Automatic Tip Cleaners (less expensive options)

[Xena E]

Capacitance Sensing Microsecond-Level Reaction

 

What are you laughing at?

I've got Capacitance Sensing Microsecond-Level Reaction on my shoe shine machine.

My electric tooth brush has also has Capacitance Sensing Microsecond-Level Reaction.

Who's got the time to wait for a Capacitance Sensing Millisecond-Level Reaction to switch it on?

I don't know how the world has ever managed before Capacitance Sensing Microsecond-Level Reaction on their automatic soldering tip cleaner?

Oh yeah, they used to use a freakin' sponge!

you can wipe it on a dry paper towel too, it works. you need to be quick so it does not burn. But I like that you get a fresh area every time. It actually gets very clean.


if its crudded up you can rub it on a piece of dry wood, which is somewhat more abrasive

Paper towel is very good, it also costs alot less than a JBC tip cleaner

(Actually I use my jeans, ... but don't forget if you're wearing a skirt or shorts instead though    ).

Regards,
Xena.

[coppercone2]

you should try them instead of just thinking you need some kind of apparatus to do everything because they need an accessory to sell.

[digger]

or, you know, instead of making assumptions about what others have tried, you could try to stay on topic. lol

i think i've tried most common tip cleaning products (besides stainless wool), and fwiw, my favorite manual method is brass wool.

[coppercone2]

BTW you know if you make some complicated machine you need a different one every time you switch solder types?

There is a reason its not popular


Have a good look with a magnifier on whatever fixture you even use to hold a brass sponge. Unless you give it a deep clean, there is a good chance you can contaminate your fresh soldering iron tip with the wrong kind of solder. They are filthy. Procedurally you don't even want to use the same solder stand, because its contaminated with tons of tiny little solder globules that get stuck all over it, and fall off randomly.

Using wipes, or a sponge in a tray, that is easy, cheap and effective, plus it has a low chance of contamination. Who the hell knows what is inside of some "port" that you stick a iron into?

This is one of those things that could lead to a failure but gives everyone a sense of professionalism. Likely to cause havok if it shows up in a factory or serious lab. Professional engineers are very wary of bad solder joints, their a huge freaking deal. Its the difference between being allowed to use your own creations for serious work to being relagated to hiring companies to do everything for you to ensure 'quality', after a quality/safety review gets a bad vibe from your complications.


Alot of people here did important things (either for ensuring the success of a company reputation/quality wise, or even safety) and that is why people are suggesting you stay away from contraptions like this that mess with a age old proven soldering technique.

[digger]

some complicated machine

the machine does not seem complicated

Who the hell knows what is inside of some "port" that you stick a iron into?

in my workspace, as the sole user of the device, i'd have a fair idea.

the risk of cross-contamination applies to anything that can harbor solder... brass wool, used soldering iron tips, existing solder joints of unknown composition, etc. there's nothing inherently more risky about a mechanized tip cleaner.

is the solution not simple? if in doubt, remove the solder from the joint, clean your iron tip, and apply fresh solder. do that a couple more times until your paranoia is quenched. or you could only do new work (no rework).

in any case, thanks for the cross-contamination PSA, but i hope we can continue on to automatic tip cleaners from here

[shabaz]

my favorite manual method is brass wool.

I've been using steel wool for the past seven or eight years or so, I initially wasn't sure because the manufacturer described it as 'more aggressive' but, I don't do production volumes, and so for general use, I've not noticed any premature tip wearing.

But perhaps the high-speed automatic cleaners might be better with the less aggressive brushes.

One reason I'd like to try an automatic tip cleaner at some point, is that the tips can snag on the wool (JBC tips for instance have a bulge at the end). Not a bit issue, just takes a few seconds to occasionally clear that off, but would be great to improve on that.

I don't want to spend a lot, so am interested in the sub-$100 options. Still kind of hoping others review first though!

[digger]

i just ordered an aixun cm30 ($88 shipped, aliexpress), so we shall see. i'll do a teardown and review. i'll also try to compare it to yihua 200C ($50 shipped, amazon).

