Soldering station, simple and resistant

[armandine2]

Good luck.

We have very different methods.

I'll leave you to the 'overthinking'

Regards.

J.

lead horses to water = no drinks for the horses

... simple and resistant, if that is worth a thesis you'll need to overthink it some more

[marck120]

Good luck.

We have very different methods.

I'll leave you to the 'overthinking'

Regards.

J.

lead horses to water = no drinks for the horses

... simple and resistant, if that is worth a thesis you'll need to overthink it some more

Drinks for horses are few but there are.

Of course it is a thesis, maybe you did not understand what I mean by simple and resistant, simple I mean with little electronics.

Analog controller + Linear transformer = almost zero risk of failure.

[shabaz]

Hi,

That's not true by any stretch; there are still a lot of electronics inside soldering stations such as the one in your photo; they have amplifiers and MOSFET switching to measure and control the temperature, and those parts can fail.

You could go very retro and buy a soldering iron with zero electronics and just a heater element, and even then, the element can (and does) fail.

I think expecting to buy a low-cost soldering station such as the ones that you have listed, which have no track record of operating for many years of service because most of them have not been around for more than a few years; it is unrealistic to expect them to work for more than five years or so, at a guess. For instance, take apart the iron handle and compare and contrast it with a normal-brand iron handle. You'll notice the contacts are not as good, and they will eventually fail (as will the normal brand ones; they won't last forever, either).

Even if the lower-cost soldering stations you listed work for five years, it is still quite good value for money if you spend just sub-100 euros as you wish and if the performance was good for those years. Any longer operation is a bonus, but I don't think you should rely on that. I have a KSGER all-in-one soldering iron for portable use, I really like it, I don't regret its purchase, but I don't expect it to last a decade.

In contrast, around 2014, I purchased an old, low-cost, used JBC soldering station from eBay with an LCD screen, so certainly not "analog" as you mention; it has a microcontroller inside, and it functioned well for another decade for me, and I still have spares that I can use (if I don't get around to repairing it; I have a new soldering station now, so less incentive to do that). And there are various repair threads on it, so I won't be trailblazing if I wish to repair it.

Summary: your assumptions seem off the mark, and you're expecting too much from the investment. And you are indeed over-thinking it, as others mention.

[marck120]

@shabaz

Hello

Yes of course, a soldering station with zero electronics does not exist, I never said that inside the soldering station in the photo there are no electronic components, I just want to say that the risk of failure is much lower unlike sophisticated soldering stations with LCD screens and switching power supplies built with low quality components, of course even a linear power supply fails, their internal copper windings sometimes touch together and short circuit.

What are the low cost soldering stations in the list ? Which models are you referring to ? Some are also expensive, yes this is true, some models have been on the market for a few years but other soldering stations in the list have been built for a long time, just because it is built recently does not mean that it will break down immediately.

Nothing is eternal, I do not want to expect impossible things, I just want to avoid buying a soldering station that will last me a few months, 5 years of life seems little to me anyway, I do not want to give stupid examples but my television is 10 years old and still works well.

Obviously from a 50€ soldering station I don't expect it to last like a 200€ station, if I spend 150€ minimum I expect it to last more than 10 years, yes undoubtedly the ksger and quicko have a good quality-price ratio.

Anyway in the end my idea is the same as yours, the ksger and quicko stations have the good thing that on Aliexpress there are many spare parts, you can find power supplies, LED controllers, stylus at a low cost, for this reason every time a part breaks I could replace it and I would always have the soldering station working, but I don't understand if all the controllers and switching power supplies are compatible with each other ?








From what I understand you recommend a ksger and the quicko ? Regarding the stations in the list with linear power supply what do you think, are they all to be discarded ?

I was thinking of taking this one too since it is shipped by Amazon, in the end it is the same as a ksger or a quicko, what do you think ?

https://www.amazon.it/Preciva-preimpostati-visualizzazione-Termostatica-Intelligente/dp/B0CB3VS9JD/ref=sr_1_1_sspa


I'm not thinking too much, there are many options to evaluate, it takes time and it's not easy to make a decision.

[shabaz]

I have not used the one you refer to, but there are 41 user reviews on that website to help.

It costs 50 euro, and if it lasts you several years, that's less than the cost of a pizza per year, and if you're happy with the reviews,  then I think you can't expect much more for the investment.

