A week using an Apple iPhone -- An Android user's perspective

[bd139]

His problem is he's running a tail end repair business which is a dying market and race to the bottom. People go to him out of desperation. Basically their devices are usually second hand, grey market, possibly already repaired and they can't afford to buy a new one so they are forced to hire Rossman to do a cut price repair. I used to run the same sort of business on the side years ago. He needs mindshare so that people go to him first which is what he's doing. He's an excellent businessman.

Premium grade Samsung has lifespan of ~1-1.5 years with an absolutely shitty warranty and service and replacement policy (look at the whole recall mess). It's dire and all third party repairers who will tell you it's water damaged instantly because they are being paid so little to repair them.

Premium grade iPhone at least 2 years, usually 3 and retains 40% of value after two years. First two covered on AppleCare if you want it which reduces incident cost of a new screen to 25 and a new handset of 79. They even send you a new handset out and a box to put the old one in to send back. Much better value proposition and TCO over 2 years. I pay 979 GBP for my handset with AppleCare for 2 years, get 250 back worst case, 30 GBP/month which is 79 more than a Samsung S10 with a warranty that's a POS and lasts half as long and has a crappy resale value.

In a business the support and TCO for iOS is much much lower as well as they rarely drop dead or have problems in the field. I've worked for a company that dumped Samsung and HTC over this and went to iOS entirely.

[Mechatrommer]

well the keyword is "they can't afford to buy a new one" unlike android market, new or used. here one can buy used android for peanuts, people on the higher rank can change/trade in phone yearly (if that is really matter to them), even some of lower grade staffs have much much more expensive androids than me this is the ecosystem... for companies who can afford Keyslight or R&S T&M, i guess iphone is the market for them.

and i dont think samsung will fail in 1-2 years given enough care, my previous samsung served me well around 3 years iirc (bought 2014) and i changed not because it fails or anything wrong with it, but because i need dual sim and our department provided us with some real crap android that costed peanuts new when i checked in the net (Altitude). but it came with free mobile internet sim which i now currently used with my personal sim on A7. the crap phone got its buttons stuck after 1yr+ but still working with enough pressure. now i'm on galaxy A7 7mths old, my previous KZoom passed down to my BIL because he's on tight budget and commitments. the wifey's old galaxy is collecting dust now (still working bought the same day as my KZoom 2014), with other 2 dept crap phones + 2 other tabs (also dept sponsored) now i'm having trouble managing them because the kidey's always like to sneak in for those to play that stupid bricks games, its a controlled substances now to prevent them failing school

[bsfeechannel]

Premium grade Samsung has lifespan of ~1-1.5 years with an absolutely shitty warranty and service and replacement policy (look at the whole recall mess). It's dire and all third party repairers who will tell you it's water damaged instantly because they are being paid so little to repair them.

Premium grade iPhone at least 2 years, usually 3 and retains 40% of value after two years. First two covered on AppleCare if you want it which reduces incident cost of a new screen to 25 and a new handset of 79. They even send you a new handset out and a box to put the old one in to send back. Much better value proposition and TCO over 2 years.

So, basically, Android phones are consumer goods while Apple phones are capital goods.

[bd139]

So, basically, Android phones are consumer goods while Apple phones are capital goods.

Not really. Both are capital goods or consumer goods. That's defined by who's holding it. For me either is capital goods as my entire income is dervied from communication through it. Just Apple has a lower TCO and better risk profile. TCO comes from longevity support and low downtime, risk profile comes from replacement availability and support.

[Halcyon]

Ah SE is the Moto E of iPhones. Bear that in mind during evaluation. It’s not a bad handset as such but it’s based on 2015 tech in a 2010 chassis.

Oh I totally understand the hardware limitations, however most of my gripes are with the operating system. It's the same whether it's on this older handset or a brand new one.

Premium grade Samsung has lifespan of ~1-1.5 years with an absolutely shitty warranty and service and replacement policy (look at the whole recall mess). It's dire and all third party repairers who will tell you it's water damaged instantly because they are being paid so little to repair them.

I'd have to disagree with you there. I've had my S8 now just under 2 years and it's still a great handset, albeit something did fail on the cellular side which seems to be an unusual case. I had the LCD replaced once (by Samsung) because I was stupid and dropped it onto concrete. It cost me $300 for a new LCD, rear glass panel and battery (which because it was glued down, needed to be replaced as well once the device was opened and LCD removed). They did it on the spot while I waited and it didn't require me or them factory resetting my phone.

Now, that I'm making an actual warranty claim, it's still covered under Samsung's own warranty. No need to enact my consumer law rights. No questions asked, I simply fill out the online form, print out the provided shipping label and throw it in the post.

As far as I know, in Australia, Samsung has more shopfronts/genuine repairer shops than Apple does. I would never take my phone to a third party repairer, I would just do the work myself.

[james_s]

Ah SE is the Moto E of iPhones. Bear that in mind during evaluation. It’s not a bad handset as such but it’s based on 2015 tech in a 2010 chassis.

