Pace ADS200 soldering station

[PACE-Worldwide]

I’ve been looking for a good station for a new robotics program.  Since these will be used by numerous kids who are new to soldering, they have to be reliable and easy to use. I don’t mind paying for quality, but, since we need multiple stations, the tips need to be be durable and reasonably priced. It came down to the Hakko fx888d or Pace ads200.

I bought an ADS200, it appeared to be overshooting the temp, but then I saw Dave’s video. Hopefully the new firmware will address this.

Now I just need to get some different tips, I have a lot of projects stacked up to solder and test.

Thanks for the excellent forum, it is invaluable. I finally created an account so I can hopefully give something back!

The new "1-4" firmware should resolve the display overshoot issue. I'll be send a new Chip out next week.

Thanks,

Aaron

[Shock]

I’ve been looking for a good station for a new robotics program.  Since these will be used by numerous kids who are new to soldering, they have to be reliable and easy to use. I don’t mind paying for quality, but, since we need multiple stations, the tips need to be be durable and reasonably priced. It came down to the Hakko fx888d or Pace ads200.

Congrats PixieWrestler, I think you made a good choice. The ADS200 has the extra power availability, doing connectors or any high thermal mass joints will be a breeze. As the kids improve in skill, perfect iron for fine smd work and good ergonomics for small hands (and adults).

What country is your program based in?

[PixieWrestler]

Congrats PixieWrestler, I think you made a good choice. The ADS200 has the extra power availability, doing connectors or any high thermal mass joints will be a breeze. As the kids improve in skill, perfect iron for fine smd work and good ergonomics for small hands (and adults).

What country is your program based in?

Thanks Shock!  We are in the USA. I am very impressed with Pace’s response to the minor nuisance of the temp display.
For the first unit, I didn’t get the auto setback upgrade, I can’t decide if that is something we’ll need for the additional units.

[Shock]

Thanks Shock!  We are in the USA. I am very impressed with Pace’s response to the minor nuisance of the temp display. For the first unit, I didn’t get the auto setback upgrade, I can’t decide if that is something we’ll need for the additional units.

It just gives you more flexibility for stop/start soldering. Now with the 1-4 firmware it's configurable so that instant setback can be set to go low temp immediately as you return the iron. The other advantage is you pull the iron out of the stand and it tells the station it's go time again (as opposed to cleaning the tip or pressing a button). People who always tin their tips properly before returning the iron to the stand might prefer it as well.

It's not essential but you could always try it and if you don't like the stand tethered to the station disconnect or remove the cable later.

[labjr]

Does anyone know if current stock at TEquipment contains the latest firmware?

[labjr]

I called TEquipment. They confirmed with Pace that the recent shipment shipment of ADS200 with instant setback stand DOES contain the most recent firmware.

BTW their website shows no stock but they actually have 16 units. Maybe call to confirm if you wish to place an order.

 

[PACE-Worldwide]

I called TEquipment. They confirmed with Pace that the recent shipment shipment of ADS200 with instant setback stand DOES contain the most recent firmware.

BTW their website shows no stock but they actually have 16 units. Maybe call to confirm if you wish to place an order.

Sorry for the delay in answering this ... was at 2 Trade Shows the last 2 weeks, so I've been shirking my duties. In any case, I called TEquipment this morning, and they confirmed that they only have the newest versions of ADS200. So all the stock they have at the present time should have Firmware Rev 1-4.

Again, please message me if you need the latest firmware Rev 1-4, and I'll ship it out.

Thanks again,

Aaron

[hrbngr]

labjr/Aaron,

thanks for the updates on TEquipment inventory for the newest firmwar ADS200s. A question for the those that purchase from them, do u know if there will be any sort of Black Friday sale (based on previous years) that might surpass the regular forum discount?

[Shock]

labjr/Aaron,

thanks for the updates on TEquipment inventory for the newest firmwar ADS200s. A question for the those that purchase from them, do u know if there will be any sort of Black Friday sale (based on previous years) that might surpass the regular forum discount?

Aaron mentioned a while ago that the margins are pretty tight on the Pace ADS200, but you could try hitting Evan up from Tequipment.net who is the on the forum here, to see if there is any special above our regular 6% off and free shipping he can do. Who knows he might be able to throw in a free tip or something.

Evans username on the forums is tequipment I think he has email notifications on so should see he has been messaged.

[joeqsmith]

How are the tweezers coming along?   The blue rubber on the ones I use are now shot.  The rubber has started to fall apart and it's very sticky.   I looked on PACE's site along with Jensen Tools to get a new set and it seems that no parts are available for the tweezers beyond the tips.  At $200, I would expect to be able to maintain them.   Hope when/if you produce tweezers for the new station, you keep that same size and feel plus offer replacement parts.   