Me, I would not make that same decision, but I have used soldering stations long enough to know more precisely what my personal needs are; the mix of price-performance that others may want will be different to yours.

You need to make your own decision of course, I'm merely pointing out that there's a good chance it's only a decision that will be relevant for a few years anyway.

[marck120]

@shabaz

Yes I read the reviews on Amazon, they almost all seem positive, yes certainly if it lasts 5 years it is 10 € each year, the cost of a pizza as you rightly said.

My reasoning was this, the soldering station is composed of three parts mainly, controller, power supply and stylus, as I said the ksger and the quicko have the advantage that the spare parts are easily available, for example if a power supply breaks it costs 15 euros, so by replacing the power supply the soldering station lasts me another three years for example, my PC for example is already 11 years old, recently I replaced the power supply the ram and the ssd and I can still use it, I was wondering if I can do the same with the ksger or quicko ? With other soldering stations it is more difficult to do this job because the spare parts are difficult to find, in fact as a supplement I was thinking of buying a kit on Aliexpress, so I would have the spare parts ready, but as I said you have to see if they are compatible, I saw that power supplies and controllers have different connectors and pins.

But what decision would you make ? I am aware that they gave me a lot of advice but your opinion is also important.

Yes of course the final decision is up to me, yes if I spend 50 euros for 5 years it will be fine, I hoped to be calm for at least 10 years but if it is not possible, patience, in fact I was aiming for a soldering station with a linear power supply with the hope that it would last longer.

[shabaz]

Hi,

When I was younger, I purchased a simple soldering iron with an in-built temperature control in the handle. I used it for about 6 years. I still have it somewhere; it still works, but my needs changed after that period, so it made sense to buy a new soldering iron, regardless of whether the old one still worked.

Ten years ago, when I couldn't justify spending a lot, my decision was to buy a used JBC soldering station from eBay, and it lasted 10 years. Today, I was able to justify buying a new JBC station, and I needed it for the very wide range of soldering tips (I require ultra-fine tips, as well as large tips). I also needed a portable soldering iron, so I bought a cheaper KSGER tool, fully aware that I'd be lucky if it functioned for a few years.

Your needs will also change; it's very unlikely you will want to continue using that soldering station for 10 years.

EDIT: I tried reading the translation, I can't tell if there are more tip choices. The tips selection visible in the photo looks pretty bad (to me anyway). That alone would be good reason to consider something else, if it were me. But maybe you're OK with those tips (e.g. if all you plan to use is the chisel tip with through-hole parts for instance, then it may be fine).

[marck120]

Hi,

Yes I understand, in ten years there will also be more performing soldering stations, I don't have any particular needs, I just need some thin tips to solder on the Arduino, in the end the soldering station is a basic tool let's say, it only has to melt the tin, even if over the years the stations have evolved, the current technology of the T12 for me is more than enough even if then maybe I regret it since the C245 are definitely more advanced, maybe in 5 years the T12 will become obsolete, this doesn't mean anything obviously, many people today use the 900M and are happy with them.

My minimum goal however remains 50 euros = 5 years, otherwise I prefer to get to 150 euros but as long as the station lasts much longer, as I said I don't have any particular needs, duration is more important, at least on Amazon I should have a 2 year warranty, on Aliexpress I don't even know if the warranty exists.

Anyway if you have identified some interesting soldering station let me know, even among those with the linear power supply that I listed.

You were very kind, thank you for the advice.

[shabaz]

I don't have any particular needs, I just need some thin tips to solder on the Arduino

I see.. in that case, an all-in-one soldering iron should easily meet your needs, it will be about 50 euro, and will most likely last at least 5 years, and is more than adequate for through-hole work with an Arduino.

Couple of examples are in the screenshot. The Antex one is available in Italy and has an excellent track record of lasting a long time (it has been in production for decades, any issues are ironed out), and it comes with a stand, and a very "normal" bevel soldering tip, which will suit you much better than the default conical that comes with other soldering irons. Plus it is earthed by default, unlike some of the low-cost soldering stations.

Even if your needs change after 5 years, you will be able to use this as a backup iron.

EDIT: Cheaper on Amazon, although I cannot tell if there is a stand with that.

[marck120]

EDIT: I tried reading the translation, I can't tell if there are more tip choices. The tips selection visible in the photo looks pretty bad (to me anyway). That alone would be good reason to consider something else, if it were me. But maybe you're OK with those tips (e.g. if all you plan to use is the chisel tip with through-hole parts for instance, then it may be fine).

