Can Your DSO Do This?

[alsetalokin4017]

Vertical mode triggering, allowing stable display of two (or maybe more) unrelated waveforms with different frequencies.....

I can't see any way to do it on the Rigol DS1054Z for example.  Yet even the basic analog Tek 2213a does a good job of it.  I don't think I've seen this mentioned in the various "DSO vs CRO" discussions, and I can't remember if the high end LeCroy and Tek DSOs that I used to use at work could do it.

[vk6zgo]

If I recall correctly,W2AEW covered this with a couple of Youtube videos.
You have to save the display with a DSO to get a similar display,although it doesn't feel as satisfying to me.

[Mechatrommer]

some modern dso cost $800 a pop, lets just assume thats the norm price nowadays. but some, with the same cost you can get 2 pops, not just you will get 2 FFT albeit slower 16K FFT, 2 decoders etc, but the good thing is, you also will have 2 unrelated trigger circuit, non-to-be-found in any modern dso at the price its just you need to make a custom rig to stack them together for minimum footprint, even without, still less than the cro's of the yesteryears.

[alsetalokin4017]

If I recall correctly,W2AEW covered this with a couple of Youtube videos.
You have to save the display with a DSO to get a similar display,although it doesn't feel as satisfying to me.

Yeah, definitely not as satisfying since the saved trace will not be live.

[Ata]

Yes.... My DS1102E can do this... Just set the alternate trigger mode, then you can set the horizontal time division and trigger level/type independently on each channel.. simultaneously.

My DS1104Z can't do this because this and my other DSO scopes do not have alternate trigger modes.

It seems that on modern DSO tes alternate trigger mode has been eliminated..

 

[rf-loop]

Vertical mode triggering, allowing stable display of two (or maybe more) unrelated waveforms with different frequencies.....

I can't see any way to do it on the Rigol DS1054Z for example.  Yet even the basic analog Tek 2213a does a good job of it.  I don't think I've seen this mentioned in the various "DSO vs CRO" discussions, and I can't remember if the high end LeCroy and Tek DSOs that I used to use at work could do it.

Of course can.



Here scope is running and trigger mode ALT. CH1 signal is just sine wave ~270kHz  and CH2 signal is ~977kHz frequency sine and AM modulated with ~1kHz and this channel is set for trig this AM modulation freq. (of course without ext trig sync)
Both channels have separate trigger settings. Trigger result is rock solid.
Bottom window can see both sinewaves (and CH2 there is this carrier ^977.2kHz)




Here also trigger ALT. Both channels have separate own trigger. There is two different frequency and different lenght pulses. Here also measurements on + tracking cursors. (here was also tested wfm/s speed. Result, 18kwfm/s)

[Mechatrommer]

Here scope is running and trigger mode ALT.

so thats what ALT is for? this makes me a total newbie. i didnt know i can do that on my DS1052E

[xygor]

...  Yet even the basic analog Tek 2213a does a good job of it.  ...

That doesn't look like a good job of it.  Trigger instability? Focus?

[xygor]

Of course can.

So what model is it?

[rf-loop]

Of course can.

So what model is it?

XDS3102A

[Wuerstchenhund]

Vertical mode triggering, allowing stable display of two (or maybe more) unrelated waveforms with different frequencies.....

I can't see any way to do it on the Rigol DS1054Z for example.  Yet even the basic analog Tek 2213a does a good job of it.  I don't think I've seen this mentioned in the various "DSO vs CRO" discussions, and I can't remember if the high end LeCroy and Tek DSOs that I used to use at work could do it.

Alternate trigger is pretty rare on DSOs, and the few that have it are pretty much all entry-level scopes. It's a nice feature but I can't see much need for it, which is probably why it has died out in the first place.

[Fungus]

Alternate trigger is pretty rare on DSOs, and the few that have it are pretty much all entry-level scopes. It's a nice feature but I can't see much need for it, which is probably why it has died out in the first place.

Does the R&S HMO1202 have it? 

[rf-loop]

Vertical mode triggering, allowing stable display of two (or maybe more) unrelated waveforms with different frequencies.....

I can't see any way to do it on the Rigol DS1054Z for example.  Yet even the basic analog Tek 2213a does a good job of it.  I don't think I've seen this mentioned in the various "DSO vs CRO" discussions, and I can't remember if the high end LeCroy and Tek DSOs that I used to use at work could do it.

