The ideal local electronics store

[smackaay]

Living here in Edmonton we have one electronics store for the whole city. Granted, the reason for this is probably pretty clear since electronics is a pretty niche hobby and serious engineers and hobbyists get their stuff from external suppliers. I was in the local electronics store the other day and I was looking around and noticing that the stock that they carried was old and obsolete. They used large amounts of store space to showcase LED's in plastic bags of quantity 2, losts of space showcasing old chips that aren't even commonly used anymore.
They do have a good section with soldering stuff, wire and shrink tube but that's about the only section they have. I think it's kind of sad, every time I go through the door to see the same tired stuff on the shelves. They seem to have a large customer base but I suspect that they're not doing as well as I'd hope. This lead me to thinking, what would be the ideal electronics store? Who would you cater to in order to both be fun and profitable. What sort of items would you stock?

I've been kind of playing with the notion of opening a store (probably won't do it) and have some vague ideas about what I would like but I'm more interested in hearing what everyone else has to say on that subject. What would be your ideal electronics/hobby store? What would it stock? and most importantly, how would you make it profitable?

[Rerouter]

i would think the simplest approach would be to backbone it with useful gadgetry and some area of appliances, amplifiers and security system stuff  tend to be a once in a while thing for my local place, but in turn they make large profits on them,

while for the electronics, while they are slightly similar in regarding rarely updating there stock, they atleast keep it cheap, working on the idea, if its cheaper, they will get more people in due to the cost of postage on external sources, (no idea if that actually is working though)

[ivan747]

I have thought about this many times in the past. Making it profitable is really hard since you are selling stuff that's worth cents. It's easy to steal components and at least in my city there are a couple of dozen stores that sell electronic components, primarily for service technicians (usually power inverters and expensive consumer electronics with made with mostly discrete components, like CRT TVs and stereos).

[ivan747]

Here are some suggestions I though about:
*The salespeople must know what they are selling, preferably being college students in EE
*The store could offer certain services for free, for example crimping terminals on CAT-5e cables (I know it's not related to electronics, I just can't think of a better example)
*The store could have a laser cutter / CNC machine and charge for cutting / milling some piece.
*The store should sell at least 90% of the ICs manufactured by more than 3 companies.
*It should also focus on getting people into the maker movement or something equivalent, that guarantees you'll get more regular customers looking for materials to make (and design) stuff, rather than just repairing old radios.
*It could offer a PCB fabrication service (outsourced, of course). You pick your PCBs in the counter.
*If I had my own store, I would want it to be like a retail Sparkfun (easy to find and discover useful things to make prototypes), rather than a retail Digi-Key (a place where you find an specific part or group of parts based on some criteria). Of course, I should also stock the popular parts Sparkfun doesn't stock, like the complete 78xx voltage regulator series.

[Bored@Work]

*The store could have a laser cutter / CNC machine and charge for cutting / milling some piece.

And a web service so customers can get their CAD file checked from home before they drive to the store. Maybe even upload it, get a ticket number for the job and once customer paid for the job (online with credit card or in the shop) manufacturing starts. In the shop people can of course watch the machine cutting parts. Place the machine in the shop window, don't hide it in a workshop on the back.

*It should also focus on getting people into the maker movement or something equivalent,

These movements could be a fad. You have to be very careful to not miss the boat when something goes out of fashion.

*It could offer a PCB fabrication service (outsourced, of course). You pick your PCBs in the counter.

What would be the advantage compared to directly ordering a PCB on the Internet? With the CNC mill one could offer simple PCB production on the go. Although the PCB wouldn't have professional quality they would have the advantage that the customer could get them now. One could even think about providing a simple etching service, too. So customers don't have to mess with chemicals at home. Professional quality should of course be outsourced.

Having empty PCBs of popular open hardware projects in stock (Arduino, OLS, bus pirate, etc.) would be nice. And reprints (maybe only as e-papers?) of the project descriptions.

In general, a big fat catalogue of projects customers can flip through to get some inspiration. Customers can buy copies of the project plans for a small nominal fee (e.g. $1). If they buy the BOM or just 50% of the BOM in the shop they of course get the project plan for free. Kind of a huge bunch of kits, but many more than usual and more flexible - only buy the parts you don't already have.

Another service a real great local electronics store should provide is "calibration". Customers could bring their instruments like multimeters and oscilloscopes and get a quick check against a reference for a small fee. If they leave the instrument in the shop for an hour (warmup), they could get some better comparison with a reference. I would not offer adjustment (too many different procedures).

[Uncle Vernon]

Just a store without goose pimples would be a plus.

Ever been told by a goose with pimples that a part your chasing doesn't exist???

[ivan747]

*It could offer a PCB fabrication service (outsourced, of course). You pick your PCBs in the counter.

What would be the advantage compared to directly ordering a PCB on the Internet? With the CNC mill one could offer simple PCB production on the go. Although the PCB wouldn't have professional quality they would have the advantage that the customer could get them now. One could even think about providing a simple etching service, too. So customers don't have to mess with chemicals at home. Professional quality should of course be outsourced.

Having empty PCBs of popular open hardware projects in stock (Arduino, OLS, bus pirate, etc.) would be nice. And reprints (maybe only as e-papers?) of the project descriptions.

In general, a big fat catalogue of projects customers can flip through to get some inspiration. Customers can buy copies of the project plans for a small nominal fee (e.g. $1). If they buy the BOM or just 50% of the BOM in the shop they of course get the project plan for free. Kind of a huge bunch of kits, but many more than usual and more flexible - only buy the parts you don't already have.