Sorry, I just read what you wrote, are you referring to the set of tips for the soldering station on Amazon ? It seems there are only two tips supplied, the fine one and the chisel one, moreover the soldering station only has 75w, will they be enough, the same identical station obviously also exists in the C245 version and has 120w.

[shabaz]

are you referring to the set of tips for the soldering station on Amazon ?

Yes, it looked very limiting from the photo. If there is a C245 version then the tip choice will be much better, but beware that there's no guarantee it will even last five years; the handles are of lower quality internally compared to real JBC handles, plus, there's quite a lot of electronics to go wrong (even with a linear supply, the JBC system uses a lot of electronics inside, and a lower-cost clone is unlikely to have the same reliability). If 5-10 year operation is important to you, then there's less chance of that with a JBC clone, compared to the simple all-in-one irons such as the Antex one.

[marck120]

The problem is that they are not adjustable, yes currently I have to solder on the Arduino but if I then need more power for other more general jobs I find myself with a not very powerful stylus, better that it has adjustable temperature.

https://www.cselettronica.net/elettronica/saldatura/attrezzature-saldante/jbc/30st-saldatore-stilo-230v-25w-con-punta-r-10d.1.1.1152.gp.23183.uw

https://www.amazon.it/Antex-S582470-ANTXS25-Ferro-saldare/dp/B00862W052/ref=sr_1_1

In my second post they are all in the list:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/soldering-station-simple-and-resistant/msg5634317/#msg5634317

The C245 version is this, the station basically looks the same:



https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005005943750062.html

But the handle can be easily replaced I think, all JBC handles should be compatible, yes unfortunately the JBC clone tips are of low quality :

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006173325032.html

I also report the list of soldering stations with linear transformer, it is just to have a small list, many are to be discarded:

GVM H3, WEMON T31, AiXun T413, STP 920, RF4 RF-ONE, Toor T12-X, LEISTO T12-X, SUGON T26D, SUGON T36, i2C 2SCNi, I2C PDK1200, WEP 982D, Aixun T435, AIXUN T420D, Quick TS1200A, Best BST-933B, Jabe UD-1200, JBC BT-2BWA, Mechanic MA-SD01

https://www.unionrepair.com/soldering-iron-station/

[JohanH]

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006173325032.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.5.739853f9HJLYXB&algo_pvid=9879d5ae-ffc1-4617-a4b7-a669a5db0614&algo_exp_id=9879d5ae-ffc1-4617-a4b7-a669a5db0614-2&pdp_npi=4%40dis%21EUR%219.61%211.35%21%21%2110.47%211.47%21%40211b8f9a17268180267726237ed079%2112000036117891429%21sea%21IT%210%21ABX&curPageLogUid=l5WJhyVRJx70&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A

Please, when posting links to web sites, leave out the tracking information after the question mark (?). So the above link would become:

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006173325032.html

It saves space in forum posts (easier to read) and makes a cleaner Internet without all the tracking. Note. Sometimes the information after the question mark is needed to open a web page correctly, but most often it's only tracking information or similar and can be left out.

[marck120]

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006173325032.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.5.739853f9HJLYXB&algo_pvid=9879d5ae-ffc1-4617-a4b7-a669a5db0614&algo_exp_id=9879d5ae-ffc1-4617-a4b7-a669a5db0614-2&pdp_npi=4%40dis%21EUR%219.61%211.35%21%21%2110.47%211.47%21%40211b8f9a17268180267726237ed079%2112000036117891429%21sea%21IT%210%21ABX&curPageLogUid=l5WJhyVRJx70&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A

Please, when posting links to web sites, leave out the tracking information after the question mark (?). So the above link would become:

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006173325032.html

It saves space in forum posts (easier to read) and makes a cleaner Internet without all the tracking. Note. Sometimes the information after the question mark is needed to open a web page correctly, but most often it's only tracking information or similar and can be left out.

Thanks for the correction, I totally agree, in fact I didn't like these very long links either, I couldn't find the solution, I hadn't thought of copying only the link before the question mark, it was my mistake. Thanks.

[tatel]

As I see it, you fear cheap chinese stuff won't last for even five years, even for non-intensive use, based on I don't know what kind of data, probably just western China haters hearsay. Also, you are not willing to spend the bigger amount of money needed to buy the better, overkill for your needs, western stuff available, neither used nor new.

