Author Topic: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard  (Read 305677 times)

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Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #625 on: May 06, 2016, 07:34:04 pm »
More speculation. We've sold this item in Asia, Japan, every western European nation, South America, Africa, Russia, every US state, UK, China, Australia, New Zealand! WHY, because residents of these locations cannot find something better for the price. It's a revolutionary product unlike anything else in the world. We've sold to university labs, calibration labs, industrial labs. One of our buyers said he bought our unit so he wouldn't have to lug around his Fluke 732B! 

If a calibration lab purchased it for anything other than to satisfy a curiosity - I would be baffled. Please provide the name of any lab that is using these for any type of reference so I know who NOT to call on for calibration.
At the price you are selling these things, it is not a challenge to get customers to buy it once and take their chances. Once they see the reality, it is very hard to imagine anyone buying a second, third, or more.

You really have to try one. A number of our buyers have purchased more than one unit.
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Online HighVoltage

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #626 on: May 06, 2016, 08:04:24 pm »

You really have to try one. A number of our buyers have purchased more than one unit.

I bought one from you .... was so disappointed and gave it away ....
Here is my original picture again, if you need a reminder.
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Online IanJ

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #627 on: May 06, 2016, 08:36:01 pm »
I bought one from you .... was so disappointed and gave it away ....
Here is my original picture again, if you need a reminder.

I can't believe that photo!............I personally could not under any circumstances ever produce and sell something of that build quality (and yes, I sell my own Precision Voltage Source)......no matter how it performs. I couldn't even pot it then sell it knowing what lurked beneath.
Pride has gone out the door in exchange for dollars...............

Ian.
Ian Johnston - Original designer of the PDVS2mini || Author of the free WinGPIB app.
Website - www.ianjohnston.com
YT Channel (electronics repairs & projects): www.youtube.com/user/IanScottJohnston, Twitter (X): https://twitter.com/IanSJohnston
 

Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #628 on: May 11, 2016, 04:40:05 am »
Quote from: codeboy2k
I was really disappointed to see it hand wired.
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

Quote from: codeboy2k
Would have preferred to see a manufactured PC board in there. Please don't say it's not meant to be opened.  It should be safe to open any reference, as long as I don't mess with the settings. People open up 8 digit DMM's and Fluke 732's.  Opening it should not be a problem.

Unfortunately, no other board designs have worked. It would be truly phenomenal to just have them manufactured from our parts. The device can be opened, but the trim pots are accessible through the cover, and they may be disturbed by removing it. Nothing else will happen, though. We have recently begun labeling the units "calibration void if labels have been tampered with." In reality, to produce a device like this at this price requires some sacrifices. The device is robust if not tampered with.   

Quote from: codeboy2k
Good to see that you decided to make a PCB (I think you said so in one of your previous posts).  There's a lot of good information here in the forum, and lots of smart people who have good advice to offer you. You can make a really nice, clean and small PCB to fit in there, and it will significantly reduce your construction time and effort, and the product will still function as it should, and will ultimately be better in the end.  So consider that advice when you do, and you'll make a good product. With Gellar Labs no longer making temperature compensated references, you are in a unique position and have a head start on anyone else jumping in to fill that void. Go for it!

Thanks for the vote of confidence. I'm plagued by oscillation with prefab boards. I'm going to try RF substrate next. It's a shame about Joe Geller. But I have learned from his business model. I took my design right out of a data sheet, and then built on it. Anyone can do it, but not everyone wants to spend months and years experimenting. I never intended to sell voltage references.

I made one with a bare chip and four wires off of it to banana jacks. That was it. It worked for handheld meters, so I was happy. I mentioned the device to a friend I've had my whole life, and he brought over his meter to check out the reference. He said, "It's better than a standard cell."

I said, "What's a standard cell?" So, he explained it to me. Throughout the process of development I was many times mistaken about what you can get out of  a regulator IC. But I had my lifelong friend who has much more experience than I do, to assure me of what was possible.

So, the device eventually turned out better than I ever thought possible. I didn't plan it. It just sort of happened.

Quote from: codeboy2k
No one likes smoke and mirrors, so they might poke you on that, so remember to stick with the measured facts, only science and engineering here.