The SE is the only iPhone worth owning IMHO, the rest are gigantic and of those several models have that unsightly notch in the screen. What a joke that is, Steve Jobs must be turning in his grave, if he could see the current state of the Apple product lineup heads would roll.

[Bassman59]

Ah SE is the Moto E of iPhones. Bear that in mind during evaluation. It’s not a bad handset as such but it’s based on 2015 tech in a 2010 chassis.

The SE is the only iPhone worth owning IMHO, the rest are gigantic and of those several models have that unsightly notch in the screen. What a joke that is, Steve Jobs must be turning in his grave, if he could see the current state of the Apple product lineup heads would roll.

Nobody cares about the notch.

[bd139]

I rather care about the extra screen real estate. The notch is irrelevant to that. It just exists.

[Mr. Scram]

Ah SE is the Moto E of iPhones. Bear that in mind during evaluation. It’s not a bad handset as such but it’s based on 2015 tech in a 2010 chassis.

It's a £379 phone, not a budget model.

[bd139]

That is the budget model relatively speaking. XR starts at £749 as a comparison.

Also as a comparison the galaxy S10 is £899

[Mr. Scram]

That is the budget model relatively speaking. XR starts at £749 as a comparison.

Also as a comparison the galaxy S10 is £899

The fact that Apple asks significant amounts of money for their other phones doesn't mean a £400 phone can or should be called a budget model. It's more expensive than the vast majority of smartphones. It's a bit silly to lump it in with a £100 budget phone. Saying one shouldn't expect too much of a £400 phone because it was already old hat when new isn't exactly a fine marketing pitch either.

[bd139]

It’s not cheap for sure but always with Apple you’re paying for the hardware, the software, the support network, the retail store chain, the online services which back everything the phone does, everything. Thus when you pay money they don’t need to sell you out with bundled shit apps and tracking.

Everyone moans when there’s a £200 profit margin on a phone but forgets all that costs money.

I don’t know what Samsung’s excuse is. They are expensive, google provides the majority of services and you get the shit apps and tracking.

[Mr. Scram]

It’s not cheap for sure but always with Apple you’re paying for the hardware, the software, the support network, the retail store chain, the online services which back everything the phone does, everything. Thus when you pay money they don’t need to sell you out with bundled shit apps and tracking.

Everyone moans when there’s a £200 profit margin on a phone but forgets all that costs money.

I don’t know what Samsung’s excuse is. They are expensive, google provides the majority of services and you get the shit apps and tracking.

"Apple Reports 1Q 2019 Results: Nearly $20B Profit on $84.3B Revenue"

While I do understand companies are profit driven and don't work for free, that doesn't appear to be much of an issue for Apple. A £400 phone shouldn't be a budget experience.

[Jeroen3]

Vendors of phones are inflating the price until demand falls away. Innovation in phones is over. The next model is only "more pixels" and "more memory". The only way to make more profit on less sold is by higher margin.

If you've paid big money for any device with the Fruit logo, then you can write all the arguments you want, price won't change.
It will stay an expensive phone. You can say it's because of the abstract features, like iCloud or the ecosystem.
But it isn't, since you still have to pay for those. Either by the developer or storage subscription.
They're just expensive, and them being expensive is part of their brand success.

You can say, my Dodgee can also do all those things, yes it can. But it doesn't carry the fruit logo that provides "a sense of pride and accomplishment".

[Halcyon]

It’s not cheap for sure but always with Apple you’re paying for the hardware, the software, the support network, the retail store chain, the online services which back everything the phone does, everything.

The biggest issues I have with Apple currently (and in the past 5-10 years) is that:

• The hardware is usually behind the other major manufactuers in terms of specifications, features and cutting-edge technology. It's already outdated when it's released.
• The software is dated. It's polished but dated. It's where Android was several versions ago. Some things feel clunky or unrefined, others are incomplete or missing entirely.
• Their support network/retail stores are among the "better" examples, but only when they feel like it. There are plenty of examples where Apple couldn't give a shit about the consumer.
• Online services -- Apple give you nothing over what Android does. In fact, I find Apple more intrusive. They can keep their online services.

I honestly can't remember the last time Apple "innovated" anything that wasn't done before.

[james_s]

Nobody cares about the notch.

Lots of people care about the notch, I certainly do, I would never buy a phone with a big notch out of the screen, it completely triggers my OCD, it obstructs content, especially when the screen is in landscape mode. *You* don't care about the notch, but that is different than "nobody."

[james_s]

"Apple Reports 1Q 2019 Results: Nearly $20B Profit on $84.3B Revenue"

While I do understand companies are profit driven and don't work for free, that doesn't appear to be much of an issue for Apple. A £400 phone shouldn't be a budget experience.

