 180 & 280 series ? 

As a new owner of 287,  this makes me worry as I just knew it.

JohnDee, please post the photo of that leaked cap and the damages at the pcb if any.

there is some internal pictures of the 287 here in the forum its hard to find btw.

[uoficowboy]

Interesting - I had noticed that my 189 did not have the battery life that it used to have. Still lasting months... but it used to last years. So the consensus is that replacing this component will fix that?

[tsmith35]

I have a Fluke 189 multimeter.  It suddenly died (nothing shows on the LCD display).  I changed the 4 batteries (the old batteries were only slightly below normal).  The two fuses checked OK.  Inspection of the circuit board shows some leaking on a small (6.5mm diameter) surface mount battery.  The marking of this two-tab coin cell has the logo of Matsushita (now Panasonic) and the numbers 3709.  I could not identify this cell on the web in order to find a suitable replacement.  I am hoping somebody can help...

From what I've found, that's a supercapacitor rated at 3.3V and 0.2F. Looks like they're discontinued, but perhaps one of these may do the job: Digikey

[mikeselectricstuff]

Just had a look in my 287 - some signs of corrosion on the cap

[M. András]

Just had a look in my 287 - some signs of corrosion on the cap

how old is your unit?

[mikeselectricstuff]

About 6 years old I think

[JohnDee]

To answer BravoD's question below, the supercap on my Fluke189 looks very much like the one in mikeselectricstuff's 287 picture below. 
The original Panasonic supercap (P/N EECEN0F204AK) is still available in the USA and Canada from Digikey, Allied and others but with a min buy qty of 2,000pcs.  May as well buy a new DMM...  However I did a datasheet comparison and ELNA P/N DSK-3R3H204T614-H2L (corresponding to Digikey 604-1147-1-ND at $2.81ea, no min qty) as suggested by tsmith35 below looks like a good candidate for replacement.  I will probably go with that one.

[ElektroQuark]

What does FLUKE say about this?
Warranty?

[BravoV]

there is some internal pictures of the 287 here in the forum its hard to find btw.

A huge high res photo of 287's gut -> Fluke 287 DMM Teardown and photos , although its not very clear whether its using Panasonic cap, can't identify the (M) Matsushita logo like Mike's.

Just had a look in my 287 - some signs of corrosion on the cap

About 6 years old I think

Mike, looks like you need to de-solder that cap off, worry it will going to burst out the goo once the container structure collapsed eaten by rust. 


My two 287s are manufactured in Jan and April 2013, will open it up to see which brand, its very unlikely they're using Panasonic Goldcap like Mike's since Panasonic already discontinued that for a while.

[BravoV]

My 287 is manufactured in April 2013 (Box label) with serial no 23780XXX.

The ultra cap's date code 1204 is also showing corroded sign, not as bad as Mike's though. Definitely not Panasonic (Matsushita brand) with that (M) logo like Mike's.   

Does this thing leak ?  Anyone knows what brand is that ?

Dave, this issue should be a good material for a short video blog.

Close up shots attached below.

[Tasman]

Just had a look inside my 187 - it does not have one of these capacitors. 
Seems like they are for the logging memory backup.  Glad I didn't cough up the extra for the 189.

[Svuppe]

Ahh, good news. I was going to open my 187 tonight, but thanks to you I don't have to.

-Mikael

[amyk]

The original Xbox had the same problem with its supercapacitor... you should definitely replace it as it can cause rather serious damage to the PCB if it bursts: http://dannygalaga.com/xbox.html

There's also a rather strange paragraph in the datasheet given earlier:

7. Brown extraction
Brown extraction may occur around the sealing part depending on use conditions. This extraction is electrically nonconductive.
Therefore, it does not infl uence in the electric characteristics.

[tsmith35]

However I did a datasheet comparison and ELNA P/N DSK-3R3H204T614-H2L (corresponding to Digikey 604-1147-1-ND at $2.81ea, no min qty) as suggested by tsmith35 below looks like a good candidate for replacement.  I will probably go with that one.

Actually, with Digikey's shipping, you might as well buy a dozen and sell the remaining caps off on eBay for $6.88 each.

[BravoV]

There's also a rather strange paragraph in the datasheet given earlier:

7. Brown extraction
Brown extraction may occur around the sealing part depending on use conditions. This extraction is electrically nonconductive.
Therefore, it does not influence in the electric characteristics.

Interesting, I missed that part.

If the brown goo even grew into like Mike's is harmless, then its fine, but at JohnDee's its leaking and ruined the board and surrounding components as he claimed, wish he could share some close up photo here.

[Kjelt]

How about the calibration settings? Are those also going to be affected?

[dr.diesel]

Fluke 289 cap, board rev 14, cap has been dead for years.

[somlioy]

My fluke 289

[JohnDee]

Just to clarify things up, the supercap on my 189 is just as bad as the what has been shown in the previous pictures.  It has NOT leaked onto the board or on other components.

[dr.diesel]

How about the calibration settings? Are those also going to be affected?

Nope, cal will be fine.