I'm quite surprised how infuriated some people become at the mere mention of God! SHEESH! I should know where I get my ideas!  There's no smoke and mirrors intended, just a mob mentality to make an inferno out of what was essentially a joke about magic. But, in the middle ages up until medieval times, "science" was called, "magic".
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Offline gilbenl

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #629 on: May 11, 2016, 05:27:53 pm »
Quote from: codeboy2k
I was really disappointed to see it hand wired.
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

No, its like saying Einstein is bad at basic arithmetic. Soldering is the fundamental tool of the trade. To say you've built a unique and revolutionary voltage reference, solder like a 5 year old with no thumbs and claim that it doesn't matter is laughable.

What doesn't kill you, probably hurts a lot.
 

Offline retrolefty

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #630 on: May 11, 2016, 06:44:44 pm »
Quote
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

 I agree. It's best that facts guide us forward rather then going down the rabbit hole of subjectivity.

 

Online IanJ

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #631 on: May 12, 2016, 10:56:31 am »
Quote from: codeboy2k
I was really disappointed to see it hand wired.
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

Quote
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

 I agree. It's best that facts guide us forward rather then going down the rabbit hole of subjectivity.

Wrong!.......Einstein did not sell or otherwise supply what he did as a "product" to those who wanted it and those who wanted to use it.
However, you did, and therefore you owe it to your customers to supply a product with a reasonable level of good workmanship within it. You wouldn't buy a Tv that, although worked, was cobbled together in the manner you have seen fit to put yours together.

If you really want to get away with it.......t would be better and clearer to your customers if you stated up front on your ads that you have used a prototyping assembly process & components to make up your device. The electronics community and your customers deserve it don't you think?

It's not subjective......there exists basic expectations in selling an electronics product to the public.....and this is one of them.

Help ma boab, have some pride in what you make man, have some pride!

Ian.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2016, 11:01:11 am by IanJ »
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Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #632 on: May 12, 2016, 07:17:26 pm »

You really have to try one. A number of our buyers have purchased more than one unit.

I bought one from you .... was so disappointed and gave it away ....
Here is my original picture again, if you need a reminder.

Were you disappointed in the performance? Or just how it looked? Form always follows function! If you'd rather have something that looks good than something that performs well, that's your personal preference. But performance is key.
Anything truly new begins as a thought.
 

Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #633 on: May 12, 2016, 07:28:27 pm »
I bought one from you .... was so disappointed and gave it away ....
Here is my original picture again, if you need a reminder.

I can't believe that photo!............I personally could not under any circumstances ever produce and sell something of that build quality (and yes, I sell my own Precision Voltage Source)......no matter how it performs. I couldn't even pot it then sell it knowing what lurked beneath.
Pride has gone out the door in exchange for dollars...............

Ian.

Making these standards apparently is seen as an easy way to make large sums of money.  That is not correct. If pride has gone out the door, it isn't in exchange for money! I pride myself on the supreme design and performance of the product! Nothing performs better in this market tier.

The build quality is supreme, because neatness pertains to form. Form always follows function. That is, if something doesn't function, neatness counts for nothing. Would you impugn Tesla's theories because of his messy penmanship?

We produce the best performing product of its kind and price. We offer an unconditional  return policy. We have never had a return on this product, which means you hated the product so much that you'd keep it rather than send it back for a full refund including shipping charges! That's quite a commentary!
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Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #634 on: May 12, 2016, 07:44:47 pm »
Quote from: codeboy2k
I was really disappointed to see it hand wired.
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

No, its like saying Einstein is bad at basic arithmetic. Soldering is the fundamental tool of the trade. To say you've built a unique and revolutionary voltage reference, solder like a 5 year old with no thumbs and claim that it doesn't matter is laughable.



Pure jealousy! You can't do better at design and performance, so you attack at the solder level: the only thing you can do better at. If the solder makes the connection, it's working. But the design and performance actually require talent. Think of how many people can solder and then how many people can design and implement top-performing products like we can. And don't say our product doesn't perform until you have data to back it up!

The neatness of our construction has vastly, improved over time, as all things will. But there are two kinds of people, those who create and those who destroy. Creation requires talent and skill, whereas destruction does not. I encourage everyone to create, because that makes a better world! 

If you can't use a product that performs better than any other in its price range, simply because just thinking about messy soldering causes you so much angst as to render misery of such magnitude that it cannot be tolerated, well, if that was me, I'd seek professional help. But that's just me.
Anything truly new begins as a thought.
 

Offline gilbenl

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #635 on: May 12, 2016, 08:33:56 pm »
Quote from: codeboy2k
I was really disappointed to see it hand wired.
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

No, its like saying Einstein is bad at basic arithmetic. Soldering is the fundamental tool of the trade. To say you've built a unique and revolutionary voltage reference, solder like a 5 year old with no thumbs and claim that it doesn't matter is laughable.


