Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[m k]

Remember these:

What would one use these for?

Ummmm... testicular homicide on a whole volleyball team...?

Had to add another tap

Is the room a single phase only?

[capt bullshot]

Is the room a single phase only?

No, got a proper IEC 60309 16A outlet here. Haven't done a setup using this yet.
For testing they were connected to the Fluke 5101, all voltage inputs in parallel.

[Robert763]

mnem

This is of course of particular interest in audio equipment, especially Hi-Fi gear, where you certainly don't want to introduce any extra noise on the circuit and there is nothing more annoying than having mains hum coming from your speakers.

But if it's a coupling capacitor anything in the frequency range of interest on the "outer" plate will be coupled to the "inner" plate and appear at the output. Also The is actually touching the capacitor over a large area to make any signal. Not an actual use case.

[Vince]

I am hoping to get soon a large cutting mat, A3 or A2 size, as well as a 50cm long, wide SS ruler, and a sharp blade/scalpel.

Pros have a ruler with a slider bar.
https://www.sprintis.eu/en/Book-binding-supplies/Bookbinding-tools/Rulers/Safety-cutting-ruler-55-cm.html

Used mat is a homogeneous something for public floors.
Not totally hard but still very rugged and can stand the blade for long.

Wow they also sell cutting mats, nice large A2 size ones for only 15 Euros ?!
Didn't think these things were that affordable ! Gonna get one soon then !!! 

[tautech]

I am hoping to get soon a large cutting mat, A3 or A2 size, as well as a 50cm long, wide SS ruler, and a sharp blade/scalpel.

Pros have a ruler with a slider bar.
https://www.sprintis.eu/en/Book-binding-supplies/Bookbinding-tools/Rulers/Safety-cutting-ruler-55-cm.html

Used mat is a homogeneous something for public floors.
Not totally hard but still very rugged and can stand the blade for long.

Wow they also sell cutting mats, nice large A2 size ones for only 15 Euros ?!
Didn't think these things were that affordable ! Gonna get one soon then !!! 

Check out sewing and quilting shops for even larger ones.

[bd139]

I am hoping to get soon a large cutting mat, A3 or A2 size, as well as a 50cm long, wide SS ruler, and a sharp blade/scalpel.

Pros have a ruler with a slider bar.
https://www.sprintis.eu/en/Book-binding-supplies/Bookbinding-tools/Rulers/Safety-cutting-ruler-55-cm.html

Used mat is a homogeneous something for public floors.
Not totally hard but still very rugged and can stand the blade for long.

Wow they also sell cutting mats, nice large A2 size ones for only 15 Euros ?!
Didn't think these things were that affordable ! Gonna get one soon then !!! 

Be very very careful buying cutting mats. About 50% of them are absolute garbage in recent years. Look for self sealing ones which have a white plastic layer and green layer on top AND bottom. Some of the really cheap ones, including depressingly RS Pro branded ones you can cut nearly all the way through with a scalpel and do not self heal at all.

Edit: Impex ones are generally reliable. Well here anyway.

[Vince]

I am hoping to get soon a large cutting mat, A3 or A2 size, as well as a 50cm long, wide SS ruler, and a sharp blade/scalpel.

Pros have a ruler with a slider bar.
https://www.sprintis.eu/en/Book-binding-supplies/Bookbinding-tools/Rulers/Safety-cutting-ruler-55-cm.html

Used mat is a homogeneous something for public floors.
Not totally hard but still very rugged and can stand the blade for long.

Wow they also sell cutting mats, nice large A2 size ones for only 15 Euros ?!
Didn't think these things were that affordable ! Gonna get one soon then !!! 

Check out sewing and quilting shops for even larger ones.

Yes I saw that, that same website has some sewing mats, 150x100cm !! 
Way too large to fit on my bench... and way too expensive as well, at 150 Euros !

https://www.sprintis.eu/en/Office-supplies/Cutting-mat/Large-cutting-mat-for-sewing-150-x-100-cm-self-healing-with-grid.html

I think I might go for the A1 size, 90x60. So same depth as the bench, and 90cm wide, so lots of room to play.
Twice the size of A2 but a bit less than twice the price, so good deal to me.

[Vince]

Be very very careful buying cutting mats. About 50% of them are absolute garbage in recent years. Look for self sealing ones which have a white plastic layer and green layer on top AND bottom. Some of the really cheap ones, including depressingly RS Pro branded ones you can cut nearly all the way through with a scalpel and do not self heal at all.