[PACE-Worldwide]

How are the tweezers coming along?   The blue rubber on the ones I use are now shot.  The rubber has started to fall apart and it's very sticky.   I looked on PACE's site along with Jensen Tools to get a new set and it seems that no parts are available for the tweezers beyond the tips.  At $200, I would expect to be able to maintain them.   Hope when/if you produce tweezers for the new station, you keep that same size and feel plus offer replacement parts.

You're right about the lack of replacement parts for the MT-100. But we do have replacement grips for your handpiece. It's called the MT-100 Lead-Free Soft Grips PN 1119-0177-P2 ($41.47 pair) and they only come in "lead-free green" color as we can no supply the original blue colored grip.

We are still working on an ADS200-compatible thermal tweezer that will be introduced at late January's IPC Apex Show in San Diego.

I'll pass your comments on to the PACE team.

Thanks,

Aaron

[Shock]

Just upgraded the firmware of my ADS200 stations to 1-4 thanks Aaron and Pace!

[knapik]

Looks like I finally got my new toy in the mail

[VEGETA]

Just a simple question guys, what is the benefit of this one over Hakko fx-888d?

I got the hakko as a present from my brother which is gonna replace my beloved Chinese Yihua 908 station... I wonder what are the benefits of this Pace one over the famous hakko? remember the huge price difference.

[helius]

Just a simple question guys, what is the benefit of this one over Hakko fx-888d?

The ADS200 uses tip-heater cartridges, where the heater and temperature sensor are built into the tip. The cartridges are only made by Pace, but they are quite affordable compared to some brands ($11 each). Replacing cartridges is very fast as they plug into the handle.

The Hakko FX888D tips are separate from the heater, so the control loop is looser. This has different tradeoffs, for the tips are cheaper and available from multiple vendors in different countries (the same tips as the old Hakko 936). Hakko sells tips for $9.50 each, and they are less from other companies (Plato sells them for less than $5 each). The heat recovery is slower and replacing tips is more work (you need to loosen a nut and remove a sleeve to take the tip off). The Hakko has half the heating power, with 65W compared to 120W, so it can't perform as well on boards with very large heatsinks. For most jobs the Hakko is suitable, some users just prefer higher performance.

[Shock]

I wonder what are the benefits of this Pace one over the famous hakko?

The Hakko FX888D is 65W and plastic construction with low cost tips. It has a fairly small desk footprint.

The Pace ADS200 is twice as powerful at 120W and has far superior tip heating/accuracy/swapping/work distance/power saving features. It is all metal construction, easy to operate and has an ergonomic cool touch handle. Uses cartridge tips which contain the heater, which are also comparatively low cost and well under the competition. Pace stations are designed to take additional handpieces, such as the tweezers they are releasing next year.

The difference between the two (and even the Hakko FX951, 70W station) is quite noticeable. They both solder but even if on a limited budget the Pace ADS200 is the way to go and worth saving up the extra $100 for in my opinion.

[VEGETA]

I wonder what are the benefits of this Pace one over the famous hakko?

The Hakko FX888D is 65W and plastic construction with low cost tips. It has a fairly small desk footprint.

The Pace ADS200 is twice as powerful at 120W and has far superior tip heating/accuracy/swapping/work distance/power saving features. It is all metal construction, easy to operate and has an ergonomic cool touch handle. Uses cartridge tips which contain the heater, which are also comparatively low cost and well under the competition. Pace stations are designed to take additional handpieces, such as the tweezers they are releasing next year.

The difference between the two (and even the Hakko FX951, 70W station) is quite noticeable. They both solder but even if on a limited budget the Pace ADS200 is the way to go and worth saving up the extra $100 for in my opinion.

Well, for me and many others, I don't do heavy soldering jobs thus Yihua 908 did the job nicely for me for more than a year now. I wasted the chisel tip which is what I use most, thus I can buy 5 of it for 2$.

However, I always wanted a Hakko fx-888D and finally my brother gave it to me as a gift. I could buy it though since it is just 90$ but shipping was very expensive to Jordan. He resides in Dubai so he got it cheaply and just took it with him to Jordan.

So, it is not worth extra 120$ to get the Pace one in my opinion... for me of course.

[Shock]

Looks like I finally got my new toy in the mail

Congrats! Nothing like a new firestick to bash around
I ended up with a few extra tips to try out and have some double ups. If you want a couple send me a PM and I'll put them in a small post bag for you.

[knapik]

Looks like I finally got my new toy in the mail

Congrats! Nothing like a new firestick to bash around
I ended up with a few extra tips to try out and have some double ups. If you want a couple send me a PM and I'll put them in a small post bag for you.