Alternate trigger is pretty rare on DSOs, and the few that have it are pretty much all entry-level scopes. It's a nice feature but I can't see much need for it, which is probably why it has died out in the first place.

I need it very often.

Are these examples of entry level scopes: Keysight, InfiniiVision 3000X, 4000X

Or is this comment something like this:
Fox says he does not want rowan berries, they are acidic. Bird says that of course we want rowan berries. they are a great delicacy.

[Gyro]

The humble Owon VDS series have it too. 

[Wuerstchenhund]

I need it very often.

What for (just curious)?

Are these examples of entry level scopes: Keysight, InfiniiVision 3000X, 4000X

The DSOX3k is an upper entry-level scope, the DSOX4k is a lower mid-range scope.

Why?

Or is this comment something like this:
Fox says he does not want rowan berries, they are acidic. Bird says that of course we want rowan berries. they are a great delicacy.

And your point is?

[Wuerstchenhund]

Alternate trigger is pretty rare on DSOs, and the few that have it are pretty much all entry-level scopes. It's a nice feature but I can't see much need for it, which is probably why it has died out in the first place.

Does the R&S HMO1202 have it? 

Find out yourself:
https://cdn.rohde-schwarz.com/pws/dl_downloads/dl_common_library/dl_brochures_and_datasheets/pdf_1/service_support_30/HMO1X02_bro-en_3607-0152-32_v0200_72dpi.pdf

 

[Muxr]

I do not think HMOs have it. RTM has the B Trigger, but I didn't see it in the HMO user manual.

[0xdeadbeef]

I do not think HMOs have it. RTM has the B Trigger, but I didn't see it in the HMO user manual.

At least the HMO723..2024 have a so called B trigger. But this is a trigger on the same channel. Like 1st edge is rising edge at 0.5V, 2nd edge is either at 2V within 100ns.
Not useful for the dual triggering discussed here.

[Muxr]

I do not think HMOs have it. RTM has the B Trigger, but I didn't see it in the HMO user manual.

At least the HMO723..2024 have a so called B trigger. But this is a trigger on the same channel. Like 1st edge is rising edge at 0.5V, 2nd edge is either at 2V within 100ns.
Not useful for the dual triggering discussed here.

Interesting, the RTM has the source setting under B trigger, where you can pick the channel. I guess HMO doesn't have that ability.

[xygor]

Even on the (older) RTM1054, isn't B trigger just the second in a sequence?  Either channel can be picked for trig B, but neither channel is triggered until trig A is followed by trig B, then both are triggered simultaneously.  Is my understanding wrong?  Is latest RTM different?

[Muxr]

Even on the (older) RTM1054, isn't B trigger just the second in a sequence?  Either channel can be picked for trig B, but neither channel is triggered until trig A is followed by trig B, then both are triggered simultaneously.  Is my understanding wrong?  Is latest RTM different?

I think you might be right, I will have to look into it.

[alsetalokin4017]

...  Yet even the basic analog Tek 2213a does a good job of it.  ...

That doesn't look like a good job of it.  Trigger instability? Focus?

Handheld camera and slow shutter speed. Here's a better photo using a tripod.


But it appears that some lower-end DSOs can do this after all.  The Owon is impressive, I would not have expected that.

[alsetalokin4017]

Ok..... how about this?

 

(In this case the Rigol DS1054Z makes a pretty good effort...)

[C]

Analog scopes
  ALT & CHOPPED modes

Why have them, Most scope CRT's only have one electron beam so only one spot screen can be created at a time.
Chopped is a fast switch between inputs while horizontal sweep happens.
ALT is one input for each hormonal sweep.

Working with just one beam is foundation for a lot of analog scope modes.

Digital scopes have no limits like this for display.
The limit in a digital scope is how many ADC's and how many channels.
One ADC and two channels: you have to time switch between channels.
Two ADCs and Two channels: you can have same time samples which is important for some things.

[tautech]

Analog scopes
  ALT & CHOPPED modes

Why have them, Most scope CRT's only have one electron beam so only one spot screen can be created at a time.
Chopped is a fast switch between inputs while horizontal sweep happens.
ALT is one input for each hormonal sweep.

Working with just one beam is foundation for a lot of analog scope modes.

Digital scopes have no limits like this for display.
The limit in a digital scope is how many ADC's and how many channels.
One ADC and two channels: you have to time switch between channels.
Two ADCs and Two channels: you can have same time samples which is important for some things.

But we're discussing Alt channel triggering, completely different to Alt trace display modes.