The neatness of our construction has vastly, improved over time, as all things will.


Fair enough. Will you post some pictures of your most recent units?
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #636 on: May 12, 2016, 08:58:03 pm »
Pure jealousy!

I think I can say, without fear of being gainsaid, that nobody here feels jealous of you.

Quote
You can't do better at design and performance, so you attack at the solder level: the only thing you can do better at.

Have a look through the voltage reference designs in this topic. There are clearly published designs, constructed versions of the same, and reams and reams of long term monitoring results against accepted standards. There are clearly many people here who can do better at design and can prove performance, and construct and solder cleanly and reliable too.

Quote
If the solder makes the connection, it's working.

Until it doesn't. Have you never heard of the concept of construction for reliability? Would you buy a car constructed as scrapily as your electronics are? Of course you wouldn't unless you only needed it to work for 10 or 20 miles.

Quote
But the design and performance actually require talent. Think of how many people can solder and then how many people can design and implement top-performing products like we can. And don't say our product doesn't perform until you have data to back it up!

And we say you shouldn't make such rarefied claims for your skills and products until you've got the data to prove it and are prepared to show it.

Quote
The neatness of our construction has vastly, improved over time, as all things will. But there are two kinds of people, those who create and those who destroy. Creation requires talent and skill, whereas destruction does not. I encourage everyone to create, because that makes a better world! 

If you can't use a product that performs better than any other in its price range, simply because just thinking about messy soldering causes you so much angst as to render misery of such magnitude that it cannot be tolerated, well, if that was me, I'd seek professional help. But that's just me.

Look, there's something more than a few hundred, perhaps even 1000 years of collected experience here telling you you're doing something wrong. Yet you still keep hand waving and telling us how brilliant you are and if we disagree you stoop to ad hominem attacks. Who is more likely to need to seek professional help - someone who refuses to accept the judgement of a large group of experienced engineers, or a large group of experienced engineers who all agree with each other about the facts of the matter? Would you please consider who is more likely to be right here and who is more likely to be, frankly, deluded?
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Offline MadTux

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #637 on: May 12, 2016, 09:02:07 pm »
If you have great pride in the nice and good construction of your device, why don't you then put inside images of your device into the ebay description?!?

Thereby each and every potential buyer could decide whether the great quality of the device is worth spending the little money, for which it is listed on ebay.

Over here in great bureaucratic EUdSSR, we have law called CE, which makes it mandatory to check every electronic device you sell by great EU bureaucrats. To be honest, everyone here likes it very much, because it makes it easy, simple and inexpensive to sell your homemade devices. But if I see great Calibratory D-105, I might see a reason, why this law exists  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Most interestingly, it is no longer called Calibratory D-105, but "10 V 10 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard, Nulled to Fluke 732A or 732B". Maybe the Calibratory D-105 name got too famous, for it's high quality. The seller is called kaysert .
Maybe this helps that every potential buyer sees the perfect quality of the device and buys it immediately  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: May 12, 2016, 09:27:08 pm by MadTux »
 
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Offline 6thimage

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #638 on: May 12, 2016, 09:30:05 pm »
But performance is key.

I think you are right there - but reliability is very important. When I look at the pictures of your reference it doesn't inspire me with confidence - it looks botched together and your product is worse for it, maybe not in performance, but in terms of selling it.

When I buy a product, for example a power supply, I will take it apart to look inside it, to see the quality of the build and the components used. From this you can get a rough feel for how long it will last and how reliable it will be. There is a good reason why Dave will always comments on the brand of capacitors in test gear (particularly in the power supply), its because it means something - he's not doing to be a dick.

If you improve the quality of the construction (you may have already), then people will be able to trust your reference more. In its current state, I would not buy your reference. In fact, if I was given one of your references for free I would not use it - I might play with it out of curiosity, but I would not trust it or rely on it.

This is the fundamental problem of having a product that looks hacked together. It is not choosing form over function, it is not trusting the function when the form is poor. If you would like it as an analogy, it is like comparing two cars, one that can travel at 90 mph and is in perfect condition, and one that can travel 110 mph but looks like it came out of a destruction derby, with no windows, every panel dented and none of the wheels pointing in the same direction. Whilst the second card might work better, and might work perfectly for now, you would not want to use it everyday (or at all), and you wouldn't trust it.