Edit: Impex ones are generally reliable. Well here anyway.

Thanks, learned something.

That makes their mats even more desirable :

https://www.sprintis.eu/en/Office-supplies/Cutting-mat/Cutting-mat-A1-90-x-60-cm-self-healing-with-grid-green-black.html

They say 3mm thick, 5 layers, self healing and a hard core.

Sounds good then... 26 Euros for an A1 size, printed on both sides as well (black background mat on the other side), to cater for changing colour moods ! 

[bd139]

I wouldn't recommend covering the bench with a cutting mat. They are thermoplastic and get screwed up and damaged really easily, get solder blims all over them and then you have to live with it scratching up your arms forever. They are a sacrificial surface to prevent damage to your bench.

For basic protection, a bit of discarded packaging can't be beaten as used here:



I'd just keep an amazon box or two around, flatten it and chuck it on the bench as required. For actual cutting, get something sensible like an A3 mat and use that and only use it for cutting because it'll get screwed up otherwise.

This sort of stuff (that was glorious building that kit  ):



The only really acceptable matting is ESD matting and back in the day that used to get a cardboard box chucked on top of it as well to stop it getting burned and scratched up

Edit found another picture which probably explains it better:

[Specmaster]

@Vince, not sure why you are having trouble with third party tapes, I use them all the time and have done so for years and have never had any issues whatsoever. I can only assume that the little cardboard wheel locking tab was inserted on the wrong side of the tape. You are only supposed to remove any slack tape that has unravelled during transit. From your description of the event, it would seem that you were actually adding more and more slack which will of course make the black tape separate from the label tape itself.

Yes I probably caused the problem when I was trying to make sense of this warning that I did not expect. I know better now, so I am hoping the remaining two tapes will work just fine. Still does not explain why you have to fuck around with the tape before using it, when my OEM tape did give no warning, required no action from you, no baby sitting... just plug and play.  So these third party tapes still have room for improvement if they want to be taken seriously and strictly identical to the OEM ones. Still, a bit of winding is more than acceptable "work" given the tape is literally 3+ times cheaper than the OEM one.

Only issue I have with Brother labellers is that one of mine needs a new cutter and because of regulations, they are not available in the UK. They are in the USA and after approaching a number of sellers about shipping to the UK, they have all declined stating that cutters are on the prohibited list, 

What a wonderful world we live in.... a kid you can buy a couple assault riffle down the street at the local super market, no questions asked.. but you are forbidden to by a cutter for your printer... I guess the assault riffle is harmless but the printer cutter could be used for a mass murder in a flea market. Luckily there is no shortage of TEA friends in the US to send you a cutter 

Yeah I could ask if anyone will do that for me, but TBH, I'm not that bothered as it is a duplicate printer I got on eBay for the price of a coffee and that is the only issue with it. The cutters have a finite number of cuts before they no longer will perform their function 

This printer I purchased as a donor if required, and besides I might come across another at the right price for less than the cost of a new cutter.

I just remove the cardboard warning label from the replacement tapes and pop the cartridge in the printer, never have bothered with rewinding, and never had any troubles either.

[Vince]

I wouldn't recommend covering the bench with a cutting mat. They are thermoplastic and get screwed up and damaged really easily, get solder blims all over them and then you have to live with it scratching up your arms forever. They are a sacrificial surface to prevent damage to your bench.

For basic protection, a bit of discarded packaging can't be beaten as used here:



I'd just keep an amazon box or two around, flatten it and chuck it on the bench as required. For actual cutting, get something sensible like an A3 mat and use that and only use it for cutting because it'll get screwed up otherwise.

This sort of stuff (that was glorious building that kit  ):



The only really acceptable matting is ESD matting and back in the day that used to get a cardboard box chucked on top of it as well to stop it getting burned and scratched up

Edit found another picture which probably explains it better:

OK OK.... my bench being OSB it doesn't need protecting... that's what I like about it. I can drag my old 30kg boat anchors on it all day long, I don't have to care...

OK so looks like the best to do as you said is get a smaller A3 mat and use it only for cutting.