I've been using steel wool for the past seven or eight years or so, I initially wasn't sure because the manufacturer described it as 'more aggressive' but, I don't do production volumes, and so for general use, I've not noticed any premature tip wearing.

i've been very curious about stainless wool. did you get it from jbc? if i end up not liking automatic tip cleaners, maybe i'll try that out next for fun.

[DimitriP]

Who the hell knows what is inside of some "port" that you stick a iron into?

a sense of professionalism

Yes I'm a sponge addict..."tssssss"

[shabaz]

Hi,

I've been using JBC CL6205.

[coppercone2]

Who the hell knows what is inside of some "port" that you stick a iron into?

a sense of professionalism

Yes I'm a sponge addict..."tssssss"

that is no joke if someone happened to use your equipment, you can swap the tip and sponge very easily. Merit based access control in labs exists, on paper. In reality its a purely political situation, if you even have a key on the lab. Some sales executives might feel 'unwelcome'. Your iron can get hit with one of those tiny dollar store solder kits to repair someones whatever. He has enough power to cancel your lab and three labs over, and recognizes "Alloy" to be the name of a ship in his yacht club.

I can see how an argument might go if you dare accuse him of 'contaminating' something lol

[Xena E]

@ Coppercone2

I don't think your detractors understand the implications of customers detecting impure alloys in quality assurance of hi-rel work.

Seriously:

At my company even the use of brass scourers are not allowed as the brass transfers to the iron in the tip. (Sure it saves tip wear to use it and it four nines  percent don't matter, but then loosing a contract of work for the sake of it is stupid).

Auto tip cleaners were originally designed for use on high volume manual assembly lines where speed is important, in our hi-rel work, good assembly techs are doing 1 joint in several minutes, cleaning tip between each one with a fibreglass pad and then wiping on damp natural sponge, or similar.

OK, tip cleaners are a fun gadget if you want an ornament for your hobby bench, but auditors from your hi-rel customer will perhaps advise you don't use them.

Regards.

[digger]

I don't think your detractors understand the implications of customers detecting impure alloys in quality assurance of hi-rel work.

Seriously

🤔 i think anyone doing hi-rel work should understand how to deliver on that and do whatever's needed to get the job done properly. rather, what i don't understand is the relevance to this thread's topic of discussion. do you all routinely and repeatedly bring up risk of contamination any time soldering of any kind is discussed? honest question lol

but ok, don't use anything like brass wool or brush for paid hi-rel work. duly noted.

[shabaz]

I think there's a massive disconnect and perhaps a lack of comprehension about job roles in engineering. If it were so narrow, there'd be just a fraction of engineers here. There are thousands of design engineers, they get to choose which tools they feel they need for their job, it's their decision, because it's all about their productivity so that they ultimately _can_ meet customer needs. If they took several minutes to do one joint, that's zero value (and, if anything, detrimental) to the customer. Plus, (depending on how generous they are feeling) they will get their interns whatever tool they want and never verify the condition or even the presence of their sponges. Production-grade soldering is not part of those intern's job roles either.

If DIY enthusiasts want to use or even try out low-cost automatic tip cleaners, perhaps it could help them decide and better articulate their criteria when deciding what tools they may want for their job. Even if the org is paying for it, you don't want them to waste money. If the low-cost automatic cleaning is not beneficial, that's fine. I'll still be very grateful if someone investigated it. Part of engineering is naturally trying to be more efficient and optimize processes, even if it's just a few seconds shaved-off tip cleaning. Good on those who try to do that and report back to help others.

[Xena E]

do you all routinely and repeatedly bring up risk of contamination any time soldering of any kind is discussed? honest question lol.

Well, as you ask, yes I do. Not necessarily on forum, but there seems to be a misconception that auto tip cleaners are the dogs bollocks, and a must have best method.

I've personally nothing against their use, and in manual high volume production of commercial grade work they're just fine. I just dont see an application outside that.

If you're reviewing for company use, then they're not going to appreciate garbage that breaks down and doesn't have any wearing parts spares availability, there's a reason that Metcal, JBC, etc., are popular, and expensive.

