Agilent U1272A crappy soldering

[lowimpedance]

Oh yes, tried all permutations and  the problem was the slot could not just quite make it over the tab when pushed together to clip in.
Had to gently heat the plastic with a small Weller heat pencil and expand the slots downwards a little and now they both clip soundly in.
Clearly there moulding tolerences are a bit slack. In my meters case it must have been a very tenuous the amount of engagment. (personally I think they should have used screws instead).
My first U1272a I purchased the tilt bail would not clip into the body, ie missed the VERY small dimple which it was supposed to engage on when closed!. I returned it for a replacement and it was only marginally better. Did the heat pencil trick and improved the retention to an acceptable amount.
 These are clearly not very good aspects to the case design. On other models there seems to be much more attention to the case design. (I have both a U1242b and 1252a).

@wraper , I guess your meter case clipped back together no problems? hows the tilt bail retention, bit wishy washy or firm when clipped in?.

edit: added some photo's, (for anyone considering this meter), of the tilt bail locking clip. Also compared to the U1242b which has clips on both sides and has a much more positive lock in than the 1272a.

I should also indicate that I am happy enough with the general quality of the 1272a and I can live with the minor points concerning the case design.

[wraper]

My case is completely solid, no problems with that. Tilt bail is OK, however I didn't use it much so don't know how rugged it is. It's almost new meter.

[ExtremeXS]

Hi Mike,

Nice to hear up the update fro Wrapper.  What is the process for others who appear to have the same issue?

Thanks,
Mark

[mike_kawasaki]

Hi Mike,

Nice to hear up the update fro Wrapper.  What is the process for others who appear to have the same issue?

Thanks,
Mark

ExtremeXS,

Hope all is well with you.  Happy to answer your question.

Bottom Line is that we haven't seen any units on the EEVBlog Forum that are significantly 'unacceptable', except Wraper's unit.  This is why we're taking the special process to insure the unit gets into the Product Manager's hands.  Wraper's unit will go through a special process - but expect all other repair/service issues to go through our normal process.

The other issues are based on a case-by-case basis.  The units have a warranty and any failures will be honored by Agilent.  We have a service process and the team will verify if there's a failure.  If a failure is confirmed, then a new unit will be exchanged for your failed unit.

You can simply click on Agilent.com's 'contact an expert' link from the U1272A product page, and will give your local team's phone number and email.  (and interestingly, I sit next to our Worldwide Service & Support Manager so happy to assist if any troubles in contacting the right people).

As noted in a previous note, want to document the warranty -- it has changed to a 3 year warranty after 1 March 2013.  This is worldwide; and for all sales channels/distributors.

Mike

[wraper]

Actually ExtremeXS multimeter board is similar to mine. He posted a picture in post #61 but it isn't with such magnification as mine. But I can clearly see the same soldering defects on bigger pads, especially where connector is not populated. I also see suspicious soldering on SMT parts but unfortunately picture isn't quiet clear. And his serial number is different only by last digit. His multimeter is also from Farnell.
ExtremeXS please make better pictures if you can. I also wrote about microscope and mobile phone camera. If you can access a microscope somewhere, then you can make quiet good photos. Or you can try some magnification lens and small camera combinations, maybe it works.

[ExtremeXS]

He Wrapper and Mike,

Yeah as Wrapper says mine looks the same just not very clear photos, I will try again I did use a mobile to take these as my camera would not focus at all - I do not have a microscope to try to get a better magnification (I can try and get some brighter lighting maybe).

There are some components (again not clear in the photos) that are not sitting straight as the reflow did not work and thus pull them into position.

I do understand Mike that you are saying should it fail it can be resolved at anytime in the next 3 years, but if there is a manufacturing defect on a batch then the affected devices are all likely to have the same eventual failure I would suspect.

Cheers,
Mark

[whwong]

I am the product marketing egineer from Agilent managing handheld products, we acknowledge the concern from all gentlemen here. If any of you have the poor soldering issue on PCB, please contact us directly and we shall get Agilent local service center to look into your case. We are certainily want to collect back all reported units and we will do further investigation to root cause the issue.

[retiredcaps]

And his serial number is different only by last digit.

The above alone should be enough to get ExtremeXS's multimeter back to the Agilent (same team that will investigate).  It is reasaonble to assume that the same poor soldering job would exist in the very next unit made.

How often do you come across sequential serial numbers from two different users?

[ddavidebor]

Maiby dave can put a advise somewhere here in the forum?

[tomi]

Bottom Line is that we haven't seen any units on the EEVBlog Forum that are significantly 'unacceptable', except Wraper's unit.  This is why we're taking the special process to insure the unit gets into the Product Manager's hands.  Wraper's unit will go through a special process - but expect all other repair/service issues to go through our normal process.

Hi everybody,

I'm another not-so-happy owner of an U1272A (serial MY52520012) which seems to come from the same batch as the 'only significantly unacceptable' one from wraper. I've sent photos and serial to mike_kawasaki soon after this thread started in case they needed more info to investigate the issue and I didn't want to make more fuss about it.

The photos of its internals are here:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/82714359/bad_1272A_1.jpg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/82714359/bad_1272A_2.jpg

Looks crappy, but it worked. Then I tried to gently pick a diode with SMD tweezers and it lifted straight off the board (there's an empty D10 footprint in the first photo). Just held it, no force was used.

Come on, Agilent. This is supposed to be a precise measurement instrument. It's riddled with cold solder joints and I'm supposed to trust it to be within 0.05% for a full year after calibration, since the certificate says so. And in the mean time the components will rattle off the board after I put it firmly on the table. And now I'm supposed to sort this out with the local distributor, who probably don't have a clue and will presumably conclude that it's my fault, since it's not allowed to poke inside it anyways...