In addition to this, it is important how you market something. Statistics, which can be shown to be reliable, will always win over an audience. Saying your product was designed with the help of a deity, will always lose an audience, because it is a tactic that has been used for a very long time to sell snake oil. Therefore, if you claim it, no matter how much you believe it, people will assume you are trying to con them.

I shouldn't have to say this, but none of this is meant as an attack - if you improve the construction of your reference, and it performs the way you say it does, then you will be selling them like hot cakes.
 

Offline MadTux

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #639 on: May 12, 2016, 10:09:39 pm »
While I agree that OP might be mentally ill, I think this thread should not be locked as long as the crap is still up for sale and OP is happily screwing other dudes (mostly hobbyists, I suppose) for IMO rather large amounts of money.

 It would be like locking a thread about fake Chinese transistors with the argument that poor Chinese guy can't buy food if noone buys fake transistors. IMO this comparison fits quite well, because both things might cause even more damage than the price of the item itself.
 

Offline Macbeth

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #640 on: May 12, 2016, 11:58:49 pm »
I guess Bob Roohparvar is mentally ill too? I mean what other explanation could there be? He insists Batteriser works and even gets away with selling it without providing anything at all! Dave should obviously lock the Batteriser thread. Poor Bob, he's having a breakdown maybe?

At least Calibratory is selling his dodgy references, despite some of them even coming equipped with totally different voltage refs than stated! While Awesome14 is still selling his snake oil then there is absolutely no reason to block any threads on it. Quite the opposite.

I also doubt very much that he is mentally ill, and why that should give him a free pass even if he is?
 

Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #641 on: May 13, 2016, 12:24:42 am »
Quote from: codeboy2k
I was really disappointed to see it hand wired.
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

Quote
Kind of like telling Einstein he has bad penmanship.

 I agree. It's best that facts guide us forward rather then going down the rabbit hole of subjectivity.

Wrong!.......Einstein did not sell or otherwise supply what he did as a "product" to those who wanted it and those who wanted to use it.
However, you did, and therefore you owe it to your customers to supply a product with a reasonable level of good workmanship within it. You wouldn't buy a Tv that, although worked, was cobbled together in the manner you have seen fit to put yours together.

If you really want to get away with it.......t would be better and clearer to your customers if you stated up front on your ads that you have used a prototyping assembly process & components to make up your device. The electronics community and your customers deserve it don't you think?

It's not subjective......there exists basic expectations in selling an electronics product to the public.....and this is one of them.

Help ma boab, have some pride in what you make man, have some pride!

Ian.

I'm not getting away with anything. The construction doesn't bother the world minus those on this board.

Believe it or not, most of our purchasers just use the device as it was intended, without disassembling it, photographing it, having a fit over the soldering, and then posting petty criticism online.

My analogy using Einstein and his penmanship is a valid one, except to those who don't understand it

If you don't like the standard, send it back. I don't want my customers to pay for something they don't want.

Individual expectations of how an electronics device should or should not be constructed are irrelevant to how electronic devices should actually be constructed. Neatness is stressed in a shop environment, and workers derive self-esteem from tidiness and neatness. That is to the advantage of those they work for. 

But the world is bigger than all that. Sometimes the design provides  no solder pad, and sometimes there is no easy way around that. I provide a reliable product that outperforms everything else in its market tier. If you disagree, please provide experimental evidence.

I have pride in what we produce. We do the best we can in neatness of construction while maintaining capacitance low enough to prevent oscillation.  If you don't like the soldering, don't buy the product.

Prefab boards haven't worked correctly, so we're still trying. Until we get one that works, the units will be hand made. All of the Fluke 732As were hand-made!

The build neatness has vastly improved, so most of the solder-criticism is also irrelevant presently.

Impugning our products because of criteria irrelevant to performance, and criteria produced by methods currently unavoidable in the manufacturing process is flawed.(Would you have us sell and inferior product that looks better underneath, or a superior product that isn't as neatly constructed?)  If performance was equal, obviously I would choose prefab boards.

At first semester University I placed into graduate-level physics! There were a lot more students with neat class notes and neat soldering skills in first-semester undergraduate physics.

I don't come to this site to sell references. Although many people on this board have purchased from me. This board is irrelevant to our sales figures. Our facilities produce at maximum capacity, and we barely keep up with international demand. We are one of the few American companies that import raw material, and manufacture a product, integrating intellectual property to add value, products then to be sold abroad.

