Tektronix TDS 684C won't boot Front panel all LEDs Lit up only

[Jwalling]

The scope should boot fine if you disconnect the front panel board, although it will log the error. So I doubt that the front panel is the problem. What about the LED display?

LED display was showing "_" then "8,6(?)" alternating.

I think it may be useful to make a console port adapter.

[denimdragon]

I think it may be useful to make a console port adapter.

I've disassembled everything except for the PS and the CRT area for a thorough inspection under the microscope.

I plan on building the console in a little while. I did see this on the main level Trigger encoder while I was inspecting the front panel PCB. It's chipped right here.

[denimdragon]

So I took the scope down to it's bare bones before I build the console port for it to see if I noticed anything anywhere. I didn't see anything out of the order on the PS board, but I did see something on the shutter driver board. I used a 744A shutter driver board to compare since they both have matching part numbers save the last digit (-02 for 684C and -01 for 744). I'm assuming it's a rev. change but I can't see it being that different. Moving right along...

The 2 lead connector that connects the display driver board to the shutter driver board has one of the leads missing. It looks like it's been cut clean and the through hole that it would connect to looks clean like it wasn't ever used. I'm leaning toward it not being the issue unless it was vaporized? It doesn't make sense for it to be just dangling like that. I'm not sure what to think. Should I try and connect it before I put the scope back together? I'm not sure if it will botch something up. 

See pictures below:

[Jwalling]

So I took the scope down to it's bare bones before I build the console port for it to see if I noticed anything anywhere. I didn't see anything out of the order on the PS board, but I did see something on the shutter driver board. I used a 744A shutter driver board to compare since they both have matching part numbers save the last digit (-02 for 684C and -01 for 744). I'm assuming it's a rev. change but I can't see it being that different. Moving right along...

The 2 lead connector that connects the display driver board to the shutter driver board has one of the leads missing. It looks like it's been cut clean and the through hole that it would connect to looks clean like it wasn't ever used. I'm leaning toward it not being the issue unless it was vaporized? It doesn't make sense for it to be just dangling like that. I'm not sure what to think. Should I try and connect it before I put the scope back together? I'm not sure if it will botch something up. 

See pictures below:

Leave it alone. It came from the factory that way. As I said, the HV board is not the root cause of your scope hanging on boot.

[denimdragon]

Leave it alone. It came from the factory that way. As I said, the HV board is not the root cause of your scope hanging on boot.

  I just looked on eBay at another board with matching part numbers and saw that it was the same. Well I'll be putting it back together and making the console now I guess. (I'm a hard-headed pupil sometimes  )

[denimdragon]

5. The Tek console port adapter:  https://forum.tek.com/viewtopic.php?t=137307&start=20
When I made mine from that netlist, either power or GND was not getting to the board (can't remember which...)  One wire and I was up and running

The scope's display stays on the JAVA splash screen, but it does but up every time now that the adapter is connected.

I have a few questions about the console:

1. Unfortunately, this is all I'm getting on the console port. I'm using a DB9 to DB9 with USB adapter, and I have these pins connected: 2,3,7,8 and 9 is ground. Can anyone tell me what I have mixed up to fix the garble?

2. Are there any DIP switch settings I need to make or should they all stay in the closed position?

3. Is the Memory R/W switch on the right side set in the R/W position or off?

[denimdragon]

Ok so I finally have the console adapter working (RS232 got me initially). Here is the data:



RUNNING FROM DRAM.
DRAM test passed.


        Bootrom Header Checksum passed.
        Bootrom Total Checksum passed.
        BootRom Check Sum passed.
        Bus Error Timeout test passed.

Kernel Diagnostics Complete.

Calling SDM (monitor) Routine.

        Enabling Bus Control register. Value = 0x67
        IMR 1 Register test passed.
        Misc. Register test passed.
        Timer Interrupt test (Auto-Vector) passed.
        NVRam DSACK test passed.
        NVRam Write protected.
        Flashrom DSACK and JumpCode test passed.
        Flashrom Checksums passed.

Bootrom Diagnostics Complete.


DipSwitchValue: 0


Skipping boot loader.
Transferring control to FlashROM.

PCMCIA: option card with 1 controller detected at address 0x3000000
Checking for fixed  ATA Disk.
PCMCIA: Media Detected: 3255017472 Byte Disk
FLOPPY: Detected

Adding 5994 symbols for standalone.

#RESOURCES: MEMREQ=0x0: WAIT=1:
ld < hd0:/app/tdsrte1/logo.bin
value = 100483072 = 0x5fd4000
jplogosetup()

dlsym:error,symbol splashScreen not found in symbol space 100489392
value = 0 = 0x0

CPU: 68EC040.  Processor #0.
Memory Size: 0x1000000.  BSP version 1.0.

