Grumpy rant #783

[TimFox]

Why should I spend money to re-wire my house, for no benefit to me, to help your silly idea?
What if I need to plug something into a wall outlet, for example in my garage, while wearing gloves?

[magic]

You will do it because it makes your whole digital life more convenient and simply better.

USB 4.0 introduces the new Power Delivery 3.0 specification, which permits mains passthrough with automatic negotiation of voltage and frequency. Gone are the days of travel adapters, step-up transformers or voltage switches hidden on the rear panel. All you need is USB 4.0 enabled devices and a USB cable, and USB 4.0 mains which you will invest in because everybody does.

Revision 4.1 will add a new type D connector, which can be rotated arbitrarily in 90° increments and includes additional wiring to carry 20Gb/s data and three phase power for your most demanding peripherals such as intelligent welders, electric vehicles and similar.

[TimFox]

Not I, said the fox to the little red hen.

[tom66]

You will do it because it makes your whole digital life more convenient and simply better.

USB 4.0 introduces the new Power Delivery 3.0 specification, which permits mains passthrough with automatic negotiation of voltage and frequency. Gone are the days of travel adapters, step-up transformers or voltage switches hidden on the rear panel. All you need is USB 4.0 enabled devices and a USB cable, and USB 4.0 mains which you will invest in because everybody does.

Revision 4.1 will add a new type D connector, which can be rotated arbitrarily in 90° increments and includes additional wiring to carry 20Gb/s data and three phase power for your most demanding peripherals such as intelligent welders, electric vehicles and similar.

Will USB 5.0 support megawatt charging?  It's really inconvenient to have to wait for my phone to charge up.  I'd like if it could be charged in 18 milliseconds instead.

[TimFox]

Instead, to minimize EMI problems from crappy switching DC supplies, we can install rotating shafts at a safe height above the floor, near the ceiling, and run belts down to generators mounted on the equipment.
No fossil fuel need be involved:  the shafts can be driven from windmills.

[rsjsouza]

You will do it because it makes your whole digital life more convenient and simply better.

USB 4.0 introduces the new Power Delivery 3.0 specification, which permits mains passthrough with automatic negotiation of voltage and frequency. Gone are the days of travel adapters, step-up transformers or voltage switches hidden on the rear panel. All you need is USB 4.0 enabled devices and a USB cable, and USB 4.0 mains which you will invest in because everybody does.

Revision 4.1 will add a new type D connector, which can be rotated arbitrarily in 90° increments and includes additional wiring to carry 20Gb/s data and three phase power for your most demanding peripherals such as intelligent welders, electric vehicles and similar.

Will USB 5.0 support megawatt charging?  It's really inconvenient to have to wait for my phone to charge up.  I'd like if it could be charged in 18 milliseconds instead.

Indeed, USB5.0 will charge your EV at 480V while you use your phone - all using the same wire!

[Connecteur]

No need to rewire a house, but new houses going forward could be wired with safe USB throughout the house, but higher wattage appliances could be wired directly to high-current power.

[TimFox]

And after we are bored with USB 5.0, we will rediscover 120 V, 60 Hz and AWG 12 wiring.

[TimFox]

No need to rewire a house, but new houses going forward could be wired with safe USB throughout the house, but higher wattage appliances could be wired directly to high-current power.

So, my kitchen toaster would need to be directly wired to the wall (and therefore remain in one place).
How would I connect a good-sized vacuum cleaner?  Typical power 1400 W (500 to 3000 W), but needs to plug into various rooms of the house.
That's far more than current 240 W, and 3 kW at 30 V would be 100 A (a bit high for a practicable cable).
You haven't thought this nonsense through, and your proposed solution does not have a real problem that requires it.

Now, in my experience, wall outlets are often in the wrong place, where furniture needs to go.
My solution, for the digital-heavy corner at my computer desk, is to place a proper outlet strip (with 5 120 V outlets and a circuit breaker) that also contains two USB sockets on my desktop.
Should a new low-voltage standard come to pass, I can easily replace such an outlet strip.

[Connecteur]

No need to rewire a house, but new houses going forward could be wired with safe USB throughout the house, but higher wattage appliances could be wired directly to high-current power.

So, my kitchen toaster would need to be directly wired to the wall (and therefore remain in one place).
How would I connect a good-sized vacuum cleaner?  Typical power 1400 W (500 to 3000 W), but needs to plug into various rooms of the house.
That's far more than current 240 W, and 3 kW at 30 V would be 100 A (a bit high for a practicable cable).
You haven't thought this nonsense through, and your proposed solution does not have a real problem that requires it.

