EEVblog #632 - Solar Roadways Are BULLSHIT!

[RGB255_0_0]

The Facebook page "Solar Freakin Bullshit" has a past about some panels appearing to have failed.

(https://m.facebook.com/groups/947009518667276?ref=m_notif&notif_t=group_activity)

So I jumped on the webcam to look for myself and .... nothing. Looks like the webcam is down.

Coincidence?  I think not...

I'm a member of that too 

Can't see shit.

[LabSpokane]

Can you post a clip of the Facebook post for those of us without Facebook?

I guess the Brusaws must keep up on the thread.  They don't seem to pay attention to their own data.

The cam is working fine for me, btw.

[Gary350z]

If you assume an LED life span of 50,000 hours, the LEDs will be dead in 5.7 years. So you will have to repave the streets and parking lots evey 5.7 years.

The LEDs will be driven hard so that they will be visable in the day time, and they will be heated up by the sun, and they will be running 24 hours per day. All of this will lead to a shorter life span.

(I have not heard this mentioned before, but I did not read all 48 pages of this thread. )

[EEVblog]

[ataradov]

Wow. That's beyond pathetic.

[Red Squirrel]

Lol wow the fail there is hilarious.  That cabinet lol.  I will not judge someone for using wood, not everyone has the tools for working with metal, but geeze, if you're going to use wood at least make it weather proof.  A proper top with drip edge and caulked joints everywhere and weather seal around the door would have gone a long way.   

[EEVblog]

Wow. That's beyond pathetic.

Yep, stunning that it's that bad.
Have a look at their previous Phase II test installation, at least that was really quite professional. (same pointless end result of course)
http://www.solarroadways.com/Research/Research

[Brumby]

The glare problem is astoundingly bad - and once it's been pointed out .... astoundingly obvious.

But that display cabinet is just ridiculous.

[RGB255_0_0]

 

[tszaboo]

Here we go. Different company, called Platio.
http://newatlas.com/platio-photovoltaic-solar-panel-paving/50549/
Recycled plastic base, tempered glass top. The company already was producing recycled plastic tiles.
http://www.platio.cc/en/

[james_s]

Well at least that makes a lot more sense than roadways. I'm still highly skeptical of the merits, but my patio does spend a large majority of its time relatively empty, which is not something I can say about the roads. Also it doesn't need light up road markings and there are no vehicles driving over it so maybe that would be a practical application if I had already covered my roof in panels.

[Delta]

Still stupid.

Until every square metre of unused open space and rooftop is covered with panels, this will never ever be a sensible option.

[james_s]

Well, comparing to solar roadways, the bar is low.

[EEVblog]

 

[Domagoj T]

And some news from the other side of the globe:
Somebody has stolen a part of the solar road.
https://techcrunch.com/2018/01/05/someone-stole-a-piece-of-chinas-new-solar-panel-paved-road-less-than-a-week-after-it-opened/

[grumpydoc]

And some news from the other side of the globe:
Somebody has stolen a part of the solar road.
https://techcrunch.com/2018/01/05/someone-stole-a-piece-of-chinas-new-solar-panel-paved-road-less-than-a-week-after-it-opened/

Wow, not only can the Chinese prototype "warm up in order to melt snow and ice" - a feature proven to be nuts with the BOOE*
 analysis system, but also has "coils that can charge electric cars as they drive over it".

Rational thought really has taken a holiday with these things hasn't it?

Average car length - hmm, say 2.5m. Amount of time available for transfer as car passes that 2.5m stretch - at 50km/hr that would be (2.5/50000*3600)=180ms. Power needed to travel 2.5m (assuming 300Wh/mile) 1678watt seconds - to get that to the car every 180ms - 10kW** (give or take). Given a minimum separation between any coil in the road and in the car of 30cm this seems a tall order, especially if we add in the fact that the car is moving.

I realise that it might be useful to supply only a portion of the energy used for driving to extend range but the claim in the piece is that the system can "charge electric cars as they drive over it" which would need energy to be supplied for motion and then additional energy for charging.