Executing Diagnostics
-> Start Power-On Diag Sequence
hwAccountant probe routines
  Probe for unexpected pending ints
  Dsp Instr mem size
  Dsp D2 mem size
  Dsp D1 mem size
  Dsy Vect0 mem size
  Dsy Vect1 mem size
  Dsy Wfm0 mem size
 +~+   Dsy Wfm1 mem size
 +~+   Dsy Text0 mem size
  Dsy Text1 mem size
  Acq number of digitizers
  Acq mem size
  Cpu timer interval uSec
  Cpu Dram size
  NvRam mem size
  Opt Math Package presence
  Opt RS232/ Cent presence
  Opt 1M presence
  Acq Intlv Cal Id presence
  Opt TvTrig presence
  Opt TvTrig index
  Dsy color presence
  Opt floppy drive presence
  Opt hard drive presence
  Acq limited bandwidth presence
  Acq number of user channels
dspForcedBus ................... pass
cpuDiagD2MiscReg ............... pass
cpuDiagDSPIntMaskReg ........... pass
cpuDiagDsyAccess ............... +~+  pass
dsp68kMemTest .................. pass
cpuDiagFIFOMem ................. pass
dspRunVerify ................... pass
dspBusRequestTest .............. pass
dspImplicitBusAccess ........... pass
dspTristarMemTest .............. pass
dsyRastModeV0Walk .............. +~+  pass
dsyRastModeV1Attrib ............ +~+  pass
dsyWaitClock ................... +~+  pass
cpuDiagAllInts ................. pass
nvLibrariansDiag ............... pass
calLibrarianDefaultCk .......... pass
checkIfCalFailed ............... pass
dspForcedBus ................... pass
acqProcThermistor .............. pass
digRegisterDiag ................ pass
digAcqMemDataDiag .............. pass
digAcqMemAddrDiag .............. pass
trigGtlRegisterDiag ............ pass
trigBtlRegisterDiag ............ pass
ch1EdgeTrigDiag ................ pass
lineTrigDiag ................... pass
dlyTrigDBTRunsAfter ............ pass
slewrateTrigDiag ............... pass
trigAttenSerialReg ............. pass
trigPreampSerialReg ............ pass
trigDTCSerialReg ............... pass
trigExtlSerialReg .............. pass
trigDacSerialReg ............... pass
TICountersDiag ................. pass
gtlBigCountersDiag ............. pass
trigBtlConfidenceDiag .......... pass
glitchTrigDiag ................. pass
pulseWidthDiag ................. pass
digRegisterDiag ................ pass
fpDiagConf ..................... pass
optDiagPM110Reg ................ pass
optDiagFloppyCacheMem .......... pass
optDiagFloppyControllerIO ...... pass
optDiagFloppyDrive ............. pass
optRS232DuartIO ................ UNTESTED
optRS232DuartIntLoop ........... UNTESTED
optCentronCntrlReg ............. UNTESTED
optTv8bitRegDiag ............... UNTESTED
optTvShiftRegDiag .............. UNTESTED
optTvXparentCodes .............. UNTESTED
optTvDontCareCodes ............. UNTESTED
optTvEdgeAndLevel .............. UNTESTED
optTvSyncLevels ................ UNTESTED
Executing Smalltalk
hwAccountant probe routines
  Probe for unexpected pending ints
  Dsp Instr mem size
  Dsp D2 mem size
  Dsp D1 mem size
  Dsy Vect0 mem size
  Dsy Vect1 mem size
  Dsy Wfm0 mem size
 +~+   Dsy Wfm1 mem size
 +~+   Dsy Text0 mem size
  Dsy Text1 mem size
  Acq number of digitizers
  Acq mem size
  Cpu timer interval uSec
  Cpu Dram size
  NvRam mem size
  Opt Math Package presence
  Opt RS232/ Cent presence
  Opt 1M presence
  Acq Intlv Cal Id presence
  Opt TvTrig presence
  Opt TvTrig index
  Dsy color presence
  Opt floppy drive presence
  Opt hard drive presence
  Acq limited bandwidth presence
  Acq number of user channels
can't open input 'fd0:/startup.bat'
  errno = 0x13 (S_errno_ENODEV)
taskSpawn ("javastart",200,0x0,40000,sysExecScript,"hd0:/app/tdsrte1/RTE1.BAT")
value = 100239728 = 0x5f98970

Smalltalk/V Sun Version 1.12
Copyright (C) 1990 Object Technology International Inc.
# TDS RTE1.1 startup file.
nulldev = open("/null",3,0666)
new symbol "nulldev" added to symbol table.
nulldev = 0x5f8ff10: value = 5 = 0x5
taskSpawn "Redirect",250,0,0x4000,ioGlobalStdSet,1,nulldev
value = 100203852 = 0x5f8fd4c

ld < hd0:/app/tdsrte1/java68k.o
0x5f7f13c (sysScriptExec): Apps General Purpose Event Queue not registered in this system
0x5f7f13c (sysScriptExec): Apps Variable Event Queue not registered in this system

[Jwalling]

Ok so I finally have the console adapter working (RS232 got me initially). Here is the data:


SNIP

1. Did it hang on that particular boot? It doesn't look like it...
2. What firmware revision does your scope have?

Odd are those extra characters "+~+" before some of the tests that are related to the CPU board display areas.