I will have to find something else to cover my OSB bench. Main problem is the rough surface and non-solid / uneven "colour" which both combine to make SMD components hide on the bench, and solder blobs, and other bits of wires, strands, whatever tiny crap, hide and made difficult to sweep off the surface. So my "requirements" are a smooth surface with an even/solid colour/appearance, for good contrast/visibility of small object. If the ESD mat is too fragile that's bad indeed 

So might have to stick with wood for its resilience and care-free compatibility so to speak. I don't know, cover the OSB with thin poplar plywood. Sanded, finished, resanded, refinished... with a few coats and fine sanding, might do it. Or a thin layer of MDF, but it's not as sexy and it's ugly brown. I find the light coloured poplar ply wood much more qualitative / pleasing to look at and touch. To each their own I guess...

[bd139]

OK OK.... my bench being OSB it doesn't need protecting... that's what I like about it. I can drag my old 30kg boat anchors on it all day long, I don't have to care...

OK so looks like the best to do as you said is get a smaller A3 mat and use it only for cutting.

I will have to find something else to cover my OSB bench. Main problem is the rough surface and non-solid "colour" which both combine to make SMD components hide on the bench, and solder blobs, and other bits of wire, strands, whatever tiny crap, hide and made difficult to sweep off the surface. So my "requirements" is a smooth surface with an even/solid colour/appearance, for good contrast/visibility of small object. If the ESD mat is too fragile that's bad indeed 

So might have to be stick with wood for its resilience and care-free compatibility so to speak. I don't know, cover the OSB with thin poplar plywood. Sanded, finished, resanded, refinished... with a few coats and fine sanding, might do it. Or a thin layer of MDF, but it's not as sexy and it's ugly brown. Find the light coloured poplar ply wood much more qualitative / pleasing. To each their own I guess...

Lighter wood textures are good. Everything shows up that colour fine.

I'm using a cheap IKEA Bekant desk as a bench with the surface that came with it. Still in pretty good condition after 3 years or so. This is basically a chunk of crappy particle board with a fake oak veneer (probably plastic / paper) and acrylic lacquer. It has one gash out of it where I dropped a Cisco router on it (RIP) but otherwise looks like new. Easy to sweep, all parts show up on it and you can wipe it down with some generic kitchen spray and some paper towels when it gets disgusting. This is also my work desk so I've been kind to it intentionally which helps.

Also importantly, lighter colours make the bench corner less depressing!

Probably some industrial veneer would do it

[Vince]

The cutters have a finite number of cuts before they no longer will perform their function 

Uh..... you are scaring me... do you mean that the printer deliberately decided to stop working the cutter once it has decided that you have printed XX number of labels ?! Like the cheap inkjet printers that will refuse to print if your cartridge has printed XX pages, regardless of how much ink is left in that cartridge ?! 
So Brother has brought this "philosophy" to label printers as well ?! 

I just remove the cardboard warning label from the replacement tapes and pop the cartridge in the printer, never have bothered with rewinding, and never had any troubles either.

OK good to know. I was trying to be a good boy and follow instructions... but made it worse instead. I should just have ignored it as you do ! Oh well, made for a fun tear down and repair, so not too bothered retrospectively ! 

[Specmaster]

The cutters have a finite number of cuts before they no longer will perform their function 

Uh..... you are scaring me... do you mean that the printer deliberately decided to stop working the cutter once it has decided that you have printed XX number of labels ?! Like the cheap inkjet printers that will refuse to print if your cartridge has printed XX pages, regardless of how much ink is left in that cartridge ?! 
So Brother has brought this "philosophy" to label printers as well ?! 

I just remove the cardboard warning label from the replacement tapes and pop the cartridge in the printer, never have bothered with rewinding, and never had any troubles either.

OK good to know. I was trying to be a good boy and follow instructions... but made it worse instead. I should just have ignored it as you do ! Oh well, made for a fun tear down and repair, so not too bothered retrospectively ! 

No, the printer still works just fine, but will not cut the tape, just marks it slightly, nothing that a small pair of scissors won't fix , it does however mean that some tape is wasted each time, but a small price to pay when the clone tapes are so much cheaper.

When it comes to protecting my desk / bench, I use a gaming mouse mat, a sort of rubberised material 80cm x 30cm with a RGB electroluminescent light around the edge, about £6 from Aliexpress which has stood up well to soldering and all kinds of abuse really and if I'm going to be loads of soldering etc, I have one of those silicon desk mats that I lay over the top. I've had the silicon mat now for about 5 years and it still is like new, it just takes what ever I throw at it, in its stride, no worries, no damage.