Another service a real great local electronics store should provide is "calibration". Customers could bring their instruments like multimeters and oscilloscopes and get a quick check against a reference for a small fee. If they leave the instrument in the shop for an hour (warmup), they could get some better comparison with a reference. I would not offer adjustment (too many different procedures).

I like the idea of having the mill on a window and have it making PCBs as an alternative to toner transfer. I think the service shouldn't be expensive, maybe in the $5 range because the boards have no silkscreen. I don't know the details of making PCBs with CNC mills but doing dual-layer boards is going to be hard (nobody is going to manually place vias and solder them in place).

The store could also rent equipment in-store. You bring your project and measure / characterize it with real precision equipment, like Dave's Agilent scope. It also gives you access to tools a small business or a hobbyist cannot afford, pretty much like a hackerspace without being a nerd-club.  Apple offers a similar service in their headquarters. They give you access to a room for a limited time, it's full of different Mac models from different years, each loaded with several versions of Mac OS X. The point is that developers can test their software on these without spending a fortune on hardware. Here it is: http://developer.apple.com/labs/

Having empty PCBs of popular open hardware projects in stock is a good idea. I think a better way to do this is to offer the blank boards and sell the individual parts. For example, I order an Arduino clone designed to be a kit. I already have the AVR, so I ask for everything else. Some guy in the back looks at the parts list and picks all the parts from the cabinets except the AVR. Then he puts everything in an antistatic bag and possibly labels it. The labeling could be automatized with a thermal tag printer and a touchscreen computer with some software that loads the list and allows you to remove and add parts for a particular order and bag. That also makes handling claims easier.

"In general, a big fat catalogue of projects customers can flip through to get some inspiration." This is essential. Oops, I suggested the previous paragraph what you typed after this.  Plans for the kits could be printed on the go. It only takes a good office laser printer that can print very sharp text and schematics and some way to bind manuals.

Calibration comparison is good, but only when customers trust your reference. You could print a non-official calibration sheet.

[saturation]

Any store that stocks 'surplus' gets a plus in my book.  They usually have exotic stuff, and tend to overflow with the standard parts, often run by people who are like you.  One of the best, in the vein of Acme Electronics in CA, Skycraft in Florida.  Here an interior shot.


http://www.google.com/maps?layer=c&z=17&sll=28.593190999999997,-81.380279&cid=-7872216360198449208&panoid=N-k4KKDaQq0F6NHTasy97w&cbp=13,88.36934411474454,,0,0&q=Skycraft+Parts+%26+Surplus&ei=wMApT_KJMsf30gHIzrHvCg&sa=X&oi=local_result&ct=interior-innerspace-image-link&cd=1&resnum=1&ved=0CBwQ2hQoADAA

[ivan747]

Any store that stocks 'surplus' gets a plus in my book.  They usually have exotic stuff, and tend to overflow with the standard parts, often run by people who are like you.  One of the best, in the vein of Acme Electronics in CA, Skycraft in Florida.  Here an interior shot.


http://www.google.com/maps?layer=c&z=17&sll=28.593190999999997,-81.380279&cid=-7872216360198449208&panoid=N-k4KKDaQq0F6NHTasy97w&cbp=13,88.36934411474454,,0,0&q=Skycraft+Parts+%26+Surplus&ei=wMApT_KJMsf30gHIzrHvCg&sa=X&oi=local_result&ct=interior-innerspace-image-link&cd=1&resnum=1&ved=0CBwQ2hQoADAA

Well, that look more or less what you would find here in Dominican Republic, but they also stock regular parts and not just surplus components or second-hand parts recovered from old electronics.

[plunger]

http://www.chipdip.ru/

This chain is in Russia and so is the website but check out the photos of the shops on the middle.

We don't have anything similar here in the states.

[Gall]

ChipDip's prices are very high. However they are a very good example what the local store should look like.

Another good example is promelec.ru - they always have general-purpose parts like resistors or 74s of all kinds in stock, as well as some small CPLDs, FPGAs and microcontrollers. "Gainta" plastic enclosures, "Meanwell" power supplies, PCB blanks and some equipment as well.

Our city (Yekaterinburg, Russia) has plenty of small local component stores. Except for PromElec, they are mostly repair-oriented. They sell parts for A/V equipment, cellular phones etc. A hobbyist always can buy something like TDA7294 at any of these stores.

Since one buys parts at local store mostly for repair or prototyping purposes, the most important parts at these stores are general-purpose ICs (opamps, logic, comparators) and more advanced versatile ones (like CPLDs, MCUs or precision window comparators) - everything that is cheap and may easily be soldered by hand to a home-made board. There's no reason to sell ultra small parts or large BGA ICs except for these widely used to repair things - as long as they are available by mail.

[nanofrog]

...Skycraft in Florida...

I really miss Skycraft. 

[slateraptor]

...Skycraft in Florida.

Winter Park seems to be quite the surplus jackpot.

[nanofrog]

Nice centralized location to pick up decommissioned gear, leftovers, spares, etc. from NASA and defense contractors. 

BTW, Orlando was home until about 6 years ago (grew up in Pine Hills). I don't miss the traffic, but the rest is another matter... old friends, industry contacts in the area, and the roller coasters at Universal's Islands of Adventure certainly come to mind.