Attached is a boot log from a good TDS684C with no hard drive. Firmware revision is 5.1e. Yours will be somewhat different since you have the hard drive. I would disconnect it for now and then you can compare it better with my boot log.

[denimdragon]

1. Did it hang on that particular boot? It doesn't look like it...
2. What firmware revision does your scope have?

Odd are those extra characters "+~+" before some of the tests that are related to the CPU board display areas.

Attached is a boot log from a good TDS684C with no hard drive. Firmware revision is 5.1e. Yours will be somewhat different since you have the hard drive. I would disconnect it for now and then you can compare it better with my boot log.

It hung earlier on the splash screen because I had My Rx, Tx incorrect. It hasn't hung since. The firmware is 5.1e, and I did disconnect the hard drive. Here is the log comparison and the only differences I see are the "+~+" before certain lines. I'll have to find out what that means. Also it says that my DUART I/O is untested. What does that mean?

[chihaxinh]

Hi denimdragon

How to grab boot log in Tektronix . Can you write basic step to step , i'm have one tds 520b can't boot and display green screen only when bootting ( i using external display - my display board fault )

Thank you so much !

Nam Nguyen Hai

[denimdragon]

Hi denimdragon

How to grab boot log in Tektronix . Can you write basic step to step , i'm have one tds 520b can't boot and display green screen only when bootting ( i using external display - my display board fault )

Thank you so much !

Nam Nguyen Hai

Have you built the console port adapter yet?

[Jwalling]

1. Did it hang on that particular boot? It doesn't look like it...
2. What firmware revision does your scope have?

Odd are those extra characters "+~+" before some of the tests that are related to the CPU board display areas.

Attached is a boot log from a good TDS684C with no hard drive. Firmware revision is 5.1e. Yours will be somewhat different since you have the hard drive. I would disconnect it for now and then you can compare it better with my boot log.

It hung earlier on the splash screen because I had My Rx, Tx incorrect. It hasn't hung since. The firmware is 5.1e, and I did disconnect the hard drive. Here is the log comparison and the only differences I see are the "+~+" before certain lines. I'll have to find out what that means. Also it says that my DUART I/O is untested. What does that mean?

How is the dip switch set? On mine, all switches are set to on. If switch 3 is off, it'll skip some tests.
you won't be able to glean any useful info from the console port till you get it to hang.

[denimdragon]

How is the dip switch set? On mine, all switches are set to on. If switch 3 is off, it'll skip some tests.
you won't be able to glean any useful info from the console port till you get it to hang.

Oh ok. I need it to hang. Also all dip switches are set to on. I'll see if I can get it to hang again 

[chihaxinh]

Have you built the console port adapter yet?

Hi Denimdragon

Sorry for Off Topic , but i dont know schematics or diagrams to build TDS Console Port, All topic in tek forum have change url and die . If you know how to build console adapter port pls guide me .

Thank you so much !
Nam Nguyen Hai

[Jwalling]

Hi Denimdragon

Sorry for Off Topic , but i dont know schematics or diagrams to build TDS Console Port, All topic in tek forum have change url and die . If you know how to build console adapter port pls guide me .

Thank you so much !
Nam Nguyen Hai

Link is in this very thread!

[denimdragon]

Have you built the console port adapter yet?

Hi Denimdragon

Sorry for Off Topic , but i dont know schematics or diagrams to build TDS Console Port, All topic in tek forum have change url and die . If you know how to build console adapter port pls guide me .

Thank you so much !
Nam Nguyen Hai

Hi Denimdragon

Sorry for Off Topic , but i dont know schematics or diagrams to build TDS Console Port, All topic in tek forum have change url and die . If you know how to build console adapter port pls guide me .

Thank you so much !
Nam Nguyen Hai

Link is in this very thread!

"5. The Tek console port adapter:  https://forum.tek.com/viewtopic.php?t=137307&start=20
When I made mine from that netlist, either power or GND was not getting to the board (can't remember which...)  One wire and I was up and running"

There you go 

[Armadillo]

Have you built the console port adapter yet?

