The Hyperloop: BUSTED

[Lord of nothing]

  Hyperloop a Green Transportation Technologie which an Engine who run with a Fossil Fuel Engine. 

[ebastler]

Please help me out here (and help me to avoid watching the whole video ):
Where does the engine sit, and what type is it? I assume it is not preferred to run an internal combustion engine within the evacuated tube...

[james_s]

IIRC the engine is not in the tube, it's driving fans/pumps that suck the air out.

[SiliconWizard]

Air is probably not the only thing being sucked here. 

[james_s]

Well I'm not arguing that it's a good idea, frankly I don't know whether it will work or not, although I suspect it's possible to solve the technical hurdles. Now whether it could ever be made economical, that's something I'm far more skeptical of.

[StillTrying]

We don't call it Hyperloopy for no good reason.

[apis]

I haven't heard them officially mention the mode of propulsion, although I haven't followed it that closely. I assume they want to use linear motors and magnetic levitation (aka maglev). But maybe they can't because of piles of patents? It's the only thing that makes sense though imho.

This video seems relevant (sorry if it's already been posted):
TLDR: Often it is more cost effective to improve on existing infrastructure and technology rather than to build some fancy new revolutionary, expensive thing.

[james_s]

I'm pretty sure they did discuss propulsion, the idea is to work like the pneumatic tubes they have at banks. A big vacuum pump at one end sucks the air out of the tube while a blower at the other end forces air in behind the capsule. The capsule itself has no built in propulsion.

[apis]

I found the hyperloop Wikipedia article:

Elon Musk's version of the concept, first publicly mentioned in 2012, incorporates reduced-pressure tubes in which pressurized capsules ride on air bearings driven by linear induction motors and [...]
an electrically driven inlet fan and axial compressor would be placed at the nose of the capsule to "actively transfer high-pressure air from the front to the rear of the vessel"

However

The Hyperloop concept has been explicitly "open-sourced" by Musk and SpaceX, and others have been encouraged to take the ideas and further develop them.

There are now several different competing designs.

EDIT: Actually linear motors are also mentioned in the RI talk (@14.15) that Lord of Nothing posted earlier.

[BrianHG]

Another analysis of the Hyperloop:

"The Biggest Problem With Hyperloop - Why It Will Fail Hard"

[usagi]

However

The Hyperloop concept has been explicitly "open-sourced" by Musk and SpaceX, and others have been encouraged to take the ideas and further develop them.

There are now several different competing designs.

so when they all fail, elon can blame everyone else, instead of admitting it was a braindamaged idea to begin with.

[EEVblog]

However

The Hyperloop concept has been explicitly "open-sourced" by Musk and SpaceX, and others have been encouraged to take the ideas and further develop them.

There are now several different competing designs.

so when they all fail, elon can blame everyone else, instead of admitting it was a braindamaged idea to begin with.

Which is why he isn't putting any real money into it himself, apart from (SpaceX?) funding some student comps which is probably a tax write-off anyway. He left it up to other suckers to put in the serious money and try and do it. Same with the Boring company, Musk admitted on the Joe Rogan podcast that it's basically a joke.
Wouldn't surprise me if he's deliberately trolling everyone just for kicks.

[EEVblog]

Another analysis of the Hyperloop:

"The Biggest Problem With Hyperloop - Why It Will Fail Hard"

Great video, well researched and produced. Conclusions are bang on.

[nctnico]

I see mostly FUD in the video. I wouldn't be too quick to write the idea off (lots of companies are investing in hyperloops after all). Think about transporting of goods. In Europe the effective speed of a freight train is 30km/h. This means a lot of stuff gets trucked for hundreds of kilometers from harbours to places inland because using a freight train takes too long. A hyperloop system which can automatically transport containers to and from a harbour could save a massive amount of money (no drivers) and fuel (less CO2 emissions). Having the pods run inside a tube makes them not prone to collisions like railways are. An automated routing system would take away the time needed to assemble a train and connect/disconnect wagons at each stop. Each pod can be directed to the place it needs to be.

https://venturebeat.com/2018/12/05/hyperloop-transportation-technologies-partners-with-port-of-hamburg-operator-to-develop-cargo-service/

[MrMobodies]

Just watched the Elon Musk LITERALLY reinvents the tunnel! video from Thunderfoot.

Instead of the skate things they put little guide rails on the wheels.



Is that something they have to put on manually?

Also I see they make pipes larger than 1.83m in diameters.

ASTM A252 API 5L Grb 2m Diameter SSAW Spiral Round Steel Pipe



https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ASTM-A252-API-5L-Grb-2m_60764802350.html


I think Hyper Pipe is a better name for it.

After all it's all hype and he's piping on about it.

[EEVblog]

BTW you have to skip to 13:00 to get the rest of the new info which carries on from the start of the videos, after he's gone onto mars and Therenos.

[apis]

Meanwhile in the far east, next generation maglevs are aiming for 600 km/h:
https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/china-highspeed-maglev-prototype/index.html

[David Hess]

A discussion about Elon Musk connected with anything circular reminds me of this.  You know, for kids!

Obscure?

[MrMobodies]

Meanwhile in the far east, next generation maglevs are aiming for 600 km/h:
https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/china-highspeed-maglev-prototype/index.html

I read somewhere that they built 200 mphs? trains and tracks since the 1980's.

[EEVblog]

Meanwhile in the far east, next generation maglevs are aiming for 600 km/h:
https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/china-highspeed-maglev-prototype/index.html

I've been on one at 430km/h, they are pretty epic.

[ebastler]

I read somewhere that they built 200 mphs? trains and tracks since the 1980's.

That's a rather hazy statement for an engineering forum (even the "General Chat" section)... 

You are probably thinking of the Japanese Shinkansen. These were first deployed even earlier, starting in 1964, but they did not start at quite that high speed. The original Shinkansen went up to 210 to 220 km/h, and later generations reached 320 km/h, i.e. 200 mph, in 2013.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinkansen

[MrMobodies]

Yes the bullet trains.

Sorry about that I got it wrong and confused.

I have should have doubled checked and provided a quote which I will do next time.

[GeorgeOfTheJungle]

Spain and France are full of high speed trains.

[nctnico]

Spain and France are full of high speed trains.

Agreed. The French hold the speed record for the fastest train. Both Maglevs and regular trains suffer from the same problem: air friction. At some point it isn't going to be (financially) efficient to run trains at high speed and that is where the hyperloop concept comes in. And you don't need a complete vacuum. The energy consumption goes down linear with lowering the air pressure. Half the pressure means a 50% reduction in the energy lost due to friction (I'll leave it up to the reader to look up the formulas for energy loss due to friction versus air pressure).

[ebastler]

Spain and France are full of high speed trains.

Sure, as well as Italy, Germany, some lines in the UK and Belgium, ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-speed_rail_in_Europe

My point was that the Japanese Shinkansen was the first, by a fair margin to my knowledge.