Sorry for the sarcasm, but I'm really not in a good mood today.

Tomi.

[mikes]

Get real. Agilent has a warranty process in place. Use it. It's much more efficient for everyone, and processes ensure that things get properly documented.

Because the first person to report the issue got a bit of special handholding is no reason for anyone else to expect the same. You have a statement from an Agilent employee that bad soldering at the level of Wraper's is a defect. If your's is similar, take a picture, write a note explaining the problem, put it in the box with your meter, and go through the warranty process.

And if you broke your meter by opening it, then poking and prodding, consider yourself lucky if they do honor the warranty. Because it was in fact you who broke it.

[wraper]

tomi, I checked your multimeter warranty status on Agilent website. And I think it may be from different batch because warranty start date is 2 weeks earlier. Mine and ExtremeXS warranty start date is the same. Where you bought yours?

[EEVblog]

I have a u1273ax (OLED version) in the lab that I haven't opened yet. Perhaps worth a look also...

[tomi]

Hi wraper,

bought mine from Farnell UK in the last week of March in a bundle with a bench PSU. Same as you, just a little earlier.

mikes,
the reason for my grumpiness wasn't that I broke the multimeter. Yes, technically it was me who picked the diode off the board, but I find it highly unusual that this could be done at room temperature. And yes, both the diode and the PCB are just fine, just separated. If Agilent decide to refuse the warranty claim, so be it. I'll live.

The issue I have is not that I expect some special handholding, but I was expecting a little more active involvement from them (RMA?, recall?). Instead, they seem to have decided to wait for warranty claims (does this mean with the local distrubutor or shipping it back to UK?) and see, how many come back.

But I broke mine anyways...

[mikes]

It's way early for them to do any sort of recall. There's simply no reason for them to go through some big, expensive recall before they know the facts fully. Agilent makes good stuff, at a premium price. I'd rather they not simply do a blind recall which is likely to cover a lot of perfectly good items, and then have to raise their prices further to pay for that unnecessary action.

They've been extremely candid here - they've admitted there's a problem, and they're working to resolve it. Let them do their work. This may be limited to a particular shift, a particular PCB panel, a particular soldering line. Give them time to determine what they need to about the cause - what additional info they need, figure out how widespread the problem might be, etc., and create an appropriate response. Everything I've seen here indicates they're taking this seriously and moving forward at a perfectly reasonable pace. If they feel they need to actually see more samples, I'm sure they'll get in contact with people who've said they have the problem.

Until then, there's a warranty available should anyone know that theirs has bad soldering, or if they should have an actual functional problem, bad soldering or not.

[MacAttak]

Glad I saw this - I was considering getting an Agilent as my third DMM, but I think I'll wait this out first. I'm on vacation for a few weeks anyways, so it's not like I need it right away.

It is encouraging to see the vendor taking it seriously and making firm steps to make things right. That's exactly why I don't mind paying a few extra dollars for gear sometimes, if I feel like I can trust the vendor to back up their product with good service.

[digsys]

... Yes, technically it was me who picked the diode off the board, but I find it highly unusual that this could be done at room temperature. And yes, both the diode and the PCB are just fine, just separated. If Agilent decide to refuse the warranty claim, so be it. I'll live.

I've been in this boat a few times. I have never been knocked back when it was an obvious design / manufacture fault. In OZ, at least,
you are able to open / repair stuff and STILL RETAIN warranty, as long AS you don't CAUSE the fault. Warranty is per base rights per
country ! NOT the 1 year / limited crap they tell you. AND I have won MANY claims for friends on failures after the "listed" warranty period!
There's NOTHING to say that the part/s wouldn't have dropped off at some point anyway. A jolt here, a knock there.
If I were you, put the loose part back in the meter, stick a note referring this Forum thread, and don't back down (IF it is rejected).
I get fed up with companies pushing crap (NOT saying this is the case here), and then trying to hide behind their bullshit terms.

But I broke mine anyways... 

Not really. You don't have to defend yourself, you did the right thing.

[K6TR]

I have a u1273ax (OLED version) in the lab that I haven't opened yet. Perhaps worth a look also...

Dave an episode like the one illustrated in this thread drives home the point to everyone to take your adage seriously "Don't turn it on.....Take it apart !"

Once people have their sense of confidence in the product restored then things lighten up.

[Baliszoft]

Took my U1252B apart, looked fine.

[wraper]

Just couldn't resist to take a photo of a solder joint of the same diode which Tomi took off from his board. Well, there is no solder joint...

[SeanB]

That is some poor soldering there. Probably the only thing holding the components on is the remains of the flux used. Pads are very oxidised as well, and probably this is the underlying reason, the boards were left exposed to humid air for a period and corroded.

[wraper]

That is not oxidation, that's the only places where solder catches the pads. Places which are smooth are just clean from solder. I couldn't make a photo as good as I see it with my eyes but I think it's detailed enough to see what's going on.

[TerminalJack505]

Hopefully I don't come across as being snarky here but... 

Damn!  Those are some bad boards.  I've seen better boards in videos where junky consumer electronics are taken apart just for a laugh about how bad they're assembled.

Take apart a $20, no-name multimeter and I can pretty much guarantee you it will be better assembled than those boards.

[marshallh]

That last pic looks like ENIG black pad, unless you caught it at the wrong angle. Regardless the paste didnt reflow worth squat.

Major process fail.

[wraper]

ENIG looks ok, that pad isn't black. That looks like this because photo is made from big angle to show soldering from the side.