[med6753]

OK OK.... my bench being OSB it doesn't need protecting... that's what I like about it. I can drag my old 30kg boat anchors on it all day long, I don't have to care...

OK so looks like the best to do as you said is get a smaller A3 mat and use it only for cutting.

I will have to find something else to cover my OSB bench. Main problem is the rough surface and non-solid "colour" which both combine to make SMD components hide on the bench, and solder blobs, and other bits of wire, strands, whatever tiny crap, hide and made difficult to sweep off the surface. So my "requirements" is a smooth surface with an even/solid colour/appearance, for good contrast/visibility of small object. If the ESD mat is too fragile that's bad indeed 

So might have to be stick with wood for its resilience and care-free compatibility so to speak. I don't know, cover the OSB with thin poplar plywood. Sanded, finished, resanded, refinished... with a few coats and fine sanding, might do it. Or a thin layer of MDF, but it's not as sexy and it's ugly brown. Find the light coloured poplar ply wood much more qualitative / pleasing. To each their own I guess...

Lighter wood textures are good. Everything shows up that colour fine.

I'm using a cheap IKEA Bekant desk as a bench with the surface that came with it. Still in pretty good condition after 3 years or so. This is basically a chunk of crappy particle board with a fake oak veneer (probably plastic / paper) and acrylic lacquer. It has one gash out of it where I dropped a Cisco router on it (RIP) but otherwise looks like new. Easy to sweep, all parts show up on it and you can wipe it down with some generic kitchen spray and some paper towels when it gets disgusting. This is also my work desk so I've been kind to it intentionally which helps.

Also importantly, lighter colours make the bench corner less depressing!

Probably some industrial veneer would do it

Or go super cheap like me with plain old poster board. Surprisingly durable but when it starts to look like crap toss it away and put down a new one.

[vk6zgo]

The P-3/CP-140 is based upon the Lockheed Electra commercial airliner which had limited success.

iSTR the early Electras had an unfortunate tendency to shed their wings in flight.

Not a great handicap when your competition is Viscounts!

I'd have thought the Comet 1s were a better comparison

I'm not aware of any real deficits in Viscounts, but that is absence of knowlege, not knowledge of absence. (And no, I can't even be bothered to goole it!)

Way back, I flew from Port Hedland to Perth in a Viscount---I was underwhelmed, to say the least!

My only comparison at the time was the Fokker F27, which reached cruising height in hardly any time at all, whilst the Viscount droned on interminably, before it got there.

That was just a "niggle", but I was further soured towards the aircraft, as I had a window seat, & was treated to the delights of poorly overlapped duralumin panels (you could see the gap,)
The wings seemed to flex a bit, too.
Apparently this is common with larger aircraft, but I haven't noticed it to the same extent on other planes since.
I was, at a fairly low level, a bit dubious about the structural integrity of the wing, but dismissed it .

Some months later, the same aircraft, on the same route shed a wing & crashed.

[BU508A]

For my workbench I have one of those (nawts):

Voelkner ESD Montagematte



From another ad there is this Kronhagel (Braunschweig) branded mat:



I'm finding them very useful, especially for storing small parts during repair / teardown.

[Vince]

For my workbench I have one of those (nawts):

Voelkner ESD Montagematte



From another ad there is this Kronhagel (Braunschweig) branded mat:

I'm finding them very useful, especially for storing small parts during repair / teardown.

Somehow evokes a waffle iron to me. Now I want to make some, I am hungry. All because of you 

BTW, just found a few more transistors while searching around... look at that, a BU508A ! YES, I finally got one !!!! 

But Vince, you say, it's not a BU508A it's a BU208A !!!

Yes but !  Look at the datasheet below, the document says it covers both the BU508A AND the BU208A.. and NOWHERE in the datasheet can I find any mention of a difference between the two ?! 
So they are probably exactly the same part..... but why have two different part numbers... to describe the exact same part ?! 

Maybe one day I will find one marked 508A not 208A, but for now it will do !!!

[Cerebus]

Yes I saw that, that same website has some sewing mats, 150x100cm !! 
Way too large to fit on my bench... and way too expensive as well, at 150 Euros !

Have two 100cm x 75cm ones taped together on the long edge to make a hinge so I can put them away. When folded out it's quite a handful to move around.