If it's a little novelty item that will see minimal use, to clutter your hobby workbench, then buy the low end stuff, I've tried some of it but I won't comment because you don't want my opinion on the devices use case in the first place, apart from: you get what you pay for.

Buy cheap, buy again.

As for cutting corners and costs on the job to speed things up, by buying into gadgets like tip cleaners then you're in the kind of cutthroat competition market that isn't worth contemplating doing with manual assembly methods.

I hope you find something that satisfies your retail needs.

Regards.
X

[Smokey]

...
 what i don't understand is the relevance to this thread's topic of discussion. do you all routinely and repeatedly bring up risk of contamination any time soldering of any kind is discussed? honest question
...

There is probably a good answer to this.  If you are making a product that needs to be RoHS compliant you must have completely separate soldering systems for the lead-free and leaded soldering stuff.  The rules say that contaminating your lead-free iron with leaded solder isn't allowed while still being RoHS compliant.  If you are also ISO compliant, there are rules and procedures associated with all this stuff too that make sure you have separate systems and don't cross contaminate.  It's sort of a big deal (as in a legal problem).

Now does this apply to some dude in his garage?  Not really.  But not all of us around here are just dudes in their garages.

[thm_w]

Now does this apply to some dude in his garage?  Not really.  But not all of us around here are just dudes in their garages.

And the title of this thread is "less expensive options", if it wasn't obvious from the budget (<$100), its obvious now, we don't care about contamination.

If you do care, then its just use the fiber brushes, blue and black core to distinguish leaded or lead free https://www.jbctools.com/cl2008-fiber-brushes-for-automatic-tip-cleaner-product-2191.html

[shabaz]

Going back to the brass/steel discussion (and my question about whether the latter might be too aggressive for an automatic tool), it seems there is prior art for automatic cleaners with steel brushes, so it must work, at least with some combination of brushes and speed. The attached screenshot is from an 'Apollo-Seiko' tip cleaner for soldering robots.
There's even an automatic sponge machine for those who really want that!

This video was interesting; it's a vortex cleaner and needs an air supply, so none of that is cheap, but it was still interesting to see how it works; the presenter does a teardown, which reveals how the tip is sensed; there's likely an inductor there, and it (probably) detects the change in inductance caused by the metal tip/shaft.

[tooki]

...
 what i don't understand is the relevance to this thread's topic of discussion. do you all routinely and repeatedly bring up risk of contamination any time soldering of any kind is discussed? honest question
...

There is probably a good answer to this.  If you are making a product that needs to be RoHS compliant you must have completely separate soldering systems for the lead-free and leaded soldering stuff.  The rules say that contaminating your lead-free iron with leaded solder isn't allowed while still being RoHS compliant.

Do they actually say that? I thought RoHS only stipulated maximum concentrations of the prohibited substances in the final product. I have never heard about it specifying processes themselves.

If you are also ISO compliant, there are rules and procedures associated with all this stuff too that make sure you have separate systems and don't cross contaminate.  It's sort of a big deal (as in a legal problem).

This, and perhaps IPC specs, make more sense in terms of proscribing how one must work.

[digger]

i received the aixun cm30 but couldn't play with it today because it came with a euro plug wall wart. i'll try to wire up another 12VDC wall wart with the correct barrel plug tomorrow or somehow adapt the existing one as it is 120VAC input compatible. not sure if i have a EU->US travel adapter thing in my junk collection (but ofc i have US->EU for when i travel), but it's possible.

i considered complaining to the ali seller, but i doubt it's worth the trouble. also, the listing didn't specify one way or the other. would you guys even bother? lol

initial impression is good though. it looks/feels quality on the outside. all metal housing. didn't take it apart yet, ofc.

[digger]

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/aixun-cm30-automatic-tip-cleaner-teardown-and-review/

i did a teardown/review of the aixun cm30. i have not used it long enough to say whether i prefer an automatic tip cleaner to brass wool, but assuming you like automatic tip cleaners, i feel ok about recommending it. it's probably the best inexpensive one you can get. it seems pretty high quality.