I actually just like to see the jealousy so present within the hearts of my unjust critics. Constructive critics please take no offense. Your feedback is much valued!

It's a kind of flattery. The deeper the jealousy, the more unattainable I have made my work, and the more I will find nitpicking over the minor but assailable aspects of our products.

I don't mean to criticize any member personally. I just want to make it clear that I read into the hearts of my critics, and I accept your flattery disguised as petty criticism.

It's what keeps me striving for even greater innovation and conquest. And it really only harms those who harbor the envy! You pride yourselves--some of you do--in producing an Internet link that will damage my enterprise.

If my unfair critics only realized that my associates see as I do--they see the jealousy and pettiness in some of the posts--that they are encouraged to purchase from a manufacturer who is willing to spend more money to hand-make the product, because this produces better performance for them.   

The question as to who has the more valid stance: the members of this board or the remainder of the world, lies simply in numbers. The only people who have a problem with our product are those on this board. The remainder of the world voices no objection, and they are even thankful and complimentary toward us!

I must also state that we have an unconditional 100% money-back guarantee offered to any purchaser who doesn't like the product for ANY reason. The money-back guarantee is not dependent on the product's performance! Even if the product performs as spec'ed, nad/or--against clear warnings--the outer labels have been tampered with, the guarantee applies. Yet, only one person in the history of the product ever indicated he/she desired a refund, and that was someone on this board who had opened the unit.

Not only did he/she open the unit, but operated it open, and thus encountered an error. This buyer was also a person who violates common expectations for decent conduct among Internet users! I wouldn't have expected less than that such a person do harm to himself simply to spite someone else. I'm just answering several threads in this reply. Most of it is irrelevant to the poster.

Finally, it appears some members think I am the OP for this discussion thread, and that I came to EEVBlog seeking assistance for my product. Then, I proved myself uncooperative, mean, deranged, inept; and so my product must be flawed.

I did not start the thread. I did not come here looking for assistance. I came in response to an email I received reporting unfair criticism of my products in this thread. I simply wanted to offer a fair defense in the face of what I believed was unfair criticism: people impugning my product without having tested it.
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Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #642 on: May 13, 2016, 12:30:31 am »

Quote from: gilbenl
Fair enough. Will you post some pictures of your most recent units?

Of course!
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Offline Awesome14

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #643 on: May 13, 2016, 12:59:35 am »
Pure jealousy!

I think I can say, without fear of being gainsaid, that nobody here feels jealous of you.

Quote
You can't do better at design and performance, so you attack at the solder level: the only thing you can do better at.

Have a look through the voltage reference designs in this topic. There are clearly published designs, constructed versions of the same, and reams and reams of long term monitoring results against accepted standards. There are clearly many people here who can do better at design and can prove performance, and construct and solder cleanly and reliable too.

Quote
If the solder makes the connection, it's working.

Until it doesn't. Have you never heard of the concept of construction for reliability? Would you buy a car constructed as scrapily as your electronics are? Of course you wouldn't unless you only needed it to work for 10 or 20 miles.

Quote
But the design and performance actually require talent. Think of how many people can solder and then how many people can design and implement top-performing products like we can. And don't say our product doesn't perform until you have data to back it up!

And we say you shouldn't make such rarefied claims for your skills and products until you've got the data to prove it and are prepared to show it.

Quote
The neatness of our construction has vastly, improved over time, as all things will. But there are two kinds of people, those who create and those who destroy. Creation requires talent and skill, whereas destruction does not. I encourage everyone to create, because that makes a better world! 

If you can't use a product that performs better than any other in its price range, simply because just thinking about messy soldering causes you so much angst as to render misery of such magnitude that it cannot be tolerated, well, if that was me, I'd seek professional help. But that's just me.

Look, there's something more than a few hundred, perhaps even 1000 years of collected experience here telling you you're doing something wrong. Yet you still keep hand waving and telling us how brilliant you are and if we disagree you stoop to ad hominem attacks. Who is more likely to need to seek professional help - someone who refuses to accept the judgement of a large group of experienced engineers, or a large group of experienced engineers who all agree with each other about the facts of the matter? Would you please consider who is more likely to be right here and who is more likely to be, frankly, deluded?

The unfair criticisms in this thread are due to about five people who think everyone who fails to explicitly disagree with them are in agreement. Nothing could be further from the truth. My unjust critics stand alone against the remainder of the members, and the remainder of the world!