Now, in my experience, wall outlets are often in the wrong place, where furniture needs to go.
My solution, for the digital-heavy corner at my computer desk, is to place a proper outlet strip (with 5 120 V outlets and a circuit breaker) that also contains two USB sockets on my desktop.
Should a new low-voltage standard come to pass, I can easily replace such an outlet strip.

My washing machine stays in one place, but I have a plug for it. My stove doesn't have one.
Nobody would be forcing anyone to do anything.

[TimFox]

No need to rewire a house, but new houses going forward could be wired with safe USB throughout the house, but higher wattage appliances could be wired directly to high-current power.

So, my kitchen toaster would need to be directly wired to the wall (and therefore remain in one place).
How would I connect a good-sized vacuum cleaner?  Typical power 1400 W (500 to 3000 W), but needs to plug into various rooms of the house.
That's far more than current 240 W, and 3 kW at 30 V would be 100 A (a bit high for a practicable cable).
You haven't thought this nonsense through, and your proposed solution does not have a real problem that requires it.

Now, in my experience, wall outlets are often in the wrong place, where furniture needs to go.
My solution, for the digital-heavy corner at my computer desk, is to place a proper outlet strip (with 5 120 V outlets and a circuit breaker) that also contains two USB sockets on my desktop.
Should a new low-voltage standard come to pass, I can easily replace such an outlet strip.

My washing machine stays in one place, but I have a plug for it. My stove doesn't have one.
Nobody would be forcing anyone to do anything.

Nor shall I allow you and your ilk to force me.
Do you use a vacuum cleaner?

[Connecteur]

No need to rewire a house, but new houses going forward could be wired with safe USB throughout the house, but higher wattage appliances could be wired directly to high-current power.

So, my kitchen toaster would need to be directly wired to the wall (and therefore remain in one place).
How would I connect a good-sized vacuum cleaner?  Typical power 1400 W (500 to 3000 W), but needs to plug into various rooms of the house.
That's far more than current 240 W, and 3 kW at 30 V would be 100 A (a bit high for a practicable cable).
You haven't thought this nonsense through, and your proposed solution does not have a real problem that requires it.

Now, in my experience, wall outlets are often in the wrong place, where furniture needs to go.
My solution, for the digital-heavy corner at my computer desk, is to place a proper outlet strip (with 5 120 V outlets and a circuit breaker) that also contains two USB sockets on my desktop.
Should a new low-voltage standard come to pass, I can easily replace such an outlet strip.

My washing machine stays in one place, but I have a plug for it. My stove doesn't have one.
Nobody would be forcing anyone to do anything.

Nor shall I allow you and your ilk to force me.
Do you use a vacuum cleaner?

My Dyson has a lithium battery, easily serviceable by USB.

[Connecteur]

[TimFox]

No need to rewire a house, but new houses going forward could be wired with safe USB throughout the house, but higher wattage appliances could be wired directly to high-current power.

So, my kitchen toaster would need to be directly wired to the wall (and therefore remain in one place).
How would I connect a good-sized vacuum cleaner?  Typical power 1400 W (500 to 3000 W), but needs to plug into various rooms of the house.
That's far more than current 240 W, and 3 kW at 30 V would be 100 A (a bit high for a practicable cable).
You haven't thought this nonsense through, and your proposed solution does not have a real problem that requires it.

Now, in my experience, wall outlets are often in the wrong place, where furniture needs to go.
My solution, for the digital-heavy corner at my computer desk, is to place a proper outlet strip (with 5 120 V outlets and a circuit breaker) that also contains two USB sockets on my desktop.
Should a new low-voltage standard come to pass, I can easily replace such an outlet strip.

My washing machine stays in one place, but I have a plug for it. My stove doesn't have one.
Nobody would be forcing anyone to do anything.

Nor shall I allow you and your ilk to force me.
Do you use a vacuum cleaner?

My Dyson has a lithium battery, easily serviceable by USB.

So now I must scrap my perfectly good line-operated vacuum cleaner?
Who died and made you my robot overlord?

[SiliconWizard]

You will do it because it makes your whole digital life more convenient and simply better.

USB 4.0 introduces the new Power Delivery 3.0 specification, which permits mains passthrough with automatic negotiation of voltage and frequency. Gone are the days of travel adapters, step-up transformers or voltage switches hidden on the rear panel. All you need is USB 4.0 enabled devices and a USB cable, and USB 4.0 mains which you will invest in because everybody does.

Revision 4.1 will add a new type D connector, which can be rotated arbitrarily in 90° increments and includes additional wiring to carry 20Gb/s data and three phase power for your most demanding peripherals such as intelligent welders, electric vehicles and similar.