[BU508A]

BTW, just found a few more transistors while searching around... look at that, a BU508A ! YES, I finally got one !!!! 

But Vince, you say, it's not a BU508A it's a BU208A !!!

Yes but !  Look at the datasheet below, the document says it covers both the BU508A AND the BU208A.. and NOWHERE in the datasheet can I find any mention of a difference between the two ?! 
So they are probably exactly the same part..... but why have two different part numbers... to describe the exact same part ?! 

Well, Vince, here is a little riddle for you: can you spot the difference? 

[Cerebus]

Or go super cheap like me with plain old poster board. Surprisingly durable but when it starts to look like crap toss it away and put down a new one.

I've been using the grey hardboard (I think you 'merkins call that Masonite) that JLC uses as backing boards for PCB drilling. They use them as rigid packaging for their stencils.

Drill holes one side, comme ça:



Hard, smooth, light grey surface the other side:

[Vince]

BTW, just found a few more transistors while searching around... look at that, a BU508A ! YES, I finally got one !!!! 

But Vince, you say, it's not a BU508A it's a BU208A !!!

Yes but !  Look at the datasheet below, the document says it covers both the BU508A AND the BU208A.. and NOWHERE in the datasheet can I find any mention of a difference between the two ?! 
So they are probably exactly the same part..... but why have two different part numbers... to describe the exact same part ?! 

Well, Vince, here is a little riddle for you: can you spot the difference? 

OH !!!   

I did think of that of course... seeing as the datasheet showed 3 different packages. However I discarded that idea because the datasheet does NOT tell you that package X corresponds to this or that particular part number. It makes no connection between part number and package type ! 
Instead, all they say, is give you the power rating for each package type. So my assumption was that the BU208A and 508 were both available in all package types. That was my best guess. 

Maybe if I find another datasheet made by some other manufacturer, it might be less ambiguous....

[BU508A]

BTW, just found a few more transistors while searching around... look at that, a BU508A ! YES, I finally got one !!!! 

But Vince, you say, it's not a BU508A it's a BU208A !!!

Yes but !  Look at the datasheet below, the document says it covers both the BU508A AND the BU208A.. and NOWHERE in the datasheet can I find any mention of a difference between the two ?! 
So they are probably exactly the same part..... but why have two different part numbers... to describe the exact same part ?! 

Well, Vince, here is a little riddle for you: can you spot the difference? 

OH !!!   

I did think of that of course... seeing as the datasheet showed 3 different packages. However I discarded that idea because the datasheet does NOT tell you that package X corresponds to this or that particular part number. It makes no connection between part number and package type ! 
Instead, all they say, is give you the power rating for each package type. So my assumption was that the BU208A and 508 were both available in all package types. That was my best guess. 

Maybe if I find another datasheet made by some other manufacturer, it might be less ambiguous....

Don't forget, those transistors are very old. I think, at the time, when the BU508A came out, the BU208A was only available in the TO-3 case. The TO-218 case is much cheaper in respect of mounting costs and since it was widely used in TV sets for the horizontal deflection (and creating the 27kV high voltage) part, all those TV set manufacturers insisted of a cheaper alternative of the TO-3 BU208A.

Edit:
The datasheet from ST shows clearly, that the BU208A is related to the TO-3 case.

[mnementh]

So... I am thinking of fabricating some king of tool that would cut the labels in one single motion, easily and square. Just place the label, act on the tool, clean cut in a single stroke, next label please. Maybe with two razor blades in a holder with a little handle, and mounted on a hinge. Maybe a screw to adjust the spacing between the two blades, to cater for different sizes of drawers.

   

Scour your local yard sales, eBay and Thrift stores for a audio tape, videotape, or film splicer. I've seen a gazillion over the years for a buck or 3.

Tape splicers are commonly available for 1/4" and 3/4" widths (lots more sizes too, but not as common); film splicers in 8mm, 16mm and 35mm are common.

mnem
 

[Vince]

Found it !  Downloaded over half a dozen datasheet for the BU208 / 508, finally found one that lists both at the same time AND is not ambiguous and.... it's written by the same company, ST !

See below... it is the exact same datasheet... EXCEPT the one I had/ posted earlier was written in 1996. This other one is exactly the same but written in 2002 and the only difference I can see, obvious, is that on the first page they added in the summary table the information telling you what part number corresponds to what package type ! 

So I just got unlucky earlier and picked THE datasheet NOT to get !