Keysight Scopmonth, Taxes when winning. Marketing-Bullshit?

[Towger]

Only if it would be a CRT-scope.

[ericloewe]

But there is a 4.2% tariff on Oscilloscopes.

It looks as if you are correct. :-(
[...]

Sorry, but he is not. Only if it would be a CRT-scope.
A simple check of the taxation and customs information:
English: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=en&Taric=90302091&SimDate=20160316
German: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=de&Taric=90302091&SimDate=20160316

Just klick on the last link "9030 20 91 90 Other".

That's oddly specific. What's funny is that another official page just mentioned oscilloscopes in general.

[ProBang2]

But there is a 4.2% tariff on Oscilloscopes.

It looks as if you are correct. :-(
[...]

Sorry, but he is not. Only if it would be a CRT-scope.
A simple check of the taxation and customs information:
English: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=en&Taric=90302091&SimDate=20160316
German: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=de&Taric=90302091&SimDate=20160316

Just klick on the last link "9030 20 91 90 Other".

That's oddly specific. What's funny is that another official page just mentioned oscilloscopes in general.

Very interesting! Link?
And... Which other page is official, rather than the database of the EU?

[ericloewe]

But there is a 4.2% tariff on Oscilloscopes.

It looks as if you are correct. :-(
[...]

Sorry, but he is not. Only if it would be a CRT-scope.
A simple check of the taxation and customs information:
English: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=en&Taric=90302091&SimDate=20160316
German: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=de&Taric=90302091&SimDate=20160316

Just klick on the last link "9030 20 91 90 Other".

That's oddly specific. What's funny is that another official page just mentioned oscilloscopes in general.

Very interesting! Link?
And... Which other page is official, rather than the database of the EU?

I didn't keep the link, but I believe it may have been the UK's tax authority's mirror of the above database.

[SeanB]

You can almost always find a tariff that is lower rated for most electronic equipment, so that it is either zero rated ( then only VAT and Ad Valorum apply) or will have some rate applied. Generally if you are not a total asshat to the customs official at the customs counter ( not the delivery people but the actual customs office so this means you have elected to collect it yourself) they might apply the lower tariff. If it is a courier guy, with a whole batch of paperwork, moaning about the time then they simply apply the first tariff, which typically is the higher one, the reductions are in subcategories.

For this prize I definitely will go see the guys in customs, they tend to be nice enough once you know them a little and are polite and friendly. May be a big bill though, SARS loves their slice of bacon.

[markone]

For this prize I definitely will go see the guys in customs, they tend to be nice enough once you know them a little and are polite and friendly. May be a big bill though, SARS loves their slice of bacon.

Mmmh, not true at all at least here in Italy.

Everything comes here from abroad (outside CE) through a courier is promptly charged with VAT (italian version is named IVA : 23%), import taxes and courier's custom office practice's expense, normally they do not even let you look at custom practice details before you pay the bill.

For instance when 9 years ago i bought a Rigol DS1022CD from an HK ebay seller, DHL charged me 175 Euro for a 480 Euro invoice (including shipping) at road level.

I had two option :

1) pay the bill and get the shipping and open custom invoice envelope.
2) refuse the shipping and probably lose a lot of money ;-)

Notice that the official italian importer price was over 1000 Euro, now we too have italian and EU seller with nice price for this stuff, apart  Fluke, Keysight and Tek ... not a great problem anyway.

Useless to say that nowaday i buy abroad only if i'm absolutely desperate, unless it's not a small packet sent by signed for postal service.

[ve7xen]

Everything comes here from abroad (outside CE) through a courier is promptly charged with VAT (italian version is named IVA : 23%), import taxes and courier's custom office practice's expense, normally they do not even let you look at custom practice details before you pay the bill.

At least in Canada, this is probably more the courier companies trying to get their pound of flesh than the government. If you call the courier before they have brokered the package for you, you can insist that they allow you to self-broker. This means you need to go to the courier depot, collect a ream of paperwork, carry it to the customs office, get the item cleared, and then return to the depot to collect the package. For an item like this though it would save you a pretty penny. Those brokerage fees are (almost literally...) highway robbery. Next time you need to do something like this in your country you should check if such is possible there. My understanding is that, at least here, they are legally required to allow you to self-broker or use the brokerage of your choice, but of course they will do it themselves if you don't request otherwise.