It's not a budget experience, it's a fantastic bit of hardware. The OS has serious flaws, but these flaws are across the whole line. I have had my SE for a couple years now and have found zero shortcomings with the harrdware, it's snappy and responsive with a nice sharp screen and physical home button, a real luxury these days. If I could change anything about it I'd make it a bit smaller while keeping the same specs.

[0culus]

Ah SE is the Moto E of iPhones. Bear that in mind during evaluation. It’s not a bad handset as such but it’s based on 2015 tech in a 2010 chassis.

The SE is the only iPhone worth owning IMHO, the rest are gigantic and of those several models have that unsightly notch in the screen. What a joke that is, Steve Jobs must be turning in his grave, if he could see the current state of the Apple product lineup heads would roll.

I bought an iPhone X a couple months after it came out, after having an original 6+. It's been flawless and I'm still using it and enjoying it with no plans to get a new handset for a while. The handset is the perfect size for my hands (I would not get the plus sized device again). The notch really isn't that bad. The OLED is really really nice to look at, and easy on the eyes in the dark if you engage night mode to automatically turn on.

Personally, I have better things to do with my life than dick around customizing my phone. And as a professional in the infosec realm, I strongly appreciate the out of the box security posture you get with Apple. Is it perfect? No. But it's a hell of a lot more sane than anything else.

[james_s]

Actually that is something I'd change about the SE if I could, an oled screen would be great. A smartphone with about the same computing power, about 5% smaller than the SE with an OLED display, physical home button and a less buggy iOS would be great. That with iOS 6 updated to support current apps and a micro SD slot to hold pictures/video/media would be my holy grail phone.

I don't really want to customize and tinker with my phone either but Apple has really been irritating me lately. They update iOS constantly, never fixing the glaring bugs but just adding new features I have no use for. Then if you don't update, it gets to where you can't install any new apps anymore, even when versions of those apps exist that will run on the iOS version you have. The last straw was when they axed support for 32 bit apps, zero benefit to me except if I update it will take away nearly a dozen older apps that I paid for and use, apps which are abandoned and will never get updated. An upgrade ought to give me something new, it should never forcefully take away capabilities that I use. I don't like Android at all but unless things change my next phone will not be Apple, they used to be dramatically better than anything else out there but I'm not sure that's the case anymore. I only stayed with them this long due to a combination of inertia and the fact that they made the only decent spec phone I could find in a small form factor and I loathe gigantic phones. I want something small enough to slip fully into a pocket and comfortably use one handed.

[0culus]

On the flip side, if you commit to supporting legacy, you end up with a turdpile like Windows that tries to bring support for everything all the way back to DOS.

[Mechatrommer]

with billions of profit, not a single cent on supporting legacy version?

[bd139]

Apple are far better at supporting legacy than most. Consider the 68K -> PPC and PPC -> Intel transitions and the upcoming Intel -> ARM. Also iPhone 5S is still supported with latest iOS after 69 months. The last 32-bit iOS only device was fully supported for 48 months. Name a 2013 Android or Windows Phone that's still supported...

I know of noone who actually has used an iPhone until iOS is EOL. They either got a new one or destroyed it.

[SilverSolder]

I don't get why the performance of a phone (Android, in my case) keeps going down over time.  It's as if it is impossible to "keep it clean".

Apple ruined my old 4s, which I liked, with an OS update that didn't work on that hardware, and no way to downgrade.

Planned obsolescence is rife in this industry.

[james_s]

On the flip side, if you commit to supporting legacy, you end up with a turdpile like Windows that tries to bring support for everything all the way back to DOS.

You mean the operating system that has absolutely dominated the personal computer marketplace for decades, selling billions and billions of copies? Much of that dominance is because backward compatibility and legacy support are paramount.

I would argue as well that much of the problem with Windows has nothing to do with the legacy support. Some of the longstanding gripes sure, but for the most part that stuff is good enough. It's the UI design and attempts to monetize everything that has done it in recently. Removing 32 bit app support from iOS provides no tangible benefit at all, I would challenge anyone to find something that it noticeably improves because all I see is devices having less capability after being updated. We're not talking 20 year old software here, it's apps I bought 2-3 years ago and actively use.

[james_s]

Apple are far better at supporting legacy than most. Consider the 68K -> PPC and PPC -> Intel transitions and the upcoming Intel -> ARM. Also iPhone 5S is still supported with latest iOS after 69 months. The last 32-bit iOS only device was fully supported for 48 months. Name a 2013 Android or Windows Phone that's still supported...

I know of noone who actually has used an iPhone until iOS is EOL. They either got a new one or destroyed it.

I used my iPhone 4 (not S) until about 2 years ago. My partner still has her 4S running iOS 7 and I have a very old iPad running I think iOS 9 which is the latest it supports. That thing is almost unusable though as Apple always updates 1-2 versions beyond where updates should have stopped for older hardware. I would prefer to buy a device, get it all set up the way I want it and then freeze the configuration until the hardware fails. Every time I've ever gone against my better judgement and updated iOS on a device it has ended up slower without any real benefit and regretted it, with no way to roll back.