Hi Denimdragon

Sorry for Off Topic , but i dont know schematics or diagrams to build TDS Console Port, All topic in tek forum have change url and die . If you know how to build console adapter port pls guide me .

Thank you so much !
Nam Nguyen Hai

Option 13 refers to the RS232 centronic board at the back of the TDS unit.

The objective is to connect this board to the A11 processor board J40. [by jumper wires or by pcb adapters]

On the TDS520, the console port is J40, a PCB edge connector 10 X 2 [See pictures].

The correct pinout is as follows;


Console port - Option 13 Board - (Signal Name)
A10 - 1 - (D24)
B10 - 3 - (D25)
A9 - 5 - (D26)
B9 - 7 - (D27)
B8 - 2 - (D28)
A7 - 4 - (D29)
B7 - 6 - (D30)
A6 - 8 - (D31)

B1 - 21 - (A1)
A1 - 23 - (A2)
B2 - 25 - (A3)
A2 - 22 - (A4)
+5V (B6) - 24 - (A5)
GND (A3/A8) - 26 - (A6)

B5 - 12 - (INT#)
B4 - 15 - (IOCS#)
A5 - 16 - (SYSRESET#)
A4 - 17 - (RNW)

A3, A8 - 9, 13, 19 - (GND)
B6 - 10, 20 - (+5V)

B3 - not connected

not connected - 11 - (DS#)
not connected - 14 - (DSACK0#)
not connected - 18 - (AS#)

Notes:
On the console port "B" is the top side of the processor board.
Signals A5 (Pin 24) and A6 (Pin 26) need to be set to +5V and Gnd to make sure the serial port of the option 13 board is selected.
The 3 ground pins (9, 13, 19) should be connected on the option 13 board, so normally you only need to connect one of these to the console port connector.
The 2 +5V pins (10, 20) should be connected on the option 13 board, so normally you only need to connect one of these to the console port connector.

This link below provides exact information from the contributors there. Also PCB adapter board designed by someone.

Take a look; https://forum.tek.com/viewtopic.php?t=137307&start=20

I hope this compile give you a proper direction/starter to building the console service adapter.

[denimdragon]

I finally got it to hang!!! And now it's consistent. Maybe the bad weather here scared the heck out of it  Here's what I got in my console:

{\xf4}{EOF}{GS}

And that's it. Anyone know what this means? Thanks.

[Jwalling]

I finally got it to hang!!! And now it's consistent. Maybe the bad weather here scared the heck out of it  Here's what I got in my console:

{\xf4}{EOF}{GS}

And that's it. Anyone know what this means? Thanks.

Never seen that before. Must be failing very early in init. Could be the bootrom or some sort or I/O failure.
I would start by checking the address and data lines to the EEPROM which holds the boot code.

[Armadillo]

Firstly, I think you should check proper & complete Reset timing Circuit;

On the 520 CM schematic, it would be the U1175;

[denimdragon]

Firstly, I think you should check proper & complete Reset timing Circuit;

On the 520 CM schematic, it would be the U1175;

I believe I've located that area. It's a tantalum cap on this board it appears. How do I check it @Armadillo 

[Armadillo]

I suggest you confirm that "Power-on reset asserts for a minimum of 400 milliseconds after the +5 V supply stabilizes." is available and stable, clean, no glitches right into the reset pin of the processor and also;
tweezers out the tantalum and the MLCC and check ESR and capacitance.

Edit: BTW, I don't like MLCC though it look innocent.
Edit: bear in mind that this is a case of intermittence problem, so you will be looking at marginally out of spec components and trial and errors will be unavoidable.   

Edit: Also the LED readout would provide some infomation;
Edit: Also check the console hook up is not shorted.

[denimdragon]

How often tant caps go bad?

[Armadillo]

How often tant caps go bad?

Not often, the thing mostly fail short, at times moisture creepage or crack, but it always where the small percentage that creates the most problems. How much are engineers certain on certainty and probability? MTTF, MTBF are all mathematical statistics. 
Well, it would be prudent to go through the obvious troubleshooting steps and iron out along the way.

Not often I would say, but you will still need to unearth this 400ms burden and move forward unless the LED is showing some status of life.

[denimdragon]

Not often, the thing mostly fail short, at times moisture creepage or crack, but it always where the small percentage that creates the most problems. How much are engineers certain on certainty and probability? MTTF, MTBF are all mathematical statistics. 
Well, it would be prudent to go through the obvious troubleshooting steps and iron out along the way.

Not often I would say, but you will still need to unearth this 400ms burden and move forward unless the LED is showing some status of life.

Ok, where do I check the 400 ms Signal? On the 7705 IC? The RS232 IC or the DUART IC? I'm confused. I'm guessing the 7705 (U1175).