[markone]

Those brokerage fees are (almost literally...) highway robbery. Next time you need to do something like this in your country you should check if such is possible there. My understanding is that, at least here, they are legally required to allow you to self-broker or use the brokerage of your choice, but of course they will do it themselves if you don't request otherwise.

Exactly, an highway robbery ...

About custom self-brokering stuff i never heard nothing about that here, for sure they do not offer it to you and it's not applicable with express shippings, where packages leave US territory only after the completion of custom's clearance (custom's invoice compiled), usually made few hours after courier's pick-up.

And if you consider current Euro/USD exchange rate, buying abroad is utterly pointless.

[mjkuwp]

in the USA:

I won a car this year in a raffle.  First order of business was:
 - do you accept the prize or not?  YES!

Second business, done the same day was:
 - paid 25% of the cash value of the prize to the group that ran the contest - who passed it directly to the IRS (USA tax collecting group)

Also paid sales tax on the purchase when I took delivery.

don't want to diver the existing discussion, but want to say I never considered bashing these groups for following rules that were laid out for their contest and by the government.

I haven't filed my income taxes yet so I am not 100% sure how this all washes out on the tax forms.

{In answer to subsequent questions, gasoline right now is about $2.00 USD / Gallon}

[ProBang2]

@ mjkuwp

Answer me one question, please:

How much are you paying for a gallon gasoline?

(With the answer I´m able to make a exact example, how the [in this case] german supreme command get our money.)

[Augustus]

@mjkuwp: That's a bad example. You live in the US, you know your laws, you knew the value of the car and therefore you had a pretty good idea on how much the win would set you back. This campaign (at least to us Europeans) is more like:

KS: Congrats dude, you just won a FREE!!! oscilloscope!

Eurodude: Wow! That's amazing! Cool! WOW WOW WOW!!! Please send it to xxxxxxxx.

KS: One moment dude, here's the contract, sign it on the dotted line.

Eurodude: Contract? What's all this wording about? What's this taxes thing on it, never heard of it before?

KS: Uhummm, well, you first have to pay something to receive the prize, but really, this isn't something to worry about, trust me, we just have to make sure, really, just a little insignificant profane formality.

Eurodude: Pay something to receive a prize? Are you really KS, one moment, I first have to check, you know, there are warnings all over our media, each day, please understand, one moment, I have to check this first.

KS: Don't worry. It's just this tax thing and look how shiny your new scope is, it's the Rolling Royce of scopes and will surely impress the gurlz. Just look at all the buttons and knobs, they are all lit! A dream!

Eurodude: Well, uhummm, yeeeeees. I want it now, I want it badly, please please please tell me how much I would have to pay to get it as quick as possible. You know, this is really important to me. HOW MUCH?

KS: [Silence]

 

[rx8pilot]

its not their responsibility.

Sent from my horrible mobile....

[Brumby]

Maybe it's not their responsibility - but they could at least supply the basic information that only they can provide in order for the potential recipient to be able to approach their country's customs and tax people to work out what their liability would be.

[Carl_Smith]

Just had a thought -- Since Keysight is allowing winners to accept less expensive scopes, ask for two scopes of half the value.  Sell one to pay the taxes, keep the other one.

[Keysight DanielBogdanoff]

Hi Folks,

There's a lot of tax talk going on; we really are trying our best to help out our winners. Things like subbing out a lower cost scope are not what we planned on doing, but we really do want to take care of you. If you win (and we hope you do!) we're going to try our darndest to make it work out. Thanks for your patience!

-Daniel

[rx8pilot]

Hi Folks,

There's a lot of tax talk going on; we really are trying our best to help out our winners. Things like subbing out a lower cost scope are not what we planned on doing, but we really do want to take care of you. If you win (and we hope you do!) we're going to try our darndest to make it work out. Thanks for your patience!

-Daniel

Daniel - I have the taxes all worked out. All I need to do is WIN. I will jump up and down for a week! There will be no discussion of taxes or swapping for a multimeter. Still hoping for the 6000!

[Brumby]

I somehow get the feeling that if rx8pilot wins a scope, we''l hear the YEEEEEHAAAAAA!! all the way over here in Australia without need of a phone.

[Augustus]

its not their responsibility.

Oh, really? But maybe it is in their own interest to save some face? I don't think the EU, with more than 500 Million first-world citizens, are one of their lesser markets...