Yes, I have seen some good designs on this board for DC references, but few that can provide equal performance to mine. My claims are tested, but you will notice I don't make many claims.  I constructed a 10VDC LTZ1000-based reference, and the best I could get out of it, after perhaps 50 prototype revisions, was 1ppm/degree C. Other than that, and the cost of the parts, it was about equivalent to the one we currently sell.

I've tried many approaches to find the one that works. I have the finest equipment available. I'm not trying to fool anyone. I report only what I directly observe.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2016, 01:05:32 am by Awesome14 »
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Offline timb

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Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #644 on: May 13, 2016, 11:18:26 am »
Yes, I have seen some good designs on this board for DC references, but few that can provide equal performance to mine. My claims are tested, but you will notice I don't make many claims.  I constructed a 10VDC LTZ1000-based reference, and the best I could get out of it, after perhaps 50 prototype revisions, was 1ppm/degree C. Other than that, and the cost of the parts, it was about equivalent to the one we currently sell.

Wait, you're claiming that your D-105 is on par with a well designed and constructed LTZ1000 based voltage reference?! Is that seriously what you just said?

If that's the case, then why do all these 7.5/8.5 digit DVMs use the LTZ1000? Fluke, Keysight, et al go through painstaking effort to not only design those reference circuits, but actually check each individual LTZ1000 and bin them accordingly. Why would they do that if they could just poorly solder some cheap reference onto a piece of perfboard and call it a day? Hmm?

Also, I'm *still* waiting for those raw CSV files of data from your "long term testing" that you promised 6-months ago.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic; e.g., Cheez Whiz, Hot Dogs and RF.
 

Online IanJ

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #645 on: May 13, 2016, 12:20:18 pm »
I'm not trying to fool anyone. I report only what I directly observe.

Send me one and I'll test.

- HP 3458a 8.5 digit DMM (calibrated less than a couple weeks ago).
- Keysight 34461 6.5 digit DMM with logging.
- Temperature environment chamber (controlled range 10deg below ambient to 35degC approx).
- Temperature controlled workshop 23degC +/- 1 degC.

I'll post results/graphs here straight out the box.

Ian.
Ian Johnston - Original designer of the PDVS2mini || Author of the free WinGPIB app.
Website - www.ianjohnston.com
YT Channel (electronics repairs & projects): www.youtube.com/user/IanScottJohnston, Twitter (X): https://twitter.com/IanSJohnston
 

Offline try

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #646 on: May 15, 2016, 10:31:55 pm »
Awesome14,

this claim is taken from your ebay ad:
Our testing indicates that under 100% uptime at 10M Ohm load, long-term drift is < 1.0ppm/120 days.

How is it possible that you suggest that your reference drifts less than 1ppm per 120 days when the manufacturer of the IC states "less than 20ppm over 1000h"?

One device you are nulling against, the Fluke 732A exhibits a transfer uncertainty of 6ppm over one year.
How come you know your references are within +-2ppm of the SI-Volt, when your master reference can drift 6ppm per year?

Regards
try

 

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #647 on: May 16, 2016, 11:06:24 am »
try,
Obviously you did not read the complete thread, it is well explained - starting on page 7 -

This is actually a very hilarious thread, probably the funniest one on eevblog.

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #648 on: May 17, 2016, 03:23:38 am »
I am a longtime lurker but after reading this long thread I am compelled to say that I was thoroughly entertained. godnut!!
 

Online IanJ

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Re: Calibratory D-105 DC Precision Voltage Reference Standard
« Reply #649 on: May 19, 2016, 10:56:48 am »
I'm not trying to fool anyone. I report only what I directly observe.

Send me one and I'll test.

- HP 3458a 8.5 digit DMM (calibrated less than a couple weeks ago).
- Keysight 34461 6.5 digit DMM with logging.
- Temperature environment chamber (controlled range 10deg below ambient to 35degC approx).
- Temperature controlled workshop 23degC +/- 1 degC.

I'll post results/graphs here straight out the box.

Ian.

Isn't biting........

Ok then, if anyone wants to send me theirs......I'll test it and of course return it afterwards.

PM me.

PS. I am in the UK.

Ian.
Ian Johnston - Original designer of the PDVS2mini || Author of the free WinGPIB app.
Website - www.ianjohnston.com
YT Channel (electronics repairs & projects): www.youtube.com/user/IanScottJohnston, Twitter (X): https://twitter.com/IanSJohnston
 


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