* Back of old Envelope

** Sanity check - does an EV need 10kW continuously? Yes - look at it another way. A Model S with an 85kWh pack has a range of 300+ miles (but probably not too much "+"). Assume constant 50mph = 6 hours to drain the battery. 85kWh/6h = 14kW

[Domagoj T]

Wow, not only can the Chinese prototype "warm up in order to melt snow and ice" - a feature proven to be nuts with the BOOE*
 analysis system, but also has "coils that can charge electric cars as they drive over it".

Rational thought really has taken a holiday with these things hasn't it?

Average car length - hmm, say 2.5m. Amount of time available for transfer as car passes that 2.5m stretch - at 50km/hr that would be (2.5/50000*3600)=180ms. Power needed to travel 2.5m (assuming 300Wh/mile) 1678watt seconds - to get that to the car every 180ms - 10kW** (give or take). Given a minimum separation between any coil in the road and in the car of 30cm this seems a tall order, especially if we add in the fact that the car is moving.

Well, there is (was??) a wirelessly powered bus in Korea.
https://www.wired.com/2013/08/induction-charged-buses/

The article gives us some numbers:
"With a 6.7-inch gap between the road and the bus, there's 85 percent charging efficiency at 100 kW from the road to the bus.
The charge plates under the road generally take up only between 5 and 15 percent of the total route, and remain switched off until an induction-capable bus approaches. "

Also, my day job is building a model train layout in H0 scale (1:87) and on it we are implementing a road system where cars, buses and trucks will be powered wirelessly, (batteries are not giving us the performance we want, especially on the small passenger cars and aren't nearly able to last entire day, which is needed when we have visitors).
Of course, on such a small system we don't really care about the efficiency of the system and the power lost in transmission, which is horrible, to be honest. We just need the functionality. Also, we have just a few mm gap between the coils, something that can't be achieved on real cars.

[grumpydoc]

Well, there is (was??) a wirelessly powered bus in Korea.
https://www.wired.com/2013/08/induction-charged-buses/

Neat

[glarsson]

Somebody has stolen a part of the solar road.
https://techcrunch.com/2018/01/05/someone-stole-a-piece-of-chinas-new-solar-panel-paved-road-less-than-a-week-after-it-opened/

Why? Too small to use on someones driveway. A competitor doing some industrial espionage?

[james_s]

Probably someone who saw something they could steal so they took it. Some people will steal anything that isn't nailed down, and some things that are. Wouldn't surprise me if it was teenagers who wanted a cool toy to play with.

[ataradov]

Probably someone who saw something they could steal so they took it. Some people will steal anything that isn't nailed down, and some things that are. Wouldn't surprise me if it was teenagers who wanted a cool toy to play with.

But this is indicative of a real problem with BS projects like this. You theoretically have miles of unsupervised high tech stuff. Ripe for stealing and recycling.

[ivaylo]

Probably someone who saw something they could steal so they took it. Some people will steal anything that isn't nailed down, and some things that are. Wouldn't surprise me if it was teenagers who wanted a cool toy to play with.

But this is indicative of a real problem with BS projects like this. You theoretically have miles of unsupervised high tech stuff. Ripe for stealing and recycling.

Not a fan of solar roads, but so unsupervised are the miles of copper and aluminum which bring you power and communications. In the civilized world this shouldn't be a problem.

[ataradov]

In the civilized world this shouldn't be a problem.

Yeah, right. All that stuff is barely accessible. And accessible stuff gets stolen all the time for copper. And that's in the middle of silicon valley. Homeless people disable traffic lights for copper to recycle.

[jonovid]

sheet of radioactive materials will melt snow and ice, just stay in your car at all times 
it may even glow in the dark.

[glarsson]

Probably someone who saw something they could steal so they took it. Some people will steal anything that isn't nailed down, and some things that are. Wouldn't surprise me if it was teenagers who wanted a cool toy to play with.

The solar panels are below transparent concrete and the missing piece was "neatly cut" by a "professional team" according to the article.