"Keysight Technologies is committed to conducting its business in an ethical, environmentally sustainable and socially responsible manner." (quote from their company's website)

Sounds like a quite helpful and responsible company to me 

So, yeah, maybe the marketing folks in Santa Rosa, California really don't know. I give them the benefit of the doubt. But it only takes them a simple phone call or an email to one of their official EU sales offices to find out. Because the Keysight staff in their EU offices DO know darn well. They are paid to know such things. It is their daily business to juggle with prices and taxes and customs tariffs. So yeah, Keysight marketing guys, just give 'em a call and tell your lucky winners how much they have to spend on their "free" gifts. It's not that hard at all 

[RGB255_0_0]

If there are other companies out there looking to give out free stuff and they see this thread, do you think Germany will be on the list of countries open to it?

[SeanB]

I doubt it, but they will not be the only countries excluded. Brazil comes to mind here, along with my home country of South Africa.

[Augustus]

As open as the UK, because we're still both part of the EU and the rules concerning this free giveaway are basically the same to both of us.

[diyaudio]

I just read something totally funny. 

9. Winner Notification. Any potential winner will be notified by mail, email and/or telephone. If a potential winner cannot be contacted, does not respond within fourteen days from the date that Keysight first tries to notify him/her, and/or the prize or prize notification is returned as undeliverable, such potential winner forfeits all rights to win the promotion or receive the prize, and an alternate potential winner will be selected. Upon contacting a potential winner and determining that he/she has met all eligibility requirements of the promotion, including without limitation, where permitted by law, the execution of required waivers, publicity and liability releases and disclaimers, such individual will be declared a "winner" of the promotion. In accordance with local laws, if the selected entrant is a Canadian or South African resident, that entrant will be required to answer a mathematical skill-testing question, without assistance of any kind (whether mechanical or otherwise), within the time frame provided above. Keysight assumes no responsibility for lost, late, or misdirected communications or any computer, online, telephone, or technical malfunctions that may occur. No substitution, transfer, or assignment of the prize is permitted, except that Keysight reserves the right to substitute a prize of equivalent value in the event the offered prize is unavailable

[Howardlong]

A random prize draw based solely on a game of chance would be illegal in those jurisdictions. A draw which also requires skill, however, is not.

[mstoer]

I just read something totally funny. 

9. Winner Notification. Any potential winner will be notified by mail, email and/or telephone. If a potential winner cannot be contacted, does not respond within fourteen days from the date that Keysight first tries to notify him/her, and/or the prize or prize notification is returned as undeliverable, such potential winner forfeits all rights to win the promotion or receive the prize, and an alternate potential winner will be selected. Upon contacting a potential winner and determining that he/she has met all eligibility requirements of the promotion, including without limitation, where permitted by law, the execution of required waivers, publicity and liability releases and disclaimers, such individual will be declared a "winner" of the promotion. In accordance with local laws, if the selected entrant is a Canadian or South African resident, that entrant will be required to answer a mathematical skill-testing question, without assistance of any kind (whether mechanical or otherwise), within the time frame provided above. Keysight assumes no responsibility for lost, late, or misdirected communications or any computer, online, telephone, or technical malfunctions that may occur. No substitution, transfer, or assignment of the prize is permitted, except that Keysight reserves the right to substitute a prize of equivalent value in the event the offered prize is unavailable

In Canada the law requires that all contests include a skill testing question. This has something to do with gaming laws:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skill_testing_question

Often the company holding the contest will even give you the answer or hint you to it if it isn't already obvious enough.  The questions are often something like  what is  30/5 + 4  ... yes, that simple.

Edited to add:  I'm fine with the taxes, just need the scope. Thanks in advance

[continuo]

These rules are sometimes weird. In Germany, for example, lottery wins are only tax free, if the winner is chosen by a solely random process, like drawing a random name from a pile of names or the classic form of a lottery, where random numbers were picked out of a barrel. If you had to solve a puzzle to win the prize it may very well be taxed as an income, because you had to do some "creative work" to get it and the prize is considered to be the payment for this work. The borders between these two cases aren't very well defined and there have been several reported (lengthy) court battles between a winner and the tax office over taxation or not. Wins in TV quiz shows like "Who wants to be a millionaire", still very popular over here, generally will always be taxed but the host covers this for the winner.