Well, I really hope you don't behave the same way when it's time to put a preservative in place. Just saying.

Sorry to be blunt, but you are wasting both your time and ours looking for the holy grail. What you are looking for doesn't exist, period. You are not going to get a new JBC/Metcal, etc, at the price of a Quicko/Ksger

All the possible, well-known, viable options have been already given to you, yet you continue to putting yourself into that self-made conundrum.

The way to solve that conundrum would be to read that 169 pages long thread about custom firmware. It started in March, 14, 2018, so more than 6 years ago. That's more than the five years you would want your prospective Ksger/Quicko to last. Then you would have a good idea about how long these stations last. That wouldn't be hearsay but fact-based user reports. Quick answer: very few people reported his cheap chinese soldering station ceased to work, particularly if they got a top-chinese-tier one. Like that Quicko 958. Of course chinese quality control isn't that good and you could have bad luck. But probability is really on your side, and what you do expect for 50 €?  I know, you want your cheap station to be like a 600 € one. It wont happen, man.

Of course reading 169 pages would be a big waste of time when you have been already given the answers, not just about chinese cheap stuff, but also about expensive, better quality western stuff. You would be wasting only your own time, however, and that wouldn't be a so bad thing.

I have to say, worrying about if it could last more than five years, while saying you aren't going to use it intensively, is ludicrous, do you realize that? Thinking about getting a new JBC one, for that kind of work, while thinking it should cost about the same, is even more ludicrous.

Man, no matter if you choose the cheap or the expensive one, put that preservative in place and have fun.

Edit: typos

[marck120]

I'm sorry to tell you but you're saying things that aren't true, I never said that cheap Chinese stuff won't last even five years, I said that if I buy a 50 euro soldering station and it lasts me 5 years it's a good compromise.

But what do you mean by this sentence ? You're talking about putting a condom on me, I hope I didn't misunderstand.

"Well, I really hope you don't behave the same way when it's time to put a preservative in place. Just saying."

Here is another thing that is not true, I have never claimed to buy a JBC/Metcal at the price of a Quicko/Ksger, you do not care about my time, if you think you are wasting your time do not answer.

But who the hell told you that I claim that a 50€ station is identical to a 600€ one ? I have always said that my maximum budget is 120€, I can even go up to 150€, even at this figure I know very well that it will never be the same as a professional station.

Even if it is not used intensively it does not mean that it will last a long time, if a product is of low quality it can break even after a month, if I may say so if I invest 120 euros 150 euros the station must have a minimum of quality,

I have been given many solutions, I have never said the opposite, I understand that it is impossible to analyze all the soldering stations, and I do not complain, indeed I am satisfied with all the advice they have given me, in fact I did not ask other questions, lastly I had only asked if among the soldering stations on the list with the linear power supply there was any valid model

I accept advice and opinions from everyone but with the tone of your post it almost seems like you are scolding me with rather unfortunate comparisons citing "preservative" I did not understand well, I hope it is Google Translate's fault.

Greetings. I wish you many good things.

[tatel]

if you think you are wasting your time do not answer.

Yeah, exactly

[marck120]

if you think you are wasting your time do not answer.

Yeah, exactly

Good, keep it up.

[stretchyman]

I pity the person who sells him a car or anything for that matter.

Just to blow my own trumpet so to speak....

40+ years of soldering experience from using a crappy 12W Weller and having spent the last 20 years using a MX500.

Who cares how complex and over engineered it is, it doesn't make it unreliable. Simple does not necessarily mean good. Any iron needs thermal management which cheap ones wont provide.

The Metcals are an utter revelation in soldering.

Just take my advice and buy one.

Please save us all the agony of choosing for you.

J.

[tatel]

I pity the person who sells him a car or anything for that matter.

Yep... that would probably be like Project Manhattan

[marck120]

@stretchyman

Yes, I understand that the MX500 is a professional device and the best soldering iron that can be found on the market, I don't doubt it, but as I explained, new ones cost a lot and I had no intention of buying used products.

Yes, undoubtedly a simple device does not necessarily make it good but in principle it should be more resistant, yes of course a complex station does not mean that it is unreliable, I remain convinced that a soldering station with a linear transformer will last me longer, for example the Mechanic MA-SD01 and the Sugon T26 or the BEST BST-933B seem well built to me.