Will USB 5.0 support megawatt charging?  It's really inconvenient to have to wait for my phone to charge up.  I'd like if it could be charged in 18 milliseconds instead.

Indeed, USB5.0 will charge your EV at 480V while you use your phone - all using the same wire!

Don't give the EU ideas! They could very well mandate the replacement of mains AC with USB-C v. xxx at some point.

[TimFox]

Although apparently francophone, the original poster is a man without a country.

[SiliconWizard]

So now I must scrap my perfectly good line-operated vacuum cleaner?
Who died and made you my robot overlord?

Will you take the red pill or the blue pill?

[Connecteur]

Although apparently francophone, the original poster is a man without a country.

Thanks, Sherlock.

[Connecteur]

This is probably the reason there is no world standard. Everybody fights change. I'd hate to see more countries taking the "rubber room" approach to it like the UK.
I'm unhappy enough trying to get my 3-prong bulky laptop power cord into my carrying bag.  I like the newer ones that are powered by USB-C.  I think there's a lot to be gained by adding USB to the existing power outlet standards.  If not for total safety of it alone.

[tom66]

Of course, UK power plugs don't need to be as bulky as they actually are, it's just the cheapest implementation of the standard.  See Apple's iPhone charger design for instance.  The UK market is big enough that they have a custom plug with folding pins.  A single spring pops all pins out when you unfold the earth pin.  The regulatory information is hidden under the pins.  It's rather elegant all considered.

https://theoutletshop.co.uk/products/apple-5w-usb-power-adapter-folding-pins-new

[TimFox]

This is probably the reason there is no world standard. Everybody fights change. I'd hate to see more countries taking the "rubber room" approach to it like the UK.
I'm unhappy enough trying to get my 3-prong bulky laptop power cord into my carrying bag.  I like the newer ones that are powered by USB-C.  I think there's a lot to be gained by adding USB to the existing power outlet standards.  If not for total safety of it alone.

Feel free to add USB-type power outlets to existing wall sockets, next to the real ones in the same box.
The next generation can change those USB outlets to later standards without interfering with the real outlets.
In the US, where 120 V plugs are a civilized size (not the ancient flimsy ones to which people object, nor the huge ones needed for 240 V), the standard outlet wall box is 2x4 inch (single) or 4x4 inch (double).
The single box usually holds two thingies above each other (two outlets, two switches, or one of each) or one switch.
The double box that usually holds two to four thingies has enough room next to the real outlets for a USB thingy.
"Thingy" in French is "truc", depending on context.
The original English word "thingamajig" apparently is the source for the formal English word "jig" for a fixture, and the informal word "thingy".

[themadhippy]

ones to which people object, nor the huge ones needed for 240 V), the standard outlet wall box is 2x4 inch (single) or 4x4 inch (double).

those huge boxes  (for the far superior systemt   )  aint much bigger, a single box is around 3" x 3" and a  double around 6" x 3"

[TimFox]

However, in the US we get more outlets per linear inch of outlet strip, due to the smaller plugs for the safer voltage level of 120 V.

[Connecteur]

I don't think I'm alone in who finds excessive caution aggravating.  The driver in front of you who chooses to drive well under the speed limit; the gas station that removes the fuel nozzle latch, so that you are forced to hold the trigger throughout the fill, and countless other purported "safety measures" which do very little or nothing to save lives or prevent injury.  There's always someone trying to outlaw pressure cookers or lower all the speed limits, but that is not risk management, it's "risk avoidance."

I cringe every time I see a clunky UK lug, and I doubt that it saved many lives, at least to the extent that it outweighs the inconvenience.
That's why I think a type of USB could provide both sufficient power for small appliances and total safety from possible electrocution, but a convenient sized plug that won't get in your way.

[TimFox]

Again, here in the US we use what I consider to be a sensible-size plug for 120 VAC.
I do not preach to other countries what plugs they should use on their power distribution.
I have considered what small appliances are probably unsuitable for USB-level power connections.
Besides kitchen appliances, we have a hair dryer, a good vacuum cleaner, and a good audio system (not a handheld device for compressed files and earbuds).
TV sets larger than our modest flat-panel can pull from 75 to 120 W when operating, while a reasonable computer monitor draws maybe 55 W.
In the kitchen, a full-size refrigerator pulls 350 to 780 W when running.  With a wall plug, it is easy to replace when needed.
Similarly, a dishwasher pulls over 1 kW when running:  batteries not included.
Also, consider my drill press:  they range from 300 to 1000 W for reasonable sizes.
Furthermore, table saw, and soldering station are examples of plug-in tools.
You may like USB-style connectors:  be sure to make them easy to replace if abused, but remember what else you need to power.