New Keysight 4 Channel Scope (1200 X-Series)

[tv84]

Old thread, but I can not see how you fail to see the difference between a KS scope (professional design) and GW (toy like design, even if good scopes)?

Are you blind man? 

   A few minutes ago you were calling another member "dishonest", now you come to a 1-year old thread to call another one "blind"?

Why don't you go play with your non-toy KS and stop calling names to other members?  Or did the playground close for the weekend? 

[martinot]

With my apologies to Daniel and Keysight , I personally wouldn't recommend any of their scopes less than 3000 series.
3000 series is amazingly fast, both in user responsiveness and in retrigger time and is pleasure to use.
It also has very short memory, and as such is not good for lots of decoding, or looking at long captures.
But as interactive scope is the best.

I agree that interactivity and snappiness are the strongest point of the KS scopes, and that low memory are there weakest point (do not argue with that).

On the other hand, what is pretty much a single flaw with 3000T (short sample memory) is many times worse with 1000X and 2000 series,

I think you exaggerate way too much.

Fact: The new KS budget 1200-series has exactly half the memory of your, many times more expensive, 3000-series scope.

and also waveform capture rate is much slower on 1000x/2000 (which was one of good things with 3000). So you get worst of the both worlds.

If you are looking at 1000X series class, from A manufacturer you have RTB2000 that will give you 20x the scope in every regard,but for more money, or you can look at the GW Instek MSO/MDO/GDS-2000E that are fantastic scopes, and also Siglent 1000X-E or even Rigol MSO5000 series (still really new, but will be stable in coming months) for much less money and much better capabilities.

I agree that waveform update rate is a really important factor to miss less information. The KS 3000-series is absolutely fantastic with it's 1 million updates/sec, but it is way to expensive for me.

How do the other scopes which you recommend perform?

The RS&S 2000-series (which I really like and consider buying myself); up to 50 000 waveforms/s.

Siglent 1000X-E; Waveform capture rate up to 100,000 wfm/s (normal mode)

GDS-2000E Series; Waveform Update Rate of 120,000 wfm/s

KS DSO-1200-series; 200,000 waveforms/sec

The only one beating them all is the new Rigol 5000-series (with up to 500 000 wfm/s, with some debates)

[martinot]

Edit: one advantage of the Keysight though is that it can decode across segments and use the list display to jump from one segment to the other. In turn I have not seen any other oscilloscopes do that.

I am not sure the Keysight 1000X series has list display for serial decoding, are you referring to 2000 / 3000 series?

I don't know about the 1000X series. I'd assume a scope with decoding has a list display...

Not the Keysight 1000X series, and micsig added it in the latest firmware

I have yet not tested the serial decoding myself, but from the manual and fact sheet for the 1200-series it has pictures at least of a list display in the serial decoding.

[TK]

Edit: one advantage of the Keysight though is that it can decode across segments and use the list display to jump from one segment to the other. In turn I have not seen any other oscilloscopes do that.

I am not sure the Keysight 1000X series has list display for serial decoding, are you referring to 2000 / 3000 series?

I don't know about the 1000X series. I'd assume a scope with decoding has a list display...

Not the Keysight 1000X series, and micsig added it in the latest firmware

I have yet not tested the serial decoding myself, but from the manual and fact sheet for the 1200-series it has pictures at least of a list display in the serial decoding.

My post is 1.5 years old.  Now KS 1200X series serial decoding includes list display

[martinot]

Assortment of cheap no name caps on the PSU. Crappy fan mounted in the worst way possible for acoustics. And then there was this non-sense with the screen and dead pixels... Now don't get me wrong. All of that is acceptable or expected if you are trying to build something as cheap as possible. But building something like that, in china, and then asking 3 times the price over something else of similar build quality does not sit well with me.

What caps do you have in Rigol och Siglents?

The fan of the 1202G I have tested is quite quiet (compared to other scopes and measurement/lab equipment)!

If you measure the dB of yours we can compare with mine? Perhaps you can get it exchanged if yours louder than normal/other KS scopes.

What is your serial number (might be dependent if it was an early or first batch version)?

If you do want to give it in public, you can leave out the last digit (or you can PM me if you prefer, and we can compare with the one I test)?

How many dB is it compared to the same type of scopes from Siglent or Rigol?

 

[martinot]

We do have a MSOX3000 at work and i do really like it since its essentially a slightly updated 6000 with a bigger screen, wavegen and slower boot time.

Tho what does irk me is that the X3000 has the same buttons on the front panel as the 6000 but they are in different locations. This often results with me hovering my finger in front of the wrong part of the front panel as i frustratingly look for the button i want to press. Oh and having a LED for AC BW 50Ohm next to the channel would be nice to have like it was on the 6000 (Seen lots of confused coworkers due to AC or BW limit being on without them knowing).

LOL that sounds familiar...
I personally miss the most physical LED for trigger event.
To the point that I connected a low power LED and resistor to trig out and sticking it out in the front.

I like that idea. Creative!

[martinot]

Old thread, but I can not see how you fail to see the difference between a KS scope (professional design) and GW (toy like design, even if good scopes)?

Are you blind man? 

[ personal insults by tv84 deleted ]

 now you come to a 1-year old thread to call another one "blind"?

Seriously?

Please tell me if your think they look the same:

[tom66]

And sure, the PSU caps aren't the best out there, but looking at the numbers the reliability of the 2-channel 1000X is insanely good. I obviously can't share numbers, but the AFR/MTBF is easily 2x better than a lot of our other gear.

The PSU actually looks nice. https://youtu.be/9KcOQsVxtoU?t=475

Also, people think of Aishi capacitors as low grade, but they are one of the best non-Japanese capacitor manufacturers there.
On a well designed flyback SMPS the ripple current through those output capacitors will be small, as the switching frequency is quite high nowadays (likely 150kHz or above)

[RBBVNL9]

It's been quiet on the threat for a while, but as this seems the most general threat on the Keysight InfiniiVision 1200 X-Series and EDUX1052A/G oscilloscopes, let me post some question...

When using the FFT mode, the manual (Fourth edition, September 2021, p. 61) explains:

• FFT units will be displayed in dBV when channel units is set to Volts and channel impedance is set to 1 MΩ.
• FFT units will be displayed in dBm when channel units is set to Volts and channel impedance is set to 50Ω.

The issue is that the channel impedance on this scope cannot be set to 50Ω. Is this an error in the manual (and this piece of text was copied from a more sophisticated Keysight scope)?

PS some of my other oscilloscopes allow dBm display in FFT mode and thereby either assume there is an external 50Ω load (Rohde & Schwarz RTB2004), or allow you to set the value of the external load (Siglent SDS2000X Plus). But on the DSOX, I cannot get it to display dBm at all (and if I would, it's not clear what impedance it is assuming).