I am the one suffering the agony if anything.

Come on, it's better to close the discussion, yes obviously I will choose a soldering station, I will keep you updated.

Thanks for all the advice received.

[armandine2]

@stretchyman

Yes, I understand that the MX500 is a professional device and the best soldering iron that can be found on the market, I don't doubt it, but as I explained, new ones cost a lot and I had no intention of buying used products.

...this seems a bit peculiar - what have you got against secondhand soldering equipment?

[marck120]

@stretchyman

Yes, I understand that the MX500 is a professional device and the best soldering iron that can be found on the market, I don't doubt it, but as I explained, new ones cost a lot and I had no intention of buying used products.

...this seems a bit peculiar - what have you got against secondhand soldering equipment?

I have no warranty, I am referring to the two-year legal warranty, yes in the past on eBay I have already purchased used products and I have not had any problems, I prefer to buy the soldering station new. Good evening. See you soon.

[Shock]

Secondhand Metcal MX 500 if you have limited funds and want the cheapest but quality bang for buck. I was going to get the same but the Pace ADS 200 came out and I was already interested in Paces other handpieces.

A few years back I spent months looking. The T12 is dead end since the C245. If you are like me you'll never be happy with the Chinese compromises and quality. I was intending to run original tips then realised the handpieces aren't anywhere near Metcal (and now Pace) in terms of quality.

So it seemed pointless investing time in the T12 which is the least performing cart in the crappiest handpiece. Then considered the C245 but Metcal is cheaper to run genuine carts with arguably more reliable tips, a nicer handpiece at a better working distance as well as being genuine.

[marck120]

@Shock

Hi, thank you so much for the advice.

I've been doing research for three weeks now, no one rushes me and I enjoy doing research so I take it easy.

I'm not ruling out any option but I wanted to have a new product in my hands, yes unfortunately the budget is limited, they recommended a Metcal MX 500 on eBay, looking at them they seem quite used, I don't know how many years of work they have behind them, then if unfortunately it breaks what do I do, there is no guarantee and I am not capable of repairing it.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/305601286383

From what I understand however the metacal uses proprietary tips:

https://it.farnell.com/metcal/sttc-136/chisel-tip-30deg-2-4mm/dp/4950641

Look, for me too it's a crossroads between the T12 and the C245, my use is exclusively hobbyist, I'll do some welding every now and then, the only doubt is about the 80w watt power of the T12, if I spend €50 for a classic quicko t12-958 and it manages to give me 5 years of service I'm already satisfied, or a Silverflo 982-I C245 in the same price range, or an AIFEN A9E etc.. It should be remembered that the cost of the C245 tips is higher.

Yes I agree with you, the Chinese soldering stations are a compromise of quality, they will never reach the level of Metacal and Pace.

Instead, if I decide to increase the budget then I absolutely aim for a soldering station powered by a linear power supply, but I would have to increase the budget to about 180€

In your opinion is there any valid model among these stations ?

Aixun T435:

https://www.martview.com/aixun-t435-led-display-dual-channel-smart-soldering-station-for-mobile-phone-bga-repair.html

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006091246219.html

Jabe UD-1200 :

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/33040378742.html

Sugon T26D :

https://www.diyfixtool.com/products/sugon-t26-precision-lead-free-electric-soldering-station-repair-kit

https://www.unionrepair.com/sugon-t26d-precision-soldering-station-suitable-for-jbc-soldering-tip.html

GVM H3 3 :

https://it.aliexpress.com/i/1005006141462168.html

https://www.unionrepair.com/gvm-h3-3-in-1-smart-soldering-station.html

i2c PDK1200 :

https://www.unionrepair.com/i2c-pdk1200-precision-soldering-station.html?variation_id=20036

WEMON T31 :

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006393604934.html

AIXUN T413 :

https://www.diyfixtool.com/products/aixun-t413-integrated-soldering-station-with-t245-t225-handle

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005007478867632.html

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005007500598444.html

WEP 982D :

https://it.aliexpress.com/item/1005006402871100.html

LEISTO T12-X :

https://it.aliexpress.com/i/32871902459.html

https://www.diyfixtool.com/products/toor-t12-x-lead-free-soldering-stations-upgrade-leisto-t12-11

TooR T12-X :

https://www.unionrepair.com/toor-t12-11-75w-digital-lead-free-precision-soldering-station.html