Unfortunately, for some reason it took Mektronics a month to actually ship it to me. I also asked if it was possible to get a discount on the ~$550 list price, and I had to go through some convoluted process where they changed the price on the website itself temporarily just so I could buy it and then change it back after I did. All that and a few days later it went on sale for the same price

Are you sure you're willing to just give away your extra tips to me?

[Shock]

Are you sure you're willing to just give away your extra tips to me?

Yeah I have a few spares and some consumables as well. I'll send you a PM.

[salavat]

Aaron,

I was very excited to learn about new ADS200 station, which would be excellent price/performance device. (I think) pricing is important in the ADS200 offering, thus I am curious to what extent you have influence over the pricing of your distributors?

The reason for asking is that your Russian distributor sells ADS200 with standard tool stand for 364 USD at current exchange rate, which is way off from European pricing at your Finnish distributor, and 40 % above the tequipment pricing (without 6% discount for eevblog members).... at that price point (I believe) ADS200 with instant set back stand is getting quite close to JBC compact station....

[PACE-Worldwide]

Aaron,

I was very excited to learn about new ADS200 station, which would be excellent price/performance device. (I think) pricing is important in the ADS200 offering, thus I am curious to what extent you have influence over the pricing of your distributors?

The reason for asking is that your Russian distributor sells ADS200 with standard tool stand for 364 USD at current exchange rate, which is way off from European pricing at your Finnish distributor, and 40 % above the tequipment pricing (without 6% discount for eevblog members).... I that price point (I believe) ADS200 with instant set back stand is getting quite close to JBC compact station....

I would say PACE has about a 25% influence over pricing, which isn’t much. In the US, it is actually illegal to dictate prices to distributors. It is considered to be a form of price-fixing. We can “highly recommend” or “strongly suggest” that a distributor lower their prices if we think they are gouging customers. But distributors set their own pricing, and usually do so based on a set discount PACE provides against a published list price. I don’t know why distributors in Russia charge more for PACE product as I am not directly involved in that side of the company, but I suspect their costs (shipping/duties/tariffs, etc) are far higher than Tequipment’s, a distributor located about a 6 hour drive from PACE’s factory in NC. It would not surprise me if the shipping cost of an ADS200 box were US$75-$100 by the time it gets to Russia, whereas it’s only $4/box for Tequipment, who buy at least 50-100 units at a time. The Finnish distributor is likely willing to make less margin than the Russian distributor but that's just opinion, I really don't know.

[salavat]

I would say PACE has about a 25% influence over pricing, which isn’t much. In the US, it is actually illegal to dictate prices to distributors. It is considered to be a form of price-fixing. We can “highly recommend” or “strongly suggest” that a distributor lower their prices if we think they are gouging customers. But distributors set their own pricing, and usually do so based on a set discount PACE provides against a published list price. I don’t know why distributors in Russia charge more for PACE product as I am not directly involved in that side of the company, but I suspect their costs (shipping/duties/tariffs, etc) are far higher than Tequipment’s, a distributor located about a 6 hour drive from PACE’s factory in NC. It would not surprise me if the shipping cost of an ADS200 box were US$75-$100 by the time it gets to Russia, whereas it’s only $4/box for Tequipment, who buy at least 50-100 units at a time. The Finnish distributor is likely willing to make less margin than the Russian distributor but that's just opinion, I really don't know.

Aaron, thanks for reply. For your information - there is 0 % (zero) custom duty on soldering stations (just checked). Of course, there is a VAT 18%, which is neutral, since it is paid by importer on the border, then distributor (importer) is reimbursed by customers who pay 18% VAT but from the retail price (which is obviously higher).

As transportation costs are concerned - I am (as private individual) pay something like 14 USD per kilo for air delivery, for business customers carrying loads and boxes, pricing starting from 3 USD per kilo (real figure).

So, probably, you can figure out what makes Russian prices so interesting)).

[labjr]

I'm wondering why the 1/8" 30 Degree Chisel tips are more expensive than the other tips in both the Standard and the Ultra Series?

[PACE-Worldwide]

I'm wondering why the 1/8" 30 Degree Chisel tips are more expensive than the other tips in both the Standard and the Ultra Series?

The short answer is they cost us more to manufacture. Standard 1/8"/3.18mm 30° Chisel Tip PN 1130-0051-P1 and it's Ultra-Performance version PN 1131-0051-P1 were originally custom created for a specific customer, and I think we had to perform some secondary operation (like extra plating) to manufacture the tips to specification. It other cases, it's simply harder to plate and manufacture the tip (Knife-Tips and ultra-fine point tips are an example), so those cost more too, which will be reflected in a higher list price. In general, if the tip shape requires a secondary operation, the price will go up.

Aaron